Why Bush will go down

[Pobeka]

Folks, it doesn't matter if Tenet takes the blame. What matters, is before the first shot was fired, Bush knew the evidence he used to get congress to give him full control was fabricated.

He had plenty of time to go back to congress and disclose the error, but he didn't. He instead chose to commit men, women and children to their deaths based on that error.

We know he is a worthless piece of trash, with no regard for human life. Now we have proof.

Everyone needs to write, call their representative in congress about this. They were used too, whether they like it or not.

[iH8repukes]

1. One little problem . . . SOTU speech was 2 weeks after war vote.

Congress had already given Bush war authority two weeks before he gave his SOTU speech. So anyone congressman who claims he was mislead about Niger document must have been mislead AFTER they voted to give Bush power.

I stopped getting my hopes up about this. Bush/Rove will find some way to wiggle out. I just don't think the majority of Americans give a shit about one document. They don't think Bush went to war over one document.

If we really want to bring Bush down, we've got to prove Bush was told that the Niger document was bogus before his SOTU. So far . . . no proof. But I keep praying . . .

Gore in '04

[Pobeka]

2. No, the timing of SOTU is irrelevant

Bush had the opportunity to report the error to congress before the war started, and he didn't. Even if he found out 1 day before the war, he should have reported it to congress. He used congress. It is a lie of ommission, but a lie none the less.

[Pobeka]

4. Powell

Powell is saying they new there was something wrong with the Niger thing which is why he didn't mention it to the UN.

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

3. So far...no proof.

:wtf:

The proof is everywhere.

[Pobeka]

5. Thread 4 was supposed to be a reply to this. :-(

[Pobeka]

16. Many a congressperson was misled

about the nuclear issue WAY before the SOTU speech. Remember, the vote giving Bush free reign to invade Iraq was given before the 2002 elections?

Go find Waxman's letter to the president.

[number9]

6. unless a miracle happens and the House of Representatives

becomes controlled by the Democrats, he will continue to skate away unscathed. I wish there ws more interest and focus on retaking the House - at least some kind of strategy. It's beyond me how ordinary Americans can see what that chamber of horrors accomplishes week after week and not respond in disbelief.

[Pobeka]

7. When I say "go down"

I don't mean impeach, I mean won't win the next election.

Even the repubs in congress like to think they know what's going on.

This will hurt Bush's standing in his own party.

[number9]

9. I think it will only hurt his standing in his own party

if the people finally rise up and demand investigations - open investigations. It won't happen. If 9/11 couldn't do it, nothing can. Sorry to sound so negative about it, but after years of watching this country be completely bought and sold, I don't think for a minute that he'll go down. Just my opinion :)

[Pobeka]

12. politicians don't like to be irrelevant

They get into it because they want to be important. They want to call the shots, at least have a say in it.

Call your representative. Tell them they were made irrelevant by a dishonest president. How do you think they are going to feel, regardless of which side of the aisle they're on? They're going to feel left out. They won't like that.

[Imajika]

8. Bush will not go down

The problem here is that far too many get way too excited with every Bush administration scandal.

Scandals happen in every administration. It is VERY, VERY hard to impeach a President or force one out of office.

Things like ENRON, Bush Knew, Cheney Energy Papers and Niger-Uranium come along and everyone on DU jumps to the conclusion that Bush is going to go "down".

It is just not likely to happen that way. This actually adds to the cynicism and feelings that Rove is somehow all powerful (which he is most definately not).

Expectations are way to high. Instead of thinking that every scandal will bring Bush "down", just think of all of these scandals as chipping away at his popularity and credibility.

We need to focus on 2004. Just assume Bush will be in office for the next election. Now think of all these stories, issues and scandals as dents in his armor - sometimes small, sometimes larger.

With the right candidate and a good campaign we should be able to use all of these scandals to our advantage and be running for the big prize against a much weakened Bush.

Imajika

[Pobeka]

10. The problem with those other scandals

Is they did not see the light of day. This is staring everyone in the face. There is no squirming out of it.

Bush could have come clean with congress before he committed men, women and children to their deaths.

Call your representative. Tell them they were made irrelevant by a dishonest president.

[enough]

11. To repeat, Pobeka is talking about 2004 election, not impeachment

We're not talking about impeachment. With this Congress, that's practically impossible. We are talking about Bush loosing the election in 2004, which seems NOT impossible at this point. That will be good enough for me.

[union_maid]

13. Chipping away..

I'm not looking to impeach him. Impeachment can be a very undemocratic thing as we've seen. I'm just looking to elect someone else. This latest thing isn't a huge bomb, but we're chipping away. This administration thought they had a blank check to do anything they liked after 9/11 and that they could just brush off any legitimate criticism like a speck of dust. They're getting a wake-up call on that, and that's the important thing. I really think a lot of people took comfort in seeing them as infallible. It's scary times and feeling like the people in charge of taking care of us are on top of everything is better than believing we're being led by a bunch of madmen who are twisting facts to jive with their own personal reality. That's a very uncomfortable thing to believe, but it's a truth that's starting to emerge it seems.

[Pobeka]

14. It's about honesy, integrity

All those things dubya said he'd bring to the White House.

He had the chance to tell congress before the war started that the nuclear argument was bogus. He didn't. He sent humans to their death instead of being honest, and re-enaging congress in an open discussion with the true facts.

[calimary]

15. We also need to write to MSNBC and thank them for Keith Olbermann!

His report last night was STELLAR! Complete with Buck-Passing references, AND a healthy helping of the anti-bush "Army Times" editorial.

PLUS - Andrea Mitchell's report during his program was actually worth watching. She actually bothered to add, right at the end, how the CIA had followed Tenets "falling on his sword" by releasing proof that it had repeatedly warned the administration about the bogus Niger paper. That was her closing line before her sign-off. Therefore, that's the last thing you remember...

[iH8repukes]

17. Probability that Bush knew Niger document forged: 60%

Probability that anyone can prove that CIA told Bush himself that Niger document forged: 10%

Probability that anyone in the 70% of the country who claim to be moderates or repukes give a shit about Niger document: 2%

Gore in '04

[Pobeka]

18. See my post 14

This is about Bush's character. He promised honesty, integrity.

We've been handed this one to us on a silver platter.

Don't play it down. "If you give up, you are certain to fail."

This one is worth a shot. It plays to the moderates. It plays to the moderate Christians, who do care about honesty and integrity.

[iH8repukes]

19. I hope you are right. But I'm 98% sure you are wrong.

All the moderates I know, including myself, think that intelligence is imperfect. That intelligence is full of assumptions. That intelligence is often wrong. That the CIA had plenty of opportunities to take out the sentence on Niger if they in fact felt strongly enough that it was wrong. That someone in the CIA screwed up and didn't warn Bush that the Niger document was suspect. That if someone had in fact warned him directly that the Niger document was forged, he would have taken it out of the SOTU. It was such a small, small part of the evidence he used to decide on going to war.

Now, I'm sorry I'm not running around screaming that we need to impeach Bush. And I'm sorry that no one has convinced me that anyone other than liberals gives a shit about this document. No, I'm not going to get excited about this issue until someone with credibility steps up and says "I told Bush the document was phoney before the SOTU" address. THEN, I'll get excited.

[demgrrrll]

20. Nice deflection but no cigar. Bush is responsible for the words that come

out of his mouth. Tenet purposefully uses a passive voice in his mea culpa to allow further investigation of his statements. If todays NYT op ed is any indication of the CW then this isn't going away anytime in the near future.

[iH8repukes]

21. You can think that all you want.

I don't believe for a second that middle America will blame Bush if one piece of evidence out of tens of thousands of pieces of evidence is bogus. UNLESS he knew beforehand that the evidence was bogus. AND it can be proven that he knew beforehand. THEN I'll believe Bush will get hurt by this story. Not until then.

Look, Bush is positively the worst president in my memory. But I'm not going to get all caught up in a story that I don't think has a snow-balls chance in hell of bringing down his presidency. I'm sorry! I pray I'm wrong. But you can get as excited as you want.

And by the way, I take great exception to your stupid comment about "deflection". Deflecting from what? What are you trying to say? Are you implying that I'm some sort of Bush apologist? If you are, you can go fuck yourself. I wish he would eat shit and die. But that doesn't mean I'm going to go crazy everytime I hear of another Bush scandal. There's already been plenty of scandals to take him down. This is just another one. I'll believe Bush is going down when I see polls showing him below 50% or so approval AND another poll showing a democrat candidate with appeal across the middle of the electorate.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

22. He's Down to 59%

The 48% who voted for Bush in 2000 will be with him to the
end. Our challenge is to get the 51% who voted for Gore and
Nader. It's doable with the right candidate.