Question for Catholic DUers: How do you take back your church?

[cap]

My church just put out a pro-life voting card for GW and voter registration cards.

What is the tactful way to get Kerry in front of people? I think we have support in the community, it's just hidden.

[MAlibdem]

1. Kerry is catholic

Spread a "vote for one of your own" message.

[alcuno]

2. Wear your "Kerry for President" button to Church.

Sometimes we are truly like sheep and follow whoever happens to be leading at the time. People often take their cues from the boldness of others; we're looking for leaders. Something as simple as wearing a button to mass makes a statement.

[DustMolecule]

3. I think you're going down the 'wrong road' here

Sorry, but I think the thing to 'go after' is that it is wrong for your church to put out a 'pro-life voting card for GW'. I think you should contact your pastor and tell him to withdraw this from the parish.

Your pastor has the obligation to put forth the Catholic church's teaching/position on abortion for the parish members. They are NOT to engage in 'politics' or specifically supporting one candidate over another, etc.

I distinctly remember some (10-15?) years ago that priests and sisters were expressly forbidden to run for/or take any 'public' office. There were 3-4 priests/sisters who had to resign some local offices that they had taken because of this church directive.

The directive came from whomever/whatever is over all the dioceses (sp?) in the US. The idea was that 'playing politics' was a distraction from their larger/higher mission.

Your pastor should put out the church's position and trust the parish to put their faith and their knowledge - in light of all the issues - to the best use possible.

edit: spelling

[JPJones]

4. Clarify

Do you mean people at the church or the Church distributed the cards.

If it is the Church, report them to the bishop. JPII has come down hard on priests who dabble in politics.

BTW, point out that Kerry is Catholic and B* is a Bob Jones lover. Have your own voter registration.

There really needs to be a pro-life organization that takes in pregnant teens instead of trying to stack the Supreme Court. Against abortion? Don't have one.

[DustMolecule]

6. We actually have one in our area

There really needs to be a pro-life organization that takes in pregnant teens instead of trying to stack the Supreme Court.

and it does a lot of really good work. But I tell you, it's small (only reaches a mere handful of young women), and it's hard hard work. Volunteers - mostly women - talk to these girls, find out what their story/situation - really take the time and effort to figure out how they can help. Then they offer 'real' assistance. Some even take the girls into their homes while they're pregnant and help them find adoptive parents for their child, etc. Then will mentor them afterwards to get them on a good path.

THIS is the type of thing that does some good in the world! How many of those that jump up/down screaming pro-life would EVER reach out a hand to help someone in a difficult situation? If they won't give any genuine help to anyone, then I think they should just freakin' shut-up.

[twilight]

19. they have post-abortion workshops

My Archdiocese sent out a letter about post-abortion workshops. They realize that 43% of all women under the age of 50 have had an abortion and they realize that many of these women are/were Catholic.

In my opinion, they are reclaiming the Church! It is about time that they reach out!

I commend them for this approach.

Anyone that cannot see through what is going on with politics and the Church is crazy if you ask me. My parish is no longer praying for *, they are praying for peace in our world and especially in the Middle East.

If your Church is preaching something else, report them to your local Archdiocese and believe me they will change their message quickly if they are pumping the war. The Catholic Church is antiwar and there is no way around it.

If you question this, ask our Pope John Paul II. I thank god for him and his work despite what many say.

Power to all Catholic Churches! They are giving it their best around here where I live. They realize there are many that have left. Now they have changed. I for one am glad.



:dem: :kick:

[eileen from OH]

5. Well, first off, you may want to point out to your pastor

That by putting out candidates' names they are jeopardizing their non-profit, tax-exempt status.

From Americans For Separation of Church and State (I think. I googled several sources and not sure exactly where this is from but it described it pretty well.)

********************
"In IRC 501(c)(3), lobbying is described as "carrying on propaganda, or otherwise attempting, to influence legislation," while political activity is described as "participat in, or interven in (including the publishing or distributing of statements), any political campaign on behalf of (or in opposition to) any candidate for public office." In short, IRC 501(c)(3) organizations may take sides with respect to political issues, but not political candidates."

**********************

And to the practical question - Churches officially put out pro-life stuff all the time and there are Catholics to whom this is a big issue. But I do think, at least around here, that most of us stick with the Church in SPITE of the Vatican, not BECAUSE of it.

As I've noted several times, I think that for the majority of American Catholics, Rome "jumped the shark" with the prohibition of birth control and divorce. We don't bother fighting 'em, but we DO ignore 'em.

eileen from OH

[stldemocrat]

7. Vatican

I think that it goes beyond "jumped the shark". The Catholic Church is flat out anti-woman. I grew up Catholic, so I speak from experience.

[SharonAnn]

17. Yes, me too. I went back several times and left several times.

Haven't been back for 25 years.

The Catholic Church is interested in running a hierarchical, patriarchal organization that is founded on control of women's sexuality. Even the supposedly "celibate" priests are trying to control women's sexuality by not allowing priests to be influenced by a woman and her sexuality.

Just a bunch of men who have to have somebody to look down on.

[twilight]

20. you should go back and check it out

I ended up going back because my mother was dying and she was a devout Catholic. It has changed. I was shocked to see "alter girls" now rather than boys.

There is no more Latin being said where I am. I miss the mystery that used to go with it.

However, it has changed no doubt and it is for the better.

Women don't need to cover their heads anymore. They don't have confessions before Mass anymore either.

Many changes indeed.

There were a real help when Mother got sick and was dying and I'll be forever grateful to them for this. They helped me A LOT!

twilight

:dem: :kick:

[Iris]

8. There are organizations who promote change within the church

Catholics for a Free Choice is one.

Also, A Call to Action - http://www.cta-usa.org/

[Not Me]

9. I left...

I simply got to the point where I refused to participate in the oppression of women, gays and non-Catholics that the RC Church espouses.

And, frankly, I haven't looked back.

[jumptheshadow]

15. Me, too

And you know, it was hard, because religion had meant a lot to me when I was growing up. (All religions.) I attribute much of my empathy for oppressed groups and my interest in progressive causes to the influence of a few Catholic leaders and clergy, some of whom crossed my path and some whose writings I read avidly.

Yet there simply reached a point where the Church's resistance to spiritual growth, and its corruption by a small group of men, triggered my decision to leave it forever.

No formal religion has replaced it yet.

[cap]

10. the voting card was written by a pro-life group

and left in the church vestibule. Maybe call the bishop -- the bishop in Philly is more liberal.

[DustMolecule]

11. It's only proper to start with the pastor before you go to the bishop

Perhaps the pastor doesn't even know about this (or approve of it). Give your pastor a chance to respond. Take it to the 'source' (local) first. In fact, if you go to the bishop that will probably be the first question they will ask you. "Did you talk to the pastor about it?"

[cap]

12. maybe i need to talk to

the bishop first. There was also a pro-war article in the bulletin clumsily disguised somehow as reconciliation and how the highest good was to give your life for someone else's during combat. A Republican Congressman has shown up at a health conference sponsored by the church.

[Name removed]

13. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Mrs. Overall]

14. What most Catholics don't realize

is that the anti-abortion stance is the ONLY Republican doctrine that is consistent with Catholicism. Almost all other Republican positions are anti the basic message of the Church (Jesus' message, not the Vatican's).
Catholics are also very ignorant of how the "religious right" in this country, of which George Bush is a member, is basically very anti-Catholic and views the Catholic Church as not being truly "christian." Most fundamentalists believe that the Catholic Church is the "whore of Babylon" spoken of in the Book of Revelation.

[SharonAnn]

18. Also, the Republicans "Death penalty" fixation is definitely

Anti-Life and is also against Catholic teaching.

[SharonAnn]

16. You may want to contact Americans United

and send them a copy of the information along with any of the specifics about when it was handed out, where it was handed out, and what was said when it was handed out.

Or, you might want to report them to the IRS and request that their tax-exempt status be revoked. Include the same information as above and copy the parish priest.

And, you could do the IRS report anonymously if you wish.

These churches have to STOP THIS SHIT!

Besides, any real Catholics would vote Democratic.

[SarahB]

21. There were too many issues I could not reconcile

I was brought up Catholic and my mother still is, but from my dad's side and with other family members, I was also exposed to Protestant (mainly Methodist) churches as well. I think because I felt equally comfortable attending a church that was not Catholic, it was an easier choice, but there are so many things I don't agree with (transubstantiation, infallibility of the Pope, lack of women in positions of power, celibacy requirements, and their stances on birth control and abortion). With in the next year, the incidences of the mass cover-ups with regard to pedophilia solidified it for me. For me, continuing to go to a church where I do not believe so many of the things taught feels like hypocrisy. Sorry, I have no ideas about how to overcome what you're experiencing.