Heres more Proof the Draft is coming SOON

[Mari333]

wake up America!

Whether for reasons of conscience or from lack of information, young men who fail to register with Selective Service are subject to a growing number of penalties. They are threatened with maximum five years in prison and $250,000 fine. No one has been prosecuted in the past decade, but non-registrants are currently automatically denied certain federal and state benefits. Such penalties are part of an effort to coerce young men into registering for the draft, and Selective Service has been instrumental in initiating the legislation.

At the federal level, non-registrants are ineligible for student financial aid, employment with the federal government, and if not already citizen, the right to citzenship. Similar penalties at the state level are outlined in the table below.


http://www.nisbco.org/UAA/ss_state_pen.htm

[Luvpurp]

1. Yet a corp can pay no taxes and stiil receive govt contracts

go figure!

[metis]

2. draft/divinity students

Does anyone know how the draft would affect divinity students? A friend of mine, says her son wouldn't be affected because he's studying to be a pastor, and would be exempt.

[qb]

4. Wow! Dubya may have single-handedly solved the Catholic priest shortage

[SheilaT]

8. They're already looking at a draft

of "needed specialties". If there's a shortage of chaplains enlisting, they'll draft chaplains. Don't even BEGIN to think that your divinity student son will automatically be exempt.

It's very clear to me that if things continue as they have in Iraq recently, if we invade a few more countries like Haiti, if there's a perceived need to have open military patrols in this country (think airport "security"), then a draft will surely happen. The 75 day start up is the MAXIMUM time it will take to happen, and rest assured that a draft could be put in place in well under 30 days.

And don't believe for one moment that the majority of Americans will object -- all it will take is one small prevented terrorist attack, or better yet one that actually occurs -- and people will take to the streets demanding our young men (and perhaps young women) be pressed into service in large numbers to insure national security.

Sunday I was at a forum in which Truman's desire for a universal conscription and the subsequent desegregation of the military were being discussed. One old fool who'd been himself drafted in the late 40's or early 50's thought there was nothing wrong with being drafted, that it gave young people a needed dose of discipline. There are many more like him out there.

[noonwitch]

13. He would have to register as a CO

That's what my brother did when he registered and was studying to be a minister. It means that they can still draft him, but can't put him in a position to kill other people, so he'd be a medic or some other noncombat position.

[Toucano]

3. People are shocked

when I've shown them this.

These laws got through state legislatures with NO publicity whatsoever.

[Mari333]

6. It is being gagged from the press in an election year

thats why it needs to get out on the Net and to everyone you meet.

[bedtimeforbonzo]

5. one important thing

When were these laws passed? The page doesn't say.

I suspect that many have been on the books for years.

[Mari333]

7. check out www.bushdraft.com

www.bushdraft.com

[Beaker]

9. why i can't get too worked up about the prospect of a draft-

first of all, i'm too old, and doubly disabled to boot- i once tried to join the navy, and despite scoring extremely well on the test that they administer to prospective recruits (the recruiter said that mine was the highest he had seen), I was told that the slight deformity of my right hand would prohibit my acceptance...and since then, a spinal condition i wasn't aware of at the time has rendered me more completely disabled.

I also feel that there should be some type of mandatory government/social service for all citizens before they reach age 25.
military service would be one type of such service, but not a requirement.

[Mari333]

10. Thet are sending kids over with disabilities and PTSD,

sending them back to Iraq with shrapnel in them, and some are being sent who tried to commit suicide.
They will send anyone. Our kid was diagnosed at Ft Dix with socliosis of the spine and they sent him, and conveniently lost his X rays..
they will send anyone
dream on
http://www.bringthemhomenow.com

[Beaker]

12. dream on?

I was turned away due to a disability, and even if it weren't the case today, i'm still too old at this point to go, so i'm not concerned about being drafted.
if they had the draft in place, it's A LOT more likely that people with disabilities, like your own kid for instance, would NOT be sent to Iraq, because they'd have plenty more able-bodied people to choose from.
a draft would be fine, and even favoured by me.

[BiggJawn]

15. I'm too old, too.

But you won't catch ME saying "Young guys? Eh, Fukkim.."

Don't be an armchair warrior, Beaker, please.

You're OK with the idea of, and even FAVOUR a draft that will send our best and brightest off to get maimed and killed for the direct benefit of Halliburton and those old white men at PNAC?

Sorry, but I can't support such an idea.

[Beaker]

17. so you feel it's ok to send the mediocre and stupid to their deaths?

"You're OK with the idea of, and even FAVOUR a draft that will send our best and brightest off to get maimed and killed for the direct benefit of Halliburton and those old white men at PNAC?"

As long as there are going to be american servicemen killed in Iraq(which is a forgone conclusion thanks to the lil'dictator...i don't belive we should just cut and run at this point- we made the mess, we need to clean it up), I would rather see it done thru a draft, as opposed to interminable stop-loss actions for existing troops, and heavy reliance on reserves and/or national guard units.

as i said- one of my more "extremist" beliefs is that there should be a two-year 'service committment' of some type for all American citizens to complete before reaching age 25- not necessarily military, but for some it obviously would be.

is it any more or less fair to send kids who signed up out of economic need, or to get training and/or money for college- not expecting that the lil'dictator would actually put them in harm's way, than to have a draft where everyone has an equal chance to be on the recieving end of a roadside IED?

[BiggJawn]

20. Damn...what are these unfamiliar words in my mouth?

"so you feel it's ok to send the mediocre and stupid to their deaths?"

DID I SAY THAT!????

No, I didn't, did I? sorry for my use of the term "Best and Brightest". When I was younger, that was a common umberalla term for our young people, "The Best and Brightest", you know, the "Hope for the Future" and all that.

Sorry, I wanted to hold them ALL up as something more that just Rumsferatu's cannon fodder.

As for the rest of your"Extremist beliefs" I think you're FOS there, too.

"...have a draft where everyone has an equal chance to be on the recieving end of a roadside IED?"

What you been smokin', dude? "EVERYONE"?? "EQUAL CHANCE"??? You honestly think the Children of Privilege are gonna go into the military? No, those "service committments" of yours (actually, is there not a bill before the Congress that would require that? A GOP-sponsored bill?) Like volunteering for Meals on Wheels and helping at the nursing home would all go to the privileged. Guess where that leaves the REST of our kids? Uh-huh, their rich uncle is hiring....

The Draft is shit, and so is that "Service Committment" plan you act like is your own idea.

Put some more words in my mouth, c'mon, they didn't taste so bad.

[Kanary]

27. Agree with you about mandatory government service

I have thought that for many years.

It would do wonders for the spoiled rich kids driving around in brand-new hummers, and spending $$ like water.

No exemptions, period. EVERYBODY.

Other countries do it, and the US is badly in need of it.

Thanks for mentioning it.

Kanary

[wabeewoman]

11. The thing that has changed since

the old timers idea that the military was 'good for you' is that in his day we weren't involved in all these undeclared political wars. Its one thing to be drafted to really be defending your country and yet another to be drafted to protect some corporations oil profits. Personally I think there would be such an outcry from the parents it would either put an end to the draft or the 'wars.'

[SheilaT]

14. I am utterly opposed to any kind of

universal mandatory service. I have a son who is mildly autistic (Asperger's Syndrome) and I honestly do not believe he would survive basic training. My other son is the kind of tough-minded young man who would not only survive but probably thrive in a military. But I don't want either of them to go.

Women are odd that way. We go through the nine months of pregnancy, and often a great physical ordeal in childbirth, and then men don't understand why we're not willing to send our sons off to die. You give birth, then you can make decisions to kill. But not before.

[BillZBubb]

16. I really wish all women were as you say

Unfortunately, there are far too many that are more than willing to let their children go off to war. Heck there are even some who will applaud the Chimp after he's gotten their kids killed for lies. Sad.

[Beaker]

19. I'm all for it- the universal mandatory service thing...

although it wouldn't necessarily have to take the shape of military service- there's plenty of things that need to be done in the national parks, for instance...and there would obviously be allowances made for those with disabilities.
consider it the responsibility that comes from living in a (hopefully advanced) society...Our country has become one where everyone is almost totally self-centered, and any true sense of real society is lost. the type of "universal mandatory service" i envision would hopefully help recreate it.

[BiggJawn]

21. You're not the only one.

You might get your wish. It's called the "Universal National Service Act of 2003"

(H.R. 163 - S.89)

Looks good, but what happens after all the "nice" jobs are filled with the children of the Congressmen, CEO's, Bush "Pioneers", etc.

Kids like mine have to "enlist" to jump into Rummy's people grinder.

Wish you'd stop acting like it was your idea.

Or ARE you Charlie Rangel?

[Beaker]

25. it may surprise you to learn that other people are capable of thought...

and actually have individual opinions of their own.

"Wish you'd stop acting like it was your idea..."

i never said that mandatory service is my idea alone- although it's something that i've been in favour of, and seen a need for for the past 20 years or so...responsibility to society and all.
coincidently, over those same 20 or so years, i've seen the people in this country get more and more self-centered and socially myopic.

[BiggJawn]

28. So you think we can LEGISLATE social awareness?

If i wasn't so upset over the news today, I'd laugh.

I think this is another of those "agree to disagree" stalemates.

You think they can force the residents of this country to be more socially responsible by passing a LAW, you go right ahead.

I'll just sit here now and disagree with you. The intent of that bill was to try and get cannon fodder without saying the word "Draft".

Oh...

"it may surprise you to learn that other people are capable of thought and actually have individual opinions of their own."

Wrong. Since I have PLENTY of opinions of my own, it's no surprise. You have plenty of opinions of your own, and I, like you, sometimes don't care for the other fellow's opinions.

[GiovanniC]

22. If We'd Just Called It "Mandatory Service"

Instead of "slavery" in the 1800's, would we have had a Civil War?

Something about the oxymoron of mandatory volunteerism rubs me the wrong way.

[Beaker]

26. look at it this way-

for one thing, slaves were exploited by their masters for personal profit. "mandatory volunteerism" as you call it is more about responsibility to country.

if you have a house, and there's a leaky connection under the sink, and you don't have the money to call a plumber, what do you do?
do you let it just drip away until it starts to rot?
do you turn off the main water supply and just do without that sink?
do you roll up your sleeves and do it yourself?

that's kinda sorta how i view the mandatory service thing- except instead of a house, we're all part owners of the nation.

it amazes me how so many people feel absolutely no responsibility to improve their society, but feel that they still have right to complain about the state of it.
it used to be the hallmark of staunch repukes, but not anymore.

[GiovanniC]

32. I Am a Volunteer

I used to volunteer as a page for the local district library, and more recently I have been a mentor/tutor for elementary school students and I serve on a council that provides funding to nonprofit agencies targeting youth, such as Big Brothers/Big Sisters. I think volunteerism is to be valued.

But it should not be mandatory.

And let's say that "your" proposal for mandatory volunteerism was enacted. How would you propose it be enforced? If someone goes "AWOL", as it were, from picking up trash in the park, do they get jail time, or what?

[Kinkistyle]

24. In other words: Slavery to the State.

The state has no right to "own me" as in mandatory service. If I don't want to do a particular I have a right to QUIT and do something else like painting or making movies. Screw "universal mandatory slavery". As soon as that happens I am in Canada pledging allegiance to a Maple leaf.

[Cronus Protagonist]

18. I think you'll see mandatory conscription very soon

A draft won't provide enough people for what the BFEE is up to. I think that very soon everyone who reaches 18 will have to serve for at least two years - something like the Israeli situation.

http://brainbuttons.com/home.asp?stashid=13

[reformed_military]

23. I think you are wrong Mari333

Here is an excerpt of the background of Selective Service.

In 1973, the draft ended and the U.S. converted to an All-Volunteer military.

The registration requirement was suspended in April 1975. It was resumed again in 1980 by President Carter in response to the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan. Registration continues today as a hedge against underestimating the number of servicemen needed in a future crisis.

Those penalties you mention have been in place since when I registered in 1983.

[tom_paine]

29. Mari, I just don't understand how this is "corroborating evidence"

that the draft is coming.

I mean, I agree that the draft is coming if the Busheviks "win", but how does this bolster that beliefe?

I mean, is this what shows up now when you click on US Pell Grant Webite or something?

Something like that, newly placed there, might concern me.

But from here this looks like a list of state laws.

[Freddie Stubbs]

30. Do you have any proof that these penalties have been implemented recently?

If not, this does not lead me to believe that a draft in immanent, especially if these laws have been on the books for years.

[x-g.o.p.er]

31. These rules were in place....

when I had to register for selective service back in 1985.

[LagaLover]

33. Very true--this is no proof at all

I VERY much doubt there wil be a draft. The military doesn't want or need it.

[Technowitch]

34. Draft = Temporary Slavery

...and not just any sort of temporary slavery either. After their involuntary induction, these young men (and possibly women) are subjected to treatment specifically designed to break their will.

Harsh exercise, sleep deprivation, arbitrary rules, severe punishment for perceived infractions, and deliberate attempt to create peer-pressured "group-think", to dissuade anyone from having a will of their own.

This is how we teach young people that it's okay to kill someone... and not just 'okay' but something to be sought after and to be proud of.

Or as I saw some time ago in a spoof "interview" with God in The Onion. It went something like: "What part of 'Thou Shalt Not Kill' don't you get? I gave you four words of one syllable each, and still you muck it up with permission to kill over religious dogma, economic philosophies, and over black goo in the ground. Anybody who kills anybody else, for whatever reason, is NOT doing it in My Name or with My permission. Stop it already."