Attention FLORIDIANS: Have you actually SEEN the Bush Billboard?

[Stephanie]

I suspect this billboard pic going around may be a photoshop.

Our intrepid reporter needs to know. If you've seen it, can you get another picture? And then can we get the attorneys on it? If it's a fake we need to know that too.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=104&topic_id=2735920&mesg_id=2735982&page=

rawstory

30. CLEAR CHANNEL DENIES BILLBOARD EXISTS

I just called their press person in Jacksonville. You KNOW this billboard exists, guys, you've seen it? Because I can't even write about it. I'm sending their sales person in Jacksonville the photo now, but he says it's not actually there and probably photoshopped.

The other threads have discussion on the billboard itself. I am just asking for FL witnesses - have you SEEN it? Does it actually exist? If so, please pinpoint the location. Thanks!

[Inland]

1. A Media Corporation foisting a Cult of Personality

Scarier than simply having a political view, or buying candidates, Clear Channel's message is simply Bush Is Leader.

No discussion. No issues. No reasoning. Just stating it as a fact not up for discussion--from a media giant.

Fascism is here.

[Kathy in Cambridge]

2. How Orwellian

:scared:

It's also from the "Cult of Personality" playbook a la Stalin and Hitler.

[jokerman93]

66. Correction

A la Sun Myung Moon.

And I'm deadly serious about that speculation.

[Ganja Ninja]

3. I haven't seen one yet but as soon as one pops up ...

I'll go out and buy a new paint ball gun.

[Skidmore]

4. Where are the graffiti artists when you needs one? nt

[tk2kewl]

5. here...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=105&topic_id=2047051

[papau]

9. So where is it - Fellow says FL,, then DUer helnwhls says Illinois

helnwhls (1000+ posts) Sat Nov-20-04 06:58 PM
Amazingly, they left it up almost all summer. This was outside a small IL town.

[Stephanie]

11. It's beginning to sound like urban legend

We may see it on Snopes soon.

[vinnievin777]

6. sometimes

You throw your hands in the air and say
"I don't know what to do"

Vinnie Vin
http://www.vinnievin.com

[Walt Starr]

7. If you ask me, it's clearly a photoshop

Look at the line between the photo of Bush and the rest of the billboard. Also, look at the text on the billboard:

Our Leader.

There would never have been a period on a real billboard.

somebody photoshopped this and is passing it off to discredit DU.

[peekaloo]

10. Could someone give an ACTUAL location of this "billboard"?

I'll be 50 miles from Orlando this week and would love to photograph it!

:eyes:

[Stephanie]

13. That's the problem

So far, no one can give a location. It's looking more and more suspicious.

[Walt Starr]

15. It's a blatant falsehood

Go to the thread in question, click on Vote4Kerry's profile. One would think with a name like that they would have been a DUer prior to the election.

:eyes:

[davhill]

29. Yes

Approaching downtown Orlando from the North on Interstate-4. The first one appears just after the Lee road interchange on the East side of the freeway. The second one (The one I photographed) is on the West side just south of the Fairbanks interchange but it faces southbound traffic from across the freeway

[peekaloo]

54. Thank you.

[UL_Approved]

16. Check the file with a text editor

This picture was saved at a low-quality compression, which explains distortion around the edges.

Method: Save the picture, and open it with NOTEPAD! You can read text at the beginning of the file. It was apparently taken with a NIKON E2500, firmware v1.1, at 2004:12:20 20:32:28. This date and time is either the firmware date or timestamp of the photo.

As a comparison, take a look at this photo, an immediate photochop:



If you open it up, you can see ADOBE and Ducky as text at the beginning. There is NO tag like that in the original. This has a high likelyhood of being authentic.

[fob]

17. Can you make one that reads - Our Apologies!

[UL_Approved]

18. Talk to DUer demnan

He posted the edit on this thread:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=104&topic_id=2735920#2735969

[Stephanie]

19. 2004:12:20 ---> December 20, 2004?

?

[UL_Approved]

21. That is what is in the file

You have to save the picture to you harddrive, and then use Notepad to open it. Mixed in with random characters is the text I posted earlier. The clock must be set wrong in the camera used for the original photo.

[Walt Starr]

22. Yep, they didn't use photoshop, but these editting commands are there

too:

COLOR BASIC AUTO AUTO AF-S RED-EYE €" è AUTO AUTO OFF d d OFF


Probably used some basic editting tool that came with the Nikon.

[UL_Approved]

23. Are those settings verified?

Do they come from an editing program, or are they settings used in the camera at the time of the picture? I don't know, please check this out.

[Walt Starr]

25. Could be camera settings, might not be

Microsoft tools don't save those sorts of headers.

But my original point stands. Look at the angle of the line between the Bush photograph and the rest of the billboard then look at the angle of the line of the right edge and then the left edge of the billboard.

It doesn't fit the perspective. The line between the Bush photograph and is 100% perpindicular to the entire phtogrpah while the edges fit the perspective. That line is a clear indication this photo has been monkeyed with.

[UL_Approved]

27. I think the portrait was added, but

the rest seems to follow perspective distortion from the point of view of the camera. Whoever did this knows enough about photoediting to not modify plain-text tags within the file. I wish I had some analysis software for laying the billboard face out as a flat sheet. That transform would tell right away if the photo was fake (the edge would not be straight on the portrait).

[Walt Starr]

32. I can prove it was photoshopped

Clikc the below link and look at the redlined version. Look at the post underneath the line between the portrait and the rest of the thing:

[UL_Approved]

34. I was thinking the same thing

My only question is, however, what about the rest of the billboard? Was it rendered, VERY carefully photochopped, or done in an advanced editing program designed for this sort of thing? The lighting is also wrong on the portrait: it is too flat. The rest of the sign looks authentic, though. If somebody is able to spoof the ENTIRE photo, I want their number.

[Walt Starr]

35. Just wash out parts of it and insert the text you want

Keep the clearchannel crap at the bottom.

Notice also, the "second photo" in the thread has the billboard at ground level to the highway. No posts at all and the sign is even more washed out.

I don't buy it.

[UL_Approved]

38. Well, it looks like we need confirmation to settle

I don't know what else to say besides what I posted on plain-text information embedded in the file. I am still a little disturbed at how they got the text alignment for perspective distortion and how they got the lighting. I wonder if the middle text was changed and the portrait was added, but nothing else. This could have come from a political ad somewhere.

[NervousRex]

33. If it must be done....

This spotted in western KY.

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

8. I'm willing to play dirty

Even if it IS photoshopped, if it's spread enough it will get more "mind-share" than the rebuttal. Works for them. Works for us.

[Katarina]

12. I'll ask my husband and son to keep an eye out

They are going to Jacksonville this afternoon. I'll see if he will take the camera with him just in case. I'll let you know this evening if he finds it.

[Village Idiot]

14. I wonder that it does not say:

Ein Volk.
Ein Reich.
Ein Fuhrer.

[Ducks In A Row]

20. it doesn't seem to really exist.

if it did, there would be more photos from different locations to prove it.

[davhill]

26. Here is another view of the same

This was taken from accross the freeway

[Stephanie]

40. What freeway? Did you take this picture?

Is that your website that it's posted to? Can you verify that it's legit?

[davhill]

42. Yes

I-4 North of downtown orlando on the West side facing south near the intersection of Fairbanks.

[Stephanie]

44. DING DING DING DING DING!!! We have a WINNER, ladies and gentlemen!

Thank you! Got it everyone? I-4 North of downtown Orlando -

Would you be willing to have your pix published by a reputable online newssource? I am going to point rawstory to your post. Thanks davhill!

[davhill]

46. By all means do so

Here is the third (and worst) of the pictures I have uploaded. I think the experts should be convinced by now that they were not photoshoped.

[Vote4Kerry]

48. Davhill, thank you so much for getting truth out

Really appreciate it buddy!

[Walt Starr]

67. That picture was the one that convinced me!

The reason being is I could clearly see the offest from the sign itself compared with the support structure which demonstrated why the perspective was actually not skewed!

[Vote4Kerry]

47. What about the denial by Clear Channel?

Clear Channel is denying the billboards exist. What can we do if we catch them in their lie?

[Stephanie]

49. I don't know about the lie, but the fact they put this up shd be an issue

for the lawyers. This should jeapardize their status under the FCC, IMO.

[rawstory]

55. Still don't have enough info for a story; single source photographs

Clear channel denies it and there are three photos taken by the same person -- this doesn't provide enough evidence for a story. I need independent shots. Also, the blurriness of each of the photos in and around the text of the billboard doesn't check out graphically.

I apologize for skepticism, but as I would be relying on only ONE person to be my eyes and ears and the company denies it, I can't go on that one person's word unless I know them personally and trust them. A few other folks saying they've seen it is great, but I have to as a journalist remain skeptical.

[Vote4Kerry]

56. Go to I-4 in Orlando (near Princeton and Fairbanks interchange)

you should see it. Hope that helps!

[Stephanie]

57. If you'll pm davhill, at his post above, he will verify

Also there are several corroborating posts, including one below from someone who saw the same billboard in Fresno. You have the location. I think that davhill would speak with you by phone if you like. You have the exact location, so I guess what's needed now is a call to someone you can trust in Florida to verify and possibly get a better picture.

*edited - sorry, got dave's name wrong!

[davhill]

58. I am sorry I am the only source

I cannot believe that no one else on DU has seen them. They are impossible to miss going either Northbound or Southbound. In the entire Orlando metropolitan area there must be someone who drive I-4 and checks out DU! I have not seen the one in Jacksonville, of course, but others have. I am sure verification will come soon. I am also pretty sure that Orlando is being used as a "test market" and these signs will blight every freeway in our land soon, if no one objects strongly to them now.

[rawstory]

59. Yeah..

not trying to burst your bubble or say either way what i feel about the veracity of your report, just need other folks who've seen them. the specific address should help once i get clear channel on the phone again. they should be able to trace it very quickly.

[davhill]

61. I found another source

A letter to the Editor of the Orlando Sentinel (registration may be required)
http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/opinion/letters/orl-edple20112004nov20,1,6430675.story

[Name removed]

24. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Vote4Kerry]

28. Check I-95 near I-10 Junction

Man, not allowed to be using computer at work like this..anyways sorry to have caused such a controversy. Here is the source from where I got information:


http://forum.therandirhodesshow.com/index.php?s=dc433bf60ac75886963f9f6e18f3a87b&act=ST&f=12&t=38200&st=105

This is who I heard owns the signs:

Clear Channel Outdoor
5333 Old Winter Garden Road
Orlando , FL 32811
Phone: [phone]
Fax: [phone]

This is a group that has been putting up Bush signs (link)

http://www.frwsb.org/GOP-Billboard.htm

I hope this helps in your investigation!

[Stephanie]

41. Thanks! Randi's board says it's on I-4, or I-95?

Any DUer's near there to check it out?

http://forum.therandirhodesshow.com/index.php?s=cead047375f1b04598848a818b3a984c&act=ST&f=12&t=38200&st=0

Nope no joke... it's on I-4 heading into Orlando....

++++++++++++

No you aren't Rev! hahaha... My sister emailed me, it's on I-95 near the I-10 junction.... they just put it up Saturday....

+++++++++++

[Vote4Kerry]

43. Here's another pic (different angle)

[bear425]

30. No, but on a recent road trip I saw an old one that said:

Vote for George W. Bush... Like your life depends on it.

Sickening

[Miami Liberal]

31. I'll be in Orlando this weekend

and will be on the lookout for any of these signs.

[TSIAS]

36. I saw a similar creepy billboard

It read something like "Thank you President Bush, Tony Blair, and our troops for having the wisdom to protect America". There was a giant picture of Bush on the billboard.

It's located right before the SR-50 (Titusville) exit while traveling Northbound on I-95.

[kerry-is-my-prez]

37. I think this will backfire.... It looks too orwellian/stalinist.

Like someone said it reminds them of the posters of Saddam in Iraq. I hope they put them up on every street corner and billboard around. It will start to freak people out. Show them that this country is just like the U.S.S.R. with all of their posters of Stalin.

[immoderate]

45. Sounds like a plan

If we put up lots of posters with Bush picture, and it says Our Leader, how could they complain, and it would perhaps have the desired effect of showing how decadent our system has become.

Just a thought.:think:

--IMM

[Minstrel Boy]

39. Looks to me like some pixels show artifacts of photoshopping.

I suspect a hoax.

[GOPNotForMe]

50. It's real.

My friends from Orlando drove up to visit me this weekend and told me all about it when they got here. They were rightly pissed the hell off.

[Liberal Mommy]

51. This is what I can tell you about EXIF data

Almost all new digital cameras save JPEG (jpg) files with EXIF (Exchangeable Image File) data. Camera settings and scene information are recorded by the camera into the image file. Examples of stored information are shutter speed, date and time, focal length, exposure compensation, metering pattern and if a flash was used.

Since EXIF information is exclusive to the JPEG, the data will not be in an image if saved in another format such as TIFF. If you edit an image in certain image editing programs, EXIF data can also be lost. Remember, always edit copies of originals.

EXIF DATA FROM YOUR DIGITAL CAMERA

This is the type of camera the pics were taken with Nikon Coolpix 5200


The IP of the pic davhill posted is from a Florida road Runner account home.cfl.rr.com

[Walt Starr]

52. I APOLOGIZE, I NOW BELIEVE THESE THINGS ARE REAL!!!

And that fact terrifies me.

[Stephanie]

53. I'm glad we asked

Now that we know, perhaps that Clear Channel guy would like to explain himself. HE's the one who first said it didn't exist and was photoshopped. Now that we've verified it's real, let's see what he has to say.

[Lorien]

60. No, and I travelled past that intersection Friday

(headed towards Daytona) unless it went up this weekend? :shrug:

[Stephanie]

62. Really? Can you get someone to take a look?

Since I know you and remember your posts from early days when we were working on logos and such and you did the cartoon of Bush's lapdogs - (why did you change your name, BTW?) - do you think you could get someone to drive by and take a look? Location:

There are two actual billboards and anyone who commutes down I-4 near the Fairbanks or Princeton interchange cannot miss them.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=104&topic_id=2735920&mesg_id=2736455&page=

[Vote4Kerry]

64. Verification from Orlando Sentinel (article)

Don't know if this helps, but here is a link to an article in the Orlando Sentinel which talks about these monstrosities:

Posted November 20, 2004

Billboard message

On my way to work Wednesday morning, I looked up and saw a giant billboard with a picture of George W. Bush and the words "OUR LEADER" under it. The first thing I thought was, when was the last time I have seen a president on a billboard? What is going on? Didn't Saddam Hussein have his picture up everywhere? What next, a statue?

I am so concerned with our country and the division. I still stand by my vote, which was for John Kerry. George W. Bush has a lot of work to do to change the way I feel. Putting him up on a billboard does not make him a better president. His actions speak louder than words.

I wonder if anyone else finds the president's picture on a billboard odd? I'm sorry, but it reminds me of countries with dictators, and it seems people are making him out to be the messiah, the savior of our world.

Fear, fear, fear. I'm tired of being afraid.

[Liberal Mommy]

65. Orlando Sentinel Link

Orlando Sentinel Link

[Stephanie]

71. Thanks! The letter:

Posted November 20, 2004

Billboard message

On my way to work Wednesday morning, I looked up and saw a giant billboard with a picture of George W. Bush and the words "OUR LEADER" under it. The first thing I thought was, when was the last time I have seen a president on a billboard? What is going on? Didn't Saddam Hussein have his picture up everywhere? What next, a statue?

I am so concerned with our country and the division. I still stand by my vote, which was for John Kerry. George W. Bush has a lot of work to do to change the way I feel. Putting him up on a billboard does not make him a better president. His actions speak louder than words.

I wonder if anyone else finds the president's picture on a billboard odd? I'm sorry, but it reminds me of countries with dictators, and it seems people are making him out to be the messiah, the savior of our world.

Fear, fear, fear. I'm tired of being afraid.

Dianna Lawson

http://orlandosentinel.com/news/opinion/letters/orl-edple20112004nov20,1,6430675.story



Orlando

[Lorien]

68. I can take a look tomorrow

I don't live far from there.

I changed my name because I use "Lorien" on a number of other boards, and it just makes it simpler for me. Plus, plenty of people on DU have the name "Jen" in their username, so it was getting as confusing as my senior year in High School, where there were so many "Jennifers" in my classes that they started giving us numbers (thus I was "Jen6").

[nickgutierrez]

63. What the hell?

Dictatorship, here we come...

[rawstory]

69. Called the Sentinel and Clear Channel

The Orlando Sentinel: No one knows anything about the billboard. Left a message with their letters editor who might have checked the letter for accuracy.

Clear Channel Jacksonville: "That doesn't sound accurate." (re: I-95 and I-10 sign) Going to call corporate and say they'll have someone call me back.

Clear Channel Orlando: No media person available this week.

[Liberal Mommy]

70. I just talked to Michael Murphy

I just posted about what he told me. It does in fact exist!

Verification

[Skinner]

72. This billboard has got to be fake.

The small text at the bottom is too legible, too sharp, and too white. I use Photoshop a lot, and that looks like PhotoShop. I'd be curious to actually see the high-res original of this photograph (if it even exists).

Also, the disclaimer is highly dubious: "A political public service message..." A political public service message?

Unless and until someone can come up with some sort of independent verification that doesn't come from an anonymous person on an internet message board, I'm locking.

ON EDIT: I still think this is fake, but after an appeal we have decided to unlock the thread and permit discussion to continue.