Kerry Ad Says Bush Lost Debate, Then Lied

[G_j]

**warning this feels like a pro-Bush spin piece.
more desperation stemming from Bush's abysmal debate preformance.
They are grasping at straws, but they were obviously given a little bit of an 'opening' here.
----------------



http://www.guardian.co.uk/worldlatest/story/0,1280,-4531533,00.html

Kerry Ad Says Bush Lost Debate, Then Lied

Sunday October 3, 2004 1:46 PM


AP Photo DCEV118

By NEDRA PICKLER

Associated Press Writer

WASHINGTON (AP) - John Kerry on Saturday looked to frame the next presidential debate in a specriticizing President Bush's economic record, but also tried to get in a final word about their last face-off by declaring himself the winner and Bush a liar. ``George Bush lost the debate,'' an announcer says in a television ad Kerry's campaign unveiled Saturday. ``Now he's lying about it.''

The Democratic presidential candidate's accusation came two days after his first debate with Bush, when he told moderator Jim Lehrer that he avoids saying that the president is lying to the American people.

``I've never, ever used the harshest word, as you did just then,'' Kerry said. ``And I try not to, but I'll nevertheless tell you that I think he has not been candid with the American people.''

In the first poll taken since the Thursday night debate, Kerry was running even with Bush after having trailed him in the same survey last month. The Newsweek poll showed Kerry had the support of 47 percent and Bush 45 percent, with independent candidate Ralph Nader at 2 percent.

..more..

[captainjack]

1. assasination piece

crappy journalism at its best. kerry was responding to serious mudslinging by the bush cheney team, and bush really did lie in that ad.

[JoFerret]

2. Bush is certainly out there lying

about what Kerry said plainly in front of 25% of the population and a sizable chunk of the world.

[radfringe]

3. just a suggestion for an ad/talking points

this is very loose idea - but I think you see the pattern

start with Arbusto - bailed out by Spectrum-7
Bush on the board of Spectrum-7 (I believe) - and was "saved" by a take-over from Harken (bush also on board, sold stocks just before Harken went under)

bush* has been "bailed-out, saved or otherwise had his messes cleaned up by somebody else

We did have a surplus, a balanced budget - now it's a mess
Iraq is a mess, war on terror is a mess
Once again somebody else will have to clean up a bush* mess

[w4rma]

4. The "journalist" is trying to make it sound like Kerry said that Bush was

lying about who won the debate rather than talking about Bush's lies about policy.

[iamjoy]

5. This Is Not Good

I mean, even if Bush is a liar, this could backfire. Senator Kerry stood up a few nights ago and said he never used the word liar and that he would try not to. Now he puts out an ad using the word? Technically Kerry may be right, as of the time of the debate he never used the word and maybe he did "try" not to. Besides, does Kerry actually speak the word in the ad? Still, if he said he approved the message that justification won't fly.

The way this could be spun, knowing the GOP's talent for distortion is showing alternating clips of the ad and John Kerry saying "I've never used the word." Guess we'll have to see how this all comes out in the spin cycle.

[G_j]

6. I agree that

it leaves an unnecessary opening for GOP spin.
There are other words that could have been used.
It may not stick though, most people know what a lie is, regardless of the choice of words used to describe it.

[Toots]

7. I think this ad is a mistake for the Kerry people.

It is very subjective who actually won the debate. Most people know Kerry did but a lot of Right-wingers feel Bush* did win. This is hardly the issue to accuse him of lying over. There are just too many other really valid occasions where he did lie and it can easily be shown. Maybe Bush* feels in his heart that he knocked one out of the park. It can't be called a lie if he truly believes he won.

[Moderator]

8. Duplicate

Same subject, different source. Add the guardian article if it offers new information

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=102&topic_id=880499