Question for Pacific Northwesterners: Why is your region half Dem/Repub?

[mot78]

I've always thought of Oregon and Washington as bastions of liberalism, and they are the ones who come out with initiatives like asisted suicide, free needles to AIDS patients, and permissive drug laws. They even went for Dukakis in '88, at a time when now-solidly blue states like California, Illionis, and New Jersey didn't. Why are Oregon and Washington swing states?

[Catt03]

1. I'd like to know also

I mean, you have Pattie Murray and she appears to be popular. What's up with this?

[babzilla]

2. city folk vs country folk

the large population centers are liberal, then there are the small rural towns that are rushbaugh land.

In general, the coast is blue and the inland is red. Just like the rest of the country.

[Arugula Latte]

3. Strong rural/urban split

Portland and Eugene in Oregon are very Democratic; the rest of the state is very no-taxes Republican with a libertarian streak (thus the assisted suicide law and a tolerance for marijuana, etc.) It's probably not as fundy as rural parts of other states; this is the least "churched" area in the country.

The same split holds true for Seattle and the rest of Washington state; however; Seattle has a much larger population so the Democrats have more influence, I believe.

[mot78]

5. Makes sense

I wonder if the Libertarian Party could ever gain a foothold in the region.

[babzilla]

8. jinx

you owe me a coke Oregonian.

:hi: from a Washingtonian

[Arugula Latte]

16. You beat me by a minute

I must have been typing while you pressed "post message."

To keep with the Northwestern theme, I guess it would be more appropriate if I sent you a latte or a microbrew! :hi:

[Curious Dave]

4. Its a bit of a generalization...

But, west of the Cascade Mountains (Seattle, Portland, etc) tend to be more west coast liberal; whereas east of the Cascades tend to be more like the inter-mountain western states (Idaho, Montana, etc). Makes for in interesting mix sometimes in state politics.

[SOteric]

6. The rural areas are Republican, and much of the wilderness

communities as well. And there are 5 active military bases in Western Washington. But the vast majority of Western Washington state is urban, liberal, tree-hugging, whale-watching, peace-loving and Democrat/Progressive-electing territory.

[sandnsea]

7. The rural areas are IGNORED

That's why. If Portland would pay more attention to rural voters, maybe they'd win more of them over. But you do have to be able to target the interests of a parent or small business owner when you reach out to rural America. City interests aren't rural interests and the Republicans have done a masterful job at exploiting the differences. But rural areas that vote Republican become more and more economically depressed. Democrats should do a better job of making the case for Democratic economic policies in rural America. That would make a HUGE difference. As well as family issues, like health care and education. And outdoor fishing and recreation. Instead, all that comes down from Portland is far-left talk that isn't representative of the Democratic Party as a whole anyway.

That's the way I see it.

[FlemingsGhost]

12. It's all Portland's fault?

Funny, the state legislature is GOP controlled. Has been for a long time...

[sandnsea]

15. Campaign offices are in Portland

That's the way it is. They do a horrible job of involving the rest of the state in the campaign process. They don't even bother to try to frame their positions so that they'll appeal to rural voters. It's far-left, Portland-centered politics, all the time. Communicating with Portland people on this campaign, you might as well not even exist in their minds.

And no, the legislature has not been GOP controlled for a long time, it's historically gone back and forth. Long periods of Democratic control, then long periods of Republican control, then back again.

[democracyindanger]

18. So your problem is with Kerry's Oregon operation

not Portland. Or maybe it isn't, and it should be.

[sandnsea]

24. No, with Portland

The Dem & Kerry volunteers who are Portland people. And that's all they tend to pay attention to. They are doing an OUTSTANDING job of organizing Portland. If they communicated with the rest of the state as well as they do their own people, we would have the state wrapped up by now.

[FlemingsGhost]

21. Portland is the biggest city in Oregon. Where should it be?

If rural voters are being ignored, with a GOP-controlled legislature, they only have their representatives to blame. But since that ain't gonna happen, let's blame the radical agenda of the gay-lovin', environmental wacko heathens in the big city.

Oh, wait! Maybe they can redistrict again ...

[sandnsea]

23. Ignored by the Dem Party

At the state level, jeez, what in the hell does that have to do with the GOP legislature???

[baby_bear]

13. good points, sandnsea, and applicable in WA

We just may end up with a Republican governor in part for the reasons you cited. Our legislature is split down the middle and is impotent because of it, so a strong governor could be powerful (we haven't had one for 8 years). The Republican candidate, Dino Rossi, is using the argument you make in your message to appeal to state-wide voters.

We reap what we sow, and all that. I am mostly afraid that this situation could make it possible that WA would go for Bush, oh lordy.

s_m

[AntiCoup2K4]

14. God no... if we get a 'Puke governor, especially Rossi... I'm outta here

Locke is close enough. :puke:

[babzilla]

17. "far-left talk from Portland"?

Oh, if only the cities would reach out to the rural voters, they would be welcomed with flowers and candy.

Do you mean far-left policies like equal rights and labor rights?
Here are two good examples of what happens when the urban centers try to reach out to the rural areas.

1. Equal Rights: Watch the documentary Ballot number 9 to see the seething hatred that ensues during the 1992 campaign for Oregon's anti-gay ballot initiative. Sponsors of Measure 9 called it "a simple battle between good and evil". The resulting virulent discourse on the "dangers and immorality" of homosexuality led to an unprecedented rise in violence against lesbians, gay men and their supporters, with families torn apart and neighbor set against neighbor.

2. Labor Rights: Witness what happens when UFW organizers try to promote decent living conditions, fair wages and protections from exposure to pesticides for the farm laborers. Funny enough, for some reason this message is not embraced in the rural areas. If this doesn't make the case for "Democratic economic policies in rural America" let them revel in their rural economic depression. They'll always have Walmart.

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

20. Ah...

WalMart.

[sandnsea]

25. There you go

There are more issues in the state and the country than gay rights and farm laborers. That you would choose to point to those two issues is exactly what I'm talking about. Ignore everything rural people care about, their families and jobs and businesses, and focus on a couple of politically correct issues and wonder why you've lost the rural vote. You don't have to give up minority issues to address majority issues. Those farm laborers want health care and education, just like everybody else. And everybody else wants fair wages & protections and job safety, just like farm laborers. But you have to turn it into a divisiveness that never needed to be there.

And Measure 9 failed, didn't it? That ought to tell you that there are alot less right wing fanatics out in the sticks than you think there are.

[Arugula Latte]

9. One other point

I think Oregon's role as a swing state has been somewhat exaggerated. Yes it was a close Bush/Gore squeaker last time, but Nader got about 5 percent of the vote. I don't think he'll get close to that amount this time.

[Radical Activist]

11. yes, Nader

Oregon and Washington would not have been close at all if not for Nader. I think their status as swing states is overblown.

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

10. Lack of exposure to differing opinions.

I've lived on both sides of the Great Divide.

Although public discourse is still stifled in Seattle(media), the East side is a resplendant and undulating wave of Limbaughsia. Like most places, it's a matter of numbers, the more exposed you are to differing points of view, the more tolerant, the less exposed, the more single-minded. Your single-mindedness will directly reflect your exposure to "news"(and I really mean those quotation marks) sources.

It's the same everywhere, I'd venture.

[Touchdown]

22. Been away for a while, but I remember Yakima...

as a city with a lot of "Old Money". Lot's of conservative and rich orchard owners, with thousands of acres owned. Most of the city fathers (rich farmers) control the city council, regardless of who the mayor is. So any attempt at bringing in industry, or shipping (Some Japanese companies wanted to locate distribution centers here) would never get approved. It's a city with hilltop mansions overlooking the strip tenements and poor housing in the valley, and they like it that way. It's very staid there and nothing changes much. It's also a hotbed of pentecostal political activism.

If you've eaten an apple, then it was probably grown there, but until these guys get bought out, and leave (not a chance) they will always be conservative. I'm glad I left.

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

26. Yakima was the Big Town where I grew up.

We drove 20 miles to Yakima when we needed durable goods(anything but beer).

Alar, Hanford and you. Ah, Yakima.

[kaitykaity]

19. The Thugs have really gone after

rural, white voters, selling them the culture wars.

If anybody here has ever lived in a small town, where
everybody knows everybody, and everybody judges everybody,
the culture wars were a godsend to get those people to
vote Thug.

[robertpaulsen]

27. Former Ashland, OR resident blaming: REDNECKS! n/t

[depakid]

28. Sand & Sea makes excellent observations

which I think are very much in keeping with how many rural Oregonians perceive things- especially those might see things otherwise, like many on the west side of the Cascades and in Dechutes County. The ability to relate to and actively engage citizens in rural areas about issues that concern them- that they find important- was the major reason that former Governor John Kitzhaber was so popular. It's why the Republicans had such a hard time killing off the Oregon Health Plan.

Unfortunately, neither the progressive interests in this state nor the state Democratic party can come close to matching the amount of money raised by the right- especially the out of state money that pours in during elections. So its difficult to get the message out- and when you consider the entire media outside of Portland and maybe a couple of programs in Ashland bleats out non-stop right-wing propaganda- it's not surprising that rural people have the attitudes that they do.

That, however is no longer an excuse- not for the Dems (who are miserable failures in putting together a cohesive statewide campaigns on the legislative level) and not for the rural citizens who insist on sending extremists to Salem. If the policies that these hard right Republicans advocate is what they want- then that's what they'll get. Scorched earth. It's going to hurt them much more than Portland and its environs- who've shown a willingness to take care of their own, (only to have rural representatives try to grab a share of the local taxes we voted for to keep our vital services safe- talk about gall).

I feel sorry for folks in the rural areas, because they really are suffering and it's only going to get worse. Ironically, that may only serve to deepen the divide and reinforce their dysfunctional beliefs. Organism once made an inightful comment about this- in essence he said that when people shortsightedly refuse to pay for services (thinking that government sucks) then services inevitable will have to be cut to the point where they really do suck. I'll add to that and say that the more that education is defunded, the less education people get and the poorer they become- and the more easily they're swayed by the types of emotional and prejudicial arguments that comprise the Republican's stock in trade.

[kaitykaity]

29. Kitz's jeans and boots look helped.

Rumor had it the reason Kitzhaber didn't want to run
for Gordon Smith's senate seat is because Kitzhaber
didn't want to give up the boots.

[depakid]

31. I wonder how that would have played inside the beltway?

A Senator Kitzhaber would have been a beauty of a maverick- sort of the anti-Frist. The job was his for the asking- Gordon Smith wouldn't have stood a chance.

There was no way he was going to leave Oregon for bowels of DC though. I can't imagine how anyone familiar with he and his family ever thought otherwise....

(Damn- in a few years, he could have been a great president, too).

[kaitykaity]

32. Him and Sharon might have had to have

stayed married, also.

Yeah, I volunteered on the Bradbury campaign against
Smith, and Smith outspent him six to one or something
like that. It was terrible.

[banana republican]

30. Eastern Washington is the home of

The John Birch Society (see the Chad Mitchell Trio's song of the same title)

almost every one in my highschool class ( ellensburg) left e'burg for seattle or other places. The only individuals who remained were the children of those who owned the city to begin with or had a reputation as a "jock" in high school.

A few others who couldn't aford to go to college or get out of town started their own businesses, most of them as carpenters, painters, electricians etc..

Any one who could get out of dodge did....