Affirmative action: What are your thoughts on the issue?

[prolesunited]

Seems there is a wide disparity of thoughts here, so let's discuss it.

I'll post the poll, but I would hope people take the time to explain their answers.

[livinginphotographs]

1. Generally in favor of it.

I'd like to see more focus on class, but I think it's a good idea overall.

[ultraist]

2. edit

edit, time lapse on loading the page!

Until the playing field is level, we need to implement programs that deal with these discrepancies. If we are not pro active, things will not change.

The Democratic platform is clear on this: Democrats support AA

[livinginphotographs]

14. Actually no, I forgot.

Thanks for reminding. ;)

[Viking12]

3. I don't believe the "scars" LBJ referenced have yet been healed

"You do not wipe away the scars of centuries by saying: 'now, you are free to go where you want, do as you desire, and choose the leaders you please.' You do not take a man who for years has been hobbled by chains, liberate him, bring him to the starting line of a race, saying, 'you are free to compete with all the others,' and still justly believe you have been completely fair . . . This is the next and more profound stage of the battle for civil rights. We seek not just freedom but opportunity—not just legal equity but human ability—not just equality as a right and a theory, but equality as a fact and as a result."

LBJ, in a speech to the graduating class at Howard University, June 4, 1965.

[Trailrider1951]

4. You bet your a$$ I'm in favor of it!!

Having been the recipient of blatant wage, advancement, and academic discrimination for many years, in several different jobs and as a graduate student, I think it is absolutely necessary for anyone who is not a white male to get a level playing field. The only people who want to get rid of affirmative action are either white males or people ignorant of how much discrimination is really out there. :mad: GAWD, how I hate it!!

[DBoon]

5. speaking as a white male

oddly, I've never felt disadvantaged by affirmative action.

White males who complain bitterly about how they have been passed over by women/minorities strike me as losers who were unqualified to begin with.

[UdoKier]

16. I'm not against it either.

But I think it should help disadvantaged people of any color, including poor whites (IE Appalachia)

[tom_paine]

6. Generally against, does it ever expire? We need to formulate an Exit

Strategy.

Seriously, AA certainly served a purpose, it still does. But the benefots are starting to be outweighed by the negatives and the policy is as open-ended as the bullshit War on Terror.

In both cases, leaving the situation open-ended is bad, IMHO. Now, I realize that, given the realities of Imperial Amerika it's an impossibility, but dreaming that I still lived in a Free Country:

What would need to be done is a massive summit with Leaders of both Parties and Civil Rights Leaders to have a frank dialogue about when and how AA would one day come to an end. Would it be tied to African-American income levels or literacy rates or something else? The range of possible criterai is endless and smarter people would hammer the details out.

Now I return to Imperial Amerikan reality, where Lies, Infoganda, and Goebbels v2.0 make having ANY "frank dialogue" a literal impossibility.

(sigh, I hate coming back to the reality of Imperial Amerika, things are much nice in the Free America I hold in my heart)

But the reality is, after a certain point, AA is a detriment not just to minorities, but to society. Yet it still has a worthy function. A bitter Catch-22 indeed.

If America were still free I we could come together as a Free People and solve this thing to at least the partial satisfaction of most.

But Imperial Amerikan bullying and bulldozering makes such dreams almost laughable.

Like asking Hitler to negotiate in good faith with himself.

[devilgrrl]

7. Hey you freeper lurkers!!!

[K-W]

8. The benefits far outweigh the mostly bogus negatives.

We segregated society, we need to desgregate it.

[prolesunited]

9. I really would like to hear from the people

who oppose it or think it's no longer necessary. Make your case. Maybe you'll win some converts.

[BuyingThyme]

10. It's a question of definition and semantics.

On its own, "affirmative action" doesn't mean anything.

[DrWeird]

11. I think people who are against it are racists.

Or just plain stupid. Mostly they're racists.

[prolesunited]

15. Well, that will certainly generate

a productive discussion. I really want to understand why people don't embrace it and calling them names won't encourage them to explain their positions.

[fishwax]

12. I'm in favor of it

and hope for the day when it will no longer be necessary. But I'm afraid that's a long way off and that the last four years have seen regression in race issues. Partly b/c conservatives have been able to sell the myth that AA is reverse racism or that white men have somehow been held back in great numbers as a result.

[Ian David]

13. I'm in favor of it for schools and scholarships, unsure about the rest

One would HOPE that once minorities receive equal education, they would have equal job opportunities.

I said, one would HOPE.

But then there's one time I was put in charge of hiring an intern to work for my company. Two extraordinary college kids showed up. One was an Arab boy from Afghanistan, the other was Asian girl. My boss killed the internship idea instantly.

So, like I said, one would HOPE, but I am not naive enough to think we're all cured of racism yet.

But I am definitely in favor of affirmative action in education. After all, it worked for Bush.

[stillcool]

17. I think very soon it will be a non-issue......

as the rest of society blends itself into the fascist state we are becoming. Just as our govt. encourages others to unite against, so shall we be uniting....as water seeking its own level. We will all be discriminated against equally.

[woodsprite]

18. I've seen it abused so its a toss up

Something needs to be done until we see people as just people and we can see past race, sex, religion.

[prolesunited]

22. In what way have you seen it abused?

Is there a way of preventing the abuse rather than throw out a beneficial program?

You can cite abuse in any program: housing, food stamps, worker's comp, etc. Should we get rid of those as well?

[prolesunited]

19. Who put it's harmful to minority groups?

I really am interested why you would say that.

[gollygee]

20. People mistakenly think that without affirmative action there is no action

But that's not true. Without affirmative action there is negative action - otherwise known as "last hired first fired." Affirmative action balances the negative action that is currently unfortunately natural in the US. Once negative action no longer exists, affirmative action will no longer be necessary. I'm guessing that's a long ways away.

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

21. Generally in favor and PROUD OF THAT FACT

Just last year there were studies demonstrating that people who "sounded" african american or had african american sounding names were less likely to get jobs than others.

There was also a study last year that showed an ex-felon had an easier time getting a job than an african american (not that I think ex-felons should not be able to find work.

Studies also show that up to 10% of people in jail are FACTUALLY innocent and that up to 50% of people behind bars are african american.

Studies STILL show women are paid far less than men for equal work.

So yes, I favor programs that level that playing field since there is no doubt with so much left to do it will surely regress were AA not in place.

[jcappy]

23. in favor BUT

it tends to split oppressed groups into the haves and have nots--an effective wedge for those in power. also, the haves tend to get assimilated pretty quickly and forget any movement they once belonged to and even may have led (loss of leadership) in other words, it can be a way of buying people off, and splitting resistance movements.