Who uses orange prison garb? Americans or Terrorists?

[bushgottago]

Look at this! Berg is clearly in custody of AMERICANS!!!!

[freetobegay]

1. Well

[FreakinDJ]

2. I think you nailed it

pretty hard to fathom why he is wearing that orange jump suit if he is not in US custody

[Guy_Montag]

3. Children!! Play nicely with the new kid.

Welcome to DU :hi:

I imagine that they put him in an orange suit to remind people of Guantanamo.

[CWebster]

7. I think a better excuse is

that the only footage they had of him is from the prison....where they were known to take many pictures and perhaps, document more than they should have.

Orange coveralls, yellow wall, white chair. And that doesn't even begin to list all the problems with the depicted "terrorists" or the US claiming he wan't in custody.

There are just to many holes to document, but then they didn't have a lot of time to attend to some of the more glaring details.

[Bombtrack]

4. uhh, prison jumpsuits like the one at right are generally made of cotton

not a satin-ey material like the one at left, which appeared on video as pinkish orange, not orange.

[bushgottago]

6. Not satiny material

I think the sheen isn't really there. It's a lighting issue and the effect of "blooming" that happens when you digitize video.

[CWebster]

9. Satiny impression can be atributed by the quality of the light

during filming.

[troublemaker]

31. "can be attributed to"

Yes, it can be attributed to anything if you like playing games, but the plain fact remains that it's a thin satiny material.

[Zero Gravitas]

5. American Prison clothing in Iraq

If he was in US custody in Iraq he would be naked except for a bag over his head.

[PeaceProgProsp]

8. It may be that the video was intentionally made to look like a US

prison either to (1) make the point clear that this was an eye for an eye, and/or (2) to make conspiracy theorists go crazy.

[Eric J in MN]

10. If there is evidence that of US involvement, it must be because

If there is evidence that of US involvement, it must be a trick?

I don't know what hapenned, but dismissing all evidence for one side as a trick by the terrorists isn't the way to find the truth.

[PeaceProgProsp]

14. That's not what I did.

I'm just saying this is another possiblity.

It also makes sense, from a, well, cinematographic persepective, that, if they're trying to draw parallels between what they're doing and what happened in the prison, they'd also use mise en scene to reinforce that point.

[Zero Gravitas]

15. Evidence?

Wearing orange clothing isn't evidence of anything. Sorry. I have no problem with people questioning the "official" story but leaping to pre-determined conclusions based on wishful thinking is just plain silly.

[CWebster]

11. Right

we are the conspiracy theorists and you buy Bush cabal's theories, like maybe the reason for this illegal and criminal invasion?

[PeaceProgProsp]

33. That's not what I said at all.

And I resent the attack.

[Beetwasher]

12. Indeed, That is Also a Possibility

I certainly wouldn't dismiss it. However there is enough anomalies and evidence to conclude at the very least that all is not what it seems or what we are being told as the official version.

[PeaceProgProsp]

17. Of course, one would have to ask, how did they get the chair

and jump suit and the yellow paint. Perhaps those things aren't easily available to your average Iraqi insurgent.

[mzmolly]

19. I thought of that, but the fact that the US denies ever having him in

custody is not explained?

[PeaceProgProsp]

22. Whether the US is responsible or not,

it looks bad that they had him last (which is why they're now claiming they offered him a ride out).

By the way, it's possible that he didn't write the emails to his parents. He might never have been released by the US. The emails might have been forged.

There are just too many questions and not enough answers.

[mzmolly]

25. I would think parents/friends could tell if he was the person writing

emails? A persons dialect and manner are still apparent - even in emails?

[PeaceProgProsp]

28. I agree.

However, from what we've heard, Berg was simply writing that he was having trouble getting out of the country, and he was going to try other routes.

If the tone seemed different, the parents might have attributed it to the dire circumstances and wouldn't have noticed.

They weren't conversattional emails from what we've heard about them.

[mzmolly]

35. Not sure. I saw a website with emails from him to his family...

but I don't have the link now. Many were conversational - at least initially, and I think when he was "released" he had time for conversation?

But again, not sure.

I am certain his parents/family will not stop looking into this matter, they are fighters from what I can tell.

[leftistagitator]

30. That's what I've been thinking, they did it in a mocking style of us

It's the only way I can justify some of this stuff to myself without getting into extreme theories. I don't want to be like those guys who screamed "Clinton killed Vince Foster", but there is so much weirdness going on with the tape and the final month of Berg's life, I'm having a hard time coming up with the non-tinfoil hat theory that explains everything.

[daleo]

13. That is a good comparison

The collar (v-neck, whatever you call it) is pretty supportive, as is the elbow length sleeves, and overall bagginess. Assuming the color difference is a video effect, either he was in prison garb, or someone went to a fair bit of trouble to make it look so.

Regarding the color difference, note that the "white chair" in this photo is fairly off-white, so it does seem that somewhere in the process the color balance has gone off 'true color'. After all, as many posters have mentioned these are supposed to be the ubiquitous white lawn chair, which we have all seen in regular life, and are usually pretty white.

[Q]

16. Don't they sell these orange jumpsuits at WalMart?

- Everyone has one of these. They're probably in every American and Iraqi home.

- It's just a COINCIDENCE.

[Guy_Montag]

18. I started out a little sceptical about this video,

but the more tinfoiling that goes on the less I am (I guess I'm just contrary).

I cannot believe that if this is a setup by the CIA/Mossad/Carlyle group/etc, by US forces in a US controlled prison, they would not

1) take him into a room that with no distinguishing features. That include the paint - it only takes a couple of hours to paint a room magnolia, if your not that bothered about the finish.

2) use a chair from the prison - ok maybe they would, but only if they were extremely common. You wouldn't use chairs that you brought from the US, you would go out & buy a cheap local one.

3) Finally and most damningly - why would you have him dressed in orange prison fatigues. If they are standard US army clothing for prisoners you would use something else wouldn't you. Naked, random clothes from the market, army fatigues, anything is better than the clothes you put all you captured in.

If you were faking this you might miss some things, but these are too fucking obvious!

edit: spelling

[Q]

20. Put in a context of an American media that no longer practices...

...investigative journalism. Few believed that the video and the circumstances surrrounding Berg's death would get this much close scrutiny. Thank God for the internet.

[Eloriel]

23. Not very many people "get it" about the internet, and esp.

places like this where a lot of discussion and detailed analysis and hard research goes on, or how important blogs are becoming. Hell, even people like Bush and Rummy (and so many others) don't understand how easy it is to identify and refute their lies. They'd still do it, because their lies make it to TV ("where Reality lives") and corrections or rebuttals usually don't. So the lies live on (such as the conflation of Iraq and Saddam with 9-11), while the truth doesn't get into the mainstream. But that will change, I think, in time. More and more people are beginning to understand that if they really want to know what's going on, they have to go online.

Sadly, so-called journalists also don't seem to understand how easy it is to do some investigative work on every possible topic -- and they usually have access to Lexis/Nexis, as well. Maybe some day they too will get it.

[sandboxface]

21. How are these pictures related?

I can't tell. The person on the right is wearing a bracelet and what looks to be a hat. It's also difficult to see his facial hair. Where did rense get these images?

[Deja Q]

24. Could Berg have escaped US custody but walked into the killers' hands?

:shrug:

[mzmolly]

26. Yes, but again were missing the point that the Americans denied ever

having him in custody. Why?

[Irishladdie]

27. Exactly!

The American Admin is saying they never had him, I think thats a lie because of the jumpsuit. He was released just like his parents said and then kidnapped by extremists! He stood out like a sore thumb on the streets of Iraq with that orange jumpsuit on when he got kicked out on the streets by the Americans!

[thecrow]

29. Wouldn't they have made him take off the jumpsuit?

When, specifically does the US give these jumpsuits out?
I have seen the Iraqis who are inmates,and those released today... but I have only seen them wearing Iraqi garb or their birthday suits.
:wtf:
Isn't the orange jumpsuit more consistant with the garb at Gitmo?
Could he have been flown to Gitmo? There was certainly enough time to do so between April 10 and last Saturday.

[AmericanErrorist]

32. Both?

Try something a bit more substantive.

[stinkeefresh]

34. - - brand new theory? - -

I've been looking at the evidence that this was CIA, and it really is compelling. What I couldn't figure was why would the U.S. claim that Berg wasn't in U.S. custody when they should have known that the family would immediately prove that to be false.

Now I'm thinking that they WANT us to scream "conspiracy"! A), it's pragmatically unprovable at this time, so it does us little good. B) it undermines our POV in the eyes of many Americans. If it could become nationally known that "the liberals" are accusing the U.S. of the murder of Berg, that will play right into Bush's hands.

I think the video is custom made to horrify the sheeple AND make us DUers cry "conspiracy". Both effects help them.

We should keep discussing this among ourselves and the occasional open-minded fence sitter. But getting a megaphone would be a bad idea.