Revised: NYT and Tenet and the "Bush is crazy" story.

[troublemaker]

(Mods: this is in part duplicative but corrects some petty errors and incorporates new data. Merely appending corrections to a previous post is a poor substitute for getting it right up front so I hope you will let this replace its somewhat flawed predecessor. It's better for quoted material to be error free.)

Early this morning off-beat political news/gossip/speculation website Capitol Hill Blue published a story called Bush's Erratic Behavior Worries White House Aides about Bush's dangerously erratic behavior. It was sourced to anonymous White House aides.

http://www.capitolhillblue.com/artman/publish/article_4636.shtml

Many liberal blogs and site picked it up, but very cautiously because it didn't have much facial credibility. Within the article it offered a new account of Tenet's departure that defied the official story, the conventional wisdom and even the alternative conventional wisdom. (We need to add ACW to the lexicon) The story said that Bush fired Tenet in a fit of pique without consulting any of the people that most assume really run the WH, including Cheney and Rove. (Of course on paper it was technically a resignation as most high-level firings are.)

The story also alleged that Bush kept Tenet's dismissal to himself and only told the power players about it after his press conference with Australian PM Howard. Then Bush left his shocked cabinet and advisers, went outside to announce Tenet's resignation to the world, and promptly left the country.

When I read that part of the CHB story I had grave reservations about the truth of it. Could Bush really go through all the business involved in a meeting with a Head of State without mentioning to anyone that, "oh, by the way... George Tenet doesn't work for us any more."

I guess it's not entirely implausible. Tenet may have requested that Bush not tell anyone because it was bound to leak and Tenet wanted to tell some people personally himself. The NYT says he called at least two members of Congress Thursday AM, for instance.

But it's still a juicy story... Bush keeping the big boys in the dark like that and then dumping the news on them on his way out the door.

That juicy claim from the CHB story seems to have been confirmed by the NYT in their final edition this morning:

The timing of the announcement appeared to take even senior White House officials by surprise. As one recounted the events, Mr. Bush had just walked back into the Oval Office after finishing a morning news conference in the Rose Garden with Prime Minister John Howard of Australia. At that point, Mr. Bush informed a small group in the Oval Office that Mr. Tenet had resigned. The group included Mr. Cheney; Secretary of State Colin L. Powell; Condoleezza Rice, the national security adviser; Andrew H. Card Jr., the White House chief of staff; and Dan Bartlett, the White House communications director.

Minutes later, Mr. Bush reappeared on the White House lawn to make the short walk to Marine One, the presidential helicopter. En route, he stopped to make the statement about Mr. Tenet's resignation to a group of reporters. http://www.nytimes.com/2004/06/04/politics/04TENE.html?pagewanted=print&position=

After reading that in the NYT I had to wonder why such a hot little detail was in the NYT and in the CHB story but seemingly not anywhere else. Yes, CHB may have snagged the juicy detail from the NYT but the CHB story claims a posting time of 6:15 and last revision time of 6:30 (presumably EST, since no one disputes it came out early this morning) and the NYT version of the detail in question was a late addition to their previously posted version. I don't know exactly when it was posted but if CHB added that NYT detail to a hoax they were pretty damn efficient about it. (If it was elsewhere *before* the NYT and CHB I just didn't see it. Corrections are desired.)

Perhaps the crazy-ass CHB story had some real sourcing inside the WH and perhaps we ought to take it with one less grain of salt. Not accept every word, mind you, but accept it as having some actual sourcing.

Okay... so what if CHB got it right? The official story is that Tenet requested a private meeting with Bush. He talked briefly to Andy Card on his way to see Bush in the residence part of the WH and told Bush he was resigning. So everyone at least agrees there was a private evening meeting and Tenet left the meeting without a job.

But let's accept the CHB version of Wednesday evening for a moment. Tenet requests a private meeting with Bush or visa versa. (I don't think it's usual for Bush to have meetings in the residence; Clinton was less formal but Bush tries to keep things separated) During that meeting "when the director challenged the President... the President cut him off by saying 'that's it George. I cannot abide disloyalty. I want your resignation and I want it now." Tenet was allowed to resign "voluntarily" and Bush informed his shocked staff of the decision Thursday morning. One aide says the President actually described the decision as "God's will." (yes, I do realize that CHB is quoting from a pretty private meeting and that raises questions itself, but it could be hearsay from any number of WH personnel)

<<<Tinfoil alert>>> But if CHB is right and the firing was a spur of the moment thing that happened during this private meeting then what the hell was the meeting about in the first place? The official rationale for the meeting is that Tenet wanted to resign in person, but if the meeting wasn't set up (by either side) to discuss Tenet's pending unemployment then what was it about? And what did Tenet say that was so disloyal?

Speculate away...

[opihimoimoi]

1. I smell protection of the CIA crew. IMO Tenet wanted to save his

boys from the Bushites they wanting the CIA to fall on the sword thingy/ Rather than that, Tenet took the hit. HMMMMMmmmmmm

[BeFree]

32. CIA Crew...

CIA has been dogging the smirk for some time now, eh?

Smirk tells Tenet to call off the dogs. Tenet goes to the dogs and comes back to the smirk with "I can't do that, it's outta my control". Smirk fires Tenet thinking he will put someone in charge of CIA who will call off the dogs.

[opihimoimoi]

34. Those Pesky Spooks gonna git revenge yet.

Bush is Toast

[Stephanie]

2. You're a stickler for accuracy

The meeting had to be about (pick one):

• Bush knew neo-cons gave secrets to Chalabi
  
  
• Bush knew neo-cons were about to out Plame
  
  
• Bush knew neo-cons lied about Iraqi WMD's
  
  
• Bush knew but did nothing to stop the 9/11 attacks
  
  
• Bush knew about the torture and murder at Abu Ghraib

There is no reason for Tenet to meet alone with Bush unless it is a matter that affects him personally. Any matter of policy would go through someone else, either instead of Bush or in his presence.

So Tenet went to Bush to tell him he was personally implicated in one of these stories. On the same day that Bush hired a private attorney.

[rocktivity]

WHO GAVE THE SECRETS TO CHALABI???

And why did he need to know them? Was it part of some kind of setup in case he had to be "disposed of" as the next Iraqi leader?

:headbang:
rocknation

[troublemaker]

16. I hope that's not the topic

My hope is that Rumsfeld is too weakened right now to get Tenet fired just because Tenet fragged Rummy's boy Chalabi.

But maybe Cheney still has more control than I think. He's weakened, yes, but maybe...

[Spazito]

19. I don't think Chalabi relates directly to the Tenet resignation...

only because of the timing of the lawyering up and the Tenet resignation, there was very little time between the two events and bush's call to a personal lawyer relates directly to the Plame case as confirmed by the White House.

[Media_Lies_Daily]

58. First off, it was the DIA that crashed Chalabi's party, not the CIA....

...and second, if anyone passed secrets to Chalabi, it was the OSP.

[rocktivity]

72. From what I've been reading lately, EVERYTHING from Chalabi to WMD

is Tenent's fault.

At first, I thought he'd resigned in disgust. But if he were doing such a "superb" job as Georgie says, why was an OSP needed in the first place?

:headbang:
rocknation

[susanna]

11. That's my take, too...

I just outlined the same to a friend. I'm leaning towards the Plame scandal, but Chalabi has been getting reamed the last week or so, and I can't tell you how surprised I was when that started...I almost fell over. Someone was messing with the Pretender-in-Thief's go-to guy for Iraq - that was a shocker to me. CIA? Hmmmm....

[troublemaker]

35. To me the Chalabi thing argues for Tenet resigning

The CIA definitely took on the Office of Special Plans and Pentagon in general. I assumed Tenet was taking care of business--tidying things up before he left.

I *still* think Tenet resigned without pushing or else Bush fired him on his own. Anything else involves too many people for it to have been so surprising, especially the way everyone is leaking these days.

[Media_Lies_Daily]

65. I also think that Tenet is now free to say whatever he wishes...

...under oath, and/or in public.

My guess is that Tenet knows where ALL of the bodies are buried, and he's personally not happy with the NeoCons.

[troublemaker]

68. I'm glad he knows where SOMETHING is buried.

I actually sort of like the guy, but he's earned that shot.

[aquart]

20. Ah. Good point. We're told that was about Plame.

Which means nothing, of course.

Did Cheney hire his attorney before or after George's?

[Spazito]

3. Could it be that Tenet went to the WH to tell bush that...

he has been subpoenaed to appear before th grand jury on the Plame investigation and that he intended to testify to bush's knowledge of and/or involvement in the outing of Valerie Plame? That would explain the "loyalty" question and, given bush's temper is well known, he then demanded Tenet's resignation. That's my take, anyway.

Edited to add: One question, if answered, might help with the scenario. That question is: At what time was the meeting held with Tenet and was it before OR after bush had contacted a personal criminal lawyer?

[Stephanie]

4. Maybe he personally served the subpoena....

Wouldn't he have to be served?

[Spazito]

6. I am not sure what you mean....who served the subpoena and to whom?

[troublemaker]

5. That's my guess, or something close

The only problem is that there's no reason for Tenet to have much knowledge of the Plame affair.

But Tenet did instigate the investigation with the CIA referral to DOJ.

Could Tenet withdraw such a thing? Could he tell DOJ the investigation was no longer in CIA's interests? I don't know. If such a thing is possible perhaps Bush requested he do that and Tenet refused. (Rank speculation alert)

But we do know that Bush talked to a lawyer, went upstairs, met Tenet and Tenet came downstairs without a job.

[Spazito]

7. Do we know for sure that bush talked to a lawyer before meeting with...

Tenet?

[troublemaker]

9. It was the same day and Bush goes to bed early...

my impression is that he talked to the lawyer first, but I don't *know* that. I see what you're getting at, though. It's more fun if he talked to the lawyer after Tenet left.

[Stephanie]

8. CIA did the first investigation.

After investigation they concluded that it warranted a criminal investigation by FBI. Justice ignored CIA's first request. CIA had to insist until they opened the current investigation. So I think Tenet would have quite a lot of knowledge about it. Josh Marshall reported all this.

[troublemaker]

12. Interesting...

if they were veering off into obstruction charges against people in DOJ then Tenet would have relevant knowledge of the early phases of the non-investigation.

[Stephanie]

14. Wow

Because we never really knew what finally made Ashcroft recuse himself.

[troublemaker]

18. nice

[Spazito]

10. To me, it would stand to reason that Tenet would have done an...

internal investigation about the leak prior to referring the case to the DOJ. It is possible that, as a result of his own investigation, he gained knowledge of White House involvement and at that point referred the case to the DOJ. I, too, will make the disclaimer that I am speculating based on the "unknown knowns", lol.

[Stephanie]

22. Josh Marshall on CIA investigation into Plame case:

On September 30th of last year Rep. John Conyers, Ranking Member of the House Judiciary Committee sent a letter to the CIA requesting a description of what contacts the Agency had had with Justice about the Plame matter prior to the commencement of the investigation.

Then last Friday, January 30th, the CIA responded in a letter we've just added to the TPM Document Collection.

According to the letter the CIA first contacted Justice by phone on July 24th, 2003. They followed up on July 30th, 2003 with a letter advising them of a possible violation of criminal law and informing them that they had opened their own investigation.

The folks at the CIA seem not to have gotten an altogether satisfactory response to the July 30th letter because they again sent the letter, by fax, on September 5th, 2003.

Then on September 16, 2003 they contacted Justice yet again to inform them that they (i.e., CIA) had completed their investigation. They provided a memo summarizing their findings and requested that the FBI begin a criminal investigation of the matter.

Finally on September 29th, Justice notified the CIA that they had in fact begun an investigation.

Why did it take so long? Why did the CIA have to press so hard?

http://www.talkingpointsmemo.com/archives/week_2004_02_01.php#002527

[troublemaker]

25. Well don't you have a good memory!

[Stephanie]

29. I have had a feeling about this for a long time

I have thought since last summer that this would be the crime that would bring down BushCO. It's so clearcut. It's Robert Hansen.

This is the first thread I bookmarked on this - the day we first heard "frog-march" in relation to Karl Rove:

Guess what Joe Wilson told me today (the yellow cake guy)

[troublemaker]

23. It's... always... the... cover-up

When will they learn? There was probably not even a prosecutable crime at the heart of l'affaire Plame when they started.

Bush cannot survive any indictment of *anyone* for anything... even spitting on the sidewalk.

[troublemaker]

13. BTW just noticed this was my 911th post

<<twilite zone music>>

on edit: Hey, now it's higher... I thought multiple replies in one post didn't count. Live and learn.

[Spazito]

15. lol and ohhhhh nooooo!

*

[Stephanie]

17. So if that is an omen, then Bush will be implicated for LIHOP

And that's the most important one. Not a scandal. A horrible, horrible crime of deliberate negligence or worse.

[djg21]

21. This stinks of Karl Rove . . .

Bush's announcement, after the A-String press had already departed for Rome, strike's me as a purely Rovian tactic. Either Rove is behind it, Shrub actually learned something from his handler, or it's all dumb luck so to speak.

I wouldn't doubt that this is an orchestrated effort by Rove tohave Shrub demonstrate he is actually capable of making a decision without the help of he and Cheney!

[Stephanie]

24. Isn't Karen back?

I think so

[Spazito]

26. From the way in which bush handled the announcement...

it didn't look "orchestrated" and when Rove orchestrates anything he is a detail man, to the extent he details himself into disasters, ie the Mission Accomplished banner. bush had to come back to the mic after 5 minutes of leaving it, it looked less than professional therefore didn't make bush look good, imo.

[troublemaker]

30. Too ragged

I can believe Tenet quit or that Bush fired him in a fit. The only thing I cannot believe is that this was a coordinated administration move. It was fucked up even by their standards. Bush was speaking without notes (and it showed) Even the RW surrogates had no talking points all day. They were left to guess whether they were supposed to smear Tenet or praise him.

[progressivebydesign]

71. I go for that explanation, too.

It was too wierd.. he was even more inarticulate than usual. He and Tenet probably had a row.. Tenet would have gone thru more traditional channels, thereby not catching everyone offguard like that.

[Media_Lies_Daily]

63. Sorry, but no. Junior's handlers don't trust Junior to say anything in...

...public that isn't scripted, or for which he has been carefully prepped.

[Dover]

27. Bush called his attorney that same evening

probably AFTER the meeting, but maybe it was before.

I posted articles outlining the reported timing of these events on Wm. Pitts post here in GD last night (the one he posted to test out his article on the resignation).

[Eloriel]

28. Another detail

Didn't Bush say, in his brief and bizarre announcement, that Tenet had submitted his letter that morning? But the meeting where he was said to have resigned was the evening before. It sure seems to me that if I were going to resign, I'd have my letter in hand.

[troublemaker]

31. lovely

I can see Colombo leaving the oval office and turning back. "There's just one thing I can't figure out..."

[Spazito]

37. Another crack in their story that he requested a meeting to resign...

it points more and more to a forced departure.

[Spazito]

33. I have a technical legal question...

If someone has testified before a grand jury, are they allowed to talk about their testimony afterwards or do they have to remain silent about it until a later date?

[troublemaker]

36. They can talk about it, but nobody else can

First ammendment trumps all. Thank God!

on edit: Of course many professions like the police probably have strong rules against GJ disclosures, but that's different. If you or I get called in we can march out and tell the world what went down.

[Spazito]

40. Thanks, that helps me with another aspect to my speculation...

and that is: Tenet testified in front of the grand jury about the Plame leak then calls and requests a meeting with bush, informs him that he had testified, what he testified to, bush blows up, calls him disloyal because of what was contained within the testimony and demands his resignation. Tenet leaves and bush calls Gonzales who recommends that bush contact a personal criminal lawyer, probably recommended the guy, Sharp. The next morning the letter of resignation is received while bush is doing his press conference with Howard, when bush goes back into the White House he finds out that Tenet was shortly going to address the CIA employees so he had no choice but to go back out and announce the retirement. How's that for speculation, lol.

[troublemaker]

48. Good, but the lawyer chat had to be before

(see the admirable post here about timing for details)

But Bush could have known the *topic* of the Tenet meeting before lawyering up.

Or he might have learned from the lawyer about something he could request Tenet's cooperation with and Tenet turned him down.

Or he might have had a legal question about something that could or couldn't happen if he fired Tenet that evening.

[Spazito]

62. Seeing that there is an LBN story about Cheney having retained...

a personal lawyer and was "recently" questioned about the Plame leak and the fact that the bush's call to the lawyer was before the Tenet meeting, I am considering revising my speculation to: Cheney informed bush about his questioning which resulted in bush calling his own attorney and what bush learned from Cheney involved Tenet. It would mean there would have had to have been a phone call from bush to Tenet with a request?, as you posited, and Tenet subsequently requested a meeting with bush and it goes from there?

It would be interesting to know the date of the questioning of Cheney as opposed to "recently". Could all three things have happened on the same day?

[Eloriel]

52. Yeah, I think Tenet's address to the CIA tripped Bush's hand

I don't know about the rest of your theory -- not dismissing it, tho.

[troublemaker]

54. I really don't have a theory

All I have is an anti-theory. Whatever happened wasn't *supposed* to happen.

I have never seen reporters so clueless for so long. Nobody's talking. Maybe tomorrows papers will be different but I've never before seen a high ranking official quiting or being shown the door without the full background story coming out in hours.

BTW just to work this in somewhere... the NYT source described as "someone familiar with Tenet's thinking" is Tenet. Has to be, right?

God, journalism has descended!

[Spazito]

55. or the guy that "retired" today"

He would have worked closely with Tenet, wouldn't he?

[troublemaker]

64. Yes, but I've heard it said that he was planning

his resignation at least three weeks ago. (and talked to people about it) I think that exotic/bizarre old time Newsweek diplomatic reporter was saying that. Laney something? Of course Tenet might have told him he was on the way out so the guy joined the party.

He's the director of human intelligence. The need someone with that title in the WH.

[Spazito]

69. Given the sequence of bizarre events, I am not buying the ...

"planning his retirement" stuff from the White House, it just doesn't compute, in this instance. The two biggies in the the CIA retire within 24 hours of each other and it is simply a coincidence and one has nothing to do with the other, nope, can't buy it.

[Dover]

38. Various Timing Articles

It all came down WEDNESDAY NIGHT. Tenet told Bush, Bush called Lawyer

http://www.talkradionews.com/news/article.php?articleID=223

..Director Tenet called Andy Card yesterday afternoon, when we were at the Air Force Academy, and requested to meet with Secretary Card and then the President. And Director Tenet was at the White House when we arrived last night. I think we arrived a little bit after 7:00 p.m. And the Director and Secretary Card met briefly in Secretary Card's office. And then Director Tenet went over to the residence and met with the President for approximately 45 minutes. And that's when Director Tenet informed him that he had -- that he would be leaving, I believe it's effective July 11th. And it was for personal reasons that he was leaving.

So does that mean that Bush called for a lawyer the same night before/after talking with Tenet?

From Wm. Pitt's Article:

Late Wednesday night, a wire report appeared stating that George W. Bush was seeking legal advice on how to protect himself from the looming investigation into who in the White House outed the name of CIA agent Valerie Plame. According to the report, Bush was "ready to cooperate" with the investigation - an interesting comment, considering the fact that the investigation has been going on for months, and that his people have been stonewalling the investigation across the board. When the President needs a lawyer, it is usually a sign that there is blood in the water.

The AP story broke around 7:30 pm Wed. night.

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=544&ncid=718&e=3&u=/ap/20040602/ap_on_go_pr_wh/bush_cia_leak

It was unclear on Wednesday night why Mr. Bush waited until what appears to be the last stages of the investigation into the leak before he consulted with a lawyer. One administration official speculated that the president must have had some indication that investigators now want to question him.


http://www.nytimes.com/2004/06/03/politics/03CND-LEAK.html?ex=1086926400&en=3f96ac9cbb94ca6f&ei=5006&partner=ALTAVISTA1

From the McClellan press meeting about the timing of the resignation:

http://www.talkradionews.com/news/article.php?articleID=223

Q Is there any connection between this resignation and the President consulting a lawyer in the CIA investigation?

MR. McCLELLAN: No. This was a decision made by Director Tenet for personal reasons, and I would not connect it to anything else. Like I said, I understand there is going to be a lot of speculation and that's why I came back here to let you know what exactly occurred. And the President also made it very clear in his remarks how sorry he was to see him leave.

Q What about a connection to Chalabi?

MR. McCLELLAN: No. I just said in answer to Scott's question, that I understand there is going to be a lot of speculation. I would not make a connection to anything else, other than this was a decision made by Director Tenet for personal reasons.

Q Was there any concern about the timing of this announcement, when they had their discussion about when the announcement would be made? I mean, the President is going over to Europe and there's a possibility that this could overshadow some of the themes that he wants to emphasize.

MR. McCLELLAN: Again, I don't think that anyone was looking at it in that context. Director Tenet made the decision that he wanted to meet with the President last night and inform him about his decision, and that's what the timing was based on. I wouldn't look at it in connection with anything else.

[troublemaker]

43. Nice work

Though the AP story broke (7:30) after the Tenet meeting (7:00) the legal consultation itself must have occurred before that meeting. Probably during the business day.

Did Bush need to know something in preparation for his meeting with Tenet? Probably not, but insinuations are warranted nontheless. If anyone needs to be kicked while he's down it's GWB.

[Stephanie]

39. Read this thread - Cheney interviewed

And he also has his own private lawyer.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x603657

[Dover]

41. Was the CIA behind the raid on Chalabi's office?

I'm wondering if Tenet is in possession of the contents of Chalabi's office (it was thought that Chalabi had collected alot of info on various VIP's as leverage).

Or was it Rummy's people who did the raid?

[Stephanie]

42. Hmmm. I believe it was CIA who did it

Remember Chalabi ranting about CIA?

[Spazito]

44. There was an article back when the raid happened...

that mentioned the Saddam files and the fact that there had been a hope to recover them in the raid but were unable to locate them. If this is true, it would make sense to me that Chalabi would not have any incriminating files on site at all.

[troublemaker]

45. Find out who controls the Dynacorp contractors

We know there were no US military along for the raid but there were six Dynacorp(? my memory fails me) "contractors" on the raid directing where to look. The raid was primarily to try to find Chalabi's blackmail files on US officials.

[Stephanie]

46. Seriously? Where did we read that?

Love to see the link for that, please.

[Spazito]

47. I will do a search and see if I can find it....

*

Edited to add: Here is a link to an MSNBC article on the Saddam files:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/4409622/

The backbone of the operation is a vast collection of secret documents seized from Saddam's files. To process them, according to one Chalabi aide, the De-Baathification Commission has 50 document scanners. There are only 20 other scanners in all the rest of the government.

Will continue to search for the article that mentioned that the files were not recovered in the search of Chalabi's offices.

[troublemaker]

50. State Dept. (the sort-of-good guys)

But eight armed American contractors paid by a US State Department program went on the raid, directing and encouraging the Iraqi policemen who, witnesses say, ripped out computers, turned over furniture and smashed photographs.

http://www.theage.com.au/articles/2004/05/30/1085855436368.html?oneclick=true

State is in the CIA/State Dept. "axis of comparative sanity."

Wshington Post (slightly better source):

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A13904-2004Jun3.html

[Dover]

56. Thanks. Well that clarifies the WHO anyway.

So maybe Saddam's papers isn't the only thing there was of value in Chalabi's office. The way Bushco operates is probably very similar to Chalabi...using information as blackmail. So who knows who has been holding info over who's head. But maybe Tenet found something he could use....

[troublemaker]

59. I read that what they really wanted was Chalabi's secret files on

American officials. God knows what that consists of. (But of course those files are probably safely stored in Tehran.)

[Spazito]

53. I found this editorial piece that refers to the files...

it is not the one I was thinking of but it does relate to the issue:

http://www.pasadenastarnews.com/Stories/0,1413,206%257E11851%257E2180849,00.html

A half-dozen dunderheads who thought they knew everything assumed they could control Chalabi and use him as the instrument of their utopian fantasies. But one week after getting cut off from the $335,000-a- month Pentagon allowance arranged by his neocon buddies, he glibly accepts the street cred that goes with bashing America. And he still won't give us all of Saddam's secret files, which he confiscated and is using to discredit his enemies.

It is a Maureen Dowd column, it seems.

[Dover]

60. Thanks. I can just imagine all the incriminating evidence

that might have been harvested from Chalabi's office. The article I remember reading attributed the collection of incriminating information on VIP's to Chalabi, rather than Saddam (said it was how Chalabi operated). But I'm sure BOTH Chalabi and Sadam had lots of juicy info. It is absolutely treasonous if Chalabi was allowed to retrieve Saddam's files.

[lanparty]

49. It didn't happen on a friday ...

That means it was "unplanned" or spontaneous. If they knew what they were doing, it would have happened on friday.

This would leave me to believe that GW and Tenent got into a spat about something and GW asked for Tenents resignation.

We'll find out. If Tenent starts singing, he was fired. If he keeps his mouth shut, he left on his own accord. However, something tells me that him and Richard Clarke will have a LOT to talk about in the coming months.

[Dover]

51. Well, the timing could have been linked to Bush's departure for Europe

rather than the Friday news dump reasoning.

[Zan_of_Texas]

61. totally different hypothesis

I was in a room with 4 like-minded citizens this afternoon. All four of us agreed there will be some sort of October Surprise -- some terrible event engineered before the election. Not necessarily in October, but you get the idea.

Okay, let's say that is true.

We know that in the days prior to 9-11, FBI agents on the ground were picking up clues, and higher-ups were discouraging them from pursuing them.

So, let's say Son of 911 is already planned. Let's say CIA is picking up the vibes, the actual plan.

Let's say Tenet goes to George and says, "Ya know, I'm not so sure this is a good idea. We're going to stop it from happening." George says the hell you are. Tenet, who may not be averse to a police state, but not one with these bozos in charge, says, MY AGENTS AND I WILL NOT TAKE THE BLAME FOR THIS AGAIN. We already took the fall for the damn Office of Special Plans and their stupid Chalabi stuff.

George says, You're being disloyal -- you're outta here.

[troublemaker]

67. If that were the case Tenet would be dead, not unemployed. n/t

[troublemaker]

57. Off to bed. This has been a very pleasant experience.

51 posts and nobody has told me to go fuck myself. That's a DU record for me! (My screen name is, unfortunately, quite apt)

[Dover]

66. Go TUCK yourself!

..into bed. Sweet dreams. Don't let the intel bugs bite.:boring:

Thanks for giving us a thread where we can put some details together.

[TexasSissy]

70. No, Bush wouldn't fire anyone, much less Tenet.

He's part of the good ol' boys network. They stick together. Besides, he wouldn't risk another tell-all book from a former staffer.

I don't think this has the ring of truth at all at all.