If it walks like a Nazi, & talks like a Nazi,.....it's a frikkin' Nazi

[mopaul]

you can refer to it in whatever termonology you wish, but that don't change the facts.

[SpiralHawk]

1. Nazi is as Nazi does

or whatever

"If this were a dictatorship, it'd be a heck of a lot easier, just so
long as I'm the dictator." - GW Bush 12/18/2000. CNN transcript

[AnotherMother4Peace]

9. & he said it with a smirk

I heard him make this statement, & he had that stupid little smirk on his face. It was a very telling & frightening statement. It sent a chill up my spine.

[Career Prole]

11. I HATE the smirk!

Welcome to DU, 'Nother Mother! :hi: :toast:

[newyawker99]

37. Hi AnotherMother4Peace!!

Welcome to DU!! :toast:

[CrispyQ]

40. Can you imagine if a Democrat had said that?

They would have fired up the BBQ & roasted them on a spit.

I told my repuke mother about that quote. Her response? "Oh the liberal media made that up." I've given up on her. She drinks the Kool-aid daily with her master, O'Reilly.

[AnotherMother4Peace]

51. Thanks for the welcome

We teased my sainted, conservative mother when she joined the AnotherMotherForPeace anti-war movement when my brother was in Viet-nam. Now my draft age boys are teasing me about being a radical for joining DU (they're the ones who introduced me to this site, they were tired of hearing me rant at the T.V. & radio). Anyway folks, I think there are a lot of people, like myself, that have gravitated to your site for that good old feeling of democracy, free speech, discussion, etc. And Crispy, tell your mom you know someone who witnessed George Bush make this dictatorship statement on T.V.

[ultraist]

66. Welcome AnotherMother4Peace!

Are you planning on attending a March 19 AntiWar rally?

[begin_within]

2. Wow that is well done.

[mopaul]

5. thanks muchly bob

i think

[benburch]

3. Amen, brother!

None dare call it Fascism.

[Capn Sunshine]

4. AMEN

if you can't point out creeping fascism by it's most notorious form, it certainly limits your options.

[Me.]

6. Are There Nazi Ducks?

cause he sure is walking and quacking like a SS duck. (with all due respect to the ducks of this world)

[mopaul]

7. sure.............

http://beta.justic7.com/irc/[e-mail]/nazi%20duck.jpg

[Me.]

8. I Knew It!

Brilliantly done btw

[Quakerfriend]

10. Very well done!

Can you imagine if * were to grow a cheezie mustache like that?!

[MsConduct]

12. You forgot rules like a Nazi and lies like a Nazi. Great graphics! n/t

[detroitguy]

13. Have to disagree

Bush is MUCH more like Mussolini.

[SpaceCatMeetsMars]

42. I say he's more like Kim Jong Il

Crazy little Daddy's boy had it all handed to him. That's why I don't get what his followers see in him. He lies and bullies like Hitler and Mussolini, but everything else is fake image.

Mussolini was a tough motherfucker and Hitler showed some physical courage. Both were self-made and could give speeches. Both of them even actually did some things for their people -- roads, physical programs, housing, a better economy and so on -- before they brought them to destruction. Bush doesn't do one thing for his followers and he's a big, phony, spoiled baby, but I guess he's THEIR little phony, spoiled brat so they love him.

[Stirk]

14. C'mon- Bush is nothing like Hitler.

Hitler had a little square moustache. Bush doesn't. SEE?!?! They're nothing alike, so stop saying that!

Now if you'll excuse me, the Department of Homeland Security has suggested we watch our neighbors, so I must get back to work.

[Skeptic_All]

15. With all of Mo Paul's Nazi talk.......

makes me wonder if he's just plugging all that fine looking merchandise he links too.

Hmmm............

[Name removed]

16. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Skeptic_All]

17. Relax.............it was a friggin' joke!

Have you completely lost your sense of humour? Good grief!

[mopaul]

19. i am relaxed, and i can still laugh

but i see nazis that look like condi rice and paul wolfowitz, a black woman and a jew. but they are nazis none the less, don't you see it? some friggin joke

[AnotherMother4Peace]

26. history has a habit of repeating itself

The Nazi comparison needs to be made & analized. Many of George Bush's beliefs are eerily similar. What is the phrase about history repeating itself. I'm sure George Bush is ignorant of history. I would add "with all due respect" but I can't.

[radwriter0555]

18. That would be the New Americanazi. Get it right dammit... That's BUSH and

the PNAC.

The New Americanazis. Just rolls off the tongue.

[theresistance]

20. Self-delete

I've decided not to touch this issue...

[Pork Chop]

21. Bush is not a Nazi

He sucks, but he is definitely not a Nazi.

[mopaul]

23. is so

[Dark]

45. Is not times infinity!

[LynnTheDem]

71. Is so times infinity plus 1!

:P :P :P :P :P

[Name removed]

69. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[LynnTheDem]

72. "one of the most ridiculed sites on the planet"??? I don't think so, lol!

And what I do think, I'm not allowed to post. ;)

[Ani Yun Wiya]

74. Which brand of *shit do you prefer?

I would be good to know which, so as to avoid it all costs...

ON EDIT:

Save yourself the shit they spew is toxic and fatal!!!!!!!!

[zmdem]

22. Thanks for being an apologist for the Nazis

By equating Bush and the American government with the Third Reich, you legitamise and trivialise Hitler. Also, why not do your photoshop thing with Stalin ? Certainly a bigger body count there.

[mopaul]

24. i don't care who killed more, pol pot, mao, stalin or bush

a mad dog nazi by any other name

[zmdem]

28. Nice, and thanks for the propaganda (n/t)

[lazarus]

35. Given your avatar

I wouldn't be talking about propoganda and who's the better leader, ya know?

[zanana]

39. Yeah! And what does ZM stand for?

Is it Zell Miller?

[zmdem]

63. Yes (n/t)

[LynnTheDem]

73. Zell Miller;

fake Democrat, fake Progressive, fake Liberal...but a real lunatic bushbot.

[zmdem]

64. What's the problem with my avatar ?

I picked it from the list offered by DU. If you've got a problem with it, suggest to contact the owner of the site.

[Ani Yun Wiya]

41. Hitler WAS trivial...

He did NOT have nukes.

[zmdem]

65. He didn't have cel phones either (n/t)

[Ani Yun Wiya]

75. First: learn to spell....

Then perhaps you can begin to read.

Hell, you might even have a shot a some form of primitive comprehension of the reality you "ra-ra" southin' boyz seem to need.

You know, all of that good old shoot-em-cowboys crap.

I advise that you "stand down" or meet the ghost of Ira Hayes.

[Name removed]

67. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Behind the Aegis]

78. how?

How does comparing the two "legitamise and trivialise Hitler?" I don't understand your line of thinking here. Also, I am unclear how the originator of the thread is an "apologist" for the Nazis? This seems to be disingenuous. Can you expound upon your reasoning on these two questions?

[clem_c_rock]

25. Bush is not a Nazi, he's a f***ing mongoloid. Now, the PNAC...

You couldn't find a better group of SS freaks anywhere.

Hitler created his Reishtag.

PNAC created their 911.


If you believe otherwise, go watch you TV.

[Cats Against Frist]

27. Fascist

We've had this argument on here, lots of times, but I believe that the Nazis are their own thing -- and I need Walt Starr to come on here and back me up, but I think the neocon/corpo-fascist/theocrat triune deserves its OWN fucking term, because, as he's put, "it's something we've never seen before."

Nazi is too historically loaded, and the Nazi type of magical thinking and narrative WAS slightly different than this crowd -- I think by calling Bush Co. Nazis, we're taking away from really nuancing the myriad ways in which they have their own original "fucked-up-ed-ness."

There is, of course, a Nazi lineage, and I do believe several people on the right have retained some of the hardcore philosophy of the Nazis, but I think that this GOP is far more into cultural supremacy than racial supremacy. They're definitely using a fascist vehicle, but while the Nazis seemed to want to create a master race of strong, fit "supermen," this movement seems content to create the fattest, slobbiest putz rolling around in an SUV, which has other connotations, that, to me, liken this to excess, where the German Nazi thing seemed far more disciplined. The GOP seems content for us all to aspire to mediocrity, so long as we drink the Kool Aid -- it's a "feel good" movement. Feel good about how pathetically average you are, how defensive you are and yet still feel like you're fucking entitled to the spoils of the planet, and harbor, somewhere, the idea that Western Civ is superior, in all cases, and therefore, you're justified in your stink.

In short, I respectfully disagree, and think it is a mistake to call them Nazis, because they deserve their own category, and also, using "Nazi" makes it VERY easy for them to de-bunk the argument with their famed "style-over-substance" fallacy: "Wha---? You called us Nazis, you wild-eyed liberals are crazy and a disgrace to America..!"

Whereas, the argument that the GOP form of authoritarian, right-wing statism is, in fact, fascism, is legitimate and well sustained by evidence.

[annabanana]

29. Well Put, C.A.F.

The term Nazi is kind of stuck in amber.

These guys are, in many many ways worse. Their hardware is superior for sure, and the mechanics of supression are nothing short of spectacular (or will be, when they get a little more organized). They are, without a doubt the Nazi's heirs and totally Fascist.

[AnotherMother4Peace]

30. We're talking scary people here

C.A.F. You're right, these guys are masters at diversionary tactics, & a comparison to Nazism would have them squealing about how radical the Democrats are. But, boy oh boy, they are scary, scary people. I used to listen to Rush Limbaugh (before Air America), and I tell you he's not only an elitist, but a bigot and racist.

[greenman3610]

31. People judge Nazis by their body count..

but Bush is running up a pretty
respectable pile of corpses.
he's just doing it overseas.
the violence is translated back to
us by tv, transformed and shaped
to a powerful "message".
The psychic
subtext is, that
you must submit to us
so that we can "protect"
you, or you will be killed.
More like Nazi 2.0.

[Just Me]

56. I have to agree with you Cats.

Mopaul is an extraordinary talent and I greatly respect his work.

However, although the neoCONspirators have certainly expanded on Nazi tactics, they are a breed of their own and far more closely fascism because they are extreme pro-corporatists/capitalists who wield every exteme that exists in this nation. It is also very clear that they are aggressive imperialists as well.

The closest descriptive I can come up with is "Fascimperialists".

[prairierose]

60. Yes, CAF, I prefer to see the term fascist used,

although like you I think there might be a more accurate term. The Nazis were fascists and so are these guys but using the term Nazi does open the door for the cons to call us or anyone who uses it crazy. It also opens the door to those would would minimize the extent of * crimes by saying...he's not a Nazi (or Hitler) look he hasn't killed as many people. He hasn't set up concentration camps. He hasn't ....whatever is next on their pathetic list to prove that he's not the same. It makes no difference, he's headed in the same direction with the same type of ideology, if not a scarier ideology. My problem is with those apologists who apparently do not know the history of the 20th century and refuse to see what is happening now.

BTW, CatsAgainstFrist, welcome to DU.

:hi:

[KG]

32. works for me....

:)

[anarchy1999]

33. mopaul, god love you. Or higher power or whatever..

You are fearless and you help us all with minds open, to see. Thank you. Thank you for being here at DU.

[Strelnikov_]

34. Reminds Me More Of Kaiser Wilhelm II, Pre-WW I Germany

WW I was about securing resources for growing industrial powers.

What we are seeing now are the opening rounds of the new Great Game to secure the last remaining fossil fuel resources for soon to be contracting industrial powers. Look at the China-Iran-India alliances currently being formed.

Seems like 1905 all over again.

. . .

Kaiser Wilhelm II, in an interview with the Daily Telegraph, published on 28th October 1908.

“Germany is a young and growing empire. She has a world-wide commerce which is rapidly expanding and to which the legitimate ambition of patriotic Germans refuses to assign any bounds. Germany must have a powerful fleet to protect that commerce and her manifold interests in even the most distant seas. She expects those interests to go on growing, and she must be able to champion them manfully in any quarter of the globe. Her horizons stretch far away. She must be prepared for any eventualities in the Far East. Who can foresee what may take place in the Pacific in the days to come, days not so distant as some believe, but days at any rate, for which all European powers with Far Eastern interests ought steadily to prepare?”

“Look at the accomplished rise of Japan; think of the possible national awakening of China; and then judge of the vast problems of the Pacific. Only those powers that have great navies will be listened to with respect when the future of the Pacific comes to be solved; and if for that reason only, Germany must have a powerful fleet. It may even be that England herself will be glad that Germany has a fleet when they speak together on the same side in the great debates of the future.”

Sir Edward Grey, Britain's foreign secretary, from an article in response to the comments made by Kaiser Wilhelm II in the Daily Telegraph (November, 1908)

"The German Emperor is ageing me; he is like a battleship with steam up and screws going, but with no rudder, and he will run into something some day and cause a catastrophe. He has the strongest army in the world and the Germans don't like being laughed at and are looking for somebody on whom to vent their temper and use their strength. After a big war a nation doesn't want another for a generation or more. Now it is 38 years since Germany had her last war, and she is very strong and very restless, like a person whose boots are too small for him. I don't think there will be war at present, but it will be difficult to keep the peace of Europe for another five years."

[porkrind]

36. All who think mopaul is exaggerating should read these links:

The Attempted Coup Against FDR:
http://www.webcom.com/ctka/pr399-fdr.html

The 1930s: Nazis Parading on Main Street
http://www.spiritone.com/~gdy52150/1930s.html


We really need to look at history to see where the right-wing comes from.

---

Read about the Right-Wing "Master Plan": http://www.zmag.org/chomsky/sam/sam-contents.html

Have you read "War is a Racket"?: http://lexrex.com/enlightened/articles/warisaracket.htm

Read George Orwell's classic "1984" free online here: http://www.online-literature.com/orwell/1984

[aebrain]

62. US Fascist History

I read somewhere that the US Fascists wanted Jewish influence of the Whitehouse to stop, and to stop the President from dragging us into a foreign war just cos some National Socialist Dictator invaded somewhere.

So they were really more like ANSWER than today's Fascist Zionazi Bushitler NeoCons. A lot of true Leftists can really identify with them, they were a grassroots popular movement demonstrating against the corrupt regime in power then, and in power now.

[itzamirakul]

38. Bush and Hitler....

Same shit, different assholes

[aebrain]

43. Counterexample

If you say Air America is a Nazi front, you're a freakin neo-con troll.

[RandomKoolzip]

52. AIR AMERICA IS A NAZI FRONT.

Happy?

[Dark]

44. Oh please. Stop with the comparisons to Hitler.

Bush is not Hitler, and America is not Nazi Germany. It's not that bad. It's bad, but not that bad.

[bpilgrim]

46. How bout Fascist?

personally i think we are more similar to imperial japan of WWII infamy but, eh, who does nuance anymore :evilgrin:

GEACPS == PNAC

peace

[Dark]

47. That I can kind of see. After all, Japan attacked us because

we were preventing them from getting oil. Always about the oil. . .

[bpilgrim]

48. yep, and their goal of a Greater East Asia Co-Prosperity Sphere is very

similar to our current policies for the ME via PNAC of bringing Peace, Prosperity, and Security.

will the future look back on Fallujah as kindly as we look back on Nanking?



Japanese aircraft bombed south Shanghai Station Aug.28,1937.
About 200 people in the waiting room were dead or wounded by the bombing. A crying baby was left alone after the bombing. - Life Oct. 4, 1937

:cry:

peace

[Dark]

49. Let us hope we meet a better fate than Japan. n/t

[bpilgrim]

54. NUKING a defeated, trying to surrender nations cities filled with INNOCENT

men, women and children... young and old, friend(American POWS) and FOE alike, TWICE... against the advice of ALL military leaders in theater at the time!

that, will certainly be hard to 'top'.

* In his memoirs Admiral William D. Leahy, the President's Chief of Staff--and the top official who presided over meetings of both the Joint Chiefs of Staff and the Combined U.S.-U.K. Chiefs of Staff--minced few words:

(T)he use of this barbarous weapon at Hiroshima and Nagasaki was of no material assistance in our war against Japan. The Japanese were already defeated and ready to surrender. . . .

(I)n being the first to use it, we . . . adopted an ethical standard common to the barbarians of the Dark Ages. I was not taught to make war in that fashion, and wars cannot be won by destroying women and children. (THE DECISION, p. 3.)

more...
http://www.doug-long.com/ga1.htm

Hiroshima is the 2nd most HORRID word in the American lexicon succeeded only by NAGASAKI. - Kurt Vonnegut


peace

[jdj]

50. yeah, we have to keep on keeping score.

he can only be Hitler when he kills ever so many million people.

He hasn't killed enough innocent people.

He's just a wanna-be. That poser.

[Dark]

53. By your logic most of our soldiers in Iraq are as evil as Hitler.

They've all killed someone. :eyes:

[jdj]

55. says who?

where's the link on who's killed who and how many each have killed?

I'd love to see that.

Just as Hitler didn't personally kill very many, if any, of the millions that he orderd murdered, so it is with Bush, or did you forget that part.

(Or maybe you thought Hilter was an evil superhero who killed millions of people just by thinking about them :eyes: )

[Dark]

68. What do you mean 'says who'.

You're the one implying that Bush is as evil as Hitler regardless of the number of people killed. By that logic, many soldiers in Iraq, since there have been over 100,000 casualties, are as evil as Hitler.

I'm not judging by number either. I'm judging by the fact that Bush doesn't want the Iraqis to die. For him, it's bad for business.

Hitler, on the other hand, DID want the Jews to die.

[ThorsHammer]

70. Agreed

[Behind the Aegis]

79. what about a new term?

Maybe we could say he is Hitler-esque? Maybe not in the same vein ('cause face it Shrub is not intelligent enough to be a Hitler), but along similar lines? I see, as do others, very disturbing parallels between the two administrations. Just because we do not have the "work" camps, doesn't mean we aren't headed down the same path.

[leftchick]

57. Many in Europe agree! Same Shit, Different Asshole....

[Q]

58. Read this very carefully...

Fascism Anyone?
Laurence W. Britt

http://www.secularhumanism.org/library/fi/britt_23_2.htm

1. Powerful and continuing expressions of nationalism. From the prominent displays of flags and bunting to the ubiquitous lapel pins, the fervor to show patriotic nationalism, both on the part of the regime itself and of citizens caught up in its frenzy, was always obvious. Catchy slogans, pride in the military, and demands for unity were common themes in expressing this nationalism. It was usually coupled with a suspicion of things foreign that often bordered on xenophobia.

2. Disdain for the importance of human rights. The regimes themselves viewed human rights as of little value and a hindrance to realizing the objectives of the ruling elite. Through clever use of propaganda, the population was brought to accept these human rights abuses by marginalizing, even demonizing, those being targeted. When abuse was egregious, the tactic was to use secrecy, denial, and disinformation.

3. Identification of enemies/scapegoats as a unifying cause. The most significant common thread among these regimes was the use of scapegoating as a means to divert the people’s attention from other problems, to shift blame for failures, and to channel frustration in controlled directions. The methods of choice—relentless propaganda and disinformation—were usually effective. Often the regimes would incite “spontaneous” acts against the target scapegoats, usually communists, socialists, liberals, Jews, ethnic and racial minorities, traditional national enemies, members of other religions, secularists, homosexuals, and “terrorists.” Active opponents of these regimes were inevitably labeled as terrorists and dealt with accordingly.

4. The supremacy of the military/avid militarism. Ruling elites always identified closely with the military and the industrial infrastructure that supported it. A disproportionate share of national resources was allocated to the military, even when domestic needs were acute. The military was seen as an expression of nationalism, and was used whenever possible to assert national goals, intimidate other nations, and increase the power and prestige of the ruling elite.

5. Rampant sexism. Beyond the simple fact that the political elite and the national culture were male-dominated, these regimes inevitably viewed women as second-class citizens. They were adamantly anti-abortion and also homophobic. These attitudes were usually codified in Draconian laws that enjoyed strong support by the orthodox religion of the country, thus lending the regime cover for its abuses.

6. A controlled mass media. Under some of the regimes, the mass media were under strict direct control and could be relied upon never to stray from the party line. Other regimes exercised more subtle power to ensure media orthodoxy. Methods included the control of licensing and access to resources, economic pressure, appeals to patriotism, and implied threats. The leaders of the mass media were often politically compatible with the power elite. The result was usually success in keeping the general public unaware of the regimes’ excesses.

7. Obsession with national security. Inevitably, a national security apparatus was under direct control of the ruling elite. It was usually an instrument of oppression, operating in secret and beyond any constraints. Its actions were justified under the rubric of protecting “national security,” and questioning its activities was portrayed as unpatriotic or even treasonous.

8. Religion and ruling elite tied together. Unlike communist regimes, the fascist and protofascist regimes were never proclaimed as godless by their opponents. In fact, most of the regimes attached themselves to the predominant religion of the country and chose to portray themselves as militant defenders of that religion. The fact that the ruling elite’s behavior was incompatible with the precepts of the religion was generally swept under the rug. Propaganda kept up the illusion that the ruling elites were defenders of the faith and opponents of the “godless.” A perception was manufactured that opposing the power elite was tantamount to an attack on religion.

9. Power of corporations protected. Although the personal life of ordinary citizens was under strict control, the ability of large corporations to operate in relative freedom was not compromised. The ruling elite saw the corporate structure as a way to not only ensure military production (in developed states), but also as an additional means of social control. Members of the economic elite were often pampered by the political elite to ensure a continued mutuality of interests, especially in the repression of “have-not” citizens.

10. Power of labor suppressed or eliminated. Since organized labor was seen as the one power center that could challenge the political hegemony of the ruling elite and its corporate allies, it was inevitably crushed or made powerless. The poor formed an underclass, viewed with suspicion or outright contempt. Under some regimes, being poor was considered akin to a vice.

11. Disdain and suppression of intellectuals and the arts. Intellectuals and the inherent freedom of ideas and expression associated with them were anathema to these regimes. Intellectual and academic freedom were considered subversive to national security and the patriotic ideal. Universities were tightly controlled; politically unreliable faculty harassed or eliminated. Unorthodox ideas or expressions of dissent were strongly attacked, silenced, or crushed. To these regimes, art and literature should serve the national interest or they had no right to exist.

12. Obsession with crime and punishment. Most of these regimes maintained Draconian systems of criminal justice with huge prison populations. The police were often glorified and had almost unchecked power, leading to rampant abuse. “Normal” and political crime were often merged into trumped-up criminal charges and sometimes used against political opponents of the regime. Fear, and hatred, of criminals or “traitors” was often promoted among the population as an excuse for more police power.

13. Rampant cronyism and corruption. Those in business circles and close to the power elite often used their position to enrich themselves. This corruption worked both ways; the power elite would receive financial gifts and property from the economic elite, who in turn would gain the benefit of government favoritism. Members of the power elite were in a position to obtain vast wealth from other sources as well: for example, by stealing national resources. With the national security apparatus under control and the media muzzled, this corruption was largely unconstrained and not well understood by the general population.

14. Fraudulent elections. Elections in the form of plebiscites or public opinion polls were usually bogus. When actual elections with candidates were held, they would usually be perverted by the power elite to get the desired result. Common methods included maintaining control of the election machinery, intimidating and disenfranchising opposition voters, destroying or disallowing legal votes, and, as a last resort, turning to a judiciary beholden to the power elite.

[jdj]

59. Bless your heart.

I love stuff like this.

I wish we could come up with a term besides Fascism, something more vernacular-ish, that people could understand, like "Gomer Pyle-ism" or something.

[porkrind]

61. I think we're almost there

:(

[Ani Yun Wiya]

77. AGAIN, THANK YOU.

Sir

As always, I MUST AND WILL, SALUTE YOU AND YOUR INTEGRITY.

[Skittles]

76. I call 'em fascist bastards

same thing though

[Ani Yun Wiya]

80. Nazi is a good start...

It appears that * and Condi-snake also "walk like an Egyptian" in the manner of the Pharoahs of old.

They also max out on the matter of being Crusaders.

Their style also echoes that of Custer, genocidal in nature and a crime on this, MY GRANDFATHER'S LAND, GIVEN BY THE GREAT SPIRIT AS A GIFT FOR ALL TO SHARE.