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hyphenate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 12:27 AM
Original message
Sheriff's Department reopens Natalie Wood case
Source: L.A. Times

The coroner originally ruled the actress' 1981 death an accident, but investigators want to talk to the captain of the yacht Wood and her husband were on the weekend she died off Santa Catalina.

By Richard Winton, Sam Allen and Andrew Blankstein, Los Angeles Times
November 17, 2011, 9:17 p.m.


Thirty years after Natalie Wood died off Santa Catalina Island, the Los Angeles County Sheriff's Department announced Thursday that it was reopening the investigation into one of Hollywood's most enduring mysteries.

Wood, 43, was boating off the island on Thanksgiving weekend 1981 with her husband, Robert Wagner, fellow actor Christopher Walken and others when she somehow went overboard and died. Officials at the time ruled her death an accident, but there has been much speculation since over whether there was more to the story.

Sheriff Lee Baca said detectives want to talk to the captain of the boat after learning of comments he recently made about what happened on board. Baca did not provide further details, adding only that the captain "made comments worthy of exploring."

A law enforcement source added that the department recently received a letter from an unidentified "third party" who said the captain had "new recollections" about the case. The source spoke on the condition of anonymity because the case was ongoing.



Read more: http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-natalie-wood-20111118,0,5141657.story



I wouldn't be surprised at anything that comes up.
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glinda Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 12:40 AM
Response to Original message
1. What do you mean about not being surprised?
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hyphenate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 12:46 AM
Response to Reply #1
2. My brief stint in the 90s
working at Universal. The tales that would come up about most every possible conspiracy around. I learned things I needed to keep to myself about quite a few scandals/mysteries/rumors.

Those in the upper echelon of the entertainment industry had many excesses, and some of them were quite intriguing. Some of those things were so outrageous, you had to keep quiet simply because you would sound insane if you told anyone.
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 12:54 AM
Response to Reply #2
3. The rumor I heard was that Wood and Walken were having a fling and
It came to Wagner's attention. Wood left to get the hell away from the drama and was intoxicated, slipped, and fell.

I've no idea if it is true, but it's a neat little package, isn't it?

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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 12:59 AM
Response to Reply #3
4. Either that, or a pack of vicious lies.
Edited on Fri Nov-18-11 01:08 AM by No Elephants
Then again, I'm sure the rumor you heard was based only upon the very most reliable Hollywood sources of pure gossip, none of whom was present on the ship.

Shit that is made up after the fact always tends to fit the circumstances very neatly, a lot more neatly than things that are true. (Duh.) So, a neat package is more of a reason to be suspicious.

And even if there had been a controversy of some kind, the death still could have been purely accidental.

If you have no idea if it's true, why risk libeling Wood, Walken and Wagner, two of whom are still alive and trying to make a living that very much dependent upon public opinion? Not to mention, families are involved.

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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 01:15 AM
Response to Reply #4
7. You don't understand what libel is, I see. It's not that, at all, when you come right out and
fully acknowledge that you are speculating and trading in rumor.

I never said it was fact. In fact, I went out of my way to ensure that I didn't pass off my comments as factual.

You might want to sharpen up that rapier thought process before you start making false accusations about what people are, and are not, doing, yourself.

I've got a news flash for you--I'm hardly the first person in the world to mention this theory. Do the google, you'd be surprised how much speculation there has been over the years as to how NW died.
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 01:45 AM
Response to Reply #7
11. Actually, I do know about it. Hence, my post says "risk" libeling.
If true, rumors, no matter how vicious and ugly, would not be libelous.

If, however, they are false, they would indeed be libelous. Hence, whenever you spread a rumor, you risk being libelous.

Qualifying it as possibly non factual is another issue. Then again, I never said Wagner or Wagner could win a lawsuit against you.

And all of that dodges the morality of spreading nasty crap with no idea of whether it is true, especially when people's llvelihood depends on public opinion.


And while we are on the subject of your risking libeling people, kindly specify the false accusation I allegedly made about you.

Finally, no one implied you were the first person to spread any rumor, so put down that huge straw man. No need to tire yourself out for no reason

Next!
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 01:54 AM
Response to Reply #11
14. Nonsense. You don't understand the meaning of the word, if you insist that
anyone repeating a rumor, or postulating a speculation, is behaving in libelous fashion, 'risking' or otherwise. Repeating a story one has heard and taking pains to characterize it as speculation is not "risking" libel or anything else.

You're in error here. Off base. Completely, and totally.

Let me "specify" the false accusation you made. You're accusing me of libel or "risking libel." Falsely. Go back and read your words.

Take more care when making suggestions or accusations about people. They're your words, and you must own them.

If you are acknowledging that I'm "not the first person to spread any rumor," why are you even making remarks about libel with regard to me?

Makes no sense at all.
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 04:09 AM
Response to Reply #14
19. LOL! Someone's been googling, but not anywhere near enough.
Edited on Fri Nov-18-11 04:33 AM by No Elephants
Or perhaps the difficulty is reading comprehension.  

It's ironic. On other threads, you've acccused me of taking
your posts too literally, rather than contextually, and also
of lacking reading comprehension. Sigh.

AGAIN, there is a difference between saying things that damage
people's reputations and saying them in such a way that
enables the victims to file a lawsuit or win (anyone can file
anything, I guess, if they are willing to risk being fined).  

I never said, "You'd better watch out. Wagner and Walken
might haul you into court and take you for all you own." 
I never even said you libeled them.  I said you had risked
libeling them.  

And. speaking of context, since my statment was in a post on a
message board and not in a legal complaint filed in a
courtroom, it should have been very obvious that my statement
was not about actionable libel.

Whether or not you agree with me has nothing to do with how
much either of us know.  And though you seem convinced your
knowledge of this subject is superior to mine, it clearly
isn't.

For example, whether you are the first person or the 100,000th
to say something libelous is irrelevant.   

People who publish or re-publish a libel are all engaging in
libel.  It's not like posting something in LBN, where being
the first to counts. Guess you missed that, but you can google
again if you doubt it.

Oh, I did not lump Natalie's estate in with the potential
plaintiffs in this non-existent lawsuit over actionable libel
that you've inexplicably chosen to imagine I was referring to.
 

The reason I did not do that is is because I do indeed know
about libel lawsuits. Maybe sometime when actionable libel is
actually what either of us is referring to, we can delve more
deeply in how much each of us knows on the subject.  

BTW, on another reading comprehension point,  I also never
acknowledged that you were not the first to spread this
particular rumor. I simply pointed out that you had created a
straw man. I did not "acknowledge" that you were the
first or claim that you weren't the first.

And again, you are repeatedly attempting to nitpick wording in
some imaginary complaint alleging you owe Wagner and Walken
damages for libeling them. 

Meanwhile, though, you conveniently continue to ignore the
[b]actual[/b] point of my post, namely, spreading ugly rumors
about people who make their living based in part on public
opinion of them is not one of Martha's good things (about as
nicely as I can express it).   

It's not even as though it benefits you, as might someone who
is paid to publish and re-publish gossip.  It's just damaging
for the sake of being damaging. 

Smearing people by spreading rumors labeled as wild
speculation may be legally safer, but it is no more honorable
and not much less damaging to the people.  Things like this
tend to get passed on and on and take on a life of their own.
Pretty soon, people are swearing on their firstborn that it's
gospel.

 In fact, perhaps the opposite may be so. Maybe it's just even
more of cheap shot when you have nothing to lose (except maybe
your own reputation as?) by smearing others.

Won't be responding to your next post on this topic because it
seems clear that you apparently already know all there is to
know about the subject; and I stubbornly refuse to acknowledge
the superiority of your legal defense to an allegation in a
legal complaint that no one filed in a DU message board court.

:rofl:
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 04:40 AM
Original message
Yeah, you said I "risked libeling" them. But the point is, that wasn't true.
People who publish or republish SPECULATION and make it clear that it is RUMOR or SPECULATION are not engaging in libel. It's not even "smearing" to repeat a rumor and qualify it as such. You go check that with an attorney, if you can't find it on your google, there.

You're the only person on this thread fantasizing about lawsuits and owing damages. Where you're pulling that crap from, I've no idea, but you'd probably be better off putting it back where you found it.

And nitpicking? Could this latest post of yours be any longer and nitpicky?

I smacked your libel assertion down because it was untrue. Now you're trying the technique of shifting goalposts about "not being nice." That's just bull. What, YOU, of all people, are never going to say mean things now? That would be a first. You're going to be "honorable" and claim the high road on a gossipy Hollywood rumor thread about a scandalous, decades-old event? Please.

Tip on out of here if you can't deal, that's fine and dandy.... but don't pretend you're morally superior just because you misspoke about what libel is--and isn't.

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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 04:57 AM
Response to Original message
22. Hopeless.

"de·fame (d-fm)
tr.v. de·famed, de·fam·ing, de·fames
1. To damage the reputation, character, or good name of by slander or libel. See Synonyms at malign.
2. Archaic To disgrace."

Not a word in that definition that says it isn't defamation if you add that you have no idea whether the ugly, vicious things you post are true.

Libel is a subset of defamation. It goes to whether something is in writing, how serious the potential damage to reputation is and a few other things.

Actionable libel is something else, as I have said two or three times now. And no one was talking about actionable libel



But, even though the dictionary definitions of defamation do not support your position, you're probably right. :sarcasm:

Speculating that Walken and Wood was commmitting adultery and Wagner found out and now Natalie's dead bears no risk of hurting anyone's reputation, as long as you add "I have no idea if it's true or not."

Please.

And again, smearing people for shits and giggles sucks. Apparently, you'd rather bs about what you DON'T know about defamation than deal with the actual point. Can't say I blame you, but it sure doesn't improve your image.
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 05:04 AM
Response to Reply #22
24. Why are you now giving me definitions for defamation when you were babbling about libel?
Don't answer--I really don't care. You're just ranting now, for what purpose, I've no clue.

If anyone has an image problem, it's you, and it is of your own making.

Find a better hobby.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 05:29 AM
Response to Reply #24
25. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
LanternWaste Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 11:21 AM
Response to Reply #24
32. I sometimes think acute onset inebriation...
I sometimes think acute onset inebriation leads to posting some pretty serious babbling and rather absurd gibberish at times. Let's hope it's inebriation... the alternative is somewhat damning in and of itself. :)
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 11:33 AM
Response to Reply #32
33. That might be it. Makes sense, anyway! nt
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 04:40 AM
Response to Reply #19
21. dupe.
Edited on Fri Nov-18-11 04:41 AM by MADem
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tabasco Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 12:04 AM
Response to Reply #7
54. Haha. Another outhouse attorney.
An anonymous post on an internet message board will never rise to the level of libel. Your "full acknowledgment" of "speculating and trading in rumor" is pretty funny.
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6000eliot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 01:25 AM
Response to Reply #3
8. I read that she walked onto the boat and caught Wagner and Walken getting it on.
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 01:31 AM
Response to Reply #8
9. That's a new one on me--I didn't know that Walken and Wagner knew each other very well. NT
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DURHAM D Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 01:31 AM
Response to Reply #8
10. I don't recall any point in the past when Wagner was not
thought to be bi or gay by my friends. Never heard anything about Walken.
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 01:46 AM
Response to Reply #10
12. Not thought to be? Or thought to be?
CNN has a fairly thorough synopsis with some theories in their coverage:

http://www.cnn.com/2011/11/17/justice/california-natalie-wood/index.html
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DURHAM D Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 01:52 AM
Response to Reply #12
13. Ok - let me be straight.
He's GAY.
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 01:59 AM
Response to Reply #13
15. Ha ha--thanks! Now that's news to me!
I thought that was what you meant, and you were perfectly clear, but having found myself in double-negative trouble on the odd occasion, I wanted to be sure of your meaning.

Hasn't he been circumspect over the years!
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hyphenate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 03:06 AM
Response to Reply #8
17. Ummmmm
That's pretty close to what I heard, actually! I see I wasnt't the only one who got that message.




Another conspiracy that some of us discussed at the time was this: Stefanie Powers loved William Holden. RJ was married to Natalie. Sometime along the way, RJ and Stefanie fell in love. So their lovers had to go. Holden died on November 16, 1981--Natalie died on the 29th. Our conspiracy thinking made sense. It so happened that RJ ended up marrying Jill Saint John after Nat's death, who shares some traits with Powers.
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robbob Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 05:42 AM
Response to Reply #3
27. Maybe you two
should just put each other on "ignore"...


...just kidding; debate away!
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 12:42 PM
Response to Reply #27
36. It looks like DURHAM D is closest to the mark, based on the news reports today.
My midday news said that the boat captain came right out and said RJ murdered the woman.
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isuphighyeah Donating Member (82 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 02:16 PM
Response to Reply #3
45. I heard that Walken and Wagner were
having a fling and Wood caught them. Who knows? I do hope they confirm that it was just an accident as this would be a terrible thing for her family to have to go through all over again.
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 01:11 AM
Response to Reply #2
6. I'm sure much goes on in Hollywood and in your own town or city, too.
Tales are just that, tales.

And they are made all the more titillating and fun to repeat if a famous person is involved, especially someone rich, attractive, talented and much desired by many.

As a teen, my bf's brother advised me, "Believe none of what you hear and only half of what you see." (And that was before photoshop, too.) He was wise well beyond his years.

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Matariki Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 04:17 AM
Response to Reply #2
20. Oh, do tell.
We promise not to think you're insane. Tell it like good fiction ;-)

Why am I thinking of David Lynch's Mulholland Drive...
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hyphenate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 01:46 PM
Response to Reply #20
41. Well, a lot of what I heard over the years can't be verified
by anyone other than the principal parties--a lot was accumulated after the fact from sources close to the issues.


I remember at the time, though, that Don Simpson, who partnered with Jerry Bruckheimer had a huge coke problem. There was an investigation on him at one point, because his secretary ended up quitting because Simpson was having her make arrangements for prostitutes for him, and for contacting his drug dealer to bring him coke to his office. Simpson had a very bad drug habit.


Another rumor around that time was about Don Bellisario, that while he was married to one woman, he was having an affair at the same time with his masseuse, and beat up his wife while she was very pregnant.


You hear things, you remember the more salacious details, of course. It's pretty much the same as most places of business, except the rumors are about famous people.
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Javaman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 10:16 AM
Response to Reply #2
29. When exactly did you work at Universal?
Edited on Fri Nov-18-11 10:16 AM by Javaman
I was working out there during the early 90's myself and had some dealings with Universal at the time.
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hyphenate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 11:36 AM
Response to Reply #29
34. I was there from February, 1989
until December, 1996. I worked in a variety of positions, but was let go during the major upheaval that was a result of the Seagrams takeover.

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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 12:45 PM
Response to Reply #34
37. What a shame. One of my ancestors had a small role in the establishment
of the Independent Motion Picture studios, owned by Carl Lammle, that later became Universal. He was an actor, director and producer, unknown today, and most of his work was lost in the big fire. Some of it pops up occasionally in archives in Russia, Holland, Canada, etc., and I'm on a long, slow trek to find as much of it as I can.
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hyphenate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 01:52 PM
Response to Reply #37
42. Good luck!
Have you ever gotten in touch with AFI? That's the kind of stuff they work on, and try to get back as many archives as possible.

The problem with celluloid is that it's extremely flammable, especially from so long ago. Nowadays, it's not as much, and when the AFI or other agencies can, they make a 1 to 1 transfer to sturdier filmfor archiving. In some cases, there is only a print somewhere in a vault that hasn't been seen since its very first showing, and in other cases, there was been generations of generations of duplicates, and they look like crap. It's always nice to find a pristine reel somewhere along the way.
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 02:12 PM
Response to Reply #42
44. Sure have. They want money and lots of it. They have a couple of his
works out at the library in LA (I think--it's been awhile since I've gone round with them), but I can't get copies of their copy "as is"--I have to fund a restoration to get a copy, and I don't have that kind of scratch. I'd do better trying to find a copy in a film library (which I have done with one of 'em).

It would help if he were well known today, but he was an early -- very early -- player in the industry and no one knows him now. The more well-known artists are first in line. His body of work includes many hundreds of films and shorts, but many have been lost to dust or flames. It's fun, though, to see the family genetic code on film from as early as 1909 through the 20s.

The Canadians and Dutch have been very nice--they've given me DVDs of their copies "as is." Not cheap, but affordable. Library of Congress has a couple, too (to include the paper copyright records that they "put back" on film), but last time I checked, they would transfer the material to tape and then, for extra money, to DVD. Their price structure is just whacky--gives me a headache trying to figure out how much it all might cost!

I may wander down there this winter for a short stay and see if I can't "try before I buy." Sometimes being able to talk to a librarian face-to-face is easier than email, phone or net.
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Javaman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 03:40 PM
Response to Reply #44
50. If you don't mind me asking, who was your ancestor?
I'm a film geek to all things film related.

Cheers!
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 08:38 PM
Response to Reply #50
51. It's a long story.
I sent you a PM!

I'm a bit of a film geek too in some regards; no expert, though--I have what you might call "pockets of knowledge."

:hi:
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Javaman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 01:42 PM
Response to Reply #34
40. I was working on the show Quantum Leap
and had shopped a script over at the brand new sci-fi channel around '92.

Small world.

Cheers!
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hyphenate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 02:04 PM
Response to Reply #40
43. Then we might have met
because my first job at U was working in Music Business Affairs, in the same bungalow where the production staff of QL was!

I know the gang there pretty well, as we worked with them quite a bit. One of the writers, Paul Brown, worked on the Man of La Mancha episode, and there were a lot of deals which hinged on getting the music clearance for that episode.

There wasn't always a huge amount of things going on in our dept., and I often found myself hanging with Don Bellisario's son, Michael, who was about 13 at the time. I didn't watch Jag, but I do watch NCIS, and I was shocked to see "little" Michael all grown up on the show.

There was a studio cat that hung around we all named "Leaper" and we adopted him, and all pitched in to get him fixed, only to find out he was a she and she was already spayed. I recall one Christmas day when my mom and I went to feed Leaper on XMas day, and took in the tour while we there.

I also wrote my first script then, for QL, and actually got it read and critiqued by Paul, who I knew was being a good guy to afford me that kind of attention.

I finally realized, though, that I wasn't cut out for script writing--I work better in novel format and short story format.
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Javaman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 03:10 PM
Response to Reply #43
47. I was on the crew side...
What a bunch of really wonderful people. Frankly, everyone, both above and below the line were really great. Scott and Dean were the real deal. I first started as a set intern back in late '89, then came back in '91 to work as a assistant cameraman. Scott walks right up to me and says, "Hi Javaman, where ya been?", like he just saw me the day before. As a young guy still with Hollywood stars in my eyes, I thought that was such an amazing thing. Frankly, it kind of was. :)

Michael Watkins, the cinematographer took a bit of shine to me and started showing me the ropes. I am forever in his debt for the knowledge he bestowed upon me.

I remember Paul Brown. He would come down to the set from time to time with notes and such. Really nice guy.

It goes on and on. I really miss that show, both on TV and working on it.

Later on, I had two writing partners and we wrote a script called "Matrix Man" (well before "the Matrix" and that crappy Lawnmower Man", we were shopping it at the Sci-fi channel in the primordial days before anyone had a grasp of what real computer graphics were. (but that's a whole other long and twisted and depressing story. LOL). Again, I was starry eyed at taking meetings in the Alfred Hitchcock building.

I look back at those times as probably some of the most exciting of my life. I was living the dream for a guy from a small town.

Thanks for bringing back the memories. :)

Cheers to you!
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hyphenate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 11:25 PM
Response to Reply #47
53. I remember Paul Brown told me to go visit the set when they were shooting
the Man of La Mancha episode, so I headed over there one day. Scott saw me, introduced himself to me, and we spent about 20 minutes talking. You're right--he was an excellent guy.

You pretty much had most of them pegged--a great gang. I at least got to know them before I figured out how nasty the "other half" of the industry was. The Matsushita takeover was a dream come true compared to the Seagrams takeover--that's when the place began to fall apart in my eyes.

Hope you sold a few scripts--I haven't really tried doing much when I left L.A. By that point, my health had gotten worse, and I came back here to MA. There might still be a fight still left in me, but I'm content to write political/philosphical work now. I might submit my novel someplace someday, though I'm not sure it is salable any longer.
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Javaman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 10:41 AM
Response to Reply #53
55. I left L.A in '95...
Sorry to hear about your health. Why do you think your novel isn't marketable anymore?

As for the other scripts we/I wrote, after a long and bitter experience with trying to sell then via an agent that was trying to (unbeknownst to my partners and I) include in the deal him as producer. He didn't have any producing credits! It's a good thing I'm a peaceful sort, because once I found that out, I wanted to kill him. It later came to light, because of his insistence of wanting to produce, a deal was completely scuttled with Paramount. They pretty much gave the go ahead but through other channels, they dropped it because he was being so insistent. What could have been...

We wrote a few more scripts (got a different agent) but our hearts had been chewed up and spit out at that point. So off we went into independent film making. it was a fun road but nothing like the days on the set when I was an AC. Nothing we did ever hit the radar.

I had heard nightmare stories about the Seagrams takeover. Many crew members that I knew, began complaining about all sorts of things regarding the lot security and general maintenance. I was gone by that point, but I trust their word.

The industry has changed so much. My few friends that I still stay in contact with out there, say the industry has changed from day to night. I look back at the early to mid '90's as the last hurrah in a lot of ways. Getting freelance camera jobs was like shooting fish in a barrel back then. Now, I hear horror stories. Massive budget cuts across the board (mostly effecting crew), etc.

I made my decision to leave after the Northridge quake. It took a few more years, but I was looking for the right opportunity.

From time to time my GF asks me about film and if I miss it. I usually give the same answer: I so miss working with my old friends on set. I miss the camaraderie and the fun, but I don't miss the politics. It was the only job I ever had where I didn't mind getting up at 4 am for a 6am call. lol Then working a 10 hour with 3 hours of OT. :) Then doing it all over again the next day.

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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 02:22 PM
Response to Reply #40
46. I have to say, that program was a "Must See" with our crew. I enjoyed the hell out of it.
Totally improbable premise, the guy who played the Navy guy managing the whole leaping effort lived in his dress whites (no one does, not even flag officers) but it didn't matter--I thought that show was just grand! Loved the different scenarios every week, the pacing, the writing, the whole crazy concept.

That sounds like a fun job....of course, stuff might look better from outside the inner sanctum, but you should know you gave quite a few people a lot of entertainment while that program lasted.
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Javaman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 03:19 PM
Response to Reply #46
48. I loved the show. :)
Not only because I worked on it, but because, I thought it was well written and well acted.

Working on the show was a great experience. I thing QL was the exception to the rule. I had friends that worked on other shows and productions with nothing but nightmare stories. Not on QL, to my knowledge at least. Everyone was really friendly and, you could tell, everyone liked each other.

I remember this one grip Mo. What a helluva nice guy. He was so funny, as the holidays approached, he would print up sheets of christmas carol music and hand it out to the crew. Sometimes, if it were a light day, at a certain point, he would nod and everyone would take out their music and start singing. It was so much fun.

I was in my mid to late twenties back then and for me, who ate, drank and slept film, it was such and endearing experience to me. I learned a lot about film but more so, that a film set should be a fun experience. I mean, when you think about it, what are you doing on set? Making movies? shooting a show? the people are creating a fantasy, what could possibly be more fun than that?

We had a saying on the set, it went like this, "The worst day on the set is still better than the best day on a real world job". It is so amazingly true.

Now I push papers across a desk and wax nostalgically about those days.
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 03:27 PM
Response to Reply #48
49. I think the cohesiveness of the team was very evident in the final product.
I'm not kidding, I'd turn down social events on QL nights! Not that I had a full social calendar, but still! I wouldn't be trusting the VCR to record the program!

Thanks for your part in giving me and mine some programming we found enjoyable and fun--there's not much on network tv worth watching most days!
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 01:03 AM
Response to Original message
5. I am not sure what they may learn 30 years after the fact that was not available to them then, but
I hope for everyone's sake, that they put this to rest once and for all. Imagine growing up suspecting your beloved Dad of murdering your mom.
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hang a left Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 10:32 AM
Response to Reply #5
31. perhaps there was a cover-up at the time
and someone wishes to clear their conscience. I always thought the story was weird myself.
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jberryhill Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 02:34 AM
Response to Original message
16. There's a blast from the past

New life for, "Name a wood that doesn't float."
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 05:00 AM
Response to Reply #16
23. I was going to say
"off to the woodshed with you," then I realized that was not what I wanted to convey at all.

Curse my subconcious puns!
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No Joe Donating Member (106 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 03:28 AM
Response to Original message
18. I'm thinking Walken
That guy creeps the fuck outta me!
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Chef Eric Donating Member (576 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 05:34 AM
Response to Original message
26. I suspect the guilty party is Wagner, aka "Number 2."
And I predict he'll wind up in prison, joining that other henchman of Dr. Evil, Random Task.
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dipsydoodle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 05:44 AM
Response to Original message
28. Nice pics of Natalie in the Mail lnk
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warrior1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 10:31 AM
Response to Reply #28
30. the captain
just happens to be selling a book? If something did happened why wait 30 years?
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glinda Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 01:15 PM
Response to Reply #30
38. Lots of people will make a lot of retirement & holiday $$$$$$.
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Hell Hath No Fury Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 11:58 AM
Response to Original message
35. There were reports at the time --
that people on other boats in the marina heard drunken fighting and a woman calling for help. The scenario was that drunk Natalie and Wagner were continuing a fight that had started at dinner earlier over her flirtation with Walken in front of Wagner. Somehow Natalie ended up in the water -- she was calling to Wagner for help, but he was mocking her from the boat. Natalie -- who was terrified of water and could not swim -- drowned when she was not rescued.

I read the reports from the other boaters at the time and wondered why the fuck the police had decided to gloss over the whole thing. So many had seen or heard so much. It was clear as a bell that much more had gone on that night then the principles had told the police.

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freshwest Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 01:26 PM
Response to Original message
39. Oooh, score 1 for M$M divsion. I'm sure CA LEO has plenty of time since OWS has left the building..
P. S. Not dissing your thread, it is LBN. Just the M$M.
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msanthrope Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 08:48 PM
Response to Original message
52. Walken has hired an attorney.
"According to the Hollywood Reporter, the Oscar winner is being represented by Mathew Rosengart, a former federal prosecutor who is now a litigation specialist with a Los Angeles law firm.

Wood drowned after spending several hours drinking with her husband, actor Robert Wagner, and Walken, her co-star in the film "Brainstorm," on the couple's yacht anchored off California's Santa Catalina Island.

SNIP

Sources told THR that Los Angeles Sherriff's Department investigators do not consider Walken to be a suspect.

The website also reports that that Rosengart was hired to advise Walken in the inquiry, and that the actor is expected to cooperate fully."

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-31749_162-57327953-10391698/christopher-walken-hires-lawyer-over-natalie-wood-investigation/
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bemildred Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 11:11 AM
Response to Original message
56. I am sure Baca welcomes the distraction right now.
In fact I doubt it is mere coincidence that this story came out now.
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