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Mich. Bill that allows doctors to refuse to treat people is illegal

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ck4829 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-28-05 12:56 PM
Original message
Mich. Bill that allows doctors to refuse to treat people is illegal
There has been some controversy about a bill that allowed doctors to refuse to treat GLBT people. Well, it's time to tell the Congressmen in Michigan that this bill is illegal.

Sec. 201 of the 1964 Civil Rights Acts reads, "All persons shall be entitled to the full and equal enjoyment of the goods, services, facilities, and privileges, advantages, and accommodations of any place of public accommodation."

I believe that the Civil Rights Act of 1964 clearly states that what the Michigan RW is doing is illegal.

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rkc3 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-28-05 12:57 PM
Response to Original message
1. Let's hope someone brings this up - this bill is an abomination and is
against what America stands for.
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Melodybe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-28-05 12:58 PM
Response to Original message
2. You're correct sir, you should send that to them
remind them how full of shit they are.
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whistle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-28-05 12:59 PM
Response to Original message
3. Who are GLBT people?
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Boomer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-28-05 01:01 PM
Response to Reply #3
4. At least 10% of the population
Gay
Lesbian
Bisexual
Transgendered
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whistle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-28-05 01:05 PM
Response to Reply #4
8. Okay, thanks I've not seen that term before
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ck4829 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-28-05 01:01 PM
Response to Reply #3
5. self-deleted
Edited on Mon Mar-28-05 01:02 PM by ck4829
Post above explained it better than I did.
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Andy_Stephenson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-28-05 01:16 PM
Response to Reply #3
15. I am a proud member of that select group..
see the triangle to the left? :hi:
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whistle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-28-05 01:59 PM
Response to Reply #15
23. And, have you ever been refused medical care as a result of...
...your being a proud member of that select group?

A few years ago I was being treated for severe depression and while under one heath insurance plan had received medications for the condition. A month after my therapy began, the company changed health insurance carriers and I had to get a new primary care physician. I was automatically assigned a doctor by the insurance company and had to get my medication re-established with the new carrier. It took six weeks to get my appointment and when I met the doctor, it turned out that he had a conscientious objection to prescribing anti-depressants and also to comment on the sexual side effects of taking the medications. The entire clinic of six doctors had the same belief and policy. This I learned only when I was in his office and I asked. The insurance company made not effort to correct the situation when I reported it and I had to pick another PCP and wait another six weeks to get to see him. This was in Florida in 2002. I was pissed because I had never heard of such a practice, although from then on I've asked any new doctor about such a policy. This may be the return of medieval medicine folks!

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purji Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-28-05 01:02 PM
Response to Original message
6. I talked to My Rep this morning
It was brought up last year and was never brought to the senate.
The repubs bring it up at the end of the year because they know it won't go through and they can still tell their "base" they tried.
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Mizmoon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-28-05 01:03 PM
Response to Original message
7. Stunning
will cops have the right to refuse to assist them?
will teachers have the right to refuse to teach them?

I bet you the IRS will NOT give up the right to tax them!
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mainer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-28-05 01:07 PM
Response to Original message
9. But is a doctor's office a place of public accommodation?
I can see them making a distinction. many doctors have 'closed" practices (i.e., they can't take any new ones because their panels are full) and someone can't just walk in and expect to be treated.
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whistle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-28-05 01:11 PM
Response to Reply #9
12. I would think that limited liability laws that now have been...
...extended to medical practioners legally obligates them to not refuse anyone. That's the way it is in hotels and airlines where liabilities are substantially limited regarding lose of personal property.
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gollygee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-28-05 01:07 PM
Response to Original message
10. How can I find out who is sponsoring this bill?
I want to know if my rep is involved. He sends our flyers boasting about this kind of stuff.
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ck4829 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-28-05 01:14 PM
Response to Reply #10
14. Here you go
Randy Richardville

John Gleason

Scott Hummel
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gollygee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-28-05 01:21 PM
Response to Reply #14
16. Mine isn't there
thanks

He probably voted for it though.

My state senator is awful too. *SIGH*
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whistle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-28-05 01:07 PM
Response to Original message
11. How does the Michigan anti-GLBT bill read?
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ck4829 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-28-05 01:13 PM
Response to Reply #11
13. Here you go
"House Bill 5276 would create a new act to exempt a “health facility” from providing or participating in a health care service that violated an ethical, moral, or religious principle reflected in its articles of incorporation, bylaws, or an adopted mission statement. A facility asserting an allowable conscientious objection would be required to provide notice of its objection through written public notice or personally in writing at the time an individual sought to obtain that service from the facility."

This means if a hospital said it was against their religion to treat Asian people, then they do not have to treat Asian people.

http://www.legislature.mi.gov/documents/2003-2004/billanalysis/house/htm/2003-HLA-5006-s.htm
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whistle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-28-05 01:33 PM
Response to Reply #13
19. I'm posting the analysis in its entirety as this Bill could affect....
...similar public legislation is other states which want enact the same type of laws discriminating against select groups of persons. It also is very specific as to what entities can exercise these acts of discrimination. This is not a precedent that should be set in this country after all the sacrifices that have been made to lift discrimination from the laws in the past. :wtf:

<snip>


HEALTH SERVICES: ALLOW

CONSCIENTIOUS OBJECTION

House Bill 5006

Sponsor: Rep. Randy Richardville

House Bill 5276

Sponsor: Rep. John Gleason

House Bills 5277 and 5278

Sponsor: Rep. Scott Hummel

Committee: Health Policy

Complete to 3-19-04

A SUMMARY OF HOUSE BILL 5006 AS INTRODUCED 7-17-03 AND HOUSE BILLS 5276-5278 AS INTRODUCED 11-6-04

As a package, the bills would allow, under certain conditions, a health care provider or health facility to refuse to provide or participate in a health care service and allow health insurers, health maintenance organizations, and Blue Cross Blue Shield of Michigan to refuse to offer or provide a health care benefit.

House Bill 5006 would create the Conscientious Objector Policy Act to allow a health care provider to assert, as a matter of conscience, an objection to providing or participating in a health care service that conflicted with his or her sincerely held religious or moral beliefs. The bill would:

· Provide a procedure for notifying an employer of a conscientious objection.

· Prohibit an employer from refusing employment or staff privileges to a provider who asserted an objection to providing or participating in a health service.

· Prohibit a medical school from denying admission to a person who filed a conscientious objection.

· Specify that a provider’s objection could not be the basis for civil liability, criminal action, administrative or licensure action, or termination of employment or refusal of staff privileges at a health facility, or an involuntary change in terms or conditions of employment or disciplinary action.

· Provide a number of circumstances under which the protections afforded under the bill to a provider would not apply.

· Allow a provider to bring a civil action, including a petition for injunctive relief, if he or she was penalized or suffered discrimination for asserting a conscientious objection to providing or participating in a health service.

· Make a violation of the bill a state civil infraction and establish penalties.

House Bill 5276 would create a new act to exempt a “health facility” from providing or participating in a health care service that violated an ethical, moral, or religious principle reflected in its articles of incorporation, bylaws, or an adopted mission statement. A facility asserting an allowable conscientious objection would be required to provide notice of its objection through written public notice or personally in writing at the time an individual sought to obtain that service from the facility.

A facility could not assert such an objection to a service if the facility routinely provided or participated in the service and the objection was based on a disagreement with a member of a health profession employed by, under contract to, or granted privileges by the facility regarding the medical appropriateness of a service for a specific patient if the patient had already consented to the provision of the service. Nor could an objection “exclude an entire health profession.” A facility’s objection to providing or participating in a health care service could not be a basis for either of the following: civil, criminal, or administrative liability; or, with one stated exception, eligibility discrimination against the facility in a grant, contract, or program.

“Health facility” would mean a health facility or agency as defined in the Public Health Code, a private physician office, or a public or private institution, teaching institution, pharmacy, corporation, partnership, or sole proprietorship that provided a health care service to an individual. “Health care service” would mean the provision or withdrawal of, or research or experimentation involving, a medical treatment, procedure, device, medication, drug, or other substance intended to affect the physical or mental condition of an individual. “Participating in” a service would include counseling, referring, performing, administering, prescribing, dispensing, treating, withholding, withdrawing, diagnosing, testing, evaluating, training, researching, preparing, or providing material or physical assistance in a health care service.

House Bills 5277 and 5278 would allow a health insurer, notwithstanding any other provision of law, to refuse to offer or provide a health care benefit that violated an ethical, moral, or religious principle in its articles of incorporation or bylaws or an adopted mission statement. This would not apply to a health care benefit if the benefit was specifically covered under the certificate, contract, or policy. Further, the refusal to offer or provide a health care benefit could not be a basis for one or more of the following: civil, criminal, or administrative liability; or, with one stated exception, eligibility discrimination against the health care corporation in providing a certificate.

House Bill 5277 would add a new section to the Nonprofit Health Care Corporation Reform Act (MCL 550.409a), which regulates Blue Cross Blue Shield of Michigan. House Bill 5278 would add a new section to the Insurance Code (MCL 500.3406r) to apply to health maintenance organizations (HMOs) and commercial insurers.

Legislative Analyst: S. Stutzky
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Mich Otter Donating Member (887 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-28-05 04:22 PM
Response to Reply #13
24. Catholics supported this bill....
and it could be used to discriminate against Catholics.
Duh? How dumb can Conservatives get???
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starwolf Donating Member (137 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-28-05 01:26 PM
Response to Original message
17. Actually much of this already exists and is allowed
As I understand it, private hospitals can not refuse life saving measures, esp in an emergency, but after that it voluntary. Same with doctors. You cannot force an OB/GYN to provide abortions. Many don't. I want to recall that even training how to do one is optional. Same thing with pharmacies. They don't have to stock RU-488. Its not clear how this would extend that, but it is already going on at some level.
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WillowTree Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-28-05 01:30 PM
Response to Original message
18. READ THE DAMNED BILL!
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whistle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-28-05 01:44 PM
Response to Reply #18
21. Perhaps it does on p4 lines 25, 26,27 and p5 lines 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 as...
...well as the exceptions on p6 and p7.
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scottxyz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-28-05 01:43 PM
Response to Original message
20. Very good point
What the Michigan legislature is attempting to do is SICK. And illegal under the 14th Amendment.

When are these people going to learn that homosexuality is NATURAL? It has been around longer than cooking food and wearing clothes - both of which are legal last time I heard.

Someone ought to send every one of those legislators in Michigan a copy of Bruce Bagemihl's book "Biological Exuberance: Animal Homosexuality and Natural Diversity" to educate them.

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whistle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-28-05 01:46 PM
Response to Reply #20
22. That book might only stimulate and excite them!!!
:hurts:
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mcscajun Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-29-05 11:43 AM
Response to Original message
25. And whether it is illegal or no, it's unethical.
"Under the ethical principles promulgated by the American Medical Association's Council on Ethical and Judicial Affairs, doctors are not obligated to treat every patient who comes to them or might need their assistance, but are ethically bound to help in emergency situations, to live up to any contractual relationships to treat, and to not engage in discrimination based on race, sex, sexual orientation or HIV status in refusing to treat patients."
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