Must democrats make peace with corporate influence to win next elections?

[billbuckhead]

Only 2 choices in this poll, kind of like the reality of the situation in American elections if votes are counted fairly. Do we have to make peace with at least some corporations to throw the Republicans out? Wasn't life better under Democratic presidents than Republican ones?

A civil war about corporations in the Dem party only helps the even more evil Republican corporations win the next election. Are you going to make the perfect the enemy of tolerable or are you going with a Trotskyite strategy of making life so intolerable that revolution becomes much more likely?

[wuushew]

1. Kerry had the most money ever for a Dem

the character of the candidate combined with a renewed grassroots structure is the only hope.

[LoZoccolo]

3. He also had the most votes ever for a Dem. n/t

[LoZoccolo]

2. billbuckhead, I stand with you!

:hug:

I would not go so far as to call the centrist politics of Bill Clinton or even Joe Lieberman "corporatist", however.

[Atman]

4. Why not just lie to them to win their support?

Like Bush did with the fundies.

[AX10]

7. Seriously, we may have to consider this option.

Politics is a game and we need to WIN.

[GreenPartyVoter]

5. Guess which one I voted for.

[billbuckhead]

11. The Clinton Clark Murdoch triangle would be close to unstoppable

but what would the cost be? But then what would be the cost be of losing to Frist or even McCain?

[LoZoccolo]

16. They don't care, they live in Strawberry Fields.

I think I know, I mean, ah yes but it's all wrong, that is I think I disagree.

[GreenPartyVoter]

20. We'd lose to them anyway because of the rigged voting machiens, so at

least we'd have our principles intact.

[billbuckhead]

22. What if kowtowing to some corporations gave us fair voting?

Corporate media might go for that cause it gives them more power. The RepuKKKes don't need even Fox if the machines are fixed and the courts are rigged.

[GreenPartyVoter]

23. Ok, so let's say we give in to them and we get some folks elected... what

happens when we try to make policies that go against our corporate sponsors. Think we can pull that off?

[billbuckhead]

24. Implicit in this is to divide and conquer corporations

We will destroy some of the weak corporations immediately and piss off other powerful ones that will not take it lying down and will always be one step away from open sedition. Other corporations, we can make as powerful as we like.

[applegrove]

6. In 40 years, India, China, Brazil & Russia will form an economy

10 times bigger than the total of Western nations today. For sure you can access this market to sell your stuff or buy stuff using the internet. Prices will come down. But using corporations to do that too is important. That is what corporations are for: a tool to organize business.

All the growth in the 20th century favored North America. Now it will favor other places. I don't see how we can participate in that unless we 1) get ahold of the corporations to make sure they are good citizens 2) have corporations as one option.

[AX10]

8. BINGO!

I agree with you. We must promote and mandate good corporate citizens.

[getmeouttahere]

13. Boycott the bad ones, buycott the good ones!

[applegrove]

15. Buyblue seems like a good place to start. So we all know the

political affiliation of the corporations we deal with. There is lots of stuff out there on corporate transparency and the like.

As well - we must keep the ability to regulate at the will of the people.

They must pay taxes.

Capital flight needs reform the world over.

Universal health care of some form must exist in every country in the world.

[Chemical Bill]

9. We need verifiable paper ballots to win. n/t

[billbuckhead]

18. I'm assuming the votes will be counted properly, i know, a very big if

Until we get paper ballots, we don't even have a managed democracy. I've voted twice on vaporware and it's a terrible feeling.

[LoZoccolo]

10. I should say this, about the nature of Internet polls.

Voting in this poll has little consequence other than for one side to try to piss the other off, or show off (and show off even more by getting people to try to guess what one voted)...in that sense, what someone says here can very well not be what they would do in the real world.

[LoZoccolo]

12. Also...

...choice #2 is a white upper-middle class luxury, and an exercise of white priveledge.

[Mass]

14. Start by making clear to small businesses who are their real friends

and their real interests (certainly not with the corporations).

[AX10]

17. Why do the following groups vote with the Repubs?

-Small Businesses
-Poor Whites From the South
-Poor Whites From Kansas/Dust Bowl
-Some Union Members
-Firefighters
-Military

The GOP has done NOTHING for any of them!

Have any answers?

:shrug:

[Mass]

19. Poor communication and a lot of misinformation.

We need grassroots at the local level all year long, not during the six months an election cycle lasts.

We also need to define what we stand for, and be ready to explain it relentlessly. Not necessarily go to the right, but explain why you are best.

The longer you do that, the easier it is during the election.

[billbuckhead]

21. The GOP is perceived as the macho party with the heart of gold

Kind of like a Bruce Willis movie. They hate seeing all those poor people suffer but it's tough love and good for them. It's what the vengeful fundie God wants.