I am afraid what we may be facing is a serious Cult mentality

[bling bling]

I cannot emphasize enough that I am not hating on Christians here. This is not a "Christian" thing at all. It is a cult mentality thing between this administration and its scary fundy followers. It is a sociological phenomenon. Religion is not the enemy. It's the people who use it as a weapon to manipulate others and gain power that are frightening.


Early Warning Signs of (Dangerous Cults)

1. Charismatic Leader.

2. Divine Authority. A leader usually makes some sort of claim to special insight or to special revelation that legitimates both the new religion and the leader's right to lead.

(Doesn't seem to me like this would necessarily have to apply to a "new" religion).

3. Use of Authority: Far more important than one's claim to authority is what one does with the authority once he or she attracts followers. A minister who focuses her or his pronouncements on the interpretation of scripture or on other matters having to do with religion proper is far less problematic than a leader who takes it upon her- or himself to make decisions in the personal lives of individual parishioners such as dictating (as opposed to suggesting) who and when one will marry.

4. Above the Law: Perhaps the most serious danger sign is when a religious group places itself above the law.

5. End of the World Scenarios. An apocalyptic theology is only dangerous when individual followers believe they are going to be called upon to be foot soldiers in God's army, and prepare themselves by stocking up on weapons and ammunition.

6. Salvation: Like apocalypticism, this trait is far too widespread among traditional religions to constitute an authentic danger sign. A more meaningful characteristic should be how a religion actually treats non-members.

7. Group Isolation.

(My opinion is that that lack of outside information may be substituted for Group Isolation. As in, the group hearing the same issues, threats, etc. over and over from the leaders and then parotting those threats almost verbatim).

8. Deception: A final early warning sign is a group's readiness to deceive outsiders.

(In summary)...a group possessing more than one or two of the above traits might well bear closer scrutiny.

http://www.religioustolerance.org/safe_sec.htm

edited for changing brackets to parentheses (deleted the text inside brackets accidentally).

[Ron Green]

1. 9. Preparation of large amounts of Kool-Aid. n/t

[ReadTomPaine]

2. The right wing learned quite a bit from their good friend Sun Myung Moon

[Cleita]

3. Of course they are a cult.

If they have the power to run our country we are in deep doo, doo.

[izzie]

15. Wrong word. It is rule. They run things very bad.

When you are right and have power you rule.

[fshrink]

4. That has to be the understatement of the year!

[Must_B_Free]

5. Minor fringe

contrary to what they say, this is all a hoax to try to convince you that its happening.

They have %25 at best. Not everyone who voted for Bush is crazy, most are just people who are focused on other things and may occasionally glance at TV news or a newspaper headline. They were just easy to fool.

[Celeborn Skywalker]

8. I agree

Most people are not fundy nutcases. I don't even think they're 25% of the population, more like 15%. Most bush voters are ignorant of the facts and can be persuaded to vote democratic with the right message and right strategy.

[bling bling]

13. Please, arm me with that message and strategy asap.

God knows I tried converting them here in MO using facts and logical arguments. I've never heard so many religous references/undertones from people in response to why they are voting for a President in my life.

[Nay]

33. Arm me, too. God knows nothing seems to work on these idiots,

and the constant reference to religion and Bush in the same breath is astounding. If these people aren't under the sway of cultishness, I don't know what it is. Ignorance, maybe. TV Vididiocy, maybe.

[rooboy]

11. It took less than 25% of the population to elect Bush. n/t

[The_Casual_Observer]

6. 9. Mass suicide

It is the final step in all serious cults. The ultimate act of control over the followers.

[Nag Champa]

7. I'm buying an assault rifle. I don't care to have a goddamn apocalypse.

[DemBones DemBones]

9. The "Christian" Reconstructionists aka Dominionists are

1) not Christian and 2) a very scary bunch, beyond cultism, unless you think of Nazism as a cult.

Unfortunately, there are a hell of a lot of Christians who can be fooled into supporting Dominionists because the Dominionists "sound" Christian, know how to push the right buttons. It's hard to know how far the majority of Christians will go in following Dominionists. Look how far and how long they supported Hitler.

We have good reason to be frightened.

[rooboy]

10. Bingo.

And it pervades the "free market" thinking that has been pushed through the middle class for the last 20 years or more. The most clear example is how the philosophy is fused through the multilevel marketing industry. They merge business, god and politics into one dangerous movement:

http://www.merchantsofdeception.com

I've read this guy's book - once you get to the end you have a perfect understanding of how these people think and how dangerous they are.

[eleny]

12. I'm gonna build a Kool-Aid stand

[Clark2008]

14. Nationwide Intervention

My boss - a die-in-the-wool Republican - is even worried. Says we need a two-party system, the Republicans will shoot themselves in the foot and called the wingnuts, "Christian Clerics."

I think that sums it up. Christian Clerics. I like that.

(Not new to DU... had to undergo a name change.... Thankee! - I'm a red-state voter for Kerry Blue.)

[Erika]

19. Christian clerics is a good name

Only the ultra conservatives would qualify and identify. They and the Taliban have a lot in common.

[regnaD kciN]

34. Now, WAIT A MINUTE...

I hate to drop this on you, but I'm a "Christian cleric" -- a Deacon in the Apostolic Catholic Church in America (a small and very liberal denomination).

"Christian cleric" merely means a member of the clergy. Desmond Tutu was a Christian cleric. As was Martin Luther King, Jr.

In fact, since most fundies don't consider themselves part of "organized church-ianity," they would be unlikely to know what a "cleric" is -- they would merely think of themselves as having a "minister" or "pastor." And the rank and file of the fundamentalist Hate Brigade are laypeople, and hence not "clerics" in any sense of the word.

:grr:

[juliagoolia]

48. You probably allow questions in your church too

They dont. That is a big difference in you and them.

They blindy follow and questioning is shameful.

Dont take offense. I am very sprititual too, and christian but I am a new age christian. I believe Jesus about things.

Like love
like forgiveness
like tolerance
like healing
like a number of other things, but I also realize he was talking to people from 2k years ago in a time of candles and mystery to all of them. We have taken away loads of mystery since then, and I wonder what he'd be saying today?

Anyway, you are OK..

[JNelson6563]

37. I call 'em "Tali-born-agains"

Fitting I think.

[eleny]

20. Who did he vote for?

Did he have an epiphany before or after the election?

[DoYouEverWonder]

52. We need to start the deprogramming as soon as possible

Each one of us needs to talk directly to anyone who voted for Bush, who is willing to listen to us.

First ask them why they voted for Bush. Most of them voted for him because they don't follow politics, ie they don't know shit, and that he cut their taxes or he was pro-life or because he was protecting us from the terrorists...

People voted for Bush out of greed, ignoranace and/or fear. The majority of these people are brainwashed by the media and believe almost anything someone tells them, if it's in the right format.

When I talk to people, so many of them tell me, gee I never heard about that, or I didn't even know that had happened? These are the folks we need to reach. One by one. One soul at a time.

[Erika]

16. This Must Be So Embarrassing to Bushie Republicans

who didn't realize that Rove was using the cult to elect their president. Maybe they should have gotten their head out of the sand a little earlier.

[selmo7]

17. GOP Koolaid leaks through chemtrails and Fox TV microwaves

yes ma'am or mssr., it's a full blown cult.

just like Nazi Germany was.

Now will America wake up?

and start looking at the spectrum of our dysfunctionality for real?

Or will we too roll over and put our heads back in the sand?

doodoodoodoodoodoodoodoodooDOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

example, family member comes along and says "to keep the peace, let's just NOT talk about it." BOING RED FLAG! dysfunction and terrorism and freedom of speech suppressed in the homeland. Freedom Alert, Freedom Alert.

ahem dear Family Member, while I know this is difficult for you to discuss, everyone in this family is entitled to an opinion. We will all have the chance to say what we feel and think about this particular issue. We shall respect each other, but we shall not oppress each other in this family. If you feel differently, feel free to speak up.

Glory Glory Hallejuah! The angels did prevail!
Hosannah

[dogmastomper]

18. It doesn't really matter

if most * supporters are dominionists or not, what matters is that * himself seems to have a messianic complex and the rest of the administration seem to know how to use his homespun god fearin' good ol' boy image to their advantage...I do not believe at all that the brains believe that they are chosen by god, but i do believe that they don't necessarily think it hurts their cause, which is to make more money. The basic idea of some esoteric knowledge and the passing off of oneself as divinely appointed to a position of power is dangerous for many reasons. Also, with * throwing around the word mandate, it lends creedence to this very dark possibility.

[Erika]

23. Yeah, My GOP friend loved her new Escolade

They don't care if Bush is an idiot or a cultist. What's for sure is that he or they don't haven't the slightest concept of having a social conscience. Of course, they've always wondered why Jesus lacked common business sense when he gave fish and manna free. According to them, he's an idiot who totally lacked appreciation for free market values.

[selmo7]

21. for more on bloodlust cults

check out the work of Jeanne Sarsen and Linda MacDonald who explore the spectrum of relationships from healthy to torturous.

How can we not say that our relationship with Iraq IS torturous and our relationship with Europe is at best quite unhealthy.

I feel this is a radical (rooted) way of figuring out what's going on when you get down to it.

Their site and they are currently working with the UN and in Geneva for non-state sponsored torture is:

www.ritualabusetorture.org

thank you -

"Selmo"

[2Design]

22. it is a cult mentality - and there are lots of little cults and they see

bush as bringing them all together - they are brainwashed like patty hearst and others who are captured.

they have so little belief in themselves that they need some ficticous person to give them orders and control them so that they have something or someone to blame for their bad behavior (Rush on drugs) (Laura killing her boyfriend) (Bush and his gay roomate) (abuse of children, wives, etc) they do all the evil things they are against - believing it is satan - they never accept responsibilty - they couldn't help it is what they tell them selves - they deny their natural instincts more and it continues to come out in sick ways.....

[erniesam]

24. Does anyone know how many Nazis took over Germany?

I seem to remember reading somewhere that it wasn't many.

[Kellanved]

35. roughly 850,000

1926 27,000
1930 130,000
1933 850,000 (still including the "socialist" wing)
1934 2,500,000 (after the night of the long-knives)
1937 5,300,000
1945 8,500,000

[bling bling]

38. Scary numbers. Hatred and fear is infectious.

:scared:

[DELUSIONAL]

25. This is EXACTLY the problem we are facing -- cult

I've been yapping about this for years -- I've seen it getting worse worse.

Some of the cult members can be salvaged -- others are lost -- and they are willing to carry on their fight to the death.

What is worse is that these cult members have been prepared to accept a leader -- and lo and behold bushie takes up the mantel of the chosen one. Doesn't matter that he is self chosen.

These cult members now project onto him their image of a Christian leader -- one who is not a foul mouth obscene bastard that we know bushie to be. A spoiled rotten frat boy -- who always takes the easy way out and is always bailed out by daddy's friends.

Look up Totalitarian Personality -- this personality type has been referenced in the past by DUers well versed in the behavior psychology of cults.

[regnaD kciN]

26. You know what's so funny? I've seen that exact same list...

...of "Early Warning Signs" being distributed by fundies, to warn people about "non-Christian cults" like the Mormons, Jehovah's Witnesses, Moonies, etc., etc.

Pot, meet kettle...

:evilgrin:

[bling bling]

27. I would be shocked if that were not true.

This administration is the poster child for the defense mechanism labeled "Projection"

[canadianbeaver]

43. That's what I have been waiting for someone to realize

and to say it...it definately is the red pot callin' the kettle red...the early warning signs are looking them straight in the face and they can't see the tree for the forest...right under their noses in the WH...but "they" do say "love" is blind....

[juliagoolia]

28. This is them! And they are here!

I think its these guys


Maybe its this patriotic Americanism cult?


It Takes a Good Follower To Make A Good Cult Leader



November 18, 1978
Jonestown, Guyana

The Rev. Jim Jones led more than 900 followers to their deaths at Jonestown, Guyana, by drinking a cyanide-laced grape punch. Cult members who refused to swallow the liquid were shot.

AND Who can forget



And the difference is?????????????

The ones we are dealing with want to take us with them! They are working to bring on the RAPTURE folks.. They hope its a HOLY WAR of Major Magnitude so the world can come to an end as we know it. They will be swooped up almost like the comet chasers and vanish before our eyes.



http://www.nccg.org/nccm/rapture.html Im not kidding!

[Qanisqineq]

29. when my sister first turned fundy

my youngest sister told me she thought the now-fundy had joined a cult. She went to church with her and was blown away by the faith-healing. And my sister does fall into most of those categories. Simply amazing.

[The Minus World]

30. Scary, isn't it?

"I regard Christianity as the most fatal and seductive lie that has ever yet existed-as the greatest and most impious lie: I can discern the last sprouts and branches of its ideal beneath every form of disguise, I decline to enter into any compromise or false position in reference to it-I urge people to declare open war with it."

- Nietzsche

Say what you will about the man, he understood the mountains of deception necessary to fool man into willfully doing his own disfavor.

[JSJ]

31. a cult devoted to the deathhead ss

[timtom]

32. Excellent post.

Thank you for putting this in a clear light and taking the heat off the broad sweeping anti-Christian arguments.

And, might I add, this is precisely the same psychological phenomenon that occurred in (dare I say it? -- Nah!), well, you know. All you have to do is take a look at various crowd scenes in certain historical film footage and note the unanimity of joyous and adulating faces. Not a sour puss among them. How dare they say that they didn't know what was happening in their country???

We know what is happening in our country!! Let's hope there are enough of us with discernment and critical thought skills to turn back this zombie tide before we end up in total ruin, as did our historical example.

It's almost like a science fiction movie: Oh no! Mom and Dad are not Mom and Dad anymore!

[July]

36. Fascism depends on a cult mentality, too.

Fascism takes root not in certain places, times, or circumstances so much as it takes place wherever leaders adopt cultish practices. A charismatic leader, authoritarianism, suppression of dissent, exceptionalism, fomenting of the idea of "an enemy" and threats to the in-group, the requirement of devotion and financial support of the leadership and group, claim of divine backing, etc., are features of both cults and fascism, and fascistic leaders understand this very well.

[skypilot]

39. I have a not really thought out theory that...

...there is some kind of continuum from the cults of the seventies to those "network marketing" folks like Amway to the current Bush supporters. I'm still trying to fill in the blanks.

[KCS72000]

46. Thought that too.

No links to political orgs. that I have found though.

Lots of stuff about Landmark Education here. (Formerly Est)
http://www.rickross.com/groups/landmark.html

[skypilot]

50. There was a segment on....

...one of those news magazine shows, "Dateline" maybe, about a guy who was running one of those network marketing schemes. I don't remember the guy's name but I do remember that it was discovered that the company he was running was simply "Amway" with a different name. Anyway, they showed all these people who would come to hear this guy speak and it was actually like a stadium full of people all holding lighted candles. They looked as if they'd come to worship and some of them were actually crying. It was then that this theory started to take vague shape in my mind. Thanks for the link you posted. There's alot there. I'll check it out.

[seraph]

40. The Upside you ask?

Jonestown. They took care of it themselves.

[Killarney]

41. I think you're right.

Well-written post!

[Borgnine]

42. You're right.

Voter fraud and BBV aside, there's a reason Bush got so many votes, and "moral values" is only the cover for the cult of Bush.

[canadianbeaver]

45. seperated at birth

that picture is spooky....looks like bush in a couple of years...if he makes it that is....wish the people of the US could votergate him...and his little dog(cheney) too!!! Ultimate Christmas gift.!!

[SiouxJ]

44. Shrub is looking more and more like Jim Jones

I noticed this before the election. He's got Rush, Hannity, O'lielly etc. propping him up into this position. The scary part is that it won't be just the Kool-aide drinkers that go down, they'll take all of us with them.

[juliagoolia]

47. Cult of Hate and doom

We need to call it that..

Hate Radio is Evil
Doomsayer run the Govt
Rapture is the Plan for the new GOP

[mmonk]

49. You think?

[NAO]

51. The Bush Cult (title of paper on this topic, link)

THE BUSH CULT
http://www.awakeninthedream.com/bushcult.html

(excerpt)
It is a shattering experience to see through our imaginary projections and recognize that someone we thought was leading and protecting us does not have our best interest at heart. People who support Mr. George Bush resist and turn away from the irrefutable and readily available evidence that Bush is anything but a good leader, as if they are in denial with a capital D. Bush is saying one thing and doing totally the opposite, and many people are simply in denial of this and look away. It is truly as if people who support Bush are not only in denial, but are actually refusing to look and hence, blind to what to most of the world is very obvious. It is as if people who support Bush are under a hypnotic spell, and are suffering from a form of collective brainwashing. People who support Bush in his pathology are exhibiting nothing other than the groupthink of cultic behavior.

Followers of a cult unquestioningly give their power away to their leader’s version of reality. People in a cult have dis-connected from their discerning wisdom, which is the ability to discriminate between the opposites, between truth and lies, between good and evil. In a cult, any sort of reflection of the leader’s unconscious shadow is not only not allowed, but is severely punished. The cult leader is typically insulated from people who disagree with him, not even wanting to come in contact and have any connection with people who have a different point of view. People in a cult exhibit complete and total denial with regard to any evidence that contradicts the agreed upon belief of the cult. This perfectly describes people who are following Bush as their leader. People who follow Bush are completely in denial about his truly criminal behavior.

complete article at above link.

THE MADNESS OF GEORGE W. BUSH: A REFLECTION OF OUR COLLECTIVE PSYCHOSIS
http://www.awakeninthedream.com/georgew.html

(excerpt)
The truth now needs to be uttered. George W. Bush is ill. He has a psycho-spiritual dis-ease of the soul, a sickness that is endemic to our culture and symptomatic of the times we live in. It’s an illness that has been with us since time immemorial. Because it’s an illness that's in the soul of all of humanity, it pervades the field and is in all of us in potential at any moment, which makes it especially hard to diagnose. Bush's malady is quite different from schizophrenia, for example, in which all the different parts of the personality are fragmented and not connected to each other, resulting in a state of internal chaos. As compared to the dis-order of the schizophrenic, Bush can sound quite coherent and can appear like such a "regular," normal guy, which makes the syndrome he is suffering from very hard to recognize. This is because the healthy parts of his personality have been co-opted by the pathological aspect, which drafts them into its service. Because of the way the personality self-organizes an outer display of coherence around a pathogenic core, I would like to name Bush's illness "malignant egophrenic (as compared to schizophrenic) disorder," or "ME disorder," for short. If ME disorder goes unrecognized and is not contained, it can be very destructive, particularly if the person is in a position of power.

Falling victim to one's own deception as Bush has can have a very mesmerizing and gripping effect on others, as he appears so convinced of what he is saying and is able to project this conviction. To quote Jung, "Nothing has such a convincing effect as a lie one invents and believes oneself." Bush has the seductive coherence of someone who is fanatically identified, like the typical fundamentalist, with only one side of a polarity. Thomas Merton, commenting on the case of the obviously demented Nazi war criminal, Adolf Eichmann, points out "One of the most disturbing facts that came out in the Eichmann trial was that a psychiatrist examined him and pronounced him perfectly sane." A key feature of malignant egophrenia is that it is very hard to recognize when someone is a carrier, because the person can seem so normal and even endearing. The person afflicted can be very "charming" and have a certain type of charisma that can entrance those who don't see through their subterfuge.

Just like Hitler struck a chord deep in the German unconscious, Bush is touching something very deep in the American psyche. Bush is acting out on the world stage an under-developed psychological process that deals simplistically with issues such as good and evil. It’s as if he hasn't grown out of and fully differentiated from the realm of mythic, archetypal fantasy that is typical of early adolescence. This immature aspect of Bush's process speaks to and resonates with those voters who support him, as it is a reflection of their own under-developed inner process.

Whereas Hitler’s evil was more overt in its cruelty and sadism, Bush’s dark side is much more hidden and disguised, which makes it particularly dangerous. People who vote for Bush are somehow blind to what is very obvious to others. It’s as if they’ve become hypnotized and fallen under the spell that Bush is casting. Why would people vote for someone stricken with malignant egophrenia? People who support Bush are suggestible and susceptible to the same malady that Bush is embodying, as if they have a predisposition for it (based on their own trauma, dissociated psyche and tendency to project the shadow). Supporting Bush is a sign that a person not only doesn't see the deadly illness that is incarnating itself through Bush, but is an expression that this disease has taken up residence in their being and is using them to do its bidding.

complete article at above link

More articles of this type at
Awaken In the Dream
http://www.awakeninthedream.com

[SiouxJ]

53. Excellent links!

Worth passing around. Thank you!

[Lisa]

54. ways of enforcing cultural isolation ...

To elaborate a bit on your point #7, bling bling ...

--discourage travel to other countries, or even to blue states, by playing up the "they hate us" angle -- formerly-desirable vacation destinations, like Europe, are to be portrayed as rude, hostile, and unwelcoming

--ban on receiving various types of products from elsewhere, ranging from pharmaceuticals to foodstuffs (for example, I am not allowed to mail candy and chocolate, and even dog treats, to friends in the States, under new USDA regulations)

--try to minimize the chance of stay-at-home Americans meeting actual human beings from other countries, by discouraging overseas graduate students or other types of exchanges -- this makes it difficult for most Americans to say things like, "clearly not all Arabs are terrorists, my friend Tariq sure isn't"


The best prisons are not enforced with physical barriers or even strict rules imposed from above -- the trick is to get people to view certain behavior as forbidden, all on their own!