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InfoMinister Donating Member (546 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-05 11:12 PM
Original message
Dean Scream a Fake?
While checking out guerrillanews to see if they have any info on the new NIN video I saw an interesting little article about the Howard Dean video. You might want to check it out.

"This op-ed piece points out that Dean’s campaign was apparently sabotaged. The really interesting question is, who exactly arranged for this? In case there is any doubt about what exactly happened, it’s probably worth taking a look at this for confirmation of what is being said. Notice that if you google this story, you only find the information in a few places. The media really don’t want this one pushed around too much; it’s too obvious that they’re manipulating the election for their taste."

http://www.guerrillanews.com/headlines/1231/_Dean_Scream_a_Fake
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porphyrian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-05 11:13 PM
Response to Original message
1. The "scream" wasn't a fake, it was misreported.
On purpose, I'm sure.
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InfoMinister Donating Member (546 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-05 11:14 PM
Response to Reply #1
3. Well, That's The Title of the Article
They said it was misleading as far as the context as well as possible manipulation of the audio.
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porphyrian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-05 11:25 PM
Response to Reply #3
13. That's right.
Janeane Garofalo has been saying this since it happened on Air America. Apparently she was there, and said the audio played on the "news" clips came direct feed from his microphone, and didn't accurately reflect the level of noise in the room. As this was during the primaries, there were a number of Democrats who did nothing to correct this error at the time, as Dean was the forerunner until this. Good thing he didn't win the primary, huh?
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GodHelpUsAll2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-05 11:36 PM
Response to Reply #13
19. She was there
And she is absolutely correct. That room was so full and so loud that night that you could hardly hear anything. Including Dean. But this is not what was choosen to be aired. They took the direct feed from his mike and completely left out any other sound from that room that night.
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MrSlayer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-05 11:41 PM
Response to Reply #13
24. Wasn't the "scream" on the night he lost in Iowa?
If so I don't see how it effected him for that vote. It may have killed him afterward but the scream had nothing to do with his loss there. Dean just wasn't going to win, scream or not.
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pansypoo53219 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-05 11:38 PM
Response to Reply #1
21. well, a better word is manipulated
they muted out the crowd noise. it was HIGHLY prejudicial.

but then he said BEFORE he could be elected that big media needs to be broken up.

so big media took him down.
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BrklynLiberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-05 11:42 PM
Response to Reply #1
26. Part of the DLC and the Repuke plan to get Dean out of the primaries.
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GodHelpUsAll2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-05 11:52 PM
Response to Reply #26
33. I agree
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 12:03 AM
Response to Reply #26
41. Bingo. I accidently saw the moment in context on a clip
about a week later. You could hardly hear Dean at ALL in that room.

Qui bono?

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porphyrian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 01:41 PM
Response to Reply #26
70. They lead us so well into three major election losses, didn't they? -n/t
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Warpy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-05 11:52 PM
Response to Reply #1
32. The footage from elsewhere in that room
was online the day after the event, and the difference was truly stark.

Yes, Dean's campaign was torpedoed by cherrypicked video and an isolation mike.

However, the big question is who supplied the footage to every single news outlet, the same footage, every bit of it.

My guess is that it was an inside job. The DLC was terrified of Dean, since he'd done an end run around them and built a large and effective grassroots organization.

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BrklynLiberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 12:01 AM
Response to Reply #32
40. I agree. The DLC,with the help of the Repuke payrolled MSM set him up.
You can play semantics with words like "premeditated" and such...but it was a set up, no matter how fancy you slice it.
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ClayZ Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 01:59 AM
Response to Reply #32
62. And why did they play it over and over and over?
Shameful MSM!

When is the KARMA coming?

:shrug:
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Lorien Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 02:08 AM
Response to Reply #32
63. And the other footage, which made the scream underwhelming
at best, only surfaced on major networks well after the damage was done. :grr:
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porphyrian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 01:45 PM
Response to Reply #32
71. I fucking hate the DLC.
Because of their influence, the Democratic party has been chasing some bullshit "moderate swing voter" around for the last three major elections that never seemed to materialize in even half the numbers they claimed. If they don't let Dean take this party back to it's roots, I'm fucking out of it.
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GodHelpUsAll2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-05 11:14 PM
Response to Original message
2. Some of us
knew this then and tried to tell people just what was going on. But alas, no one wanted to listen. It's a tad too late now.
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democrat in Tallahassee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-05 11:15 PM
Response to Original message
4. it was in the tallahassee democrat of all places
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democrat in Tallahassee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-05 11:15 PM
Response to Original message
5. it was in the tallahassee democrat of all places
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Jackpine Radical Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 08:21 PM
Response to Reply #5
73. The Eau Claire Leader Telegram reprinted it too.
That was a helluva surprise for the L-T. I kinda made a fool of myself, emailing the piece all over W. WI & then having the L-T run it at the same time. It looked like I was lifting things from the local paper & sending them around to people that get the paper.
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lonestarnot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-05 11:16 PM
Response to Original message
6. Screamers/ nonscreamers love Dean... he can scream all he wants n/t
I agree the crowd noise was manipulated along with everything else the MSM chooses to manipulate.
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nostamj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-05 11:16 PM
Response to Original message
7. a quirk of the audio....
if you were IN THE ROOM, it was nothing.

on a PUMPED UP audio feed, it was NEWS.

the rest of the story, you know.

it was a MSM assasination and nothing less.
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GodHelpUsAll2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-05 11:20 PM
Response to Reply #7
9. Yes it was
complete misrepresentation and distortion. Repeated over and over and over and over before, oh gee oops, lookie here we just figured out this is misleading, it's not really the way it went down. Sorry....my bad. By then, it was mission accomplished.
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LoZoccolo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-05 11:19 PM
Response to Original message
8. I can't find anywhere where it points out premeditated sabatoge.
I used to work in TV news, and when someone's making a speech you always try to get a direct line into a close mic so you can hear it. In nearly any other situation, the mix between the audience noise and the speaker's microphone would never even be an issue: you would want to hear the speaker and very little of the audience in a normal situation. The big deal they made of it was bad, and you can go back and check my posts to see how upset I got about it (I was a Dean supporter), but it's a stretch to say someone arranged for this. Especially since I don't think anyone but maybe his campaign manager (I think Joe Trippi had been dismissed by then and I can't remember who the next guy was) knew anything about the speech he was going to give, and even then until that night.
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GodHelpUsAll2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-05 11:23 PM
Response to Reply #8
10. Yes but
Don't you find it odd that when you heard the Kerry speech after Iowa and the Edwards speech you got the "full effect" supporters and all in the sound? Why was it different for Dean?
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LoZoccolo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-05 11:28 PM
Response to Reply #10
15. I don't know, I haven't seen it.
Some microphones are more directional than others, maybe they set up for a bigger crowd and wanted to capture more of that, maybe they weren't loud enough to be a problem (especially if they were outside), maybe we don't even notice because as I said, had Dean not started yelling, the mix wouldn't be an issue. I think it's a matter of a sensationalistic media running away with something people find curious more than anything. That and not wanting to be out of touch with the first spin put on the story, which may have been Drudge.
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GodHelpUsAll2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-05 11:32 PM
Response to Reply #15
17. I did see it
I was in Iowa that night. I was stunned when I saw what was being played non stop on television.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 12:06 AM
Response to Reply #15
44. That's the point. There was NO story without that skewed audio. nt
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GodHelpUsAll2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 12:20 AM
Response to Reply #44
48. Exactly
As someone was so kind to point out common sense let's look at it this way for a moment. Dean lost Iowa, that we all know. What was/should have been THE story of the "Iowa Upset?" Ya think maybe it would have been something along the lines of Kery wins Iowa, Edwards hot on his trail? Really, the Edwards finish in Iowa was the BIG story. But he got virtually no big press out of it because everyone was so busy focusing on Dean.
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LoZoccolo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 12:30 AM
Response to Reply #44
52. No, there was no story without him screaming /and/ the skewed audio.
Edited on Fri Feb-25-05 12:41 AM by LoZoccolo
The skewed audio would have been there if he would have just made a speech like the other candidates made, yet would not be an issue. The skewed audio is a feature of almost any speech anyone makes ever.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 12:44 AM
Response to Reply #52
55. lol. If Dean screams in a forrest and there is no mic . . .

I remember watching the whole assasination as a Green who was prepared to vote for the winner. And thinking, why are they trying to kill this guy?

It's cool now that both Dean and his supports have co-opted the whole thing and wear it as a battle scar. :)
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GodHelpUsAll2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 01:00 AM
Response to Reply #55
59. Well
After the past 4 years, and thinking of the next 4 we should all be screaming!
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mandyky Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-05 11:45 PM
Response to Reply #8
30. Trippi was not let go until after NH
Neal replaced Trippi
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BrklynLiberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-05 11:54 PM
Response to Reply #8
36. That is EXACTLY what it says in this article.

In fact the Dean Scream was a fraud, probably the clearest instance of media assassination in recent U.S. political history.



http://www.tallahassee.com/mld/tallahassee/news/opinion/10964305.htm
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LoZoccolo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-05 11:57 PM
Response to Reply #36
37. I said "premeditated".
Edited on Thu Feb-24-05 11:58 PM by LoZoccolo
I agree they made a big deal out of something that looked worse than it actually was. But the idea that someone set him up is ridiculous.
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GodHelpUsAll2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-05 11:59 PM
Response to Reply #37
39. Why do you find it
so ridiculous?
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LoZoccolo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 12:04 AM
Response to Reply #39
42. Uh, too many things explained by common sense?
And beyond that, I don't think I'll get much further into it. This conspiracy mindset is a pattern of thinking that some people just have, and it's like anorexia or something in that pointing it out and refuting it ain't gonna fix it.
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GodHelpUsAll2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 12:10 AM
Response to Reply #42
46. That response sounds
just like something the Republicans would say when you try and point out the corruptions of this administration. Lots of condescending words, but nothing really said.

"This conspiracy mindset is a pattern of thinking that some people just have, and it's like anorexia or something in that pointing it out and refuting it ain't gonna fix it."

Followed up with lots of gushing and chest beating about the mighty war president that was appointed by God to save us all.

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LoZoccolo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 12:27 AM
Response to Reply #46
50. Difference between this and that.
The explanations they were giving for the war didn't make any sense.

The explanation I gave is like, the easiest to believe.

On the other hand, why do you think it wouldn't be a Republican plot to get us distracted with this Dean scream, an event that happened over a year ago that most people think is no big deal now, to keep our mind off the issues of today like this so-called Social Security reform and events in Iran?
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GodHelpUsAll2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 12:52 AM
Response to Reply #50
58. You didn't give an explanation
Edited on Fri Feb-25-05 12:54 AM by GodHelpUsAll2
at all. I asked a direct question but you gave no explanation other than being condescending and saying "Uh.....common sense".

As for your question of why I wouldn't think it was a republican plot to distract us from the issues of today such as Iran and Social Security. Well, I'm not sure where you are going with that since it has nothing what so ever to do with my original question of Why do you think it is ridiculous to think Dean was set up? I never said anything at all about a Republican plot to distract us a year later by using the year old Dean scream so I won't notice they are trying to destroy Social Security. Well, I do notice. But thanks for being concerned that maybe I didn't.

You may think of it as no big deal. I on the other hand happen to think it a very big deal when the media so blatantly distorts and misrepresents and even when the truth is revealed, continues to air repeatedly the distortion. Not only with the Dean scream but many many other things. That's why they are unable to distract me to the fact that they are working to kill Social Security. Because I don't think it ridiculous to see a "plot" where this administration or the media are concerned.
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LoZoccolo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 01:08 AM
Response to Reply #58
61. Yes I did.
When you record a speech, you generally give the most gain to the speaker's mic. This makes sense. You want to hear what they're saying. They probably didn't even have ambient mics there, it looked real low-profile there, like they were in a warehouse or something. You could watch C-SPAN all day and find that almost all the speeches are recorded this same way. Bush's speeches are recorded this way!

Yes, this is common sense, of course it sounds condescending.

I on the other hand happen to think it a very big deal when the media so blatantly distorts and misrepresents and even when the truth is revealed, continues to air repeatedly the distortion.

I agree. I just don't agree that it was some premeditated plot that his mic was set up just like you would any other time that you wanted to hear what a speaker was saying.

Oh, and by the way, when you deny that this revisiting of the Dean scream is not a plot to distract from the current Bush agenda, you sound just like a Republican trying to distract attention from a plot of their own. I know you notice the other issues of the day. But it sounds to me like you and some other people are trying to distract all the other DUers away from them on purpose.
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GodHelpUsAll2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 07:37 PM
Response to Reply #61
72. LOL
You got me. You figured out the evil plot of a few to distract all of DU from the issues of the day by discussing Howard Dean's death by the media. We thought we had a fool proof plan, I mean after all it is common knowledge that everyone on DU is unable to think about more than one thing and are easily distracted. Except you of course, you are one sharp cookie. How ever did you figure out the evil plot? You are simply brilliant!

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bpilgrim Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 09:14 AM
Response to Reply #42
67. ah, goin with the 'GUT', eh...
well i'm part of the reality based community and am sticking with the EVIDENCE.

Hey-Hey-Ho-Ho Social Security has got to GO!
http://news.globalfreepress.com/mp3/aar/mr/hhhh-ss-long.mp3

peace
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LoZoccolo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 11:30 AM
Response to Reply #67
68. Orwellian.
Wow.
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BrklynLiberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 12:04 AM
Response to Reply #37
43. The DLC and the Repukes were together with the MSM..against Dean.
Edited on Fri Feb-25-05 12:06 AM by BrklynLiberal
You can play semantics with words like "premeditated" and such...but it was a set up, no matter how fancy you slice it.

The DLC fed the tape to the media. They wanted Dean out. The Repukes were only too happy to take the tape and run with it .
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LoZoccolo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 12:29 AM
Response to Reply #43
51. Hoooooooo-boy.
Reagan did a bad thing emptying out those hospitals.
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DefenseLawyer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-05 11:24 PM
Response to Original message
11. Actually it was reported at the time
Edited on Thu Feb-24-05 11:25 PM by DefenseLawyer
that it was an isolated mic, I even remember seeing fairly soon after the event, the actual speech recorded "from the floor" with dean yelling over a raucous crowd. It sounded very different, and had no entertainment/shock value whatsoever. The problem was that no one cared. People either thought it was funny or thought it confirmed their (unfounded) fears that Dean was "crazy".
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GodHelpUsAll2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-05 11:27 PM
Response to Reply #11
14. It was reported after
About a week of being played over and over and over about 500 times a day. And the Oops here is what really happened was reported on one maybe two shows. NONE of the MSM actually came out and said, Hey look, this was a huge misrepresentation, this is what was really going on. Minior mention a few times. That's it.
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DefenseLawyer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-05 11:40 PM
Response to Reply #14
23. Well once it was "out there"
It was replayed by non-news sources like Leno and Letterman and wacky morning DJs repeatedly for comic effect, so even if there had been a "retraction" the damage was done.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 12:09 AM
Response to Reply #11
45. "Crazy"
What are the three buttons pushed on all assasinations? Unstable, unpatriotic, sexual deviant (and, that doesn't mean gay).

They did it to McCain, to Max Cleeland (sp?) and to Dean.
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David Dunham Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-05 11:24 PM
Response to Original message
12. Irrelevant. Dean had already lost Iowa, and Kerry was rolling over him
Dean was already dead meat even before the scream. His Saddam comment and other things had done him him already.
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GodHelpUsAll2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-05 11:30 PM
Response to Reply #12
16. When did media
misrepresentation and blatant distortions become irrelevant?
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mandyky Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-05 11:38 PM
Response to Reply #12
20. His Saddam statement has been proven true for over a year now
The world is no safer since the capture of Saddam Hussein. Our troops in Iraq have lost more comrades since then than before he was captured. Dean was the only "spined" human to tell the awful truth.
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GodHelpUsAll2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-05 11:42 PM
Response to Reply #20
25. Yep
Funny how several of out elected Dems are right there saying the same damn thing now.
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porphyrian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-05 11:43 PM
Response to Reply #12
27. Well, that's one interpretation. - n/t
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 12:12 AM
Response to Reply #12
47. I wasn't /am not a Deaniac (although I can learn :)
Dean did not do himself in. He got Swiftboated as soon as they figured him for the frontrunner.
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mandyky Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-05 11:34 PM
Response to Original message
18. Most Dean supporters know about this
Only ABC news ever followed up the story. The"scream" thing happened the week after Howard Dean told Chris Matthews that "if he was president he do something to change the media".

The clips the media played and replayed, about 1000 times, did not show the crowd or how loud that crowd was. Dean was "screaming" attempting to be heard over the crowd.

All these media outlets put out apologies, but kept replaying the same clip, only ABC did the follow up story.
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BrklynLiberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-05 11:40 PM
Response to Original message
22. 'Dean Scream' clip was media fraud
Edited on Thu Feb-24-05 11:41 PM by BrklynLiberal
Here is an excerpt and link to the original article


<snip>
In fact the Dean Scream was a fraud, probably the clearest instance of media assassination in recent U.S. political history.

Last year, a young cable news producer attended one of our twice-yearly Ethics Institutes at Washington and Lee University, in which students and journalists gather to discuss newsroom wrongdoing. He brought two clips.

The first was the familiar pool footage of Dean in Iowa. The candidate filled the screen, no supporters were visible. Crowd noise was silenced by the microphone he held, which deadened ambient sounds. You saw only him and heard only his inexplicable screaming.

The second clip was the same speech taped by a supporter on the floor of the hall. The difference was stunning. The place was packed. The noise was deafening. Dean was on the podium, but you couldn't hear him. The roar from his supporters was drowning him out.

Dean was no longer scary, unhinged, volcanic, over the top. He was like the coach of a would-be championship NCAA football team at a pre-game rally, trying to be heard over a gym full of determined, wildly enthusiastic fans. I saw energy, not lunacy.
<snip>

more...........

http://www.tallahassee.com/mld/tallahassee/news/opinion/10964305.htm
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HR_Pufnstuf Donating Member (782 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-05 11:43 PM
Response to Original message
28. soundboard recording
little audience noise.

never mentioned when played.








we're baaAAaackkk.
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fishwax Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-05 11:44 PM
Response to Original message
29. I remember the news media talking about this just a few weeks after
it originally happened. Not all of them mind you, but the truth was out there.

Still didn't stop the "liberal media" from playing the distorted version, though. :grr:
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Jim Sagle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-05 11:51 PM
Response to Original message
31. The MSM ain't nuthin' but shit. And that's on a GOOD day.
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Spiffarino Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-05 11:53 PM
Response to Original message
34. I don't care
Screw the Corporate Media....let us embrace the scream. We own it. It's our battle cry!


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Cleita Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-05 11:54 PM
Response to Original message
35. I was so angry about this when it happened because
the first report was right here on DU by anti-Dean factions. They did as much to propagate the scream as the media did to discredit him. So fellow Democrats, you ate your own and that's all I have to say about it.
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GodHelpUsAll2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-05 11:57 PM
Response to Reply #35
38. I agree with you
He had to fight the Dems just as hard as he had to fight the Repubs. The DNC did him no favors at all. I find it sweetly Ironic that he is now the head of the very group that turned their back on him and did everything they could to see him fall.
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mandyky Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 12:25 AM
Response to Original message
49. Dean lost Iowa because Mrs. Vilsack endorsed Kerry
among other things. Dick Gephardt fell on his sword. James Carville ran his mouth (as usual).

I think the comment Dean made that may have had an effect was the one aboout Osama Bin Laden. I had bad dreams about that one. But his point was, in America - "innocent til proven guilty".
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GodHelpUsAll2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 12:34 AM
Response to Reply #49
53. The ad blitz in Iowa
by all the candidates didn't help either. Kerry and Gephardt went negative. Dean followed. The people of Iowa were saturated with calls, flyer's, mailings,you name it. The people I stayed with in Iowa got no less than 10 calls a night. There was push polling, calls at un-Godly hours of the night and a lot of other questionable things going on in Iowa. And the caucus, well that was an event to say the least.
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tuvor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 12:34 AM
Response to Original message
54. Media goes nuts for dean scream but scared of bush's backlump.
:eyes:
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tritsofme Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 12:50 AM
Response to Original message
56. I could tell it was a major gaffe
the second I watched it, live on CNN.

The media didn't create that whole "yarghhhhhhhhhhh!" thing at the end.

Either way, I don't think Dean could have staged a comeback after coming in 3rd in Iowa.
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mzmolly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 09:02 AM
Response to Reply #56
65. Watch this and learn ........ a special mic was used, the noise in the
room was unbelievable. You can't even hear HD on recordings made by others in the room.

http://abc12webops.net/dean_scream.wmv

Let me know what you think after you view the entire clip.
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baba Donating Member (452 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 12:27 PM
Response to Reply #65
69. Wow, great clip.
You can really hear the difference.
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DoNotRefill Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 12:50 AM
Response to Original message
57. I watched it live on c-span....
eom.
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Straight Shooter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 01:00 AM
Response to Original message
60. If it hadn't been that, it would have been something else.
A Repub did laugh at me about the "Dean scream." I just stared at him and said, "How would you like your voice singled out, screaming for your team at the local football game, and played over 700 times on national television?"

He never said another word about it.
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LittleClarkie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 02:11 AM
Response to Original message
64. Funny these "Dean Scream was a fake" articles coming out now
First of all, no duh.

Second, he probably would have appreciated the coverage during the primaries. But this will do.

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SoCalDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 09:10 AM
Response to Original message
66. Sat Feb-07-04... I "pegged" it ..Waaaaaay back :)
SoCalDem (1000+ posts) Sat Feb-07-04 04:19 PM

The "New" Assassins!


Poor Jack Kennedy, Poor Martin Luther King, Poor James Meredith, Poor Malcolm X, Poor Bobby Kennedy...and so many others who were "under the radar", and we never even knew ..

People who dare to speak out are always in fear for their lives, and those named paid the ultimate price for their "free speech".

Had they lived now, in a more "evolved" time, they might have never had to die for their audacity. People who made waves back then were just "dealt with" in the crudest, but most effective way of the day......elimination.. Everyday people were stunned, shocked, saddened, outraged, and then they moved on. Daily life has a way of taking over, and except for a poignant "anniversary" acknowledgment, or the recurring "conspiracy talk", these people just passed into history as tragic figures.

Those assassinations did serve a purpose though. The message sent was loud and clear. Say the Wrong thing, and you are DONE.

In the "modern" world, although there are still assassination attempts here and there, the "serious" ones are not as common . A more efficient way of handling "rogue elements" is the new and improved way...Assassination by Media is the more accepted way now. If one looks back to the period following the Bobby Kennedy assassination, you can see it taking root. Bobby's slaying might have been the straw that broke the camel's back, in that people were ready to say..ENOUGH!!. People took to the streets and things got too "messy" for the old ways to ever work again.

Flash forward to the Watergate era. At first the story dribbled out and people did not pay a lot of attention, but the Washington Post knew they had a story and they kept at it like a junkyard dog. They challenged BIG GOVERNMENT, and they never quit. When the story finally got the attention of the general public, and Nixon was taken down, the press was bolder than ever before.

This was the era of the "white paper".... 60 Minutes was the very embodiment of "make them accountable".. They went after sleazy business practices and governmental screw-ups, and they hit hard.The show they do today is more "individual driven", and is pure tabloid journalism when compared to the way they started. The targets of their "investigation" are often beleaguered people who are already overextended financially by lawsuits or other problems, so they are probably less likely to sue, or they are the pathetic , sympathy-inducing people who have been "done wrong".

Behind the scenes though, there was a group of people who were seething with anger over what had just happened, and they were determined to get things "under control again". This was the beginning of media consolidation. Towns that had once had 2 or 3 competing newspapers, now had only one, television was still the "big three", Republican Think Tanks were sprouting up like toadstools after rain.

Jimmy Carter's tenure was the "test case" for what would come later. This gentle man was attacked in the press for every little thing. The Nixon hangover may have been partly to blame, since people were genuinely more interested in what went on "behind the curtain", but the things that Carter was berated about were just plain silly..Who remembers the "lusting in his heart" episode...or the "attack of the killer bunny".. or the "he wears sweaters in the oval office".."turn down your thermostats"...or "Amy is so ugly".. Those were the memes of the day.. The press chose to amplify these things to make this man appear to be a lightweight. The real problems he encounters as president were things not of his making, and It think he did try to solve them, but with only one term, and the difficulties of the first "oil crisis", and the "hostage thing", he was doomed..

Nightline was born out of the frustration of the hostage crisis. That show started as a one hour news program with a daily update on the hostages.

A rootin-tootin Dubya would have just saddled up (other people's kids) and attacked Iran, and if the hostages were killed, it would have been "collateral damage", but Carter thought he could negotiate them home. This was our first real experience with the "new middle east". They were radical.. They were mad.. They were Bad.The old ways would never work again. Oddly enough, we now know that some of the very same people we associate with the Reagan/Bush , Bush # 1, and Bush # 2 regimes were involved , behind-the scenes , in the Iran Hostage issue.. At the time, I do not recall hearing their names mentioned when Nightline went on night after night, enumerating the "days since....".

The press attacked Carter relentlessly, and I do not recall much rallying on his behalf from anyone, and the hostage crisis did him in. It was not accidental that the hostages were released at the exact moment of Reagan's swearing in. Bush 1 had CIA connections, and the Bush loyalists (the same ones we have now) choreographed the incident masterfully, and the press ate it up. People love a winner, and Reagan came in as a winner. It was also no accident that doing away with the fairness doctrine was high on the list of "things to do".

The republicans were riding high, awash with money, and the public gaze was averted. Inflation was rampant,unemployment was high,there had been wage & price freezes and gas shortages... All in all, people were willing to "be taken care of", and they trusted the grandfatherly guy they had seen in the movies. It was not long before the doctrine was gone, and without that, it was easy for very rich ideologues to start buying up media , and they did it with a vengeance.

Looking back, it's not hard to see how effective it was. The things that have been attributed to Reagan/Bush 1 would have never been tolerated by a Democratic administration.The Clinton years showed us that , in spades.

The switchover was seamless too. Local radio stations had mostly been music, with local hosts who did silly home town pranks, held local contests for their listeners, and had news on the hour. Somewhere during this time frame, "talk/opinion" formats started really emerging, and more and more stations gave up their music formats altogether.

What better way is there to ensure that a particular opinion saturates the public, than to have local radio stations all under the same corporate ownership?. If station ABCD in Omaha is owned by the same parent company as most of the others in the area, the "movement" between stations will not happen. In the past, a radio host could get into a jam with his bosses, and the next week, he was on a competing station in a nearby town, taking a lot of his listeners with him, but when the same people own all the stations, and a host goes against the wishes of his bosses, there is NOWHERE for him to go. The atmosphere of "go-along-to-get-along" stifles any real discussion of opposing ideas.

When the major source of information of a population only airs ONE viewpoint, it's easy to demonize the opposition. The "media people" had , and still have, easy access to their own "facts" that are regularly churned out by the think tanks, they have access to all the "professional speakers/pundits" that they could ever use (also cheerfully provided by the think tanks). These same people are often editorial columnists for the papers , who just happen to be owned by the same people who own/operate the radio & TV stations.. .

There was a time when, once an election was over, people just licked their wounds, accepted that they had lost and then vowed to try again. The "new assassins" in the media cannot ever allow the "quiet time" between elections, because the fires must always be stoked. The potential adversaries must be ridiculed,belittled,scorned, accused and abused, well in advance of the next election so that the "right" people win. The unusual aspect of this , is that since the Fairness Doctrine went by the wayside, it's usually the Democratic candidates who are put through the grinder, while republican candidates with more "baggage" are treated with kid gloves. Any misgivings about a republican candidate can be explained away as a "youthful indiscretion", or a "cute colloquialism" ,or a "miscalculation", or "getting inaccurate advice", and so many more.

A candidate who has all the qualities necessary for office, is attacked mercilessly from the moment they announce they are running for office. The 24/7 media of today is expert at the art of "linguistic assassination", and they have the time to do the job well.

Election 2000 is a prime example of assassination by media. Al Gore was a vice president. He did not wield the power that our current vice president does. He had impeccable credentials, was eloquent, had a squeaky clean family life, and lived modestly considering his position. He was actually considered dull. He never presented himself as a "life-of-the-party" guy.He was the studious guy, who read bills before he voted. He was the guy who did research. He was the guy who actually went to Viet Nam , even though he was not a Green Beret with a bayonet between his teeth, singlehandedly wiping out a division of Viet Cong.The fact is ..He went.

They hammered at him about his wardrobe. Every little gaffe, was portrayed as a LIE. His opponent was secretive, smart-assed, sullen, and unknowledgeable, yet HE was portrayed as "a bit rough", "a nice guy that you would like to have a beer with", " a friendly "people-person", and too many others to list. By implication, HE was the guy with the white hat, the Good Guy, and poor old Gore was the liar with the bad fashion sense, who was dull. The daily indictment and litany of his "sins" was impossible to ignore, and every interview started and finished with him trying to refute the smears aimed at him, and him alone.

The assassins have taken aim this election season, and again they have taken aim and have wounded, if not killed, a few of the possible candidates. The media has moved from a position of watching what happens, and then reporting on it, to MAKING it happen, and then tweaking it to make an ever-better "story"..

The little known governor from a small state ..hmm that sounds familiar... is such a good story. Howard Dean was this cycle's John McCain. The press loved him.....until they had built him up to almost rock-star status, and then the only thing for them to do to get more ratings, was to "kill" him. And so they did.. They report with childlike wonder at why "he's not doing better in the polls", and then they laugh and giggle and "cue up the tape".. Then they put on their scrunched up worried face and wonder if the campaign is broke.. They are "so concerned".. They cluck-cluck to each other about how disappointing it is to see him not doing well, and yet they have already reloaded for the next victim.

Now on to the next willing contestant, John "Botox" Kerry.




By the time the election actually occurs, the candidate has been hopelessly smeared, and politically assassinated.. It not only can remove a candidate from the prospect of elected office, but it effectively silences them as well.

Assassination by media is so much more effective, since the whole "martyr thing" is eliminated and it's not nearly as "untidy" as the old way..

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...
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