Been thinking of a post from a few days ago.....

[kentuck]

Which I do not recall the poster nor the date, but s/he asked a question that has stuck with me, mostly because I am a born skeptic.
Basically s/he asked, why did we never question the "19 hijackers" theory? It has been accepted as fact - even by the 9/11 Commission. This seemed to me to be an excellent point to make. Why should we accept that there were "19 hijackers" on that day? Could there have been more or less?

[shraby]

1. There was always supposed to

be a 20th hijacker, but how did they know there were 5 on each plane? Also how did they know there were only 4 planes involved?

[yella_dawg]

2. Validation of the "19 Hijackers" theory is contained

in the white paper the administration released which implicated OBL as the ringleader of the whole thing.

No. Wait. They never actually released that, did they?

Never mind.

[SpiralHawk]

5. The American public has never seen one scrap of evidence

that bin Laden was involved either. Meanwhile, he has never claimed credit. He has only said he was happy that 9/11 happened.

So where is the beef, George? I am willing to believe bin Laden was involved, but I would like at least a teensie scrap of evidence.

Remember, George, there is nothing wrong with telling the truth.

[kentuck]

6. Also, Kristin made a comment this AM....

on C-SPAN that there are more "groups" involved than just "al Qaeda". How short -sighted is it to focus all our attention and resources on al Qaeda?

[LynnTheDem]

10. Except...

A better Q is WHEN will we focus ANY of our resources on al Qaeda, seeing's how Iraq had nothing whatsoever to do with 911 or al Qaeda, and the Taleban offered to hand UBL over if the US provided any proof of his guilt. Something bush declined to do.

[MercutioATC]

7. Actually, OBL did take "credit".

The authenticity of the video has been questioned, but there was one.

[BeFree]

11. Problem is

There has never been true justice brought to 9/11. They virtually lynched OBL without any more 'proof' than that which you, Merc, so murkily state.

Well, if that questionable video is enough for you, that is one thing. But for a large part of us, it is not enough. Truth and Justice, and all that, demands much more evidence before we are willing to convict.

[MercutioATC]

12. I didn't say that it was "enough" for me.

I believe OBL's history of attacks on U.S. interests and his repeated anti-American statements contributed to my conclusion, too.

[BeFree]

16. Your headline, read it again

"OBL took credit...."

And you dished it out as some kind of proof. And now, called on it, you duck and cover with further murky 'proof'.

Why is it that you don't call for a complete investigation? Is there something about Truth and Justice, brought to it's full and complete conclusion, that you have a problem with?

Or are you willing to convict on incomplete information? I hope you never sit on a jury which hears my case.

[MercutioATC]

18. Yes, that's why people occasionally include a "body" in their posts.

...to explain their headline.

I'm not ducking anything. I stated there was a video of OBL claiming credit. That's true. I also stated that the authenticity of the video has been questioned. That's also true.

My post was in response to a post that claimed "Meanwhile, he has never claimed credit.".

What don't you understand?

I think a complete investigation would be a great idea. That doesn't detract from the facts I posted.

[BeFree]

19. For ya'll in GD

...who never venture into the 9/11 forum, let me explain that ol' murky and I have gone round and round about 9/11.

Here we go again, eh? LOL

Ol' murky got his nickname from just what you've seen here. He says one thing then murks it up with another. Hey, it's a free and open forum. But the lead in and the lead outs are just too much. One must simply point out the obvious.

For far too long, the issue of 9/11 has been murkily clouded by mis-info and mud. If we are ever to get to the real story, people like ol' murky must be convinced of their mistaken identifiers and led to the truth one step at a time. LOL

[MercutioATC]

20. ...and THIS is representative of the level of discourse I deal with there.

If anybody can show me how I've "murkily clouded" the waters here, I'd appreciate it.

[BeFree]

21. I just did... can't you see that?

Of course not.

"OBL admitted it, but someone disputes it." Like, duh!

Anyway, you always get the last word in, and being that I am tired of your protecting the boosh administrations hiding the truth of 9/11, I'll leave it at that.

Besides the people here are mostly not on the side which you seem to be. Go ahead, take a poll.

[MercutioATC]

22. So pointing out that "Meanwhile, he has never claimed credit" isn't wholly

correct is "protecting the boosh administrations hiding of the truth"?

Any time you'd like to show any innacuracy in my post or explain how it was an inappropriate response to somebody claiming that OBL "never claimed credit", I'll be happy to listen.

[Wickerman]

3. Cauze that is what Saddam ordered, dammit!

In that secret meeting he had with Osama at Crawford.

[soothsayer]

4. there was a note saying as much stuck in that passport of one of the

hijackers, which magically appeared, unsullied, on top of a heap of rubble. 'Member?

[Warpy]

8. That was so utterly preposterous

that I'm almost inclined to believe it, sort of like the straw driven through the barn door after a tornado story.

Actually, I think the 19 hijackers and who they were is a result of those cell phone calls they allowed passengers to make as a way of keeping them quiet. They gave seat numbers, and since they were on American Airlines, the flight manifest was able to match the numbers with Arabic names. If they'd been on Southwest, they'd be SOL.

We also know at least 5 of them were using stolen passports, since the original holders of those passports have turned up alive and well in the middle east. Only the pilots seemed to be using their own passports, as they knew they wouldn't live through it, and why bother to hide? We'll likely never know the identity of many of the hijackers. We're likely never to know much about the attack and the Bush junta's either active or passive complicity.

[HFishbine]

9. Why

would they have passports for a domestic flight?

[MercutioATC]

13. They were supposed to use Saudi drivers' licenses?

Government-issued photo ID is required to board an airplane. Most foreign travellers use passports, in much the same way that U.S. travellers abroad use passports. They're globally recognized forms of identification.

[HFishbine]

14. Oh, okay.

That's makes sense.

[BeFree]

17. Yeah, sense, but...

A driver's license would have sufficed.

But, one must ask, wasn't it a miracle that the one passport surviving the plane crash and landed practically at the feet of an FBI agent?

But why carry a passport depicting one as a foreigner? Especially if you were part of a conspiracy like the one we are led to believe? Why wouldn't they just forge all-American credentials? Why carry proof of being a foreigner when it makes much more sense to blend in?

[yellowcanine]

23. I think Atta's passport was "found" in WTC rubble. Didn't hear

about the note before but I always thought the passport story was a little curious, to say the least. There are other loose ends as well. For example on the day of the hijackings two men carrying box cutters were supposedly pulled off a train - and I never have heard what happened to those guys - were they hijackers who were thwarted by the grounding of all flights? Was there a 2nd wave of West Coast hijackings planned that was thwarted? I also think that Michael Moore may be unto something about how quickly the bin Laden relatives were allowed to leave the country. Something just doesn't quite ring true about that - particularly in light of what happened to many other people around the same time and since who even appear to be Middle Eastern.

[Beam Me Up]

15. Whoever controls your perception of reality controls you.

People in suits or in uniforms get up on TV behind a podium and tell us and news reporters in all seriousness what "is" and 99.9% of us go right along with it unless our social attention is given an alternative focus. Yet, we know THEY LIE. They lie repeatedly and boldly about anything and everything. We turn to the "news" as if it IS "news" -- as if it tells us what is actually going on. We might as well be blind and deaf so ignorant are we of the facts.

I don't know how many hijackers there were. I don't even know if there were ANY "hijackers" or whether the "hijackers" were themselves "hijacked" -- much as our entire nation has been "hijacked". One thing I do know: We are being taken for a ride and the majority of people are just going along on it with absolutly no CLUE where or why.

Do we or don't we see what is coming?

BMU