CNN showing video of troops terrorizing Iraqi families.......

[karlschneider]

I have no way to describe how disgusting this shit is.

[skip2mylou]

what are the US troops doing?

in what way does it show them terrorizing the family?

[Name removed]

2. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[hussar]

5. I think the person was just asking what was happening on CNN

if you can't see it you don't know.

I am "MAD AS HELL" on a daily basis with all I read on the web and DU, when is the revolution brother, sign me up.

[Warpy]

21. A great description of this stuff

...can be found at http://dear_raed.blogspot.com/ He's an Iraqi blogger who writes better English than most of us do, with an acerbic wit that is irresistible. He skewers the Baaths, the Shi'ites and the occupying forces with equal precision.

[atreides1]

7. Calm

Calm down my friend, as a former soldier I too am angry. These men
are following orders, they know that because of this administration
they will face no consequences for their actions.

I do think that you are misreading the implication, the person may just be like those military families that have lost loved ones, but still believe the lies, because they cannot except the fact that a
life was snuffed out based on many lies.

[TNOE]

8. you misread the post Karl

skiptomylou is one of the good guys....

[karlschneider]

12. I hope so and that is why I said what I did...but seeing 16 posts made me

wonder just a bit. I know, I had 16 myself a very long time ago.
You can probably see why I never considered a career as a diplomat. ;-)

[skip2mylou]

19. sorry,

I should have used more simple words to ask my question.

[TNOE]

1. Wonder what the point of that is???

Terrorizing... when do the draped coffins start being shown?

[Jacobin]

3. Anyone who thinks this craven behaviour won't come back to bite us

is delusional.

Our troops are in an impossible situation trying to occupy a country that they were told to conquer and that has not attacked us. Now they are supposed to "police it". They are, for the most part, young and untrained for this job.

They are hot, tired, underpaid, lied to, want to go home, sick of being shot at (after Rummy told them people would dance in the streets and welcome them as "liberators"), and they are pissed.

There is no end in sight (Franks today said 4 years), France and Germany just said no thanks to sending troops as did India and Pakistan, so their rotations will be LONG.

Who can they take their frustrations out on? Their commanding officers? Is their behaviour bad? Yes. Is it understandable under the circumstances? Yes.

They are victims almost as much as the Iraqi people.

IMPEACH BUSH*

[hussar]

9. So you think their actions are justified ?

as an ex soldier myself, I think not.

The fault lies with Smirk and the US goverment and the US military,
training is poor and discipline non existant.

[Jacobin]

13. Read my post.

I didn't say they were "justified"...I said they were "understandable" which is quite different.

I also agree with you that this is Bush*'s fault....see bottom of my post.

Why don't people read posts before responding to them?

[hussar]

14. You join the military and take the consequnces buddy

just because you are thrown into a cauldron of hell doesn't mean you are allowed to destroy property and kill innocent people.

You Yanks are something else.........Oh and I did read your post........hope you are satisfied.

[Jacobin]

16. I think its nap time for you

I pointed out that human beings put in horrible circumstances can do horrible things.

Maybe it was just too obvious a statement.

Do I applaud their behaviour? nooooooooooooooooo

I've been against this invasion from the start. If I were an Iraqi,I would be fighting tooth and nail against the occupying force.

[atreides1]

20. I Did Read All of Your Post

Example: An adult who is abused as a child can in it's turn become an abuser, going to the point of killing a spouse. So should we as a society be so understanding, that we not insist on punishment for the
crime of murder, based one the fact that the murderer was an abused child.

These men and women were not placed into this position, they volunteered, they enlisted. It may have happened because of a lack of jobs at home, or trying to get money for college. Whatever the reason
they went into this with their eyes wide open. And if they did not realize that part of being in the military included the chance to go to war, then we have a bunch of idiots with guns running around a foreign country.

I was in the US Army for 13 years, and I knew when I took the oath, that I might someday have to go to war. And the time came during Desert Storm.

These troops have been placed here by an administration that does not care about them, a congress that only pays lip service, and a chain of command that is more concerned with getting that consulting job upon retirement then they are about these troops.

I like you do not applaud their behavior, but unlike you I do not give them excuses to continue it. The US military is in violation of
the Articles of the Geneva Convention, and most likely in some cases
have also violated the Laws of War. And as long as people keep giving them excuses, it will continue.

In an ironic note, the investigation into what happened to the 507th
Maintenance Co, stated that they were still investigating whether or
not the Iraqi fighters that attacked the unit, had violated the Geneva Convention.

I have never belived that all can serve in the military, only those that are willing to make sacrifices. So I do not begrudge those that
have never worn a uniform. The problem I have with them is when they try to understand us, and why we do what we do. The military is under
civilian control for a reason, when we do a good job we appreciate the
support shown by civilians, but when we do a bad job, the civilians need to make sure that the military is held accountable for their actions. Not coddle them with understanding, you can pity us, you can
praise us, but for God's sake keep us accountable!!!

[Jacobin]

22. We agree. Its a semantic difference.

I said their behaviour was "understandable". You quoted me as saying it was "excusable".

I DO NOT think its excusable. My choice of words led to a misunderstanding.

[trof]

4. why should I give a ratsass

what Ron Silver and Bianca Jagger think about this?
Even if she is on our side?
Yes, the tape of the soldiers ransacking the houses was chilling.
They are in an untenable situation.
On both sides.
Thanks *
you jerk

[ShaneGR]

6. Actually, didn't think it was that bad

The guy said his brother killed two Americans. When the soldiers asked the guy who his brother was he wouldn't say. When asked what his brother looked like the guy answered, "He's not too tall and he's not too short."

So they took him away. Don't have a problem with that.

[karlschneider]

10. Excuse the FUCK out of me.......that is EXACTLY the kind of description

typically given by any witness to cops (I was one, working my way through college)...unless of course the person is a dwarf or an NBA player. It looks to me like they 'took him away' because he didn't produce a DNA analysis. Not to put words in your keyboard, but it sure sounds like you're in favor of dragging off people for failure to provide detailed descriptions of a family member. In ANY case, I can't see how this kind of behavior is going to have any sort of positive effect on gaining the 'hearts and minds' of these people who have been "liberated", then "reoccupied."
Bah.

[Wonk]

23. quicktime of the segment you're talking about

11 M

[Jacobin]

11. Hmm

So, if China decided the U.S. had too many WMD's and convinced their army to invade and occupy the U.S. and an occupation Chinese soldier asked where to find your brother who had just shot two Chine soldiers, would you cooperate with them?

Just curious. We have no fucking business there. It's their goddamned country. We invaded it illegally and are now trying to occupy it.

Any human in any country with any cajones is going to resist being invaded, conquered and occupied.

I, for the life of me, don't understand why this behaviour is ok with some people. I'm truly puzzled.

Please enlighten me as to why its ok for our soldiers to invade, conquer and occupy a country which has not fired a single shot at our country?

[hussar]

15. Happily agree with you on this point

[Jacobin]

17. Glad you read this one

.

[searchingforlight]

18. I believe all of these behaviors are a call to each American to

decide which side they are on because, make no mistake about it, they are acting in the name of everyone of us and unless we stand up against it, we are as guilty as they.

One man, one vote is not just one man votes for whomever and then let them see what they can do. I feel it is each man votes and then each man is responsible for each right or wrong that results from that vote. RESPONSIBILITY.

[grasswire]

24. I don't see....

....why it is necessary to ransack a house while children sit cowering under the armed soldiers. The homes were literal shambles. The women sat trembling, barely able to hold it together. After it was over, the GI says "we were a couple of days late, I guess." He said they "apprehended" the innocent brothers so they could be interrogated.

[Redleg]

25. This has turned into another military bashing thread...

... no wonder so many people think that liberals hate the military. Try to have a sense of perspective- these soldiers and marines are working under difficult circumstances. They are aggressive because they have had little sleep, it's hotter than hell, they are getting shot at daily, and they have little information about the enemy and situation. Blame the Bush admin and the armchair generals for this mess, not the GIs. If there are illegal killings the perpetrator(s) will be brought to justice.