if you are thinking about Vietnam today, **Please consider

[G_j]

listening to (or reading) this....(pretty please)....it will shake the cobwebs out, I promise!!

-peace
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Source: King, Martin Luther Jr. Beyond Vietnam and Casualties of the War in Vietnam. New York: Clergy and Laymen Concerned About Vietnam, 1986.

BEYOND VIETNAM, Martin Luther King Jr.
April 4, 1967, Riverside Church, NYC

http://www.americanrhetoric.com/speeches/mlkatimetobreaksilence.htm

[Joey Liberal]

1. Yes, I am thinking about Vietnam today

I'm thinking about how the republicans trashed the Vietnam service of the last two Democratic candidates for President - Al Gore and John Kerry, while they supported a war time deserter named George W. Bush. I remember how the republicans mocked the Purple Heart medal at the 2004 convention. I remember those swift boat idiots. And then I realize just how evil and cowardly the republican chickenhawks truly are.

[leftchick]

2. Thank you G j

yet again. We must NEVER forget.

[democrank]

3. Just dusted off my copy of

JOHNNY`S SONG by war poet Steve Mason. From his poem, A HISTORY LESSON:

....Certainly, the only valid text
that will ever be written
about the Vietnam War
has already been written:
The Book of Names.

[PA Mamma]

4. Thank You so much for posting that !

I saw your post after we returned from a Peace Vigil this afternoon, Where a Gold Star Family for Peace spoke. We were completely depressed, as it was moved indoors due to the weather, and I left feeling that we are all just not doing enough.

We listened to MLKJ's speech as we ate dinner and my husband and I were utterly moved -- Tomorrow is another day to keep on fighting!

Thank You So Much

[G_j]

5. choked up

I knew there was an important reason in posting this. I listened the other day and was very moved again. I try to revisit this speech at least one a year.

& Thank you for continuing to work for peace!
:-)

[PA Mamma]

9. Again Thanks...

for the reply. Yes there was a reason that you posted that and a reason why I recommended it.

I'm afraid that my tin-foil hat might be showing a bit but I left this Vigil today, thinking yet again, that there may be a Right Wing operative within this group. I am a new member so it is hard to say, but they all seem to be so complacent and counterproductive.

I just don't know how we'll ever be heard if we're not even seen. What good does it do to hold an event if it's inside the YWCA ?
Why did my little babes crayon color their Peace Signs this morning only to have them sitting on a table?

The Threat of rain was present but we're not going to melt for god's sake. Think about a year in the desert.

I don't know , I'm sorry to lay this all out on you ...

I just went a reread this:

We Will Reclaim Our Armed Forces!
By Stan Goff
BringThemHomeNow.org
Wednesday 15 December 2004

http://www.truthout.org/docs_04/121904F.shtml

And you know, we're not going to win by being polite.

[G_j]

10. that is very unusual

I can't count how many times I've stood in the rain (or snow) at peace vigils or protests. I always thought it was part of the turf.

I'll be going to a peace vigil tomorrow in fact, frankly I think the real value in it is to let our community know we are still here. Everyone else just ignores us (politicians, media).
It will take a whole of people willing to make some real sacrifices to make a difference at this point.
I do have some faith that returning soldiers will begin to turn the tide of consciousness in this country. One just posted here at DU today!

Thanks for the Stan Goff piece, I don't think I've read this one.
I think Stan rocks!!

[PA Mamma]

11. Yes, it's odd ....

and I don't know what to do about it.
Is there a War forum here? Or a how to spot Right wing operatives in your DFA Group??

Where did that returning vet post?

Yes, Veteran's are one of our most critical assets !
We need to be very supportive of them.

Have you seen this ? :
The New Face of Protest?
by Karen Houppert
http://www.thenation.com/doc.mhtml?i=20050328&s=houppert

[G_j]

12. here is the thread:

posted by Mortos,
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=104&topic_id=3574882&mesg_id=3574882
-----

One thing I can say about infiltrators, in general they will attempt to fuel disagreements and channel a group's energy in unproductive ways. If someone is causing rifts and arguments they COULD be, but not necessarily. The most obvious plants I've seen have been at larger rallies. If someone is trying get people to rush the "pigs" that is pretty much a give away. :think:

a war forum might be useful here, but I like to post about the war in GD where the most ppl will see it.

thanks for the link, I will check it out. :-)

[Just Me]

6. One of my absolute, most favorite MLK presentations!!!

Amazingly, the very first MLK presentation I read. He grabbed me through his words,...and has been a part of me ever since.

[Just Me]

7. REVOLUTION OF VALUES

A genuine revolution of values means in the final analysis that our loyalties must become ecumenical rather than sectional. Every nation must now develop an overriding loyalty to mankind as a whole in order to preserve the best in their individual societies.

This calls for a worldwide fellowship that lifts neighborly concern beyond one's tribe, race, class, and nation is in reality a call for an all-embracing and unconditional love for all mankind. This oft misunderstood, this oft misinterpreted concept, so readily dismissed by the Nietzsches of the world as a weak and cowardly force, has now become an absolute necessity for the survival of man. When I speak of love I am not speaking of some sentimental and weak response. I am not speaking of that force which is just emotional bosh. I am speaking of that force which all of the great religions have seen as the supreme unifying principle of life. Love is somehow the key that unlocks the door which leads to ultimate reality. This Hindu-Muslim-Christian-Jewish-Buddhist belief about ultimate reality is beautifully summed up in the first epistle of Saint John: "Let us love one another, for love is God. And every one that loveth is born of God and knoweth God. He that loveth not knoweth not God, for God is love." "If we love one another, God dwelleth in us and his love is perfected in us." Let us hope that this spirit will become the order of the day.

We can no longer afford to worship the god of hate or bow before the altar of retaliation. The oceans of history are made turbulent by the ever-rising tides of hate. And history is cluttered with the wreckage of nations and individuals that pursued this self-defeating path of hate. As Arnold Toynbee says: "Love is the ultimate force that makes for the saving choice of life and good against the damning choice of death and evil. Therefore the first hope in our inventory must be the hope that love is going to have the last word" (unquote).

We are now faced with the fact, my friends, that tomorrow is today.

Actively demonstrating our love for one another is the epitome of strength and courage,...and the consequence of actively loving one another is unification, fulfillment and wholeness.

[G_j]

8. I am in total harmony

with these beautiful words. Not that I have found out how to even begin to live them fully. That is a lifetime's work, but for me well worth the struggle.

the three Rs we teach our kids are NOT Revenge, Retribution and Retaliation!


a Love Supreme
thank you!

[Just Me]

13. EVERY human being is in harmony with what we CAN create.

That's the point, that's our power,...we all know we CAN create a world community that embraces our humanity, our struggle, our venture into the unknown, the future over which none of us can completely control. We could, would get through tomorrow more easily if we knew we had eachother, today.

We're not talking about "fantasy" or "magic" or something impossible. The proposition that WE can create by our own WILL a community and society and world which, by action and deed, values life and being alive,...is real.

The choice to actively support life is as real as the choice to selectively ignore and deny and destroy life. The choice to advance the whole is as real as the choice to advance a few. The choice to act in service of self is as real as the choice to act in service of others.

I don't believe any moral or ethical, religious or spiritual human being holds themselves out as being self-serving. However, actions speak.

[G_j]

15. that why it IS possible

because these are choices we make everyday.

:toast:


--
just thought I'd include
MLK Six Principles Of Nonviolence

1. Nonviolence is not passive, but requires courage

2. Nonviolence seeks reconciliation, not defeat of an adversary

3. Nonviolent action is directed at eliminating evil, not destroying an evil-doer

4. A willingness to accept suffering for the cause, if necessary, but never to inflict it

5. A rejection of hatred, animosity or violence of the spirit, as well as refusal to commit physical violence

6. Faith that justice will prevail


with a deeper discussion here:
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2005/1/9/212551/7336

[Just Me]

17. The power of choice. We have those choices.

We always have had the power of those choices.

1. Nonviolence is not passive, but requires courage

2. Nonviolence seeks reconciliation, not defeat of an adversary

3. Nonviolent action is directed at eliminating evil, not destroying an evil-doer

4. A willingness to accept suffering for the cause, if necessary, but never to inflict it

5. A rejection of hatred, animosity or violence of the spirit, as well as refusal to commit physical violence

6. Faith that justice will prevail


Those are choices ALL HUMAN BEINGS have the power to exercise. ONLY THOSE WHO WANT TO EXPLOIT HUMANITY ATTEMPT TO CONVINCE SOME PEOPLE THAT THEIR POWER IS LIMITED TO OVERPOWERING. The power-mongerers have always wielded their "selves" in such a way.

[Daphne08]

14. There's also this:

WAR
written by Barrett Strong and Norman Whitfield

Sung by Edwin Starr, 1942-2003


"War!

What is it good for?

Absolutely Nothing!

War!

What is it good for?

Absolutely Nothing!


War is something that I despise

For it means destruction of innocent lives.

For it means tears in thousands of mother's eyes.

When their sons go out to fight to give their lives.'

-

War!

What is it good for?

Absolutely nothing.

Say it again.

War!

What is it good for?

Absolutely nothing.

Say it again.


It's nothing but a heartbreaker

Friend only to the undertaker.

War is the enemy of all mankind

The thought of war blows my mind.

Handed down from generation to generation.

Induction destruction

Who wants to die!

-

War!

What is it good for?

Absolutely nothing

Say it again.

War!

What is it good for?

-

War has shattered many young man's dreams

Made them disabled, bitter and mean.

Life is too precious to be fighting wars each day

War can't give life, it can only take it away.

-

It's nothing but a heartbreaker.

Friend only to the undertaker.

There must be some place for these things today.

They say we must fight to keep our freedom,

But Lord there's gotta be a better way.

Better than war.

War!

What is it good for?

Absolutely nothing!"


Here's a link to a clip (scroll down) of it in case you've never heard it:
http://www.digitalhistory.uh.edu/learning_history/vietnam/vietnam_music.cfm--

[G_j]

16. right on!

love that song!