Are we winning most issues, and not even aware of it?

[Jesus Saves]

I know at times it can seem like we keep losing. It can get depressing.

But what if it only *seems* like that. What if you stepped back from the feelings of the moment - the tyranny of the moment - and looked at the big picture.

Let's take gay rights for instance. There was a time when you could not even talk about gay rights. Well, we are talking about it now. There are gay characters on television. Civil unions are coming (hell even Dick Cheney supports those) and when that happens full gay marriage is right around the corner. I know those things will happen eventually.

There is a segment of our country that is uncomfortable with gay marriage, so we've been talking about it, as a country. That simple act of talking about it, letting people complain and biatch, it only serves to help the cause in reality. It gets it out in the open. It's being delt with. Which is something you couldn't say was happening sixty years ago.

I believe we will win the issues in the end. What has Bush really succeeded in doing domestically? Other than his war, all he was are tax cuts and debt, which can be reversed.

[Melodybe]

1. yes 70% opposed Bush on Social security, Terri Schiavo, filibuster,

etc, etc,

[AndyTiedye]

9. What Does Boosh** Care What We Think?

He has his base, and he has the voting machinez.


"committed to helping Ohio deliver its electoral votes for the president"
Walden O'Dell, CEO

[JDPriestly]

2. Liberals always win in the end.

Conservatives get power and hold on to it and make a horrible mess of everything -- just like Bush and his gang right now. And then, when all seems lost, the voters turn to their liberal saviors who make things right only to have power grabbed by conservatives who start the cycle over again. Happens over and over throughout history. Best just to start liberal, stay liberal and be liberal. We're the problem solvers. Conservatives are the problem creators.

[AndyTiedye]

10. Last Time Such a Gang of Conservatives and Religious Zealots Came to Power

...it took 1000 years and 7 Crusades before the liberals started winning again
--and that only because their kings and bishops had to lead their
troops into battle!
Most of them didn't make it back from the last Crusade.

[K-W]

3. Yes, we are losing purely on organization, America is very liberal.

That is the secret the right doesnt want anyone to know.

[SnoopDog]

4. Maybe but...

Look at our huge deficit.

Real ID Act.

Hugh setbacks on pollution controls.

Billions of dollars squandered into the pockets of war profiteers.

Bankruptcy bill (could be reversed I think).

Alaska oil now opened up.

No Jobs.

These are but a few items but so important. I personally feel that gay marriage and abortion are 'extra credit' items. These have always and only been wedge issues.

Our country is being dismantled - we have not achieved any victory yet.

[Jesus Saves]

6. The environment

well they have to appropriate the language of the environmental movement - 'clear skies' - 'healthy forests' - etc...

I think people will eventually wake up to what's going on. The lasting truth is that the language of environmentalism is here to stay.

[K-W]

7. Because being right doesnt give victory, organization does.

It is quite simple, the right has a massive organizational advantage over the left.

And organization is what matters, that is why, in the absence of any other competing ideological organization, extreme myths can be accepted as truths.

[SnoopDog]

8. Yes they have extreme organization...

1) They have the military industrial complex
2) They have the media
3) They have a rigid conformity within their party
4) They have the church crowd
5) They have a huge brain-washed citizenship
6) And of course they have all three branches of our so-called government.

And they follower their leaders like sheep or lemmings (and over the cliff if that is where they are led)


What do we have? Basically no organization.

Being liberal unfortunately means we all want to have our own ideas, our own 'INTERNET organization', our own clubs.

My one word is that we liberals are all 'splintered'. There are what seems like hundreds of groups, DU, PDA, ACLU, and a whole bunch more. We seems to pick a group but no group has a significant number of participants.

If we ALL simply had one group and that one group led the charge - we might make the difference.

Even Dean seems to not have united us against this evil government.

I am actually afraid - afraid that MY United States is dead as we to know it. We are not free. We are polluting ourselves to death. There are no protections from the courts. There are no jobs. We have a huge debt. Our economy is ZERO. Our dollar is almost worthless (exaggeration but every day we are getting closer).

Are we at a point of no return? Is there a legal and peaceful means to restore our government?

The absolute only way we as citizens have to provide our own 'check and balance' is to vote evil people out of office. We have rigged elections - if repuks gain more seats in 2006 - we are truly dead.

[noamnety]

5. It's hard to view this as winning

When the damage to our water supply, air supply, global warming, and all is permanent.

The freedom to marry is important. But so is the freedom to drink water that doesn't give you cancer, or to eat lettuce that doesn't contain rocket fuel.

We're losing the silent battles.