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Composed Thinker Donating Member (874 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-25-03 04:32 PM
Original message
How Close Are George Soros and Wesley Clark?
Haven't some people suggested that Soros' large PAC was really meant for Clark?
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Pepperbelly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-25-03 04:34 PM
Response to Original message
1. I HOPE they are close ...
I think Wesley could beat Bush like a rented mule and then go on to undo as much damage as possible. If Soros wants to bankroll a return the nightmare of peace and prosperity, I hope he goes for it.
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Composed Thinker Donating Member (874 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-25-03 04:37 PM
Response to Reply #1
3. Why
Edited on Mon Aug-25-03 04:44 PM by Composed Thinker
Why do some people insist Clark is a war criminal? The evidence that he's not is there.

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KC21304 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-25-03 04:42 PM
Response to Reply #3
4. Why
would some people keep bringing it up?


Kerry/Clark
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Composed Thinker Donating Member (874 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-25-03 04:44 PM
Response to Reply #4
6. Because it's hard to shake something like that
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Pepperbelly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-25-03 04:43 PM
Response to Reply #3
5. because some goobers think that to support their candidate ...
they have to smear the competition.
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LoneStarLiberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-25-03 04:49 PM
Response to Reply #3
8. It's Shotgunning
Cross examination debate tactic-fling as much crap out as you can and something will surely stick. Legitimacy has nothing to do with it. I think the war criminal charge amidst all of the other stuff beginning to find its way out into the political arena about Clark is shotgunning.

You are correct. The only international body officially sanctioned to prosecute war crimes originating from the former Yugoslavia, the ICTY, declined to indict any of the NATO commanders or soldiers as war criminals because THE EVIDENCE DID NOT EXIST for such indictments.

Ramsey Clark is a wingnut. Enough said.

Most of the people here who don't like Clark because of this involvement in the Kosovo campaign don't believe in legitimate military action. I understand their point of view but will continue to politely disagree.

In short the war crimes charges are only important if you are in the International ANSWER crowd. Otherwise don't waste your time reading them. They didn't matter to the ICTY so they shouldn't matter to you.
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jumptheshadow Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-25-03 05:49 PM
Response to Reply #8
15. Shotgunning
I read similar stuff on the Free Republic a few months ago. It's weird to see this coming from both the right and the left.

Having said that, I'm going out to the bookstore this week to see what there is out there on this war.
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eleny Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-25-03 04:46 PM
Response to Reply #1
7. "the nightmare of peace and prosperity"
Edited on Mon Aug-25-03 04:47 PM by eleny
oh god, no!

no! no! no! :scared:
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TacticalPeek Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-25-03 04:51 PM
Response to Reply #7
10. Exactly! I weighed too much and had too many employees. n/t
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Brian Sweat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-25-03 06:01 PM
Response to Reply #7
16. It's almost as bad as my nightmare where
Eliza Dushku ties me up and has her way with me. I hate that nightmare.
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tameszu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-25-03 04:37 PM
Response to Original message
2. Not as nearly close as Clark supporters would like
As far as I know, Soros is using his money to target battleground states for the general elections.

Dude, if that were true, the draft Clark people would be jumping up and down yelling it. Believe me--right now their big priority is make other Dems think he's a winner.
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Donna Zen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-25-03 04:50 PM
Response to Original message
9. While I'm not an expert
on just about anything, rumor has it that Soros, independent of anything to do with Clark, is shocked by what is happening in America. He has avoided the Am. political scene for the most part. The money is for issue ads...not Clark ads. That does not negate the possibility that money will not flow to Clark if he should run.

Soros was introduced to Clark by Richard Holbrooke, who is very close to the General, and they have stayed in touch; it's one of those braniac things. Soros may love making money, but he can be quite liberal. From articles I've read, he seems to have a disconnect between his no-holes-barred approach to capitalism, and his championing of very, very, liberal causes. In this case, the two sides of Soros may actually dovetail; you can't make money in bushco's FUBAR world.

Soros Pledges $10 Million to Help Defeat Bush

BOSTON (Reuters) - Billionaire hedge fund investor and philanthropist George Soros this week pledged to donate $10 million to a political action group working to defeat President Bush in next year's election.

Soros, whose $11.5 billion Soros Fund Management is one of the world's biggest hedge funds, has long been critical of Bush administration policies and pledged his personal money to a new political action committee named America Coming Together, his spokesman said.

<snip>

http://cnn.netscape.cnn.com/news/story.jsp?floc=FF-RTO-roptz&idq=/ff/story/0002%2F20030808%2F161786265.htm&sc=roptz&photoid=20030609NYET180

George Soros Tries To Save The World From Global Capitalism Wired/1998


In 30 years' time, the world may know George Soros not as the speculator who made US$1 billion betting against an overvalued British pound in 1992, but as the philanthropist who spent far more than that trying to save Russia and build the "open society" - one that accepts the fallibility of its own premises and so remains open to meaningful change.


Soros founded what's now known as the Open Society Institute in 1979. i Initially, he funded dissident groups in the Eastern bloc, and, after the Berlin Wall came down, poured millions more into the former Communist republics. His foundations in the US and in democratic Europe, meanwhile, have funded, among other projects, needle-exchange programs, legal aid for the poor, and studies of the impact of corporate ownership on newspapers.


Having made billions from free-flowing international capital, Soros has nevertheless become one of global capitalism's most perceptive critics. Since capital can easily escape countries with high taxes or strong regulations, a state's ability to take care of its citizens can, he says, be severely handicapped by globalization. "The development of a global society has lagged behind the growth of a global economy," he says. "Unless the gap is closed, the global capitalist system will not survive."

Soros on EU


According to George Soros, civil society organisations also have a key role to play in monitoring and evaluating governmental human rights and rule of law policies. "Critique is what keeps a democracy honest and open to improvement," he said.

Drug legalization/2002

Serving two masters


Open Society, a revised edition of his earlier The Crisis of Global Capitalism: Open Society Endangered, is its own contradiction. After presenting a devastating critique of capitalism sure to beguile progressives and infuriate market fundamentalists, it concludes that global capitalism is the best of all possible worlds and sets forth a program of "reforms" that on close reading are little more than a call to give yet more money and power to the stewards of global capitalism—the World Trade Organization (WTO), the International Monetary Fund (IMF), and the World Bank.


There are three reasons to read Open Society. The first is for the penetrating Soros critique of capitalism. The second is for insights into the limited worldview of those who live in the world of high finance. The third is to understand why we must be skeptical of the public pretensions of persons of means who profess to serve two masters.

Wingnut take

George Soros’ Social Agenda for America Printer Friendly   Email a FriendDrug Legalization, Euthanasia, Immigrant Entitlements and Feminism

by Neil Hrab

Summary:


The February issue of Foundation Watch examined the philanthropy of the billionaire financier George Soros. It found that Soros-funded groups supported increased government spending and tax increases, and opposed the death penalty and President Bush’s judicial nominees. In this article author Neil Hrab looks at Soros grants in four other policy areas: drug legalization, euthanasia, immigrant entitlements, and feminist organizing.

Why he's a player? The Atlantic


IN The Philosophy of History, Hegel discerned a disturbing historical pattern -- the crack and fall of civilizations owing to a morbid intensification of their own first principles. Although I have made a fortune in the financial markets, I now fear that the untrammeled intensification of laissez-faire capitalism and the spread of market values into all areas of life is endangering our open and democratic society. The main enemy of the open society, I believe, is no longer the communist but the capitalist threat.



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DBoon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-25-03 05:00 PM
Response to Reply #9
11. Not much of a disconnect
I've read some of Soro's stuff. He is a classic 19th century Liberal, a JS Mill sort. He's not a Marxist or a socialist of any sorts. I think he really does believe that a certian sort of capitalism can create a just an humane society.
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TheBigGuy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-25-03 05:04 PM
Response to Reply #11
12. 19th century liberalism....
...the product of the 18th century Enlightenment.

And dont forget who the enemys of the Englightenment are...the fundys and conservatives.
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tameszu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-25-03 05:10 PM
Response to Reply #11
13. Yeah, Mill sucks man
He only advocated for equal rights for women and representative democracy Yes, I know he had an imperialist streak too, but the great thing about the Enlightenment is that it is slowly self-correcting.
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TacticalPeek Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-25-03 05:36 PM
Response to Reply #13
14. Too Apollonian. n/t
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