Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login
Google

Church and state-founding fathers

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (Through 2005) Donate to DU
 
MARALE Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-06-05 01:34 PM
Original message
Church and state-founding fathers
I found this website today. It has a great breakout of how the country was founded and why there is seperation of church and state. I am a diest and am very scared of what is happening to this country. I would think that others would be too, whether christian, jewish or whatever. We need to stop this movement of the right wing! Remember the Salem witch trials!

here's a snip:

In 1565, the first European colony in North America got founded at St. Augustine (in Florida) by the Spanish. In 1607 the Jamestown colony got founded by the London Company. In 1620 the Mayflower ship lands at Cape Cod, Massachusetts and its colonists formed the Mayflower Compact (a true Christian document) to establish a form of local government. But these early Christian colonies (the Puritans) became so religiously intolerant that a few of the colonists began to rebel. In 1636 Roger Williams founded Providence and Rhode Island because his fellow Christians banished him from Massachusetts. Why? Because of his "new and dangerous opinions" calling for religious and political freedoms, including separation of church and state. Providence then became a haven for many other colonists fleeing religious intolerance. Just a few years later in 1646, the Massachusetts general court approved a law that made religious heresy punishable by death! In 1692 hysteria grips Salem, Massachusetts as suspects accused of witchcraft get arrested and imprisoned. One-hundred-fifty people got accused, and 20 of them executed. In 1700, Massachusetts passes a law ordering all Roman Catholic priests to leave the colony within three months upon penalty of life imprisonment or execution (New York passes a similar law). In 1702 in Maryland, the Anglican Church gets established as the official church. In 1706 South Carolina also established the Anglican Church as its official church.

These early European Americans began to feel very suspicious of the growing encroachment of Christianity upon government and personal freedoms. By the mid 1750s, a few of the colonists began to introduce heretical ideas. Benjamin Franklin publishes Poor Richard's Almanac, and he begins to question Christian principles. More and more Americans become wary of religious and political impositions on their life. In January of 1776, Thomas Paine publishes "Common Sense" in Philadelphia which criticized King George III's allegiance to Monarchy, and argues for American independence. It becomes an instant best-seller. Paine, a Pagan deist would later write "Age of Reason" where he rejected Judeo-Christian tenets and scriptures.

Things had come to a head. The most influential American colonists rebelled against Great Britain and their taxes, institutional churches, and desired to form an independent government free from religion and Monarchies. On July 4, 1776, The Declaration of Independence (written by a deist) announced their independence to the world.

...

" ~ my country is the world, and my religion is to do good ~ "
Rights of Man, part 2, 1792

As a Deist and freethinker, clearly Paine's life and death reflects a legacy of freethought Paganism.

http://www.nobeliefs.com/pagan.htm
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
displacedtexan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-06-05 01:42 PM
Response to Original message
1. Truly excellent post and link!
Thanks a million (and praise Janus! Ha! Ha!) for the great analysis.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
MARALE Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-06-05 01:43 PM
Response to Reply #1
3. Thanks
I really think we need to get people to understand how scary this really is!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
SteppingRazor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-06-05 01:42 PM
Response to Original message
2. Yeah, but...
Paine then traveled to France, where he hung out during the Reign of Terror applauding the tactics of the revolutionaries. That is, until they decide he, too, wasn't revolutionary enough. Then he suddenly decided he missed America.
Ah, the French Revolution -- the ultimate example of how the best of intentions can lead to the worst of results.
Anyways, just a couple of cents on Thomas Paine, whose writings, for the record, I generally respect.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
EVDebs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-06-05 01:51 PM
Response to Original message
4. They were all Freemasons, which originated in persecuted KnightsTemplar
When the Catholic church decided to destroy the Knights Templar, the group went underground in 1307 and morphed into the Freemasons by the 1700s. Tolerance and respect for every man's TGAOTU (the great architect of the universe) along with a healthy skepticism of the power of the Catholic church---following the example of Reformation preachers, Luther, Zwingli, etc. etc.-- and the St. Bartholomew's Day Massacre, made this country's founders want church / state separation as a matter of commonsense.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
MARALE Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-06-05 02:11 PM
Response to Reply #4
5. Do you have any links on this?
I find this all very interesting, I knew the Freemasons were part of it, though did not have the info on them. I guess I am very interested in this, because I keep hearing how the constitution was built on Christianity, but don't see any really prevailing arguements on it.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Maestro Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-06-05 02:20 PM
Response to Reply #5
6. Take a look at these links
Not a Christian Nation

more to come...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
MARALE Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-06-05 02:23 PM
Response to Reply #6
7. That one is great, what I was looking for.. eom
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Maestro Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-06-05 02:25 PM
Response to Reply #7
8. Here are some more
Edited on Fri May-06-05 02:26 PM by Maestro
And it might seem that I am anti-Christian, blah, blah, blah. Really I am not. I just don't like these self-righteous bigots rewriting history. It's disgusting. I love spirituality, but to say that we are a Christian nation is just over-the-top.

Wall Builders

Wall Builders Again
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
EVDebs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-06-05 04:50 PM
Response to Reply #5
9. Read John J. Robinson's books
Born In Blood

and

Dungeon Fire and Sword: The Knights Templars in the Crusades

http://www.alibris.com/search/books/author/Robinson,%20John%20J

also, check out Steven Wohlberg's End Times Delusions and see what was considered the antichrist/beast ... the Papacy. Plus, speaking of the current Left Behind series of novels, this eschatology is from the Jesuits 'futurist' version -- in order to throw the trail off so to speak and to further the Counter-Reformation.

You may also want to check out the strange case of the "Pope's Stone" that was discarded surreptitiously during the building of the Washington Monument obilisk

http://www.nps.gov/wamo/history/chap3.htm

Scroll down to Theft of Pope's Stone. Very anti-papal feelings back then; not at all like today. Seems the Jesuits 'futurist' eschatology has won the day.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
MARALE Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-06-05 04:58 PM
Response to Reply #9
10. Thanks!
I will try ans find these at the library!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author Click to view 
this author's profile Click to add 
this author to your buddy list Click to add 
this author to your Ignore list Thu May 02nd 2024, 06:29 AM
Response to Original message
Advertisements [?]
 Top

Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (Through 2005) Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators


Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC