I object to the term "fallen soldiers"

[SoCalDem]

It always reminds me of "other" uses of the word 'fallen'. Fallen idol, fallen leader, fallen hero..."Help, I have fallen and can't get up".. "Poor baby...fall down"..

The terminology implies complicity in the very act of falling. It's almost as if, the soldiers would not have "fallen" if they had been a better shot, or had been a step or two faster, or had been watched more closely by their buddies.

The word is a "softer/gentler" euphemism of a much harsher reality..

"Shhhhh, he's 'fallen', don't wake him".. It almost seems as if he will get up , from being 'fallen'....

Those soldiers were KILLED IN ACTION, they did not FALL.. No one can kiss their boo-boo, and make it all better. "Dead" has a finality about it..."fallen" does not.

Any soldier who dies in a battlezone, was killed in action, whether they were shot in a firefight, or their truck flipped over, or they died from a heatstroke in 120+ temperatures.

To their families and friends they are DEAD...not "fallen"..

This is not a reality show, where the ones "voted off" , are offered a cable show or a commercial. The public is so used to muddled language, that they are ready to accept the "fuzzy language", but the ones most affected by this , and other wars, do not have the luzury of semantics..

DEAD is DEAD.

[IronLionZion]

1. That sounds a little insensitive

We all know they are dead, but there's a reason people don't use the term that often.

[SoCalDem]

2. It may be insensitive, but

there is nothing "sensitive" about a war. When we, as a nation, try so hard to "sensitize" things, we accept things that we should NEVER accept....like a war for nothing.:(

[RC]

17. Which is?

Will you have a funeral and be buried if you trip and fall? I'd rather wait till I am dead.
War is by it's nature unpleasant. Using nice words to describe the gruesome carnage makes it easier for the war mongers. Killed is dead. Dead is dead.

[IronLionZion]

18. respect for the dead and their families? n/t

[Dogmudgeon]

3. It's poetic, that's all

The use originated in a way to honor the soldiers and their undying sacrifice, rather than to evoke the idea that they were dead and useless.

Of course, things have changed, and such poetic language can be used to hide unpleasant facts ... "fallen soldiers" ... "grandfather passed" ... "accountability" ... and all the rest.

Who was it who said, "The first casualty of war is Truth" ... ?

--bkl

[SoCalDem]

4. In poetry or song, I can accept the usage

but when it comes to the reporting of news about the war, I would prefer a less poetic approach.

[Dogmudgeon]

11. Yep

Poetry from the mouths -- and pens -- of liars is pretty disgusting.

They want the gravitas, but they come across with pompositas.

--bkl

[Warpy]

5. While I agree in principle

...I recognized one name last night, one of my ex's nephews, a very nice kid when I last saw him.

"Fallen" is fine with me, and I think it's fine for his family, better than the too-blunt "dead."

Sometimes euphemism is silly and sometimes it's respectful. This is one of the respectful times.

[SoCalDem]

8. I do see your point about it being respectful

but there is nothing disrespectful about saying "killed in action". To me it's almost MORE respectful to say "killed in action", since it conveys the real sacrifice of giving one's life in battle or a battlezone, than to have "fallen"..

In real speech, I would suspect that the families DO say that their son/daughter/wife/husband/brother/nephew was killed in the war, rather than fallen.

[mopaul]

6. bush used the term 'honor the fallen' several times

and henry hyde said 'catch the falling flag' when he impeached clinton, as if a blowjob were a national emergency.

fallen is a nicer version of shot, mutilated, and displayed on a bridge.

[Toucano]

7. Baghdad fell.

That doesn't mean it experienced the effect of gravity. Nor does it mean it tripped or stumbled.

Words sometimes have meanings beyond their ordinary usage.

A fallen idol, a fallen woman, and a fallen soldier are each distinctly different things.

I think you are applying a limited conception of the word. That results in your objection.

A fallen soldier is a dead soldier.


fallen

\Fall"en\, a. Dropped; prostrate; degraded; ruined; decreased; dead.

Some ruined temple or fallen monument. --Rogers.


Source: Webster's Revised Unabridged Dictionary, © 1996, 1998 MICRA, Inc.

[SoCalDem]

9. Definition accepted.

:).. I still prefer "killed in action" when it refers to human beings.:)

[Toucano]

10. You're entitled to your preference.

That's what makes the world go 'round! :)

[mopaul]

12. our language hides more than it reveals

liberation. terrorist. insurgent. freedom. mission accomplished

[Toucano]

14. As does your post.

:)

Elaborate if you will. It appears to me you've cited Dubya's abuses of the language.

[SoCalDem]

15. Cited, probably because our "puppy-dog press"

is so ready to mimic those very words and continue their usage, until they become part of the accepted language, much as the people of Spain did for their lisping King..

[Toucano]

16. I understand.

When used properly, the language is a wonderful thing.

Sadly, their objective is to destroy meaning and nuance, limit concepts and ideas words represent, and muddle independent thought.

[Snoggera]

13. Those who have not been in the midst of a war

are fond of creating kinder, gentler words to describe death.

Those who have seen death know it for what it is.

Dead is most certainly dead. For the one that is dead and all who knew him or her. Dead. Gone forever. Not fallen.

Dead.

[tritsofme]

19. Not all of our fallen soldiers were KIA. nt

[SoCalDem]

20. That is true

There are many who truly HAVE "fallen" and cannot get up...without the use of crutches, canes or chairs, but at least they are still alive.

ALL the others, regardless of what killed them, are "KIA", in my opinion.

A reservist who worked in a Home Depot, would NOT have been killed in a roll-over accident in Naserijah, if he had not been SENT there. The families of these types of "fallen" soldiers, grieve just as deeply over their lost loved one, whether he/she was shot, or killed in an accident.

They would never have been there, if their unit had not been sent to war. They would still be with their families. Their death should not be minimized because they died in an accident.