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spanone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-04 02:03 PM
Original message
Rice: we may never know about WMD's because of looting....
You gotta be kidding me. Did they loot all those stockpiles that Powell told the UN Iraq had? Are they hiding these fatal chemicals in their homes? I don't think they looted those RECONSTITUTED NUCLEAR WEAPONS that Dick Cheney said they had. Are they snorting the sarin? Anthrax? If you were a looter these things are Numero Uno on your list of "not to loot" items. And this is the administration of "accountability"? Sorry Condi one too many LIES.
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SoCalDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-04 02:04 PM
Response to Original message
1. Oh great.. what next.. "The Dingos stole my wmd"??
or the dog ate my homework??
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spanone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-04 02:06 PM
Response to Reply #1
3. It's beyond me how stupid they think the American public is.
I'm totally insulted by these RW hawks. Never underestimate the public george. This time the supreme court may not save your ass.
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tom_paine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-04 02:25 PM
Response to Reply #3
21. The scary part is that they may be right.
And I think the Bushevik have been doing a very good job of estimating the apathy and ignorance of the Imperial Subjects of Amerika.

I'm not happy about it, but that's how I see it.
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tinrobot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-04 03:23 PM
Response to Reply #1
40. I doubt that is true, but if it is...
...then Condi has to answer the follow-up question.

Where are the looted weapons, and why didn't you intercept them before they fell into the hands of 'terrorists?'

Jeeez.
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judge_smales Donating Member (752 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-04 02:05 PM
Response to Original message
2. Oh, sure


If I were a starving Iraqi looting after Saddam's ouster the FIRST thing
I would want to bring into my house would be a bomb filled with anthrax spores. Or maybe mustard gas. Yup. I'd want that under my kids bed!
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Paulie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-04 02:06 PM
Response to Original message
4. If you loot and it leaks
We'd have pictures, now wouldn't we? Especially with the million plus POUNDS of this stuff?

It's almost sad how pathetic they are.
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mopinko Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-04 02:07 PM
Response to Original message
5. i knew there was a reason
they let that looting go on. you think they are stupid, but if you wait long enough, the reason become clear. (kinda kidding, i think)
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Solomon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-04 02:40 PM
Response to Reply #5
31. Was she shaking her head "no" as she always does when she
talks? Her body language always says "don't believe a word of what I'm saying. In fact, if they were to bring her up on racketeering charges she would point to her shaking head to say she never actually told a lie since she constantly indicates "no" when she talks.

As an aside, one day I ventured over to freeperville, and saw a lot of guys talking about how "hot" she is and what they'd like to do with her.
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cheapbeemr Donating Member (564 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-04 03:58 PM
Response to Reply #31
45. Exactly
She always comes across like the night nurse who's slipping everybody arsenic.
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BlueEyedSon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-04 02:07 PM
Response to Original message
6. So, in other words, the WMD's are in LESS accountable hands
because of our invasion?
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arcane1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-04 03:02 PM
Response to Reply #6
37. exactly what the "war" was supposed to PREVENT
Condi is one of the worst liars I have ever seen on tv...
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HootieMcBoob Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-04 02:09 PM
Response to Original message
7. Didn't Rumsfeld
say that they just kept stealing that one vase or chair or whatever it was over and over again? While the looting was going on they said it wasn't that bad! My god, I can't decide whether these people are evil geniuses or total nincompoops.
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nostamj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-04 02:09 PM
Response to Original message
8. is there a link???

would like to send this story to a friend...

p.s. Condi!! were those looters so careful they didn't spill a drop of poison? you are such a lying pusbag
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spanone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-04 02:22 PM
Response to Reply #8
17. Yep
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nostamj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-04 02:34 PM
Response to Reply #17
26. many thanks! n/t
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htuttle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-04 02:09 PM
Response to Original message
9. So now they would RATHER have us think...
...that their incompetence lead to huge stockpiles of dangerous WMD getting scattered, sold, etc... than have us think they lied about it in the first place.

I'll bite: Condi, isn't preventing these materials from getting out into general circulation one of the reasons you said you invaded? You fucked that one up pretty bad, eh?

Oh, wait now. You say that's not it, and want to come up with ANOTHER answer and try again?

We'll still be here. At least until November...
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Zero Gravitas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-04 02:11 PM
Response to Original message
10. Riiiight
the grateful flower-throwing Iraqis looted thousands of gallons of nerve agent and tons of newwklar bomb making program related activity equipment?

makes sense to me
:silly:
:crazy:
:shrug:
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DrBB Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-04 02:11 PM
Response to Original message
11. Condi's excuses are always WORSE than the thing
...she's trying to excuse. For instance, her claim that she didn't know about Wilson's report (Niger Yellow Cake) because it was lost "down in the bureaucracy somewhere." I.e., "I'm Natiional Security Adviser and nobody tells me anything!" The kind of utterance that should only ever appear on a formal tender of resignation, but that was her "excuse."

Now this. Um, gee Condi, I thought we went in there to prevent WMDs from getting loose and Saddam giving 'em away to any terrorist who came along. So now you're saying the plan was so completely inept that it actually resulted in the thing it was supposed to prevent? Why, incompetence of that magnitude could never have happened in this administration--it must have been Clinton's fault. Somehow. Yeah that's it. Clinton. Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton.

There. Now I feel better.
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HootieMcBoob Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-04 02:28 PM
Response to Reply #11
24. how about this excuse of hers
CONDI’S AMAZING SEPTEMBER 11TH STORY – FALSELY CLAIMED WHITE HOUSE HAD NO PRIOR WARNING OF HIJACKINGS

On May 16th, 2002, Rice said “I don't think anybody could have predicted that these people would take an airplane and slam it into the World Trade Center, take another one and slam it into the Pentagon. that they would try to use an airplane as a missile, a hijacked airplane as a missile,".

But according to the bipartisan 9/11 commission report, “intelligence reports from December 1998 until the attacks said followers of bin Laden were planning to strike U.S. targets, hijack U.S. planes, and two individuals had successfully evaded checkpoints in a dry run at a New York airport,” . More specifically, “White House officials acknowledged that U.S. intelligence officials informed President Bush weeks before the Sept. 11 attacks that bin Laden's terrorist network might try to hijack American planes.”
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lovedems Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-04 02:17 PM
Response to Original message
12. Well, my response to Condi is that if you dumbasses would have had
your shit together, you should have expected looting. It is an age old phenomenon that goes hand in hand with chaos. Things in Iraq are a mess because this administration has been such an utter failure with the situation in Iraq from the moment we stepped foot into the country.

There are alot of things they should have expected (roses not being one as we were led to believe) that they just ignored so they could get the public's approval to go to war. Screw what happens when we are done blowing the shit out of Iraq.
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treepig Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-04 02:31 PM
Response to Reply #12
25. excellent, time to bring out this graphic again . . .


ms. rice, were the WsMD looted


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Stephanie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-04 02:18 PM
Response to Original message
13. BushCO ALLOWED the looting!!!!
Edited on Thu Jan-29-04 02:28 PM by Stephanie
Remember Tuwaitha? Iraq's largest nuclear site was looted for weeks following the invasion. Tuwaitha had been inspected many times by the IAEA and the nuclear materials stored there had been sealed and accounted for. But once the U.S. took control the site went unguarded for weeks and the containers of uranium were stolen. Some of that material may have gone to the black market. Why did the U.S. make sure to guard the Oil Ministry in the first days of the invasion, but not the known nuclear sites? If BushCO truly believed there was a nuclear threat from Iraq, or a terrorist "dirty bomb" threat, why didn't they guard Tuwaitha?



~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn/A39500-2003Aug9?language=printer

In an interview with the New York Times published Sept. 6, Card did not mention the WHIG but hinted at its mission. "From a marketing point of view, you don't introduce new products in August," he said.

<snip>The day after publication of Card's marketing remark, Bush and nearly all his top advisers began to talk about the dangers of an Iraqi nuclear bomb.

Bush and Prime Minister Tony Blair conferred at Camp David that Saturday, Sept. 7, and they each described alarming new evidence. Blair said proof that the threat is real came in "the report from the International Atomic Energy Agency this morning, showing what has been going on at the former nuclear weapon sites." Bush said "a report came out of the . . . IAEA, that they were six months away from developing a weapon. I don't know what more evidence we need."

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

http://www.cnn.com/2002/ALLPOLITICS/09/08/iraq.debate/

Rice acknowledged that "there will always be some uncertainty" in determining how close Iraq may be to obtaining a nuclear weapon but said, "We don't want the smoking gun to be a mushroom cloud."

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2002/10/20021007-8.html

Knowing these realities, America must not ignore the threat gathering against us. Facing clear evidence of peril, we cannot wait for the final proof -- the smoking gun -- that could come in the form of a mushroom cloud. - G. Bush, 10/7/02

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

http://www.charlotte.com/mld/observer/news/6068775.htm
Looting of Iraqi nuclear facility indicts U.S. goals
If we feared the loss of radioactive materials, why not guard them?
TRUDY RUBIN
Knight Ridder Newspapers
Posted on Thu, Jun. 12, 2003

TUWAITHA, Iraq - On a dusty road, just outside of Baghdad, lies one of the great mysteries of the Iraq war.

<snip>The administration knew full well what was stored at Tuwaitha. So how is it possible that the U.S. military failed to secure the nuclear facility until weeks after the war started? This left looters free to ransack the barrels, dump their contents, and sell them to villagers for storage.

How is it possible that, according to Iraqi nuclear scientists, looters are still stealing radioactive isotopes? The Tuwaitha story makes a mockery of the administration's vaunted concern with weapons of mass destruction. The U.S. military hastened to secure the Ministry of Oil in Baghdad from looters. But Iraq's main nuclear facility was apparently not important enough to get similar protection.

<snip>And why, in facilities other than Location C, is the looting apparently continuing? Hisham Abdel Malik, a Iraqi nuclear scientist who lives near Tuwaitha and has been inside the complex, told me that in buildings "where there are radioactive isotopes, there is looting every day." He says the isotopes, which are in bright silver containers, "are sold in the black market or kept in homes." According to IAEA spokeswoman Melissa Fleming, such radioactive sources can kill on contact or pollute whole neighborhoods.

How could an administration that had hyped the danger of Saddam handing off nuclear materials to terrorists let Tuwaitha be looted? Maybe the hype was just hype ... or maybe the Pentagon didn't send enough troops to Iraq to do the job right.

Either answer is damning.<more>

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http://www.abcnews.go.com/wire/World/reuters20030716_192.html
U.N. in Dark About Looted Iraq Dirty Bomb Material
July 16
By Louis Charbonneau

VIENNA (Reuters) - The U.N. nuclear watchdog said Wednesday it had accounted for most of the low-grade uranium lost during looting at Iraq's main nuclear facility, but had no information about more dangerous radioactive material.

<snip>But an IAEA spokeswoman said the agency had not been permitted by U.S. occupation authorities to check the status of Tuwaitha's stocks of highly-radioactive cesium-137, cobalt-160 and other materials which could be used in dirty bombs.

"There were around 400 of these radioactive sources stored at Tuwaitha," IAEA's Melissa Fleming said.

Witnesses have said that villagers near Tuwaitha, especially children, have shown symptoms of radiation sickness.

"Any case of radiation sickness would probably be from these highly-radioactive sources, not from the low-grade natural uranium at Location C," Fleming said.<more>

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

http://www.counterpunch.org/schwarz07172003.html
July 17, 2003
Bush's Pre-emptive Strike Doctrine
The Bane of Non-Proliferation Watchdogs
By MARTIN SCHWARZ

<snip>Bush's use of the specter of nuclear threat to legitimate his intimidation policy can also been seen as just another excuse if reports from occupied post-war Iraq are taken into account. When the reports about massive looting in Iraq's biggest nuclear facility Al-Tuwaitha emerged after the war, the U.S. administration rejected the IAEA's request to send inspectors to that facility for more than a month. El-Baradei didn't even get an answer to his letters to U.S. Secretary of State Colin Powell. Meanwhile, strange things must have happened in Al-Tuwaitha: The IAEA in Vienna received several phone calls from U.S. soldiers based at the facility to secure it, who didn't know what to do with nuclear material they had found.<more>

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http://www.sierrasun.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20030718/OPINION/307180301
July 18, 2003
Bush's actions don't match the rhetoric
Guest Column by Kirk Caraway

<snip>Turn back the clock to the before the war. You "know" your enemy has 100-500 tons of chemical weapons, and you know where he is likely hiding them. Wouldn't you try to secure those sites as quickly as possible? After all, these chemical weapons posed a major threat to our advancing troops, and the big danger, they said, was if these fall into the hands of terrorists.

So why wasn't this done? Special Forces teams were flown into Iraq to secure the oil fields, but not the weapons. That speaks volumes about what the real reason for the war is.

And those weapons are still missing. Rumsfeld claims they are doing their best to search all those sites, but this is disconcerting. How many days have his 150,000 soldiers had to search the sites they already know about?

And what about the nukes? If Bush and his people really thought that Iraq had an active nuclear weapons program, why did the military wait for more than a week after taking over the region to even visit the country's main nuclear research facilities at Tuwaitha?

Why did they wait even longer to visit the neighboring Baghdad Nuclear Research Facility? Both sites were heavily looted, so if there were plans for a nuclear bomb or even some weapons-grade material, it would be long gone by now.<more>

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

http://www.msnbc.com/news/912073.asp
WMDs for the Taking?
While U.S. troops pushed on to Baghdad, Iraqis were looting radioactive materials from once protected sites
By Rod Nordland
NEWSWEEK

May 19 issue — From the very start, one of the top U.S. priorities in Iraq has been the search for weapons of mass destruction. Weren’t WMDs supposed to be what the war was about? Even so, no one has yet produced conclusive evidence that Iraq was maintaining a nuclear, biological or chemical (NBC) arsenal.
<snip>

Some of the lapses are frightening. The well-known Al Tuwaitha Nuclear Research Center, about 12 miles south of Baghdad, had nearly two tons of partially enriched uranium, along with significant quantities of highly radioactive medical and industrial isotopes, when International Atomic Energy Agency officials made their last visit in January. By the time U.S. troops arrived in early April, armed guards were holding off looters—but the Americans only disarmed the guards, Al Tuwaitha department heads told NEWSWEEK. “We told them, ‘This site is out of control. You have to take care of it’,” says Munther Ibrahim, Al Tuwaitha’s head of plasma physics. “The soldiers said, ‘We are a small group. We cannot take control of this site’.” As soon as the Americans left, looters broke in. The staff fled; when they returned, the containment vaults’ seals had been broken, and radioactive material was everywhere.

U.S. officers say the center had already been ransacked before their troops arrived. They didn’t try to stop the looting, says Colonel Madere, because “there was no directive that said do not allow anyone in and out of this place.” Last week American troops finally went back to secure the site. Al Tuwaitha’s scientists still can’t fully assess the damage; some areas are too badly contaminated to inspect. “I saw empty uranium-oxide barrels lying around, and children playing with them,” says Fadil Mohsen Abed, head of the medical-isotopes department. Stainless-steel uranium canisters had been stolen. Some were later found in local markets and in villagers’ homes. “We saw people using them for milking cows and carrying drinking water,” says Ibrahim. The looted materials could not make a nuclear bomb, but IAEA officials worry that terrorists could build plenty of dirty bombs with some of the isotopes that may have gone missing. Last week NEWSWEEK visited a total of eight sites on U.N. weapons-inspection lists. Two were guarded by U.S. troops. Armed looters were swarming through two others. Another was evidently destroyed many years ago. American forces had not yet searched the remaining three.

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http://www.latimes.com/la-fg-iraqnuke22may22001423,0,1600144.story
Dangerous Loot South of Baghdad
Iraqis close to a nuclear research site become ill after materials are pilfered. Doctor says symptoms point to acute radiation syndrome.
May 22, 2003, L.A. Times
By John Hendren, Times Staff Writer

Since early April, the International Atomic Energy Agency, the United Nations' nuclear watchdog, has repeatedly requested that the U.S. secure nuclear material at Tuwaitha. This week, the Bush administration agreed to make arrangements to allow the IAEA to return to Iraq to inspect the site.

American troops are now guarding the research center, but the looting has continued, and scientists are worried that missing nuclear material could result in a slew of safety and health problems.

"We're concerned about the health and safety of these people, and then we're also concerned about environmental contamination and we're also concerned that this material could be used for illicit use — a 'dirty bomb,' or even a nuclear bomb," said IAEA spokesman Mark Gwozdecky in a telephone interview from Vienna.

<snip>

Inside a 10-foot-high chain-link fence, a platoon of U.S. troops guards the remains of the nuclear reactor destroyed by the Israelis. Army Staff Sgt. Robert Gasman says his job is to keep looters out, but with a platoon of just 40 men and a fence that runs as far as the eye can see, he admits it's a losing battle. Looters break through nightly; they are often released within a few hours of being caught.

"There's no way we can catch them all," said Gasman, from the 3rd Infantry Division's 1st Brigade. "For all I know, there are looters back there now."<more>

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

http://www.boston.com/dailyglobe2/159/nation/For_neighbors_atom_plant_may_inflict_scars+.shtml">Boston Globe
THE NUCLEAR FALLOUT
For neighbors, atom plant may inflict scars
By Ellen Barry, Globe Staff,
6/8/2003, Boston Globe

<snip>As the US invasion approached, the security measures frayed. The Iraqi soldiers left their guardposts around March 10, and by March 20, the civilian guards were gone as well. On April 7, two days before Baghdad fell, US Marines arrived, a senior military official said in a background briefing last week.

<snip>

A US Army spokesman, Colonel Richard Thomas, said yesterday that the looting of the warehouse ceased as soon as US Marines arrived on April 7. He warned against exaggerating the ill effects of the looting, and reported that in the case of the National Museum, losses were far less than initially thought.

In last week's background briefing, a senior military official said that the Americans had arrived to find the locks broken and the warehouse ''in the condition that it's in.''

But a group of local villagers argued yesterday that Americans had permitted the looting, even cutting the locks on the doors. Inad, the shopkeeper, said Americans had encouraged looters to take the material.

''They allowed children to go inside,'' Inad said. ''Then they said it might cause radiation, but that was one month later.''<more>

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2003/06/02/wevian02.xml&sSheet=/portal/2003/06/02/ixportaltop.html">UK Telegraph
Chirac defies Bush at G8 summit
By Benedict Brogan and Toby Harnden in Evian
(Filed: 02/06/2003) UK Telegraph

France poured cold water last night on an American and British proposal to limit the spread of weapons of mass destruction as Tony Blair and George W Bush sought to outflank Jacques Chirac at the opening of the G8 summit.

While M Chirac, the host, sought to emphasise his vision of a multipolar world, Mr Blair and Mr Bush joined forces with other members of the Iraq coalition to try to force him to make combating terrorism a central agenda item of the gathering of industrialised nations.

Downing Street and White House aides said the "action plan" would help to stop terrorists detonating a radioactive "dirty bomb" in a western capital.<more>

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http://www.nytimes.com/2003/11/25/international/middleeast/25NUKE.html
NUCLEAR WEAPONS
Theft of Cobalt in Iraq Prompts Security Inquiry
By JOHN F. BURNS
Published: November 25, 2003

MIRIYA, Iraq — A seeming lapse in surveillance by American forces has led to the looting of dangerously radioactive capsules from Saddam Hussein's main battlefield testing site in the desert outside Baghdad and the identification of at least one 30-year-old Iraqi villager, and possibly a village boy, as suffering from radiation sickness.

The two capsules, taken from a site once used by Mr. Hussein's government to test the effects of radiation on animals and perhaps humans, have since been recovered after an American sweep through the area.

But American officers fear that more cases of the sickness may follow, and that they will be powerless to help unless people in the villages of Amiriya and Shamiya break their silence and identify men who looted the desert site in early September.

Lt. Gen. Ricardo Sanchez, the American commander in Iraq, has ordered an investigation to discover why an arc of eight 75-foot radioactive testing poles at the site was not more closely guarded after American nuclear experts filed a report to the Pentagon identifying them as dangerous after a visit to the site on May 9, American officers said. Defense Secretary Donald H. Rumsfeld has also taken a personal interest in the case.<more>

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Stephanie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-04 03:40 PM
Response to Reply #13
43. Please read ^ above. WHY did the U.S. allow looting of nuke sites?
It belies their whole premise for war.
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Sophree Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-04 04:12 PM
Response to Reply #13
48. I KNOW!
Maybe they should have been more concerned with securing the NUCLEAR sites that were looted, rather than securing the freakin oil fields!!!

:grr: :grr: :grr:
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Stephanie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-04 04:37 PM
Response to Reply #48
52. EXACTLY! Yet another miserable failure by BushCO
And it REVEALS their absolute lack of concern about WMDs. That's why I always post about this. If they BELIEVED their own LIES, they would have gone straight to the nuke sights and searched them for WMDs, or evidence of "programs", or whatever. And if they were concerned about weapons falling into the hands of terrorists, they would have secured these sites immediately and kept them safe.

The LOOTING at Tuwaitha and elsewhere BELIES the entire BushCO JUSTIFICATION FOR WAR. The fact that they allowed this looting is the smoking gun on their LIES.
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DemNoir Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-04 02:18 PM
Response to Original message
14. What next?
Maybe "They were sold on Ebay"
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RoadRunner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-04 02:18 PM
Response to Original message
15. A little math ...
How many camels does it take to cart off 50,000 TONS of bioligical weapons. Well, let's see. If you assume that each camel can carry 500 pounds, then it takes, hmmm, only 200,000 camels. Allowing a little space between camels, that would be a camel train over 568 miles long. Yeah, that's probably what happened.
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Amager Donating Member (80 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-04 02:19 PM
Response to Original message
16. Oh that's just pathetic. They just don't give up
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spanone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-04 02:26 PM
Response to Reply #16
22. This is what the White House calls "damage control"
The real damage is to the over 500 families whose fathers, sons, and daughters have been killed because of bushco. Not to mention the thousands of Iraqis, that we're to busy to even count.
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Hubert Flottz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-04 02:22 PM
Response to Original message
18. Bushco should KNOW what the looters looted!
The looters was Bushco! Bush's Tiny Brain is a WMD would be a better KKKon Condie!
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DemoTex Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-04 02:23 PM
Response to Original message
19. What disingenuous claptrap!
What swill! Will one person believe that shit?
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laylah Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-04 06:20 PM
Response to Reply #19
57. Unfortunately
many of the 'bots will...but I do believe we are gaining ground :bounce:

Jenn
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jpak Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-04 02:24 PM
Response to Original message
20. General Shinseki was right
Rummy didn't allocate enough troops to I-raq to do the job.

Because of this. they made the decision to secure the oilfields - not the WMD sites - first.

Now they blame looters for the failure to find the dreaded WMD.

ChimpCo f**ked up and they only have themselves to blame.
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xxqqqzme Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-04 02:27 PM
Response to Original message
23. I will NOT miss seeing or hearing
this lying, pinched face nasty woman! after November.
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spanone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-04 02:35 PM
Response to Reply #23
27. she also blamed Hussein for being "so secretive" Bwahaahahahahahah
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spanone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-04 02:35 PM
Response to Reply #23
28. she also blamed Hussein for being "so secretive" Bwahaahahahahahah
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JasonDeter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-04 02:37 PM
Response to Original message
29. David Kay said, "I've seen looting ALL OVER THE WORLD!"
"But Iraqi's are the best!" Did any reporter look and ask incredibly, "Excuse the hell out of me?" No. They just said in unison, "Wow."
And as Chris Matthews said to Kay, "Your smart and hard to debate because your so smart."
But I want to ask, "How is anyone supposed to debate the bush* cronies when they supposedly have all the secret info and no one else can see it, yet we're supposed to take their word for everything!" How the hell do you argue against that?
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yellowcanine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-04 02:38 PM
Response to Original message
30. I am less and less impressed with the supposed intellect of Rice
If she is supposed to be one of the bright bulbs in the Bush Administration, I hate to think how many dim bulbs there must be.
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Stephanie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-04 02:46 PM
Response to Reply #30
33. I am not impressed with any of them
They are very impressed with THEMSELVES, however. I think that's the gist. THEY think they are quite the geniuses, as they clomp around the world messing everything up. They have no doubt that they are right, and everyone else is just stupid for opposing them. And yet they have not SUCCEEDED at anything. It's one failure after another. And all they can do is LIE about it. Some geniuses. Great intellects. Please.
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mike1963 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-04 06:13 PM
Response to Reply #30
56. They're more like pre-tested flash bulbs.
(If you aren't somewhat an old phart, you might not remember flash bulbs...)
;-)
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davidinalameda Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-04 02:41 PM
Response to Original message
32. this just takes the proverbial cake
shouldn't there be lots of glowing Iraqis if they stole nuclear material?

is there anyone in this administration that has just the smallest bit of brains and believes that the US public has the smallest bit of brains

what a patronizing, lying sack of crap

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Stephanie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-04 02:49 PM
Response to Reply #32
35. See my post above - there ARE lots of glowing Iraqis
Nuclear sites WERE looted. However, the materials at those sites had been previously inspected and secured by the IAEA. Had the U.S. not invaded, the material would still be secure. Had the U.S. protected those sites immediately instead of worrying more about the oil fields, had they brought in enough troops to guard the sites, had they BELIEVED THEIR OWN LIES about nukes and WMDs, then the looting would not have happened.
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yellowcanine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-04 02:53 PM
Response to Reply #32
36. Actually there were some "glowing Iraqis"
Because the U.S. failed to secure known nuclear waste sites and Iraquis were dumping out the waste to use the containers. Just another example of how well the Bushbots planned the occupation.
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sendero Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-04 02:47 PM
Response to Original message
34. Condi Rice...
... says more asinine things per minute than the average 3 year old.

If astounds me how she could be in her position at all.
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Stephanie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-04 03:04 PM
Response to Original message
38. I think Condi's been reading DU
She's reading our complaints and twisting them to her purposes. Here are my previous posts on the nuclear looting. These are since the new DU - there were more at the old one:

July 16
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=104&topic_id=52593

July 22
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=104&topic_id=63025

October 5
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=104&topic_id=476777
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earthman dave Donating Member (336 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-04 03:15 PM
Response to Original message
39. Take a geiger counter to Iraq...
...and you'll find that a lot of the peasants are now radioactive. Proof, if proof be need be, that they looted all the WMDs. Case closed. Next!
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renegade000 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-04 06:00 PM
Response to Reply #39
55. i believe this was attributed to DU
no...not us...depleted uranium ;)
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earthman dave Donating Member (336 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-04 06:42 PM
Response to Reply #55
58. I'm "sure" they wouldn't use DU if it was dangerous...
After all, BushCo are the good guys, right? :)
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PVnRT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-04 03:25 PM
Response to Original message
41. So, let me see
We have "evidence" that Saddam Hussein has nukes, while he was trying to hide them and using his entire government to do so.

Yet we can't identify hordes of idiots running around the countryside, out in the open, by themselves or in a small group, that might have one or two of these things.
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ngGale Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-04 03:29 PM
Response to Original message
42. That is the dumbest answer I've heard from Condi yet...
Lame excuse if I ever heard one. Wonder how many people will suck that for the truth?
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spanone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-04 03:48 PM
Response to Reply #42
44. On today show Rice insisted that bush had no choice but to invade
for 12 years he (Saddam) defied the international community.....so why didn't bush let the un inspections go on???? Cause he was hot to trot to war.
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samsingh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-04 04:03 PM
Response to Original message
46. that's an impeachable offense
if bushites allowed looting to occur, they have endangered the world.
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Stephanie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-04 04:20 PM
Response to Reply #46
50. YES
Edited on Thu Jan-29-04 04:31 PM by Stephanie
They allowed looting, THEN they tried to strongarm Chirac to get the right to search ships in his harbor for DIRTY BOMB materials.

It's inconceivable - they let the uranium, and who knows what else, be stolen - uranium that could be used to create a dirty bomb. THEN they try to frighten the world with the prospect of dirty bombs and use that prospect to get more power worldwide.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2003/06/02/wevian02.xml&sSheet=/portal/2003/06/02/ixportaltop.html">UK Telegraph
Chirac defies Bush at G8 summit
By Benedict Brogan and Toby Harnden in Evian
(Filed: 02/06/2003) UK Telegraph
France poured cold water last night on an American and British proposal to limit the spread of weapons of mass destruction as Tony Blair and George W Bush sought to outflank Jacques Chirac at the opening of the G8 summit.

While M Chirac, the host, sought to emphasise his vision of a multipolar world, Mr Blair and Mr Bush joined forces with other members of the Iraq coalition to try to force him to make combating terrorism a central agenda item of the gathering of industrialised nations.

Downing Street and White House aides said the "action plan" would help to stop terrorists detonating a radioactive "dirty bomb" in a western capital.<more>

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

http://www.usatoday.com/news/opinion/editorials/2003-10-05-wagner_x.htm

What happened to looted Iraqi nuclear material?
Mon Oct 6, 6:04 AM ET Add Op/Ed - USATODAY.com to My Yahoo!
By Brett Wagner

<snip>

A great irony, however, seems to have gotten lost in that debate: As a direct result of President Bush (news - web sites)'s decision to invade Iraq without sufficient forces to secure and protect its nuclear research and storage facilities from rampant looting, enough radioactive material to build scores of dirty bombs now is missing and may be on its way to the international black market.

<snip>

The White House knew all along, for example, that enormous quantities of dangerous nuclear materials were at the Tuwaitha nuclear storage facility near Baghdad, sealed and accounted for by the United Nations (news - web sites)' International Atomic Energy Agency. Soon after the war began, the IAEA warned the White House that it should strive to secure the facility quickly. When word of looting at the site began to leak out through the international media, the IAEA again warned the White House.

The looting, however, went on for more than two weeks before the U.S. took any action. When the site was finally secured and U.S. authorities permitted a brief inspection by IAEA officials, the inspectors were inexplicably forbidden to check the status of highly radioactive materials that could be used in dirty bombs. Many of these materials are now unaccounted for. What the inspectors were allowed to verify is how much uranium is now missing: at least 22 pounds.

<snip>

It takes only a small amount of such materials to arm a dirty bomb. The 22 pounds of missing uranium, for example, could arm a device that could shut down Capitol Hill or the New York Stock Exchange (news - web sites) for weeks, if not months.

Properly built and encased with radioactive materials, a dirty bomb can kill thousands and render large areas uninhabitable for months or years. While their destructive capacity pales in comparison to that of actual nuclear bombs, a dirty bomb's capacity to inflict terror should never be underestimated.

<snip>

Several terrorist groups, including al-Qaeda, have shown interest in acquiring the radioactive materials necessary to transform an ordinary bundle of explosives into a weapon of mass terror. The blueprints and other components are commonly available. And now, thanks to sloppy war planning by the White House, the only missing component radioactive materials may be readily available, too.

Sort of takes the "pre-emptive" out of pre-emptive war, doesn't it?

Brett Wagner is president of the California Center for Strategic Studies and a professor at the U.S. Naval War College.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

edit - fixed link
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Ilsa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-04 04:11 PM
Response to Original message
47. So, the looters walked away with the entire
production infrastructure? Even David Kay said there couldn't be any WMD because there was no infrastructure in place to develop WMD.

This woman is quite a liar.
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rustydog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-04 04:13 PM
Response to Original message
49. Someone looted 500 tons of VX and Sarin Gas?
You know what? Right-wing idiots will be swearing this is true!
Shows one how stupid this Administration bellieves us to be.
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Stephanie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-04 04:33 PM
Response to Reply #49
51. There WAS looting of nuke materials - but BUSH ALLOWED IT
I've been screaming about this for months. I've posted many threads on it. Just read this one article and you will see - they were planting the seeds then for a future dirty bomb. Incompetence or the next LIHOP, you decide.

Read this article, please!

http://www.usatoday.com/news/opinion/editorials/2003-10-05-wagner_x.htm
What happened to looted Iraqi nuclear material?
Mon Oct 6, 6:04 AM ET Add Op/Ed - USATODAY.com to My Yahoo!
By Brett Wagner

The release Thursday of chief U.S. weapons inspector David Kay's report detailing America's six-month search for weapons of mass destruction in Iraq (news - web sites) has reinflamed the debate over whether anyone will ever uncover that country's alleged stockpiles of biological, chemical and nuclear weapons.

A great irony, however, seems to have gotten lost in that debate: As a direct result of President Bush (news - web sites)'s decision to invade Iraq without sufficient forces to secure and protect its nuclear research and storage facilities from rampant looting, enough radioactive material to build scores of dirty bombs now is missing and may be on its way to the international black market.

<more>
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Edge Donating Member (728 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-04 04:39 PM
Response to Original message
53. This is the saddest excuse I've ever heard.
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Stephanie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-04 05:45 PM
Response to Original message
54. I REALLY want to see Condi busted on this
If they had DONE THEIR JOB there wouldn't have been looting at nuclear sites.

If they are going to assert that WMDs were LOOTED they are opening a can of worms. The AIEA repeatedly WARNED Bush to secure the nuclear sites. The AIEA was WELL AWARE of everything that was safely stored and secured at those sites. Anything that went missing is the responsibility of BUSH.
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WhoCountsTheVotes Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-04 06:46 PM
Response to Original message
59. Hey Condi, read the bleeping MEMO next time!
When the intelligence agencies warn you of impending terrorist attacks - READ THE FECKING MEMO.

Rice: "We had no idea!" F$#@$ LIAR!
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OneTwentyoNine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-04 06:49 PM
Response to Original message
60. Iraqi's have missles in their Living rooms?-Give me a freakin break Condi
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Malva Zebrina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-04 07:08 PM
Response to Original message
61. Nice work Stephanie
Edited on Thu Jan-29-04 07:17 PM by Marianne
thanks



I am sorry to say that this woman is all smoke--and does not even know that smoke comes from fire. She is just another repeating robot with a degree in something that does not help one bit.

This is how a woman acts when she has been given a position that is , well that is "complimentary" and has to behave as if she is really , really knowledgable and very involved in all of it. It is all an act from another Bushbot.


Truth is that this woman was and is being used and she willingly accepts that, obviously, in order to , perhaps, preserve her "reputation". Which by now, has been trashed into a non recognizable , shallow little perfunctory acknowledgement of her position as the "woman" on board.

How does this happen to a woman who has done the work to earn such academic accolades, obviously? I mean how does she turn so shallow and so cheap and so beggar like? The woman has lost all sense of what is the right thing to do. May she never sleep another night in her life for the lies she tells in order to preserve her vaunted boss who uses her time after time and who she seems perfectly willing to let him use her.

She is really despicable and weak. She fails to recognize the thousands whom her boss murdered on the lies and, incredibly, lies further in order to cover that up. I wonder how she really survived that whole academic thing and her positions in the corporate America, when she is so obviously, weak.

Her face shows her fear and her weakness. She is really quite ugly. We have seen this display of "toughness" in her face before. She has mastered that "look" and thinks it shows something about her resolve or her strength. All an act.
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Skittles Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-04 07:39 PM
Response to Original message
62. man
the whores must be desperate if they're using the looting theory
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