What would you really do?

[MsTryska]

A question was posed to me by one of those unapologetic, rational republicans as we were discussing the state of the 2 parties - he believes democrats need to move to the center on social issues in order to court the wingnuts, and my belief is we’ve got to get back on track with economic issues and take the cultural ones off the table.


I told him that if Dems did what he wanted a whole lot of liberals and progressives would jump ship.

So then he says what would y’all do, vote for Nader?


I said I seriously hoped there would be a whole lot of write-ins if that happened.

So tell me – what would you do? Say the Dems in Charge decided that we were going to take equal rights, secular humanism and personal choice off the table -

Would you vote for the Dem anyway, since they made it through the primaries and was the Candidate, and it’s better to have Dems in power than not?

Or would you have no choice but to write in, or go third party?

[Warpy]

1. It all depends on where you think the center is.

Since the majority of Americans support legal abortion, it's the center.

He does have a point about economic issues, though. Only economic populism will win elections. Pandering to yuppies and ignoring the suffering party base of working class Americans has lost the party all three branches of government.

Holding the line on social issues while ignoring economic ones hasn't been a winning strategy. However, abandoning social issues completely isn't the answer, either. Adding economic issues and really hammering the GOP incompetence while offering working people something other than the business as usual that has held wages down while prices continue to inflate would be a winning strategy.

However, removing the prochoice plank from the party platform would destroy any chance the party has. That is how important it is for party women. You remove that plank, we will leave you.

[Crowdance]

2. Absolutely no choice but to vote non-Dem

we don't exist to serve the party; it exists to serve us. When it stops doing that, we go elsewhere. We're otherwise like lambs to the slaughter.

[blogbear]

6. yes, and 'not to decide is to decide' therefor we must continue to..

let 'public servants' know what 'we the people' want and expect out of them..

[KharmaTrain]

3. All Politics Is Local

Most issues people vote on are ones that live with them...economy, health, education and taxes...you connect with local voters on these issues above all and you stand a good chance to win elections. While Democrats stand on the right side on these issues for a vast majority, they don't get the word out and end up in these worthless debates.

A Progressive in California is not a Progressive in Florida is not a Liberal in Washington is not a Liberal in Texas. Different people, different issues, different ways the Democrats need to connect.

Your question is so essoteric I couldn't give an answer. I go election by election, issue by issue, candidate by candidate and decide my votes strictly on that. If there's a Repugnican who stands for my issues more than a Democrat, I will vote for him/her (rarely ever happens), or if there's a third party who does (almost all are one issue candidates, why I haven't found many that are attractive), I will go that way as well. I'm surely not a guaranteed Democratic vote.

In the 2004 primaries, I didn't support a candidate and wanted to see what the "base" of the party came up with through the primaries and how this would work during the election. I saw a lot of fair-weather friends around here, and now I'm still people people talking at each other, not with or to one another. With 2006 coming up real soon, this is not a very good sign.

Right now I see no one that I could turn to on a national level who speaks for me...or any special interest Democratic group that does either. What I want to see is Democrats retake the House and put the brakes on this runaway regime. Now if you want to let the Repugnicans remain in control...keep thinking the way you are.

[MsTryska]

7. so your convictions don't matter?

i have always been a "values" voter. meaning those that hold my values, whether economic or cutlural or whatever else, get my vote.

[KharmaTrain]

9. So You'd Lose An Election???

Say your local candidate doesn't favor gay marriage or abortion or whatever, but supports increasing funding for education, better access for health care and shutting down the Repugnicans, damn right I'd vote for him/her....primarily since those issues have nothing to do with a local election and only matter once your party has the numbers and power to truly legislate. Democrats are on the outside and getting further away...and it's this "values" or "convictions" arguement that is so destructive.

Your issues aren't mine, but I would imagine we have a lot of common cause. I'll back your issues if you back mine...not a one way street.

I'm tired of those who say that if you don't toe a certain line you're "selling out" or have no principals. These are also many of the same people who will trash Democrats as hard as Repugnicans splintering what's left of this party further.

If you feel so strongly on your issue, more power to you, but if you're talking about making serious changes in this country, it's time people looked at reality not hypotheticals.

[MsTryska]

12. as i said - i'd vote my values.....

and in local candidates i expect something different from the President.

this question was specifically about the presidential elections.

[KharmaTrain]

14. Right Now I'm Looking 2006

Without a Democratic House and/or Senate, any Democrat who can win in 2008 would face more problems than offer cures. Look at how the GOOP control since '94 made it virtually impossible for Clinton to do much...especially during the last years, and how they're just ramrodding legislation through with impunity.

Sorry, 2008 is too far out of my radar to think about now, and I won't until I see who the possible candidates are and the status of the party at that point.

[BigMcLargehuge]

4. I would either find another party of throw myself into

the existing one to change it back towards social issues... if that didn't work, then I'd jump ship and either become a non-voter or a third party voter

[Devlzown]

5. I think the two parties are

too close already. If the Dems moved further to the right, I would probably vote third party or independent.

[eallen]

8. Civil liberty is ever my foremost political priority.

The reason I am now voting Democrat is precisely that the GOP is now characterized by its attack civil liberty: opposed to reproductive rights, opposed to separation of church and state, in favor of sweeping and secret surveillance, etc. If the Democrats go soft on civil liberties, I think I will cry for this nation.

[BeFree]

10. I'm sorry

But that is just pissing in the wind.

If the populace was educated and informed, we'd all be talking about the latest gravity controller on the market.

As it is, with the dunces now idolizing the voting machinery, we don't stand a chance of ever regaining a voice.

[TahitiNut]

11. Look at what happened in the Republican Party.

The same arguments took place. The moderate Republicans haven't "jumped ship" in enough numbers to notice. The right-wing has taken over totally. They have no Quisling RLC (Republican Leadership Conference). Extremism works for them.

One of the things I notice is that the rightmost people in virtually any group just don't compromise within their group. When they don't get their way, they sabotage the group. When they get their way, they impose the heavy hand of authoritarian rule. Dissent is punished.

[MsTryska]

13. But do you think the moderate republicans

did good by letting themselves get hemmed up in a tyranny of the minority?


granted they are in power, but at what cost to them?

[TahitiNut]

15. "But do you thnk the leftmost Republicans ..."

did good by letting themselves get hemmed up in a tyranny of the minority on the right?"

Nope.

I think the surrender of people on the left to the authoritarians on the right is wrong within any spectrum.

On edit: Look at the Political Compass again. The political spectrum in the U.S. today is from the libertarian-left to the authoritarian-right. The scattering of "libertarian-right" and "authoritarian-left" is inconsequential in the political polarization of today's power struggle. Neither quadrant has a foothold in the political discourse. No matter what sub-spectrum you look at, the right/authoritarian is the least tolerant, least inclusive, and least compromising within that spectrum.

The notion of "moderate" is a myth! There is no such thing.

[MsTryska]

16. kick!

would love more opinions please.

:kick:

[nonconformist]

17. If we abandon our platform, we're not very well Democrats anymore

And depending on the issues and the severity of it, I'd probably vote 3rd party or the next best alternative.

I'm a die-hard Democrat, but my loyalty is not blind.

[MsTryska]

18. That was my point exactly.

you can't "move to the center" and abandon what makes you a democrat, and expect to win.


frankly i don't want these invasive jesus people in my party at all. And i'm not trying to be anti-christian or anti-religious - jsut anti-talibornagain.

their beliefs appear to be diametrically opposed to mine, and in action theys tand for everythign i'm agaisnt - why should i kowtow to them and try to bring them into my fold?

[CindyDale]

19. We were in the center on social issues. IMO, try *sinful* issues.

How were we to the left?

The only issue that possibly made any small difference was pro-choice. Did anyone really think Bush would overturn abortion rulings, though? I don't think they did.

It's all about denial, fear, and greed, IMO.

Actually, it's all about sin:

Pride: U.S. is the best.
Envy: Control others' resources.
Gluttony: Consume as much as we can.
Lust: Use others to satisfy our needs.
Anger: Get back at 'em.
Greed: Cut taxes, invade other countries.
Sloth: Take the path of least resistance; don't work on important issues such as energy.

We need to appeal more to man's sinful nature. LOL

edit: accuracy

[MsTryska]

20. hah! that's a brilliant analysis.....

they sure did win on the 7 deadly sins didn't they?

[gollygee]

21. If the dem. party is no longer hte party of equal rights and sep. church/

state then I won't vote for them. I'm sure some third party will emerge that wants me.

[porphyrian]

22. I'm sure he'd like to know.

Let the fucker sweat it.