Starve to Death, Kill, Murder. Empty Shell. Oh the power of words!

[Quixote1818]

It's interesting to see how different people on the Terri Shivo thing make their points to drum up support for their side. Those who are against her being taken off life support use words like STARVE TO DEATH or KILL HER! And those on the other side say including myself say "She is an EMPTY SHELL" or "She is DEAD" or "She is a corps". It seems perhaps Democrats have finally learned to use words like Republicans do. I don't know if that is a good thing or a bad thing just an observation.

[ultraist]

1. What I find interesting is that both sides are saying, "it's cruel."

But for those who say she cannot feel, think, and react in any capacity, how can it be cruel to keep her alive? Only a religious argument would hold up there. If she has NO awareness, she is NOT suffering by living.

Maybe they should keep her alive until there is the possibility of brain transplants or the technology to regenerate brain tissue and she could be a candidate for this. Why not?

They are working on "farming" organs now and have been for the last decade. They think they will be able to grow more complex organs within the next decade.

[Quixote1818]

2. I don't have a problem with that but do you think Terri's parents would

want some other persons brain in their daughters body? If it were my daughters body I suppose if it saved a soul I would be cool with it if I thought she would be cool with it but it sounds kind of creepy.

[Heyo]

4. interesting...

.. but a brain is "you"... so a brain transplant would be more like a body transplant, since the brain woudl retain the personality and ego.

Wild stuff.

Heyo

[ultraist]

5. But they are working on how to regenerate someone's one organs

http://www.trnmag.com/Stories/2003/073003/Fractals_support_growing_organs_073003.html
Fractals support growing organs
July 30/August 6, 2003
By Kimberly Patch, Technology Research News

Today scientists can regenerate tissue such as skin, but they are still figuring out how to grow replacement organs. The challenge is in coaxing cells from organs to grow into new organs rather than unstructured clusters of cells.

Researchers from Harvard Medical School, Massachusetts General Hospital and the Massachusetts Institute of Technology have found a way to impart structure to growing cells that may eventually allow for growth of entire organs. (The brain is an organ)

If the method proves successful, "we can use patient's own cells to create a living organ and this will remove the problems with organ rejections" and a shortage of donor organs, said Mohammed Kaazempur-Mofrad, a researcher at MIT and a senior research fellow at Harvard Medical School and Massachusetts General Hospital. This ultimate goal is still far away, he added.

[DearAbby]

6. the possibility of brain transplants? She would then not be Terri...But

AbbyNormal...Gawd what a horrid idea..who would want their brain transplanted into a body that has not moved on it's own for 15 yrs. the legs and arms contracted. Eeeeee.

Why is there a fear of Death, it is but the next step in life. If you believe that you will see God and be in heaven. Why would anyone wish to prolong this glorious moment? If you don't believe in this, then death is just the end of an existence.

[ultraist]

9. I don't believe in God

But I am fascinated by medical science and new technologies. If I had a big portion of my brain missing, I'd volunteer for a transplant or for the other new research on regenerative tissue growth.

Very few people will be approved for this type of research due to ethical restraints. She is a perfect candidate for such.

[Heyo]

3. Well.....

... you are right.

However, since I am on the side of the argument that does believe she is indeed PVS, "Empty Shell" does come close to the truth for me. I wouldn't use "Corpse" or anything like that, simple because it's plain disrespectful.

The other side goes on about "Starving her to Death!!" to "Kill" her.... and they talk about how painful of an experience that supposedly is.

I reject that whole premise, since pain must be felt to be pain. It's the whole tree-in-the-forrest argument. If there is pain, but it's never felt, was there really "pain".

I think, from her POV, she is already passed away, and she will never have known the difference when her body dies.

I saw the videos on www.terrisfight.org... I am not convinced. I have done some research (on the web) about PVS since this case became news. I have also read that they picked those videos out of many many hours of video where her actions are neither purposeful nor reactive to stimuli.... the broken-clock-is-right-twice-a-day argument.

It's just really unfortunate she never put her wishes in writing. The husband did turn down a huge sum of cash to walk away, so maybe he's not in it for the money. It's hard to understand people's movies in this whole thing without beign able to read minds.

Since, from her POV it doesn't matter, if she's indeed a true PVS, I don't see all that much harm in letting the parents just take care of her, except harm they will do to themselves, because they are seriously delusional IMO.

The question that needs to be asked is: Is there any living tissue left in her cerebral cortez or is there not? I have not seen the answer to such a question and that would pretty much settle it. Everything that makes you who you are is in your cerebral cortex. If you have no brain, you have no brain, as sad as that may by.

I pray and hope for the best for everybody involved. No winners there.

Heyo

[ultraist]

7. Personally, I don't think it's unethical to let her live IF

she can one day contribute to the body of knowledge of medicine and science. She is the perfect candidate for the new "regenerative tissue" studies. If she dies, what has she really lost? If she lives, she has a life and has contributed a lot to science.

Why is it unethical to let her live and recieve experimental treatment? She doesn't feel a lack of dignity, if the diagnosis is correct.

[Quixote1818]

10. I am cool with that nt

[Quixote1818]

8. I agree

I have been using the term "Empty Shell" and I agree that based on facts this use of terms is justified and the other side has not made their case based on science. Good post.

[ultraist]

11. They are researching regerating tissue

If she were my loved one, I'd have her up at Harvard Medical school signed up as a research subject.

[alarimer]

12. I have stayed out of these discussions

Because I am not sure how I feel exactly. If it were me, I would probably not want to live that way. I would definitely not want to be kept alive by machines either. But where is the line drawn? Hospitals are already withdrawing care from those without the ability to pay, in effect handing them a death sentence.

[Just Me]

13. I just wish we would all leave the poor woman and her family alone!!!

Are our own lives so empty or miserable or boring or whatever that we must obsess with this poor woman's life?

I hope my life is never the center piece for everyone to latch their attention.

Sheesh!

[Quixote1818]

14. It's important to debate the issue because it's an important issue

Don't you think?