I know this is going to rankle afew feathers do duers lack commitment?

[gizmo1979]

Say what you want about the right wing wacko's.They have passion and commitment to their cause.How many of us talk the talk but fail to walk the walk?The right wing wants people to get out and those people are there.The Terri s fiasco is a perfect example of this how much face time did those people get?Alot if we had that kind of passion for our issues they would have to pay attention.Instead we get trampled.We need 60's type commitment,our situation is far more grave then it was then but we can't seem to develop the passion.

[lonestarnot]

1. Absofuckinglutely! n/t

[Pharaoh]

2. its the media stupid

how much media covered the recent peace protests

compare that to the media attention of schiavo.......

then theres the voting machines that we've been screaming about for several years, whats being done about that?

[gizmo1979]

13. Maybe we have to start tearing stuff up.

[seabeyond]

3. i dont see it that way at all

what i see is a bunch of rw yell about how they are suppose to live, and criticizing those that are not doing it to the print of the bible, yet i am not seeing them live it in their life. walking the walk. i can challenge any rw mouthing off to me about morality. i do walk the walk. that is what gives me a win each and every time

i will Say, this is the one thing i admire in the democratic party. i have criticism of dems all over the place. but this exact issue is the one that allows me to admire, respect democrats. i see kerry walking the walk, not mouthing the talk in lies like bush

i see the dems walk the walk, in honoring choice, over moral issue of death of fetus.

i see dems walk the walk in supporting gays, even if opposed to a bible.

i do see them walk the walk in under god, : this is a nation of people under god, and a nation equally of people not under god

so if i were to ask myself which party walks the walk, and which are just mouthing off, i would so vote democrat

[gizmo1979]

20. So how do we get everyone else to hear us

instead of the bible thumpers.

[noamnety]

4. Actually we have the passion

We get 50 protestors at a local election protest, and are discouraged. They get 20 protestors at a national circus, and get national media attention.

It's not passion and commitment, it's church influence - and churches have an automatic and perpetual source of funding for their political activities.

We don't have a massive church network designed to "elect members of their own group or active sympathizers to specific posts in all local party organizations," to quote the annual meeting of the American Catholic Bishops.

[gizmo1979]

14. We should get a better network then

We can't just blame the media,if it's the media it's our job to figure out what it will take.If we protest long enough or hard enough things will change.What worked in the 60's I'm not saying civil war or burning down cities,but there has to be unrest.

[noamnety]

17. Absolutely

But that's easier said than done. The churches have had a network already in place for centuries, and it's one where they have a captive audience for a weekly sermon.

Air America is a good start; it gives us a news outlet for those who are basically already socially aware. But unless we are in the churches, unless we're willing to make that jump, we don't have a means of preaching to the masses, and never will.

We either wait til more people get disgusted and reject their churches, or we get over our distaste of politics and churches comingling. When the churches have a stated goal of electing more of their own to local party offices, we don't have a lot of choices - we either accept church involvement in politics and get active in it and try to influence it, or sit by quietly as victims, shaking our heads in disdain.

[tjwash]

5. So we have a couple dozen freepers covered by a fawning...

...right wing corporate media as if it is the biggest event of the century, or...





We have these with the same fawning whore press telling the whole country "anti-war protest? Where?"

The problem is not commitment, it's people being spoon-fed bullshit by the government and eating it all up.

[mattclearing]

6. Sounds like a personal problem to me.

I'm sure there are varying levels of commitment involved.

Progressives haven't turned the government into a circular pipeline of taxpayer dollars, so our commitment is less well liquidated.

When you spend half the federal budget on military contractors and think tanks who in turn support your electoral efforts for forty years, that is pretty persuasive.

Democrats and progressives are part-timers. We are't nearly as committed to consolidating power because we haven't turned the federal government into a revenue stream.

All you had to do was come out to the Iraq War protests or some of the WTO demonstrations to know that people are as committed if not more committed.

The problem is that the media listened back in the 60's, and people with a conscience could be persuaded by the media to adjust their thinking accordingly.

Now people are adjusting their thinking without help from the media. That is impressive to me. Dissent is its own cottage industry on the Internet.

We outnumbered those Terri nutcases on the 2004 election, and were out in exponentially higher numbers for the antiwar protests in the leadup to the Iraq invasion.

I guess I just don't agree with your premise. Of course, I live a mile from the Mall in DC, so it's easier for me to see.

[spooked911]

7. IMO it's more the media than our commitment.

Don't we all write letters and go to protests when possible? I think we are committed, but right now our plates are very full too.

While we need to learn how to get the media's attention better, maybe it's simply not in our nature to do the stupid and outrageous things wingnuts do to get media attention.

[G_j]

8. are you kidding?

there were at most a hundred "protesters" there at one time.
We (speaking here of progressive activists) have mobilized hundreds of thousands over the last few years. The turnout for "their" protests is always as a rule, pitiful. There were at least 10,000 people, including priests and nuns at the SOA protests this year.
The very weekend the 'Terri' story took over, on the second aniversary of the Iraq invasion, there were hundreds of protests involving thousands of people across the country.


As far as protests go, it is all above the media coverage.

[gizmo1979]

15. Maybe we need to put 100,000 protesters outside

cnn,nbc,cbs,abc.To protest the media becomeing whores of the right.Whatever it takes.We need a voice and direction.We need to concentrate on one thing at a time and take government back one issue at a time.

[sandnsea]

23. Take matters in our own hands

Whether it be protesting outside networks, or taking to the streets with fliers on the filibuster, we just need to get the fuck up and do it. Nobody does until the right person tells them to, and I've said that before around here.

People say they're not lemmings, but don't do a damned thing until Boxer or Dean says so.

[gizmo1979]

25. I feel the same

way dude!we need to empower ourselves.I went to my 1st local democratic party meeting tonight.That made me feel immensely better I feel like I'am doing something.

[sandnsea]

31. I want to hear

What's the plans where you are?

[Patiod]

9. I disagree to some extent, at least in Eastern PA

Speaking only for my neck of the woods, the committment displayed during the Kerry campaign was the only thing that rescued the state from going into the Red column, dragged down by the ignorant rednecks from the center of the state (biggest concentration of hate groups in the US)

People were out walking the streets for many weekends, banging on doors and making calls almost to the point of harrassing voters. Union members were going door to doorb in every town in the area, getting out the vote on Election Day. Hundreds of thousands turned out for Kerry rallies. Meetups are up and running, and traditional Democratic committee structures are doing better than in previous years.

One of the problems with showing passion for the issues is that it gets us arrested, gets us FBI records, gets us harrassed.

Hell, Dems can't even have a "no blood for oil" bumper sticker on their car while attending a "social security town meeting" without being harrassed by the Secret Service

If we showed up somewhere with giant spoons and tin-foil Statue of Libery hats, they'd be confiscated as "dangerous weapons", like the puppets used in Phila RNC protests.

[Jade Fox]

10. The Right's commitment is largely that of the Conservative media.....

The people who have the commitment are those who spent years and
millions to creat their "noise machine" as David Brock calls it. The
followers were always there, but feel empowered by seeing their own
views now relentlessly reflected in the media. I guarentee you that if
liberal/left values were advocated by a huge, world-wide media
machine, we would feel empowered too.

Frankly, I think we all deserve credit for soldiering on in spite of our
current national disaster. :)

[Catchawave]

11. I think the Dems are lacking a clear leader.....

that what a notice all over the place on DU.

I had hopes it would be Dean, but his position now is Chief Fundraiser, and I suppose he has to stay centrist to keep his job.

We need an "organized" movement. I thought Boxer was doing a great job being our spokesman, but have heard nothing from her during the Schiavo debate?!?

I see alot of Clark supporters here...where is he?

Kucinich? Edwards?

I want a BIG LOUD HONEST COMPASSIONATE voice to follow, not a politician.

Right now, Skinner is my "leader".....DU is my party.

[gizmo1979]

16. This is a very good point

we need focus!A leader would do that.

[OneBlueSky]

12. it's not passion that's lacking . . . it's unbiased media coverage . . .

hundreds of thousands (if not millions) of people across the country (indeed, across the globe) demonstrate against the war . . . MSM coverage: virtually nil . . .

a couple dozen wackos demonstrate in front of a hospice in Florida . . . MSM coverage: wall-to-wall for weeks . . .

and when anti-war demonstrators ARE mentioned, as often as not it's as rabble-rousers, discontents, and anarchists . . . while the right-wingers (who really ARE nuts) are pious Christians, pro-life supporters, and generally good guys . . .

[H2O Man]

18. Miami, March 1, 1969:

"Yeah! Okay! Right on...RIGHT ON! Looky here! .... I ain't talking 'bout no revolution. And I ain't talking 'bout no demonstration. I'm talking about having a good time. Are you ready? Are you ready? Are you ready?

"You're all a bunch of fuckin' idiots! You're a bunch of slaves man! How long you think it's gonna last? How long you gonna let it last? How long you gonna let them push you around? How long? Maybe you like it. Maybe you love getting you face stuck in shit. COME ON!

"Maybe you love gettin' pushed around. You love it, doncha? You love it. You're all a buncha slaves! Buncha SLAVES! .....Hey, I'm not talkin' 'bout no revolution, no demonstration, I'm talkin' about getting out in the streets. I'm talking about having some fun. I'm talking about dancing. I'm talking about loving your neighbor -- until it hurts. I'm talking about love. I'm talking about love...."

-- James Douglas Morrison of The Doors

[H2O Man]

24. Well

I suppose that the lack of response indicates my sense of humor has limited appeal. But! My oldest son thought this was hysterical.

[BeFree]

27. Well, hell, I loved it!

It was kinda in your face, eh?


"You're all a bunch of fuckin' idiots! You're a bunch of slaves man! How long you think it's gonna last? How long you gonna let it last? How long you gonna let them push you around? How long? Maybe you like it. Maybe you love getting you face stuck in shit. COME ON!

But really, that is the kind of motivation that works for some folks. But here, on DU, methinks it's more of a sweet and sour blend of gentle prodding and tough love.

But maybe we need to ramp it up a bit?

You start, and don't water it down....<grin>

[H2O Man]

29. It was too bad

that Jim was a little intoxicated that night. His message was actually on target. He was trying to create some progressive theater. But he ended up arrested. For those interested, a nice version of Jim's Miami experience can be heard on the Doors' boxed set: song one on disc one, "Without A Safety Net." (I used to have a "bootleg" tape with a little more than is on the CD.)

[kiraboo]

19. Yeah we lack a leader, yeah we're passionate. But I think the

greatest difficulty we face is the fact that we are not, by nature, a bunch of lemmings. We are not attracted by the notion of being part of the crowd. I for one dislike the whole "rah rah we rock" atmosphere that the repugs seem to thrive in. I think our outlook varies by individual which is bad for the party but actually normal and good for the individual. I also agree that we have suffered so many losses and failures lately that it's difficult to muster the enthusiasm necessary to take action. It seems like the force is just not with us.

[mmonk]

21. We're not used

to the lockstep

[sandnsea]

22. Filibuster Activism

We should be on the streets, just like they were. And yes I have been, this morning.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x3414331

[Laurab]

26. Maybe direction, but not commitment

And of course we don't pay to bus people in to protest things, either.

Also, there IS the lack of media coverage. If it's not reported, it didn't happen, somehow.

IMO we have to find the place AND the number of people, and get together so that there is no way we can be ignored. There is where we need the leader/organizer. We need huge numbers, as well as a more educated public, so that the number of people is impossible to ignore.

How we do it, I don't know. I wish I did.

[Liberty Belle]

28. Would you call this commitment?

Since the election I have:

- begun publishing a liberal newsletter that now reaches nearly 1,000 progressive activists

- ran and got elected as a delegate and officer of our Assembly
District Democratic Committee

- got elected Media Commitee Chair of our DFA chapter

- organized a "Don't Be Fooled by $chwarzenegger" rally in San Diego

- hosted a MoveOn party at my home

- helped coordinate media and acitivities for VOTERR (an election reform group in our area), including a "Count Every Vote" rally for Donna Frye, a protest at our local newspaper, freeway blogging, and an upcoming "Count Every Green Vote" rally at an Earth Day Faire with 60,000 people

- signed up to serve on a candidate recruitment commitee for
the Democratic Party and a legislative watch committee for DFA

- began publishing a weekly "Action Alert" list, which is posted on
progressive forums and circulated via e-mail to subscribers

- started writing liberal editorials for our local community
newspaper

- helped forge an alliance of progressive organizations in our area

- published editorials at Buzzflash, JeffGannon, and California For Democracy websites

- joined a "Defeat Arnold" online group to strategize with progressive leaders in California

- offered to coordinate a counter-leafletting campaign to drive off
Schwarzenegger initiative petitioners in our neighborhood

- drove to LA to speak up at a public forum hosted by DNC members

- sent money to the Democratic Party after Dean was named chair

- harangued my legislators with countless e-mails, calls and letters


I figured if I gave up housework, TV, and sleep, I could fit it all in with no problem!

[H2O Man]

30. That is commitment!

If more people would do 1/10th of that work, we could turn this country around. It's important that people realize that not many people are going to do as much as you are doing, but if more people do some of this type of work .... we are going to be okay. Better than okay, really.

[Liberty Belle]

33. I was a couch potato up until a few weeks before the election.

Now I wish I'd gotten active a lot sooner. Not everyone has as much free time as I do, since I'm a freelance writer and set my own schedule, and my kids are now teens. But as you've noted, if everyone does something, we can make a difference.

I use my own example to show how much difference one person can make, though, if you really put your mind to it.

[H2O Man]

34. Great!

I think one of the most important points you make is that it doesn't matter what a person did or didn't do in the past. Today is a new day, and it offers us a renewed opportunity to do the right thing.... or to do the left thing, as the case may be.

[Liberty Belle]

35. Yes. I've also learned to be audacious.

You never know what will happen until you ask. That's how I landed the gig writing editorials for the community newspaper.

Today, one of my newsletter subscribers (an activist leader in his own right) sent me an e-mail saying he wished The Guardian would publish a U.S. edition--and that I would make a good correspondent!
On a lark, I forwarded it to the Guardian editor. A longshot? Sure. But if you fire off enough of those, every so often something lands in the right spot.

[zanne]

32. We always have to be "nice"and "civil".

To hell with that. It's time to fight fire with fire.