Fundie obsessions with other people's private lives...

[elfwitch]

My husband and I were having a discussion this weekend on this subject. Fundamentalist Christians get all up in arms about homosexuality, abortion, non-Christian belief systems, porn, child abuse, you name it.

These people have an unhealthy obsession about things that are not only none of their business, but are unlikely to happen to them. Think about how much time they devote in their day giving deep though to those things they see to be perversions against God.

I imagine they spend more time thinking about gay sex than your average homosexual does. Not only that but they escalate the act beyond what probably really happens in these scenarios.

Example: They begin to think about gay marriage. Then they move on to gay sex. Then they move on to kinky gay sex. Then they move on to kinky gay sex and they throw in some goats or something. then they take out the gay sex and just think about goat sex. then they move to marrying goats.

The basic act of two people having sex in the privacy of their own abode escalates in these people's minds to some Caligula level orgy.

It goes like this for every "act of perversion and immorality" they rail against.

I don't think about gay sex or porn or any of the other things they freak out about in any detail or even in no detail on any given day. These fools spend hours and days thinking about it and talking about it with other people who have their same unhealthy obsession about things that really are none of their business.

Their addiction to "Jesus" causes them to travel in their own minds to places even they people they are condemning probably never go in real life.

[Gildor Inglorion]

1. You Are So Right!

Isn't it the Rev. Donald Wildmon who watches TV all day, every day and writes down every word of "profanity" or "obscenity" he encounters? Plus, presumably, glimpses of flesh and shocking double-entendres? Hey, it's a nasty job, but someone has to do it. I wonder if he's growing hair on his palms yet? *giggle*

[elfwitch]

5. Exactly!

Every breathing moment is used to worm out filth and depravity. They are immersing them selves in it. For what? To shield other people? Apparently non of them have heard of the mute button, the channel changer, or the on/off switch.

[Arianrhod]

16. One of my favorite ways to shut up a homophobe

is to ask him why he is so obsessed with other men's sexuality.

:)

[keithyboy]

40. They are simply "obsessed" Maybe they are deprived of healthy sex?

I remember their obsession with Clinton's privates to the point of Rush coining a phrase "the arousal factor."

Is it any wonder that so many priests and other clergy are entangled in so many sex scandals and abuses. This kind of wanton behavior exists in every religion you just don't hear about it that much but there are some real horror stories out there about Jehovah Witnesses, Mormons, and several scandals about Rabbis. Sex seems to be an unhealthy focus of most religious funddies of all sects and denominations.

[demigoddess]

2. you put it very well

We all wish we could put it as concisely and clearly as you did. It astounds that people have to put so much energy and effort into something that would not harm them at all if they would just leave it alone.

[XanaDUer]

3. I often think the same thing...

they see "porn" and sex everywhere. It's like they have it on the brain, and get really mad if you don't see it as well.

They should spend more time looking within their own souls before worrying about everyone else and what they are doing.

[Az]

4. The soul

Consider the soul. Or at least what some people think is the soul. It is a thing seperate from the body. Yet it is your identity. It is you. It is the soul that supposedly will survive for eternity. And where it spends eternity depends on what you do right now. Pretty high stakes there. Finite action, infinite consequence.

Christianity has given rise to socialised structures that postulate a dogmatic authority on the issue of morality. They have the rules that you are supposed to behave by in order to make sure that soul winds up in the good place for eternity.

If they are right, then modern relativistic morality is perhaps the most corrosive thing they face. It makes sense. In a complex world it seems ridiculous to claim one moral truth. Its tough to avoid this sort of thinking. Morality is a complex subject. What seems right to some may not be right to others. So how do you figure out which system to go with.

Its so much easier when you know the one true moral code. Even better when you have it written in stone. After all the soul is going to spend an aweful long time in its final destination. If you have any love in your heart you are going to struggle to save as many souls as you can. And those you cannot save you are going to make darn sure they do not corrupt the ones you love with their immoral behaviour. Because after all, you know the one true path to salvation.

[sendero]

6. as Bush 41 said...

... (paraphrased) there are way too many people out there worried that other people are having fun.

When you have put yourself into an unnaturally restrictive prison regarding sexual and other pleasurable behavior, it must be a terrible burden to realize others have set themselves free :)

[kitkatrose]

7. When you have no life of your own,

other people's lives become of utmost import to you. Wingnuts have no lives--if they did, they wouldn't find time to think so hard about others. I mean, my life isn't all that, but really, I can find more things to think about than gay goat porn. :eyes:

I caught a snippet of the 700 club before I realized what it was. They were talking about gay marriage and saying that in Scandinavia, I think, gay marriage has made straight marriage a novelty. That's right, gays are responsible for straights not marrying, and presumably becoming gay. If that's the case, then straights need to start offering toaster ovens for converting gays. A straight agenda would be nice too, just to have all the goals laid out. :D :D

[DBoon]

14. Would never work

What self-respecting gay household would EVER own a toaster oven.

GET REAL!!

An espresso maker, maybe...

[kitkatrose]

17. Whoops, put that the wrong way.

The straights get toaster ovens for recruiting gays, the gays don't get anything except for the benefit of being straight. Although he or she could start recruiting and get toaster ovens. :D

[DBoon]

22. A better idea

Give the straights automatic hot-dog cookers.

http://www.ideafinder.com/showcase/products/plp0183.htm

I mean, every self-respecting straight ALREADY has a toaster oven.

[kitkatrose]

25. Hoooooooo boy, that's funny!!!

That could be the prize for converting 10 or so. Maybe we can start off with the stuff for the As Seen On TV store. :P

[SharonAnn]

39. Same as the Catholic hierarchy obsession with "pelvic issues"

Birth Control
Pre-marital sex
Extra-marital sex
Divorce
Homosexuality
Right to Choose

[no_hypocrisy]

8. Same thing with the right to choose whether or not to continue a pregnancy

They start with their premise that a fertilized egg/zygote is the equivalent of an established, born human being. If a mother terminates her pregnancy, it is the equivalent of killing a child.

Then they morph into some forms of birth control are abortifacts, such as IUD's and birth control pills as the fertilized egg is thwarted from implantation on the uterine wall, denying its destiny to be a child. Now you're accused of killing a child by not giving it a home to live for 9 months. Therefore, the fundamentalists condemn birth control. Irrelevent whether you are married or unmarried. They believe birth control is wrong and should be illegal.

And when you get to the REAL issue, the fundamentalists are appalled that there are couples out there who ENJOY sex without the responsibility of reproduction. Yep. Recreational sex for the pure fun of it all. That's wrong. That's sinful. That's what is really bugging them. What these folks want is for non-fundamentalists to stop jumping into bed (for starters . . . ) and having carefree sex like animals, or worse, heathens/pagans.

So next time you encounter a fundamentalist trying to argue against abortion, you'll know what they're really trying to get at.

"There is only one honest impulse at the bottom of Puritanism, and that is is the impulse to punish the man with a superior capacity for happiness." - H.L. Mencken

[skypilot]

9. Check out what this Paul Cameron freak has to say...

...about gay sex. The entire article is out there somewhere. Google Paul Cameron...gay sex and you'll probably find it. He apparently thinks that gay sex is like pure heroin, even for heterosexuals. You see, gay sex is soooo much more exciting. That's why the fundies can't stop thinking about it.

http://atheism.about.com/b/a/069865.htm

[prodigal_green]

10. The Passion, Iraqi abuse

I believe there is a pretty direct link between sexual repression and sadism.

While people claimed to be moved by the Passion of the Christ, I would not doubt for a moment that a good percentage of those were "moved" sexually by the sado-masochism displayed on screen.

And if the Iraqi prisoners had chosen to engage in the behavior that they were forced to endure, they would've been condemned to hell, but because clean-livin' Christian soldiers forced them to do it, well, it really isn't any worse than frat hazing. Or as Jon Stewart called it, Freedom Tickling. I'm sure that the porn industry is hurting these days because "legitimate" media are providing plenty of beat fodder for these freaks.

[elfwitch]

11. Freedom Tickling

I just about squirted Diet Coke out of my nose when he said that.
I love Jon.:loveya:

[GOPisEvil]

12. Very well stated!

Life in this country would be so much better if people just kept their noses out of other people's lives.

[GiovanniC]

13. Don't Lump

Child Abuse in with that other stuff.

I agree with you on everything but that. But in that list, child abuse IS everyone's business. Porn, religion, homosexuality, et al are not.

[ScreamingMeemie]

19. To a point, I agree with the thread starter. As a woman who loves

her two children and would do anything for them, I have had CPS on my doorstep due to a neighbor's unhealthy interest in my family. Actually, it wasn't even a neighbor, it was a woman who lived about 10 houses down and figured (these are pretty close to her exact words) that it was her "Christian duty" to report my husband and myself for child abuse. Luckily we had a level headed caseworker who threw the case out in about 10 minutes with no substantiation to the claim. We still have no idea why she did it and I have yet to even meet her.

[GiovanniC]

20. I Realize That Protective Services Can Be Overzealous

However, if we assume that each of the things listed are actually happening, then it is our business. If someone is actually buying pornography, I don't care. If someone is actually engaging in homosexual sex/behavior, I don't care. If someone is actually praying to Allah five times a day, I don't care. But if someone is actually abusing their child, I do care.

That's all I'm saying.

[elfwitch]

23. I was riffing...

They stick their nose in all business.
Child abuse should be reported.
My point was they take their obession too far.

Example: People naked in TV, kid sees naked, kid gets weird ideas, kid starts having sex, kid starts doing drugs, kid has baby, kid has abourtion... and so on...

They think letting a kid see a boob on TV is child abuse. You gotta go along for the ride with me here folks.

[GiovanniC]

24. I'm With You

n/t

[Sir Craig]

15. Very profound observation

It never ceases to amaze me that these people will go so far out of their way to find something to be shocked and disgusted over. Recall all the efforts made by conservative groups to go through certain Disney films frame-by-frame in an effort to find something shocking. Examples of this extreme behavior: Sex spelled out in the clouds in "The Lion King," or the phallic shapes on the cover of "The Little Mermaid" video.

My theory falls under two schools of thought: Sex for these people is either akin to a traffic accident (you know the type: they are shocked, but can't help themselves from looking anyway for whatever reason), or these people are just enormous hypocrites: They have lustful feelings, but their religious upbringing has conditioned them to view any kind of healthy sexuality as sinful and/or shameful, so they mask their normal urges behind righteous indignation.

There is no way this kind of thinking or behavior can be healthy, but people are too fearful to broach the subject because it commits the one unforgivable sin: It's critical of religious dogma. The moment you announce that this behavior is unhealthy (and there is absolutely no question that it is), it is immediately attacked by twits like O'Reilly or Hannity as "liberal agenda" or "secularist attacks." Screw the evidence, that's their mantra.

The bigger problem here is America has a confused and childish view of sexuality; sex is no longer allowed to be taught in schools because the conservatives fear it will lead to increased sexual activity (proven untrue countless times, and in fact has been shown to actually reduce teenage pregnancies, which would also be an answer to the whole abortion issue: Focus on the bigger picture of why these young girls are getting pregnant). Abstinence education and the "Virgin Clubs" have been shown to be next to worthless, but they send the "proper" message (while ignoring the facts).

America is so sexually immature that we use nudity as a shaming tool, as we saw in Iraq recently (that Islam also sees nudity as shameful doesn't help either). When Janet Jackson exposes a breast, the first reaction by the government is to lose whatever sanity they might have had and go completely batshit over a nipple that no one could see unless they Tivo'd the show and ran it over and over, in slow motion, just to make sure they saw what they thought they saw (which is exactly what Michael Powell at the FCC did, going back to the original premise of this rant).

I could go on and on, but I want to save some of this for a web page I'm thinking of putting up. But you get the idea: parents need to change their own attitudes regarding sex and sexuality, and pass on healthier messages to their children. People might be surprised how many social issues might be solved with a little more education.

[Justitia]

18. Repression leads to perversion & obsession

They are self-repressed sexually, and when you repress natural urges you pervert them and become obsessed with them.

All their "issues" (homosexuality, abortion, birth control, education) can be traced back to their own sexual repression - IMO.

Not to drag the Catholic Church into this, but I think this is a key problem with the priesthood as well.

Back to the fundies...they want everyone else to be as repressed as they are. Any hint of sexuality titilates them. They see sex everywhere, and those posters who make the connection between violence and sexual repression are right on the mark (The Passion movie, sexual violence against prisoners).

Remember The Scarlet Letter by Hawthorne? Remember Rev Dimmesdale and how he would whip himself in private? He was supressing / releasing his sexuality, not punishing himself - often a missed point.

Yup, the Puritans are still here and still freaky. They are just a lot louder these days.

[Rainbowreflect]

21. So true! I have asked many a fundie the same question

and have never received a logical answer.
My question is; why do conservatives want government to butt out of issues that have an effect the pubic as a whole. Such as environmental issues, public safety and product liability.
But on the other hand they believe the government should get involved in personal issues such as sex, reproductive choice and marriage.
Totally illogical.

[Az]

26. Understanding

Many people have a large number of positions that they "know" to be true but they will have a great deal of difficulty putting into words. For some people the struggle to understand the world around them is a personal one that they take full responsibility for. To this effect they dismiss others telling them how things should be and instead delve into the nature of things for themself.

Others find themself at the business end of a lifetime of indoctrination in a system that they are told they are simply incapable of understanding. They are told the only way through such a complex system is to listen to the laws handed down by god.

I found myself sitting next to an intelligent exmuslim woman this weekend at a debate about the existance of god. It is always interesting listening to the stories of how someone found their way free from a religion. During her time as a muslim she honestly did not think she could think for herself. It was only after doubt entered into her beliefs that she found a way to apply logic and reason to her beliefs and they began to erode.

To her at the time it made sense that she could not determine for herself what was right and wrong. It made sense that these could only come from allah.

An example I use is suppose I could provide you with a very logical and rational reason why you should be able to pass your hand through the wall. No matter how much logic I brought to bear you would still look at me as if I was wearing a subservientchicken outfit (www.subservientchicken.com). You simply put would not change your mind based on my logical argument. The thing is it is relatively easy to refute this argument by simply trying to pass your hand through a wall. It is not as easy to refute an argument about god. Thus a person's belief is not going to be as easily swayed by a logical argument. There is simply nothing for them to press against. There is no emotional weight to the argument to override their emotional weight for believing in god.

The fundimentalists understanding of the universe is predicated on the rules given to them within their doctrine. Until something comes about by their own realisation they cannot see their way free of this view. Like Plato's allegory of the cave, the view of the world they have before them is their everything. Trying to tell them that there is something beyond the shadows they see is useless. You have to find the kernel within thier thoughts that may bring about a sort of cognitive disonance within their own world view. And then they can begin to bring the tools of logic and reason to bear upon their world view free of the blinders they hold close to themself.

[Bandit]

27. It has been well documented that Rick Santorum likes sex with goats

Paul Harvey likes horses and Santorum likes goats. It is well documented.

[Lars39]

28. You don't have to be out of what they consider the norm, for fundies to

be seriously overbearing about your personal life. I have an upcoming surgery and dread telling the in-laws 'cause I know everything they find out will be immediately sent to the prayer chain, which in their case means half the #$%$ county will know. HIPPA and fundies do not mix. :mad:

[QC]

29. If you really want to know, here's the main reason....

Many of these people believe that if a nation becomes wicked, then God's judgment will fall upon it and it will be destroyed. As they see it, again, this means that both the righteous and the unrighteous will suffer.

That's why the MYOB argument doesn't work with these people. Most of us believe that what other people do in private doesn't affect us, but they think it does.

Of course, there are other factors, too, like the ones people have named here. And they have a real genius for rationalizing their own sins (like the disproportionately high rate of divorce among fundamentalist Christians) and focusing on the ones that just don't interest most of them, like homosexuality. But the idea that a nation's virtue or vice is collective is a very powerful one in fundamentalist circles.

[Lars39]

30. You're right. I had forgotten about this aspect of their beliefs.

They truly believe that they are fighting the good fight for everybody's own good.

[QC]

31. And that's what makes them so hard to counter.

I wish that we could get them to start thinking of virtue and morality in terms of things like social justice and charity, and not strictly in terms of what people do with their peepees and hoohoos. Then they could be a powerful force for good.

As it is, their obsessive focus on sex makes them a menace.

[Lars39]

32. I wish there were some type of Star Trek gas we could flood the place

with and deprogram the fundies. :) The fundies in my life are getting reeeeealllly wierd. :( :scared:

[Az]

33. Unfortunately

there is no one single argument you can run at them that will crack this focus. Each fundimentalist has their own series of beliefs elevating the focus. Its only by taking out each one of those supports that you can get the entirety to collapse.

[dawn]

34. I think it's a combination of things.

Not enough going on in their lives, coupled with an intense desire to do the very things they hate others for.

Also, I think many fundies *do* engage in these activities, and these ones protest the loudest.

Finally, it just shows lack of self-confidence. I feel sorry for people who do that.

[silverpatronus]

35. i don't agree with...

you lumping child abuse in there with everything else, but other than that, i agree wholeheartedly.

[elfwitch]

36. See post #23...

23. I was riffing...

They stick their nose in all business.
Child abuse should be reported.
My point was they take their obession too far.

Example: People naked in TV, kid sees naked, kid gets weird ideas, kid starts having sex, kid starts doing drugs, kid has baby, kid has abourtion... and so on...

They think letting a kid see a boob on TV is child abuse. You gotta go along for the ride with me here folks.

[Zero Gravitas]

37. In Kansas

you can't even buy a beer without upsetting some fundies.

They are against Sunday liquor sales because the ten Commandments say to keep the Lord's day sacred. just how is a non-believer (or a Christan who has a different interpretation (same thing to the fundies I suppose) buying/drinking a beer on a Sunday preventing the fundie from keeping the sabbath in their own way? It isn't except for these Talibornagain types want to impose their religious values on the rest of us.

[elfwitch]

41. Dallas is like that too...

I figure it all boils down to, or at least it should, if you don't want to (fill in the blank) then don't.

If you don't want to drink, then don't.
If you don't want to have non-procreative sex, then don't.
If you don't want to look at porn, then don't.
If you don't want to see violent movies, then don't.
If you don't want to dance, then don't.
If you don't want to have abortions, then don't.
If you don't want to be in a gay marriage, then don't.

Just don't go around F-ing it up for those of us who do want to do these things.

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