Tanks in the streets at LA antiwar protest

[JackieO]

LOS ANGELES, November 9, 2004 - At 7:50 PM two armored tanks showed up at an anti-war protest in front of the federal building in Westwood. The tanks circled the block twice, the second time parking themselves in the street and directly in front of the area where most of the protesters were gathered. Enraged, some of the people attempted to block the tanks, but police quickly cleared the street. The people continued to protest the presence of the tanks, but about ten minutes the tanks drove off. It is unclear as to why the tanks were deployed to this location. Uploaded here is video from the event.

http://la.indymedia.org/news/2004/11/118865_comment.php#118868

[nickgutierrez]

1. What the hell???

Tanks.

TANKS.

I don't know what to say. I'm stunned.

[man4allcats]

28. I can't say I'm shocked.

I was 21 years old in May of 1970 when on the 4th day of that month National Guard troops shot to death four Kent State University students, Allison Krause, Jeffrey Miller, Sandra Scheuer, and William Schroeder, who were involved in a protest against the war in Vietnam. As tragic as that was, at least at that time America was still united in its belief in democracy. It was only Nixon and the military industrial complex that needed convincing. That is no longer the case. On November 2nd the people spoke just as people once spoke in Germany to elect Adolf Hitler. Remember today's date. These two tanks are the first we have seen. They won't be the last. God help us.

[MagickMuffin]

65. From my understanding of documentaries I've seen

Some of those students murdered were not protesting. Some just got caught in the cross fire on their way to class!

But I wasn't there so I only know what I've seen on the TV, and articles that I've read.

It is not right in any case for the military to raise up against the citizens of this country.

[HughBeaumont]

82. Sandra and William weren't involved in the protest.

In fact, Schroeder, a Lorain, Ohio native, was in ROTC and shot while in uniform. Just before the firing began, he told one of his friends walking past the Guard "Don't worry, they aren't using real clips."

[Sequoia]

148. I was thinking of Kent State on my way to work

this morning as CSN&Y were on the radio. Damn, LA my second home! I was there during the riots after the Rodney King Jr. case and they had those HumVs rolling down Lincoln Blvd. But tanks, good lord. Be careful Angles!!!!

[RapidCreek]

168. This was a test balloon....They want to see how or if the great unwashed

will react, whether the media will cover it, and whether anyone will investigate who gave the order for the tanks to make an appearance and call to task whoever was responsible.

I agree....stand by for much more of this.

RC

[skylarmae]

119. CAN YOU SAY KENT STATE?

[lil-petunia]

232. Ask why nothing in the news?

Send letters. Call the senate. Call the congresscreatures. Call any and everyone.

this is insane.

[nickgutierrez]

234. That's the other question.

This should be all over the news. Is this not newsworthy? TANKS were pulled out in front of a crowd of protestors.

[freeplessinseattle]

2. christ almighty (nt)

[underseasurveyor]

5. I love your name

LOL that's great :hi:

[freeplessinseattle]

34. thank you! we could always use a smile, especially now. I love you DU!

[underseasurveyor]

40. We are glad you're here

:toast: Welcome :toast:

[JSJ]

3. the 'frog' is being boiled alive- is that a federal or state weapon?

[underseasurveyor]

4. And so it begins

:grr:

[lucabrasi]

18. Thomas Jefferson

The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants. It is its natural manure.

[underseasurveyor]

23. One of my favorite on line friends has said that for years.

Yeah :sigh: :-(

[goclark]

117. I live in LA and all I heard was

that they switched a jury member for Scott Peterson.

Well, I also heard that they had a gunmen held someone captive in down down LA. He was protesting mexicans being in prision.

My, my what have we come to!

If it could happen in LA, it could happen anywhere!

Get ready,THEY are coming after us!

[idiosyncratic]

179. I get the Channel 4 news here in SD County and I never heard

anything about this. Nothing. Nada. Zip. Zero.

I only heard the "breadking news" about the Mexican Consulate kidnapping and heard about the Scott Peterson trial.
:puke: :puke: :puke:

[Swamp Rat]

6. Just wait until battle hardened troops return to the USA

We will become moving targets in a deadly video game.

[havocmom]

155. Look for the return of only those troops who sign those 'pray for bush'

pledges. All others will be held hostage overseas by our government for the duration of the war at home.

There is a reason the reserves & guardsmen got sent overseas. The junta does not any and real 'citizen soldiers' stateside. They learned much watching the fall of the USSR. They learned that young men in uniform, in most instances, will not fire on their grandmothers and mothers.

Man, so much whirling through my brain right now. So many pieces failing into a picture.

All the new highways they have been working on here in Montana in the middle of nowhere... we teased that they were expecting heavy traffic, interment camps and all. Damn it all to hell...

We'll meet again.
Don't know where, don't know when...

[Comadreja]

162. Or Mercenaries

From Israel.

[Swamp Rat]

253. I met one last year

He bragged (after a few drinks) that he was on full scholarship at Tulane University and was here for a special purpose - he said he was sponsored by a powerful local Jewish group with ties to Washington. It's funny, he wasn't even invited to the party as it was a birthday party for a French student of Arab decent, after he bragged about his IDF conquests, none of the girls would even stand near him.

[althecat]

7. HOLY SHIT!!!! This is really ugly...

A show of force.

[nine23]

8. "Give me a C. A not-so-bouncy C..."

"Tin soldiers and Bush's coming. We're finally on our own..."

God help you, my American friends.

[underseasurveyor]

15. Thanks we'll need it

(((HE-E-E-L-LP))

We need somebody HELP:-(

[TaleWgnDg]

9. well. there are no Reuters photos. there are no AP photos.

so. is this indymedia.org saying that Reuters and AP paparazzi didn't show up? missed this tank? hey. don't the paparazzi get paid for the photos?

http://news.search.yahoo.com/news/search?p=los+angeles+iraq+protest&rs=0&c=images

(edited to include url hyperlink)

[NorthernSpy]

39. I know AP has sometimes used Indymedia photos

It's a free newswire, and sometimes the big news services have used Indy material.

So you might see these photos eventually accompanying stories in the corporate media, if they can't find another source.

[NVMojo]

10. What the fuck!!!!!

In America? Tanks at a protest? Bush and Rove must really not want people to have their own thoughts anymore, once and for all. They know they stole the election cuz they are arming themselves to the hilt like thieves!!!

[theHandpuppet]

56. This sounds like an Arnie fantasy...

Waving his big metal Nazi cock at a group of "girlie men" protestors. Now perhaps some Caleeforneeans will see just what their votes have wrought.

[Sequoia]

151. Los Angeles did not vote for Nazi Boy

so maybe that's why they use the tanks while Ahnold struts around in Japan.

[ReadTomPaine]

11. Hey all of you calling for compromise with the GOP - take a look...

... at how the GOP is reaching across the aisle. Nothing like rolling tanks out at a peaceful demonstration to show how ready you are to be bi-partisan.

RTP.

[shrike]

105. Amen n/t

[ElsewheresDaughter]

236. AMEN and AMEN!

[Book Lover]

12. Illegal orders

Not that it matters anymore, eh?

[RivetJoint]

73. What's illegal about it?

[Solomon]

108. It violates the Posse Comitatus act. (Might have spelled it wrong)

[RivetJoint]

111. No, it doesn't

[NorthernSpy]

115. yes it does. the NG must be summoned by civilian authorities

They can't just show up wherever they feel like it, toting whatever artillery they think would be fun to deploy.

[RivetJoint]

116. And what makes you think

A. Those are National Guard vehicles? and
B. They just showed up on their own?

[NorthernSpy]

121. I don't know who they were, or what they were doing there.

But I think we should find out. Don't you?

[RivetJoint]

122. EXACTLY

Before we leap to conclusions..

like they were National Guard tanks there of their (the NG) own accord...

[NorthernSpy]

125. NG is not a bad guess, despite all those millions and millions...

... of private citizens who drive around every day in their own personal tanks.

/sarcasm

I mean, what class of license would a civilian need to drive one of those things on a public road?

[RivetJoint]

126. Some police forces do have APCs

I agree it PROBABLY is the NG, but I don't know that for sure, neither do you.

[MattBaggins]

142. That is not an APC that is an Abrams Tank

[RivetJoint]

143. It is MOST definitely NOT an Abrams Tank

[MattBaggins]

152. no It's not

my bad

[Kathy in Cambridge]

128. RivetJoint: always on the side of truth, democracy & the American way

<sarcasm on>

How is this NOT a violation of Posse Comitatus? Explain.

[RivetJoint]

131. Who did they arrest or detain?

In what search or seizure did they participate?

[Kathy in Cambridge]

153. It has nothing to do with arrest or detention

Posse Comitatus is an act that FORBIDS the use of military forces for law enforcement,

I don't understand why you even waste your time here when your arguments are so OBVIOUS :eyes:

[RivetJoint]

158. And they are being used for law enforcement, how?

Why don't you do some reading up on PC.

[Kathy in Cambridge]

159. I did

what's your excuse? I guess you went to the freeptard school of google research.

[RivetJoint]

163. Then IF you did you would see that

PC does NOT apply to actions in which the military is used to protect buildings, property or people, or to maintain or restore order in case of civil disturbance.

Why do you think the national guard gets called out during riots, etc?

While I don't LIKE the fact it APPEARS someone overreacted and called out APCs to a non-violent protest, it is OBVIOUSLY not a violation of PC.

[Occulus]

222. their mere presense is an illegal act of intimidation

don't really understand why ya don't get it....

[Book Lover]

134. Posse Comitatus

Title 18 US Code, PART I, Chapter 67,
§ 1385, The Posse Comitatus Act
§ 1385. Use of Army and Air Force as posse comitatus

Whoever, except in cases and under circumstances expressly authorized by the Constitution or Act of Congress, willfully uses any part of the Army or the Air Force as a posse comitatus or otherwise to execute the laws shall be fined not more than $10,000 or imprisoned not more than two years, or both.

[RivetJoint]

169. Tell me PRECISELY

which of these, "posse comitatus or otherwise to execute the laws." those APCS were engaged in...

[Book Lover]

174. Restoration of order

You know, the cops' job.

The tanks were deployed in order to intimidate a small group of protesters (how do I know it was a small group? There were only enough to fit on the sidewalk). There is a clear threat of force.

I have to ask where your anger is? Why does this not make your blood boil?

[RivetJoint]

177. I DON"T like it

but it did not violate ANY law.

[Book Lover]

178. It is the law that only the police restore order in the streets

And I don't believe you, frankly. Either you are a liberal so worried about doing a CYA job that you let your pockets get picked clean of your rights, or you are stealth.

[ReadTomPaine]

180. Agreed. I don't believe his guy either.

Anyone in their right mind would be outraged, not playing the part of dismissive apologist.

RTP

[RivetJoint]

184. Outraged?

Dismayed, yes. Why outraged? I don't even know this is TRUE yet.

[Occulus]

224. Why not? There's a video.

I watched it. Large-bore mounted weapon, and I do believe I see smaller arms just underneath it.

Clearly intended to intimidate peaceful protesters. Just as clearly illegal as all hell.

[HuskerDem]

206. I agree as well

You have to wonder what some people are doing here now after they worked so hard to get their post counts up. Buyers remorse, perhaps?

[RivetJoint]

181. Were is that the law?

SHOW that law to me. Are you saying we NEVER call out the NG to restore order? And don't accuse me of things you cannot prove.

[ReadTomPaine]

188. I'll say whatever I damn please about this incident and your support...

.. And you should be willing to fight and die for my right to do so.

Your attitude about this is frankly beyond the pale. If you defend these actions, you can have them. No matter who you voted for, eventually, they will come for you too. Good luck with that.

RTP

[RivetJoint]

193. Look, I do not defend these actions

IF they are true. But the fact remains NO LAW WAS BROKEN

[ReadTomPaine]

195. I don't believe a word you say. Save it for someone else.

[RivetJoint]

196. What did I say

That is not believable?

[Samantha]

250. The Constitution of the United States is the Supreme Law of the Land

and it guarantees The People to right to peacefully assemble "and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances." I going to go out on a limb here and say protesting the U.S. government for launching an illegal, immoral war, illegal in the sense it violates the rules of the U.N. (if not your conscience), immoral in the sense the estimates are 100,000 innocent civilians have been killed, based on a lie, constitutes petitioning the Government for a redress of grievances.

[ReadTomPaine]

182. You don't like it, but you make excuses for it. Nice.

[RivetJoint]

186. What excuse did I make for it?

Show me an excuse I posted which said this was ok to do. I just said it was not illegal to do it.

[ReadTomPaine]

189. I'll answer a question from you...

... when hell freezes over.

RTP

[RivetJoint]

190. Just what I thought

accusations with no proof.

[DrWeird]

192. Good idea.

Don't feed the trolls.

[RivetJoint]

194. Dr I'm no troll

just someone who believes in the truth.

[DrWeird]

197. And I'm the Queen of Antarctica.

"just someone who believes in the truth"

Funny, coming from somebody who's spent the whole thread trolling and being intellectually dishonest.

[RivetJoint]

199. How so?

What have I been dishonest about, Ms Queen?

[DrWeird]

202. Who, exactly, do you think you're kidding?

Jesus, you're like a five-year-old kid that's been caught red-handed but insists he did nothing wrong.

"But moooom! I didn't do nuttin'"

[RivetJoint]

203. Right so in other words, you can't

Don't make assertions you can't back up, okay?

[DrWeird]

204. Back them up for whom?

Because everybody sees through your bullshit.

[RivetJoint]

205. Again with the accusations you cannot support

That's no way to conduct yourself

[ReadTomPaine]

208. Here, here!

I have followed your sage advice, and used 'ignore'.

[RivetJoint]

209. That's it throw mud then leave

You sound like Shrub

[DrWeird]

214. First time I've seen a pig complain about mud.

I thought it was Shrub who approved of using tanks to disrupt and intimidate protestors.

[ReadTomPaine]

200. LOL! Like those swift boaters believe in truth! Nicely put.

[RivetJoint]

201. Again, point out where

I have lied about something.

[Sterling]

238. So do you think the cops did not beat Rodney King?

Thats about how silly your argument that you don't know if it is true that a APC was used to intimidate a group of peace protesters. The photos and video have been seen by most on the thread so you look ridiculous trying to pretend it's still in question.

[Swamp Rat]

254. LOL!

Don't feed the trolls, but give 'em a toy to play with:

[flordehinojos]

13. WE ARE THE NEW TIENANMEN SQUARE BROUGHT TO YOU COURTESY OF THE HOUSE OF

THE BUSH GOONS!

[tyedyeto]

47. My initial thought as well

And we thought that would only happen in China back in the late 80's...........

[fujiyama]

60. You know

I really could see something like that happening in this country.

ANd I'd expect almost the same reaction as that which happened in China. The people completely caved in.

After all, we had over a thousand soldiers killed for a war based on BS and a majority of people actually reelected the SOB.

[Tsiyu]

212. Mine as well

We said to our leaders, "Do something. Please!" and we thought, how do people become so coldhearted that they'd just mow down someone they disagree with? We thought it was just more evidence of the differences between the Chinese and us.

Now we see it is merely the absolute worst in human nature allowed to wreak havoc on anyone and anything it chooses.

These words comfort me:

About the current Administration:

"When I fed them, they were satisfied;
when they were satisfied, they became proud;
then they forgot me.
So I will come upon them like a lion,
like a leopard I will lurk by the path.
Like a bear robbed of her cubs,
I will attack them and rip them open.
Like a lion I will devour them."
From Hosea 13


These are words Bush********says he believes. Beautiful animal imagery there, wrought against the Official Nature Hater himself! How fitting....

I'm glad he believes them, because if they are true, this administration will get its reward from the Great Vindicator.
And even though I am a compassionate person, I wait patiently for the day Republicans have the burns and the screams they love to inflict on innocent children a world away.

God is watching, if God is.
And he, she, or it hears every scream and watches every tank...

[henslee]

14. L.A., Fallujah, to Chimpy, its all the same. With him or against him.

[firebee]

19. Do we need local militias???

Can you believe this crap? Rolling tanks in on U.S. citizens? We need to know who ordered this and why. Absolutely unacceptable in my opinion. This is a tell tale sign of fascism. Do we allow ourselves to be herded up like the Jews or do we organize and prepare for a stand if that's the direction this administration wants to take it? Should we be organizing local militias?

[henslee]

22. This will backfire on Bush. An older hippie posted the on Nov.3 that

things felt just like they did in the 60's in terms of us and them and that what followed was full on counterculture explosion. Tanks worked in Tienemeen square. They will not work here.

[Cronus Protagonist]

16. They need more tuneful chanting

The tank was impressive for such a small group, though. I think they must have been all kitted out for a riot and didn't want to waste all the time in the costume department. They had to make a dash across the stage so that we could all see the performance that they had prepared for us all.

I'm going to nominate them for an Emmy.

Show your support for the president, wear a FUCK BUSH button!

http://brainbuttons.com/home.asp?stashid=13
(We usually ship same or next business day by first class mail)

[Carolab]

17. OMG

Send this to Boxer or Feinstein or somebody!

[Pachamama]

53. I saw Boxer at the Supermarket today....

She lives right near me and is home from the recess...I told her today that I'm so thankful we have her fighting for us and she said we all need to stick together, its going to be a tough fight and tough times....

She needs to see this...We should all send this to her (and Feinstein, although Diane seems to be wanting to kiss the boy kings hand these days)....

Shame Shame Shame....

:kick:

[rodeodance]

138. best be sure it is the 'truth' before sending it

[Pachamama]

243. Be sure what is the truth?

:eyes:

[underseasurveyor]

20. I don't suppose we're lucky enough we can assume

that these lil ol tanks were just making their way through the streets of LA on their way to where some Veterans Day festivities will be held? :shrug:

I don't think so either :-(

[Diego360]

21. Those were Stryker vehicles, right?

The latest wheeled (not tracked) armored vehicles? Does that mean it was Army and not National Guard?

Stryker

*edited for wrong quote

[NVMojo]

25. kick!

[Diego360]

29. So where did these Strykers come from...

and who ordered them out? From a quick Google, it seems there is only one Stryker Brigade in the NG and it is located in Pennsylvania.

"They are part of a more than 3,000-member Stryker Brigade, a combat team the National Guard activated yesterday during a ceremony in the drizzling rain. The Stryker Brigade is one of six in the Army and the only National Guard team."

Article

[RivetJoint]

74. Easy...that's not a Stryker

[txindy]

164. Okay, it's not an Abrams tank and not a Stryker

You seem to know tanks, so what is it then? We can take the info. from there and find out where such a tank is located within the LA area. Thanks.

[RivetJoint]

170. Just said it was NOT a tank nor a Stryker

IT looks like a LAV

[rinsd]

185. I think its an LAV also

See this Du post. Looks to be the right paneling and height

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x2659372#2660468

[Occulus]

225. Looks exactly like the video...

I'd say we just found out exactly what they are.

Now we need to know who ordered them there and why.

[NorthernSpy]

32. If so, doesn't that bring up a posse comitatus issue?

Just the other day, I was warning people that if commanded to do so, the troops might indeed comply with orders to turn their guns on dissenting Americans.

I would like to be wrong about this, but still: that's what occurs to me every time someone tells us that the troops gave us our right to speak freely (and that we should therefore just shut up about the war).

[RivetJoint]

75. This has nothing to do with Posse Comitatus

as they are not engaged in law enforcement activities. One would thing we've never called out the national guard before...

[NorthernSpy]

107. and who, pray, summoned the National Guard?

I don't think they're allowed to work freelance...

Seriously: there's no mention anywhere of California authorities (ie, the Governator) calling up the National Guard for this demonstration.

And even if they had been summoned by the appropriate state authority, why would they send a couple of tanks to a street protest?

[RivetJoint]

110. Don't know who did it; I don't even know if those are NG troops

Those aren't tanks, BTW.

Also some police forces DO have APCs. These could be police.

[NorthernSpy]

113. I've seen police APCs. They don't have that big gun on the turret.

Why would the police have artillery?

I see no sign of police insignia on the vehicle in the photo.

Also, the people who got out of the APC that I saw wore clearly marked police gear, unlike the person in the picture.

[RivetJoint]

114. That's not artillery

It's an APC. AND some police DO have them. I don't live in LA, ask them.

[NorthernSpy]

118. then what is that big gun-shaped thing... a hood ornament?

If that's not a hood ornament, then it's what it looks like: a large-bore gun. Artillery by definition.

[RivetJoint]

120. Not when it is attached to an armored vehicle

Then it is armor.

[NorthernSpy]

123. Whaaaa...? Guns don't count as armor!

Why the hell would you choose to have a big random gun-shaped piece of metal projecting off your vehicle for armor? What earthly good would that do?

That makes no sense whatsoever.

[RivetJoint]

124. It is called "armor"

Not artillery. A tank counts as armor not artillery. That is all

[NorthernSpy]

130. what a relief that is

The demonstrators were menaced not with artillery, but rather with mere "armor".

Call it artillery, or call it "armor", its only conceivable purpose can have been to intimidate the people at the rally.

[RivetJoint]

132. Agreed

[Occulus]

226. ROFL

GUNS = ARMOR
WAR = PEACE
FREEDOM = SLAVERY
IGNORANCE = STRENGTH

Suuuuuuurrrrrre, guns are armor. Riiiiiiight.

[Sterling]

242. It's semantics, this guy is obviously a military fan so he is using

military lingo to describe the category of arms this vehicle is. It is however a very fucking big gun on that thing and completely outrageous that it is being used for crowd control, especially politically charged crowd control.


I think if you want to get technical this is actually mechanized infantry and not armor but I can see someone calling it either.

[PhuLoi]

129. That doesn't look like any APC I ever drove or rode in.

Judging from the photo the barrel might be either 50cal or possibly 20mm. In either case using heavy caliber weapons on people is a violation of the Geneva Convention, or so we were instructed. Heavy caliber weapons were to be used against equipment and positions only. This rule was universally ignored.

[RivetJoint]

133. APCs are equipped with heavy machine guns these days.

[HuskerDem]

211. IF THAT IS LAPD I WILL EAT ALL OF MY SHOES!

NOBODY here is that stupid, mmmmmmmkay? Was FR just a little too fucking boring today or what? Jesse Christus on a Pogo stick.

Do you UNDERSTAND how obvious you are?

[Taverner]

230. LAPD uses black tanks

That's clearly Reserve, Nat Guard or Army.

[slowroll]

239. LAPD

uses old Cadillac-Gage V-100 armored cars. The vehicles in the video are LAVs, used exclusively by the USMC.

[rodeodance]

146. someone pointed out that they are just sitting there-stationary

[Kipepeo]

198. But then they drive off at the end of the video footage

nt

[jpak]

140. No - it's an LAV-25 operated by the Marines

and it's photoshop

[OneMoreDemocrat]

149. I don't think the entire video has been photoshopped.........

This one's real.

[American Tragedy]

24. assuming this is for real, why haven't AP and Reuters covered this?

Maybe I'm just not looking properly, but I can't find anything even related to a current anti-war protest in L.A. outside of Indy, much less a visit from armored tanks.

[underseasurveyor]

26. The word "blackout" comes to mind

Just off the top of my head of course.

[JackieO]

38. Did you watch the video?

It's pretty realistic.

Apparently http://news.search.yahoo.com/news/search?p=los+angeles+iraq+protest&rs=0&c=images">AP did report on this demo - perhaps their reporter and photographer left before the tanks showed up?

[Penguin31]

57. Broken Link for AP Report/Photos, Fixed Link...

http://news.search.yahoo.com/news/search?p=los+angeles+iraq+protest&rs=0&c=images

-P

[rodeodance]

141. 2 still AP photes on your site---but no story

Anybody find an AP-or other press story?

[Baja Margie]

44. This happened, it's a for sure thing I think........????

Tomorrow there's a demonstration planned by the San Diego Coalition For Peace & Justice from 4-6:30 in front of the downtown Federal Building. We're going.

Could be the reason for the tanks, isn't this the same group that a couple days ago shut down the what do call it, induction building???

[rodeodance]

127. nothing in LATimes as far as I can goggle on its website

[goclark]

241. I googled the LA Times and nothing at 3:37 PM PST

Maybe they were "worried" because of the counsulate incident in the morning.

That was WAY across town.

But, there are a lot of federal buildings in the Westwood Area.

Lots of Marches are held there.
Passport office is there.

[Piperay]

27. How WEIRD

Tuesday evening around 5:30 after just getting off the 405 Freeway at Palo Verde Ave in Long Beach I saw two tanks parked in front of a house ( a house that has some fundie sign in front of it) with 3-4 people in fatiques starting get into the tanks. :wow: I wonder if that is where the tanks came from :think: I thought it was really weird at the time but nowdays you see all kinds of strange stuff so I just kept on going. :shrug:

[underseasurveyor]

35. Wow My old neighborhood

[sandnsea]

36. Are you serious????

:scared: I'm like 99% sure that's illegal. Could you go get the address and report that to the police please.

[freeplessinseattle]

41. now that is bizarre, a tank carpool? who the fuck gets picked up by a

TANK at their house?? sheeit! pretty soon each neighborhood watch fundie will have their own tank in the garage handy.

[neomonkey]

223. Isn't that down near Los Alamitos?

Isn't there some kind of military complex or armory in that area?

[justa]

30. Shows just how far it has gone.

[DELUSIONAL]

31. Kent State, 1971, 4 Students murdered by National Guard

and people wonder why I don't blindly support "our" troops.

If ordered these troops will murder us without questioning their orders. I've already seen the hatred of cops in California as a college student.

I feel sadness for each INDIVIDUAL military person who is killed in this stupid war.

But NEVER will I give blind support for the troops.

These same troops WILL murder unarmed citizens.

And so it begins.

Did the Governor order out the troops -- that's what Raygun did during the "troubles" of the anti-war protests.

[JSJ]

37. 3 students murdered by guard at jackson state, ca 1970

[bobbieinok]

54. this is the one always forgotten when everyone thinks of Kent State

[wickerwoman]

33. Doesn't this violate posse comitatus?

Isn't there a pretty clear law against deploying the army in the U.S.?

Someone needs their balls nailed to the wall for this little stunt.

[NVMojo]

42. in april ....

http://www.abc.net.au/news/newsitems/s1080574.htm

US tanks crush Iraqi protesters: police

At least two followers of Shiite Muslim radical leader Moqtada Sadr have been killed after throwing themselves in front of US tanks during a demonstration in central Baghdad.

"There were two or three dead among the protestors who threw themselves under American tanks, which could not avoid them on Tahrir square," said Sergeant Abbas Mohamad.

[JSJ]

43. 'posse' applies to troops' actions on us soil

[RivetJoint]

67. No, Posse

only applies to the military from military being used in LAW ENFORCEMENT (e.g., searches, seizures, arrests). It's okay to use the National Guard (and even active duty forces) to prevent violence and to protect public facilities and safety.

[ReadTomPaine]

156. Yes it does see post #135

The presence at a peaceful protest clearly violates the law. Do you support using tanks at peaceful protest? Who did you vote for?

RTP

[RivetJoint]

160. What law does it violate

How are the APCs being used to arrest or detain anyone? How are the APCs being used for any search or seizure?

By the way, post 135 is about the CA Governor.

[AnnitaR]

45. So it has begun.

:wow:

I'm in shock. Didn't think things could get much more depressing... I should have known better.

Can only imagine what they'll do to the protesters at Chimps coronation in January.

[flordehinojos]

68. they will be put in jail (like they did with the protesters at the

Republican National Convention in NY... they will be lucky if they get to spend only a few hours in jail like those protesters in NY ...

This bush administration, reinforced by stolen votes no one can prove/disprove because of no accountability voting machines, may well decide to call them "enemy combatants", "threat to the boy emperor", "you pissed off my daddy miscreant citizens" as in Saddam Hussein "pissed off my daddy" ... and they may all disappear to some rig who knows where or some unseen tent out in guantanamo bay.

I doubt nothing, put nothing over, above, and beyond the reach of the bush dictatorship. they are capable of anything and everything.

[The Minus World]

46. Tanks in the Streets...

This is it. When the first shot is fired and innocent American blood is drawn at the hands of a tyrranical government, the slumbering giant will finally awaken.

Even the 30 some-odd percent of Americans who actually voted for a man who approved of such actions will not stand for this type of blatant oppression on their own soil.

Unfortunately, the ballots for the last election ever to be held in the United States have been cast, and this administration doesn't need to play by the rules of common decency anymore.

[mourningdove92]

48. No they won't, No they won't, No they won't

The American people WILL NOT stand up. They didn't at Kent State, and they won't now!

Yes, some of us here will stand, but not the majority of goose stepping, bush loving, homophobic, war mongering, strut their stuff Americans.

I don't know WHAT it will take. If what Bush has done in the last 4 years was not enough to get him thrown out on his ass, then someone tell me WHAT IT WILL TAKE.

Yes, its starting. Bushco is not wasting any time. We are in for it now.

[lucabrasi]

50. perhaps...

with the abundance of video cams and the internets.

Or maybe I'm still in denial

[Lerkfish]

98. Kent state had photos.....still nothing. unless you count Neil Young.

[LynnTheDem]

51. America ALWAYS demonizes the "enemy"...that's why RWWs demonize US.

Read the rightwingnut blogs; we're described and demonized in the EXACT SAME WAY HITLER DEMONIZED the JEWS.

It makes it much easier to KILL PEOPLE when they're demonized as filthy traitorous scum; as non-human; as vermin.

When they start killing us, we won't be Americans, we won't be fellow countrymen; we'll be the "filthy vermin scum who hate America".

[The Minus World]

63. Sitting Ducks

Well, factoring in the likelihood of fraud in the last election, I'd say that there's a healthy majority of Americans who are aware of the sickness engendered by this administration. Such a majority, of course, was not represented in the national media.

Most patriotic, rational Americans, upon seeing this video, would undoubtedly take pause; set their politics aside, shaking their head in disbelief at what this government is capable of - what was authorized by a mixture of ignorance and neglect on the part of the American people. Such oppression, of course, will not be represented in the national media.

Soon, I fear, it will be commonplace to see "Riots Break Out; 7 Killed" buried somewhere in our morning papers.

[flordehinojos]

69. i think you are right. i think that those goose stepping, bush loving,

homophobic, war mongering American citizens will only say,"those protesters got what they deserved".

[kayell]

71. I remember as a child reading an article on Kent State

republished (IIRC) in Readers Digest. The author was excusing the killings for a number of reasons, two of which were that protesters had long hair and were disrespectful.

If tyranny is introduced incrementally, almost everyone will accept it, and some will accept anything so long as it comes from Big Brother.

[kittenpants]

109. lots of conservatives said the Kent state kids deserved what they got

at the time on a documentary about it. A few tanks now won't bother them!

[Silverhair]

88. After the shooting at Kent State, many Americans were happy. N/T

[bliss_eternal]

49. The truly scary thing is that the news didn't show tanks!

I watched NBC news at 11:00 tonight, primarily to see the protest footage. Strangely, there was NOTHING about tanks! They showed the protesters, their signs, they even spoke to one...not at thing on the tanks. Cripes...I feel sick and kind of scared.

Honestly, I only came back to the boards tonight to find out if anyone knew what group it was that protested tonight. I wanted to Congratulate them for getting on the news tonight and find out when their next protest is. I didn't expect to see this.

Yikes...

[NorthernSpy]

55. They will deny it right up until the moment they begin justifying it.

Stalin's Pravda has nothing on the corporate-owned media: both were/are the propaganda organs of their respective societies' rulers.

[sui generis]

147. well, they had better get ready for a fight then

half of America can't declare war on the other half of America without the most socially (and otherwise) destructive repercussions conceivable.

Who ordered the tanks? We need to find that line of command. That person needs to be held to the fire.

[Baja Margie]

52. Jackie

Why don't you put this over on latest breaking news? Tanks, I mean thanks.

[VOX]

58. The armored vehicle in the video has an "A/4" marking on it...

I'm not sure what this signifies, whether it's Army or National Guard.

Outrageous that this type of vehicle would be deployed to a peaceful Federal Building protest.

[Jack_DeLeon]

59. So can anyone ID what type of armored vehicle that is?

Obviously its not a MBT of any kind.

[Silverhair]

89. I think it's a Bradley. An Amored Personnel Carrier. N/T

[jpak]

139. It's an LAV-25 - Marines - 25 mm cannon 7.62 mm machine gun

This is photoshop - youv'e been punk'd.

[SmokingJacket]

154. If that whole video can be the result of photoshop...

I truly fear for future of news. Can you photoshop loving crowds throwing flowers at the feet of Dick Cheney? Can you photoshop John Kerry shoplifting a bottle of southern comfort?

I'm serious. I found that video as convincing as anything i've seen.

How can one tell if it's real?

CAN one tell?

[Hubert Flottz]

172. It's real because if it wasn't Arnold would be the TC on the point

vehicle!

Edit} Looked real to me!

[American Tragedy]

183. Photoshop can be used for video editing

although the program is not really designed for it, I do know of video editors who use it.

I can think of ways that you could possibly do it...maybe. It would be extremely painstaking work since you would have to perfectly match together literally hundreds of frames, but it could be done. I don't know if one could do it well enough for professionals to be totally fooled, though.

[Bonobo]

187. You must be tripping. I'd stay away from that stuff.

[evolvenow]

61. That is what it looked like during the riots in the early 90's

So flipping creepy!!Maybe people had cell phones with cameras? We need celebrities at these protests, then the paparazzi will be all over the place, and the photos will get massive distribution...

[Kurovski]

62. It's a shitty little scare tactic

The Bush gang knows the constant protests are coming. Bushy & gang like to be feared rather than loved, but we'll do neither.

The photos will look just swell to the rest of the world, too.

[tom_paine]

64. As unsurprising as Stalin whacking Trostky, Hitler imprisoning enemies

Or the Chinese Communists sending tanls into Bejiong for the sme reasons the Busheviks did.

And it is just the beginning.

[evolvenow]

66. If this doesn't motivate you to do something.Tanks in LA

I forwarded this to Kerry. He needs to see the snapshot of what is to come if he doesn't step in.

Dear President John Kerry,
Please do not concede. Millions voted for you, please come forward and do everything you can to end this militant insanity.
Are Americans not allowed to vote, gather peacefully, have any rights? This is Outrageous. This administration is dangerous and was not elected, last time or this time.
Thank you for everything that you and so many are doing to transform this violence.
I look forward to hearing from you and seeing you and Mr. Edwards as President and Vice-President.

[in_cog_ni_to]

70. First thought. Tiananmen Square

Was THIS on the fucking news??? Did anyone bother to show the people of this country where we're headed??? I can't believe this shit!

[htuttle]

72. Calfornia Uber Alles

And to think that Jello Biafra had been worried about Jerry Brown...

[Roxy66]

76. OMFG!!

That is so scary!! Well, it's going to get ugly...gee I wonder if it will be on CNN..Right:eyes:

[HEAVYHEART]

77. Never

See, we never see this stuff in the news. Urgggghhh!!

[in_cog_ni_to]

78. SEND THIS LINK to Olbermann! He'll expose it! n/t

[Roxy66]

83. o.k.....call me clueless..but what is n/t

I thought it meant "no thank you"

[DemonFighterLives]

85. No text

nt

[Roxy66]

79. Why isnt this in the L.A. Times!!!

http://www.latimes.com/

[Gore1FL]

80. Someone Email Olberman

I keep timing out going to msnbc when I try.

[in_cog_ni_to]

84. I emailed him.

I sent him the article posted here and the link.

Here's his email: [e-mail]

If he gets enough emails, maybe he will show the video on his show!!!

[nonconformist]

81. Are we under Marshall Law now without my knowledge?

:wtf:

Police state, here we come. Yay.

[wtmusic]

235. It's part of the Martial Plan

They're reconstructing Westwood :silly:

[DemonFighterLives]

86. Ain't this just great

Kinda makes ya feel warm and fuzzy all over. Bloody basturds would love to shoot it too.

[Hubert Flottz]

87. TANKS for the memories!

Freedom and Liberty are history if we don't fight this Now!

Where is John Kerry, in a hidey hole?

[Hubert Flottz]

90. Kick

And Keep kicked! If this ain't front page here, what is?

Now what I saw there IS IMMORAL in a democracy!

[Radio-Active]

91. anyone got another pic of this?

I need something that shows more of the crowd..

[in_cog_ni_to]

93. watch the video at the link provided above? Will that help? n/t

[no safe haven]

92. Berkeley 1970

Raygun sent NG tanks into the streets of Berkeley against antiwar protesters.

[Beam Me Up]

95. NG w/ bayonets, 69

[librechik]

96. Also Denver "Woodstock West"--LOTS of tanks

(I was there)

Invasion/Bombing of Cambodia was not popular among the young.

[no safe haven]

102. Cambodia bombing was the turning point

illegally expanding a war that could not be won. I wonder how long it will take to reach that kind of critical mass with IraqNam? I was a month too late for the tanks in Berkeley, but was there for the first People's Park riots. Bad times/good times.

[lucabrasi]

94. kick

[skooooo]

97. What's Ahhnold have to say about this ???

If I were a resident of California, I'd be calling Arny today.

[DemonFighterLives]

99. He probably finds it humorous

:kick:

[Algorem]

135. will he grope for answers?

[Fifth of Five]

171. Didn't Ahnold

talk about seeing Soviet tanks on the streets of Austria and how that was one reason he was for *? He knew * could protect the US from such an awful occurrence. Didn't it also turn out later to have been impossible for him to have seen such a thing?

If he called out the LAVs as a show of force, wouldn't it be ironic?

[Book Lover]

175. He is in Tokyo drumming up business

I have already faxed in my letter of protest.

[Pachamama]

247. No can do...the Gropenator is in Japan right now...busy selling off CA n/t

[Walt Starr]

100. Where will we end up having an American Tiananmen Square?

It's only a matter of time.

[skooooo]

101. I agree...

Putting tanks in the streets will only inflame protestors. This will spread like wildfire, imo.

[The Sushi Bandit]

103. Nothing in the LA Times about it!

They usually would have a story like that

[spanone]

104. Sounds like the terminators way to deter protesters.

Welcome to America. Hope Fallujah enjoys democracy.

[UpsideDownFlag]

106. Tianemen Square, american style. (spelling error, probably) nt

[GreenPartyVoter]

112. Just a little taste of things to come, eh?

-----------------------------------------------------------
FIGHT! Take this country back one town and state at a time!
http://www.geocities.com/greenpartyvoter/electionreform.htm

[Liberal Mommy]

137. For those of you at work

who cant watch the video. I took 10 screenshots of the video. They are uploaded to my website. Pics
I emailed the group that is protesting about contacting Olbermann. I even gave them his email. This truly is apalling.

[rodeodance]

144. thanks

[shelley806]

207. Thanks momof 3inTexas....mom of dog in Texas...

This is so frightening. I have always been more frightened of B* and his monstrous lying administration than the terrorists. Here is the most graphic visual of that. Right after another coup d'etat. I'm glad this was e-mailed to Olbermann. I'm no longer watching anything else, until they provide coverage of the elephant in the room--election FRAUD. Bets on whether or not this will be covered.

The day I graduated from med school Tienemann Square occured. This looks like a prelude...actually what's the difference?

[LeftHander]

136. Kick!

This is outrageous...

This country is about to explode!!!

[halobeam]

145. Sending to internationa papers....

IMO..everyone should be sending any buried news to international media on serious scale. This story is a MUST, as far as I'm concerned.

Hey, just had a thought, Bush claimed he's helping the Iraqi citizens', right? What stops another country leader to come invade here, to help us?

[radwriter0555]

150. The Armory is barely a quarter mile straight up the street, to the west

of the Federal Building site, as is the VA hospital.

Hence, these were military tanks brought out in a show of force it appears...

[Algorem]

157. I remember the LAPD had some kind of a tank

http://cbs2.com/josh_blog/josh_blogentry_281144118.html

[goclark]

237. The new chief of police is a bigot as far as I can tell

Bernard Parks,the ex chief, would never have allowed that crap!
This new Bremmer(sp?) thinks he knows so much about gangs and stuff.
They had a gang war a few months ago and he was pleading with the public to help him solve it.

He looks like a busher to me.

[Triana]

161. THis was probably a test...

...trial balloon for the police state that is coming.

[LeftHander]

165. LAV-25s

http://www.fas.org/man/dod-101/sys/land/lav-25.htm



The headlights and weapon is consistent as is the structures on the side when the vehicle drives away....

Probably used as a reconissance, night capable...amphibious

no doubt they sent these in to eval the situation and do a threat assesment. Once satisfied they either leave or call in APC with 11 men in each to subdue the crowd.

I would guess that this a homeland security operation...

Being it occured in front of a federal building....

THose hitting the streets should get used to seeing these in the future.

If you attack them or start destroying property then the shit will hit the fan...

[Cleita]

166. Now that's scary.

I used to live near the Federal Building on the Santa Monica side of Centinela. There were always protests of one sort or the other going on during the weekend. Every now and then a police car would drive around and check out the protesters and then drive off. I never saw tanks or any military around, even though the Reserves were on the far end of the federal property.

[AgadorSparticus]

167. holy shit. it's surreal to see this. do they really think it intimidates

us? i'm sure it just puts the fire under more asses to get out there and do more protesting.

[53 Jubilee]

176. ...it just puts the fire under more asses to get out there and do more

...Protesting. Maybe What we need is a little Napalm if it is a fire you're looking for. Actually, I hate to say this, but it looks like these guys are just heading back to the armory - after a day of showing off the inventory at a job fair or something.

[AgadorSparticus]

191. i would love to believe that. but people in FL or GA posted pics

of stormtroopers and the harrassment they experienced because of the demonstrations to the WTO and that has stayed in my mind. my mother told me what she saw and experienced in Seattle as a demonstrator of the WTO up there. it's not a stretch for this to happen under this regime.

[shelley806]

213. Go post your 'jubilee' elsewhere. eom

[neomonkey]

229. Well if that is the case

perhaps this detour is even more uncalled for.

Heading back from the job fair, what a laugh. Do you think they grabbed some Starbucks or Baja Fresh on the way back too? Maybe they pulled up to the church and said some quick prayers?

[skooooo]

173. kick

[Liberal Mommy]

210. Just talked to Frank at ANSWER

He did confirm the presence of the "tanks" at the protest. He didn't seem to feel like it was that big of a deal. I guess it bothers me more than him? Maybe they are used to this.

[sojourner]

218. Thanks!

Please disregard my message posted below. I was busy getting registered and all (new user) and this showed up ahead of me. I'll be more careful in the future.

[m berst]

215. bias

So many people are reminded of Kent State, where white students were tragically murdered.

Tanks in the streets reminds me of Detroit in the 60's. Of course the tanks weren't in the white neighborhoods.

Students being murdered reminded me of Orangeburg.

The Orangeburg Massacre

It was February 8, 1968 and Orangeburg, South Carolina was a night filled with anger and frustration. Patrolmen randomly fired on a crowd of student demonstrators. 27 students were shot and 3 young men died from the incident only in a matter of seconds. Henry Smith, a family oriented 20-year old college student at South Carolina State was shot in the side and back five times; Delano Middleton, a 17-year old high school student was shot in the hip, the thigh, the side of his chest, his heart and three times in the forearm; and Samuel Hammond, a promising 19-year-old high school student who attended a newly integrated school was killed by one shot in the back. What led to the massacre was a demonstration at a bowling alley that did not admit Blacks. 200 students gathered around a bonfire built on a campus street, only to find it to be smothered by the police. Some students retaliated by throwing rocks and bottles at the officers. The students eventually built another bonfire when the patrolmen left and that was when the trouble started. Police returned to the scene to put the fire out, only this time, someone hit a patrolman with a banister post and more objects were thrown.

After the slaughter, news spread of a gun battle between the Black students and officers. The officers, with the support of the government blamed the students for what occurred yet it was later found out that none of the students held firearms and that not one of the patrolmen followed correct riot procedures. A number of those shot wounded were shot in the feet while laying on the ground. Though the patrolmen used unacceptable means to control the demonstration, they were eventually pardoned. This is a typical story of many challenges Blacks had to face in 1968 America. It was a cry for Civil Rights.

http://www.vancouver.wsu.edu/fac/mercier/hist419/Orangeburg.html

The tragic events in Orangeburg have been turned into a clever "theme" by a young group of white musicians, apparently.

http://www.orangeburgmassacre.com/main.html

on edit - added link

[shelley806]

231. Thank you so much for sharing this tragic story m berst. Let's not

forget.

[sojourner]

216. Scary - any corroboration from witnesses, etc?

Does anybody know someone who works in Westwood area, or someone who was there? Documentation or some corroboration would be good before going too public, IMHO.

But I'm not surprised.......(sigh)

[Liberal Mommy]

217. Read post #210

I did get confirmation of this.

[sojourner]

220. saw that -- posted apology as reply to that post.

Thanks...I'll get this straight in a little bit.

[Liberal Mommy]

221. No need to apologize

I'm new here too! :hi:

[shelley806]

228. Hi again...I checked out your website and signed the petition

while there. This tank at a peaceful demonstration really bothers me (like a portent of what's to come), and then I read your post about the petition (What are you afraid of!) and I signed it--put it off yesterday because in a way I am afraid of these people targeting me...but truth and democracy are more important than fear. I want people to know what an immoral pig, who was supposedly elected on "moral issues", B* really is; I'm hoping that an investigation into fraud will expose him.

Thanks again for sharing the photos.

BTW: I was # 10,505 and then checked an error, and in the couple of seconds that took, the number was already up to #10,539!






edited to add text

[Liberal Mommy]

233. It really bothered me too shelley806

If this is just the beginning I fear what is yet to come. I'm trying to do what I can but it's not always easy with three kids at home and two of them under 25 months. I'm just glad my website can help get the message out.

[robbedvoter]

219. Freedom is on the march....Kerry conceded "for the good of the nation"

A few days ago, in Tomkins Square, NYC - an army of policemen occupied about 5 blocks to deal with a group of teen punks (I believe they had a show in the park). I asked one of them what happened: police started hitting us, we broke the windows of a van, now they are beating the s* of some kids in the park"
Helicoptes with laser lights were flying about. It looked like a war zone.
Get used to these stories.

First robbed, then beaten.

[ElementaryPenguin]

227. Holy smokes!! BushCo ready for the backlash of Coup II

:puke:

[Mr_Spock]

240. Please tell me why someone would post a joke thread like this.

It better be a joke. :(

[ElementaryPenguin]

244. It's no fucking joke!! Army Tanks have also been near Century City today

On Olympic Blvd. A buddy of mine said they waved at the Marines on top of the tanks!

[Mr_Spock]

249. Was it a parade or something?

I just don't want to think about this - but I am ready to fight if need be.

[slowroll]

251. I think so.

A guy over on Indymedia posted a comment saying that it was this:

Wednesday
Nov 10
10:00 a.m.-
12:00p.m.
VA Greater Los Angeles Veterans Day
Parade
VA West Los Angeles
For Info call (310) 478-
3711
VA West Los Angeles
11301 Wilshire Blvd.
Los Angeles, CA


Here are some pics from the '02 one with a Humvee and a SWAT truck:

http://www.gla.med.va.gov/VetsParade/default.htm

I think everybody got all bent out of shape over some lost Marines.

[Mr_Spock]

252. I was getting nervous - this is SERIOUS stuff - glad a false alarm

Was building adrenaline!

[SorryRepublican]

245. IS THIS A JOKE

[ElementaryPenguin]

246. No!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

It's quite real!! Tanks are still roaming the streets in in L.A. today!

[Swamp Rat]

255. How is this a joke?

[Rex]

248. This is a test --- this is only a test and not an actually emergency

Fire for effect!!!

[sandboxface]

256. No wonder the gov stole Indy's servers, they are a THREAT TO THE EMPIRE