Troy Davis: no polygraph test before execution tonight

[RT Atlanta]

Source: Atlanta Journal Constitution

A defense attorney says Georgia prison officials have blocked inmate Troy Davis from taking a polygraph test before his scheduled execution.

Georgia's pardons board on Tuesday, Sept. 20, 2011, rejected clemency for Davis despite high-profile support for his claim that he was wrongly convicted of killing MacPhail in 1989. Davis is set to die on Wednesday, Sept. 21. It is the fourth time in four years his execution has been scheduled by Georgia officials. (AP Photo/Georgia Department of Corrections, File)



Read more: http://www.ajc.com/news/nation-world/apnewsbreak-ga-bars-polygraph-1185618.html

---

RT comment: we can't have any more doubt cast on Mr. Davis's guilt/innocence. There is absolutely no harm whatsoever in permitting the polygraph to occur.

[tblue]

1. May they burn in hell.

And may their consciences haunt them every day of their lives.

[Zoeisright]

4. Unfortunately, people like the Georgia prison board don't HAVE consciences.

[liberal from boston]

21. Unfortunately, people like the Georgia Prison Board don't HAVE consciences.

Totally agree -- is it possible for President Obama to stay execution. This is unbelievable that Troy Davis can be put to death with 9 witnesses who have recanted & no physical evidence linking him!!! If an innocent man is put to death then the state of Georgia's Judicial System is a joke!!!

[No Elephants]

65. I am not so sure that President Obama could have stayed the execution.

A stay, I believe, is for courts to grant, not the POTUS. However, the POTUS has the power to pardon--but I don't know if it extends to this case.

I have not researched it, but the Constitution gives the POTUS power to pardon crimes "against the United States."

Troy Davis did not commit a federal crime. The name of his case would have been Georgia v. Davis, not U.S. v. Davis.

I think only the Georgia parole board had any legal power to grant a pardon or to grant clemency.

[hack89]

2. Since polygraphs are notoriously unreliable

and considered pseudoscience by many scientists, the state had good reason to say no. The harm would be to make this into more of a circus then it is. Regardless of the results it would not provide a black or white proof of innocence or guilt.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polygraph#Admissibility_of_polygraphs_in_court

[alp227]

25. yeah i agree, leave polygraphs to the Maury or Steve Wilkos shows n/t

[slackmaster]

50. I agree. As an undergraduate, I trained myself to fool one for a psysiological psych class.

It's not hard to do.

[No Elephants]

66. It may be harder for an innocent person whose life literally depends on the result to

convince the machine it's all good.

Blood pressure, heart rate, perspiration, etc. are all going to be affected by the prospect that you are going be killed that evening.

[slackmaster]

72. Yes, there's that, and psychoaths are naturally good at fooling the machines.

The information gained from such a test would have been inherently controversial and legally worthless.

[Jackpine Radical]

58. And yet I have seen people committed to high-security sex offender units

on the basis of polygraph data, often collected under unscientific and unreliable conditions by poorly trained techs.

[solarman350]

60. Polygraph is STILL used by both the CIA and the FBI

So, why does the CIA and FBI use the Polygraph STILL if it is unreliable?

In some countries polygraphs are used as an interrogation tool with criminal suspects or candidates for sensitive public or private sector employment. US federal government agencies such as the FBI and the CIA and many police departments such as the LAPD use polygraph examinations to interrogate suspects and screen new employees. Within the US federal government, a polygraph examination is also referred to as a psychophysiological detection of deception (PDD) examination

[hack89]

62. From my link

In the American military and intelligence communities, polygraphs have been administered both as terms of qualifying for a security clearance and as part of a periodic reinvestigation to retain a clearance. There is no uniform standard for whether the polygraph is needed, as some methods of adjudication do not demand a successful polygraph test to earn a clearance. Other agencies, particularly certain military units, actually prohibit polygraph testing on their members. According to a GPO report to congress,<57> polygraphy in the security clearance context has little utility in detecting untruth, but significant utility in inducing verbal admissions. That is, polygraphy is mainly useful as a prop in the interrogation process. Further, this likely accounts for its continuing use by government agencies.

Europe uniformly rejects polygraph results as evidence in court proceedings - so does Canada. Do you agree that the standard for criminal proceeds has to be as high as possible? There is a reason that prosecutors love to use it - it is imprecise enough that a polygraph "expert" can sway a jury ready to believe "science".

[BiggJawn]

64. Because to admit the polygraph is bunk would open a can of worms.

All those convictions gotten on the basis of a Woo-Woo machine and it's pseudoscience. The G-men have a vested interest in continuing to be True Believers.

[florida08]

3. The pope and Jimmy Carter support Davis

but of course that doesn't matter because uh 'someone' has to pay the price. Anyone remember the "The thin blue line"?

And polygraphs today are very reliable

Recent research reveals that the accuracy of the new computerized polygraph stytem is close to 100%.

http://www.truthorlie.com/accurate.html

[SwissTony]

5. Em, you're quoting a guy who's shilling for work for him

and his polygraph. Not an immediately obvious reliable source.

And perhaps you or he has some references to back that statement up.

[florida08]

8. for pete sakes

I'm quoting a man who has 25 years experience..how many do you have?

[jberryhill]

11. There are people with 25 years experience in palm reading....

...and palm reading is still crap.

One can be an expert in Ouija boards too.

There is a reason why polygraphs are not used as evidence in trials.

Would you execute someone on the basis of a polygraph test?

[markpkessinger]

35. This is all true, but ...

... it's worth noting that the police certainly don't hesitate to use polygraphs to eliminate suspects.

[jberryhill]

37. That is correct

Police also consult with psychics, act on anonymous tips and hunches and do all sorts of stuff in the course of investigating crimes, and none of these things constitute competent evidence of anything. That's the difference between performing an investigation and proving something actually happened.

Polygraph tests are great for obtaining confessions, too. Assuming that the suspect has been properly advised of his/her rights and voluntarily agrees to one, sometimes they get worked up enough about not passing the test that they just confess right there.

Gimme a Xanax and a thumbtack in my shoe, and I'll pass a polygraph test indicating that I'm a 5,000 year old alien visitor from another planet.

[tropicanarose]

9. That is right! Chief Justice Stevens, rest his soul, also said that he deserved a new trial

[isuphighyeah]

61. Justice Stevens is very much alive. n/t

[hack89]

18. " Truth Or Lie Polygraph Service"

Fortunately there is no history of people lying or distorting science to make a buck.

It is pseudoscience - there is no peer-reviewed and science behind it.

[RT Atlanta]

6. Rep John Lewis tweet

As retweeted by former Mayor Shirley Franklin:

bwbblog Blogging While Blue
RT@RepJohnLewis Do not weep for Troy Davis, he will be with God weep for Georgia and for our Nation Capital punishment is barbaric WELL SAID

[LibertyLover]

7. I knew the pardons board

would vote no when I heard a female family member of one of the victims demand that Davis die so that she could have closure. That is beyond sad - that someone else, who is probably innocent, has to die so that you get "closure".

[tropicanarose]

10. I completely agree. Even if the family member thought that he was guilty why is his never rop

again seeing the light of day adequate enough for them?
How can the family feel good when 7/9 witnesses have recanted their testimony.....1 or the 2 is a possible (probable) suspect in the murder himself. This is outrageous!

[saras]

22. What kind of sick pervert gets "closure" from murdering an innocent and why should we support it?

[tropicanarose]

12. NPR is reporting a last minute appeal by Troy's defense attorneys:

Death Row Inmate Troy Davis' Attorneys File Last-Minute Appeal: "Attorneys for Georgia death row inmate Troy Davis are filing a last-minute appeal to halt his execution later today. Defense attorney Brian Kammer tells The Associated Press he will file the appeal in Butts County Superior Court, south of Atlanta, when it opens later Wednesday. The appeal asks a judge to block the execution. It argues that ballistic testing that linked Davis to the shooting was flawed." (The Associated Press)

Related story: "Georgia Is Poised To Execute Davis, 22 Years Later." (Morning Edition)

[Name removed]

13. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Melinda]

14. You made a left turn instead of a right... oh, and take your hatred with you.

[Melinda]

15. What a barbaric system we have...

Heaven forbid Mr. Davis might pass... what would that do then to our system of "justice"?

This is all very sad. :(

[Scruffy1]

26. Mass murderer and admitted torture GW Bush is getting $1200 to 3600 for tickets tonight.

And Troy gets executed. Those arguing about Troy's guilt or innocence miss the point. Our whole injustice system is laughable. I don't think he would have got death if a black man had been killed.

[Melinda]

40. "Injustice system" indeed.

It's a sad state of affairs in America. I don't know this country, my country -our country- anymore.

:cry::cry::cry:

[PufPuf23]

63. We live in a pathological system, nation, and world.

I have seen the sickness every where I have lived or worked since birth to nearly 60 years in the USA but the trend is far worse and blatant compared to when I was an adolescent, university student, career fed, or academic.

The sickness is in my family; this is likely common.

GWB et all are more guilty than Troy Davis even if Davis blatantly executed a police officer, and apparently there is reasonable doubt.

Things are not well when US citizens can be executed pre-emptively and questionable executions can take place when there is possibly reasonable doubt.

Caveat: I am anti-war and anti death penalty and anti vengeance imprisonment; all are mental illness by political groups or individuals.

Individuals are born, by circumstance or herded into homicide insanity; yet, still there is no excuse for state sponsored homicide of innocents and most hostile individuals. GWB, Cheney, Rumsfeldt, Qadaffi, and other pols who kill innocents by policy are far larger monsters and murderers than the grosser and systematically immoral examples of an individual gone insanely desperate or nihilist.

[RT Atlanta]

16. Schedule for the rest of the day

barring any changes due to the last minute appeals being filed in Butts County.

From some folks on twitter:

Charles EdwardsMT @MattPearlWXIA11: #troydavis schedule:

visitation 'til 3PM,
3PM physical;
4PM last meal,
5PM statement (optional);
6PM sedative (optional);
7PM execution


This execution is really saddening me - for the life about to be murdered by my state, as well as the lack of any apparent willingeness to re-open or re-consider any changes in the original evidence/testimony.

I also have a relative near death and that isnt helping one bit.

[babydollhead]

17. I am sorry for you. try this...

breathe in breathe out as you do, send them your compassion and wish them compassion for themselves.Send them love on their way. In a way, they will be the free ones, and we need each other, the ones who are here.

may you, sweet thing, have compassion for yourself as well. a hug.

[truebrit71]

31. Okay, not to be morbid, but why in the fuck does he need a physical if they're going to kill him?

It's kind of like sterilizing the needles for putting them in his arm..waht are they afraid of, thta he'll get an infection???

This whole thing is beyond fucked up...

[RT Atlanta]

36. to defend any claims of "in human" treatment

is my guess.

And yes, it is morbid and disgusting all rolled into one.

Very embarrassed for my state today. I agree with John Lewis's sentiments from his tweet today (posted above).

[Tom Ripley]

19. This is barbarism

[humblebum]

20. If this takes place the State of Georgia needs to be boycotted

by as many people and businesses as possible, both internationally and nationally. To execute someone when there is this degree of doubt amounts to murder by the state. No different than any totalitarian regime.

[onehandle]

24. Doing my part. Pretty good chance that my wife and I will Finally be leaving early next year.

Lived here all my life.

Atlanta is a corporate bubble swimming in a sea of Klan.

[No Elephants]

67. I recommend Massachusetts. Yeah, the Brown turd got elected. But, overall, it's

a good state.

[SoapBox]

23. Sickening...

Talk about railroaded!

There are more holes in this case than swiss cheese...BUT, the ANGRY crowd still wants to KILL him.

...makes me sick to my stomach AND, if this can happen, it can happen again and again and maybe...to you.

[A Physicist]

27. Polygraph Questions

Did he ask to take one years ago? If so, why wasn't he allowed then? If he didn't ask years ago, why?

[Honeycombe8]

28. That's what I was wondering. Isn't 20 years later a bit late to take a polygraph?

Did he refuse to take one before he was convicted?

[TownDrunk2]

29. This is merely the ptb showing us that no matter what we think ...

... we've won, they will still pull the strings. May they all rot on earth while still in the flesh.

[udbcrzy2]

30. Video interview with Prosecutor

Spencer Lawton is the former district attorney for Georgia's Eastern Judicial Circuit. He prosecuted the Troy Davis case in 1991.

"There are two Troy Davis cases," Lawton said during his conversation with Wood. "One is the case in court. One is the case in the realm of public relations."

In a wide-ranging interview, Lawton panned criticism at every turn in the case. When asked about recanted testimony of seven of the nine witnesses, he was quick to point out that the witnesses themselves never appeared in a court to recant and that U.S. District Judge William Moore picked apart nearly each affidavit they signed.

Some were not under oath. Some did not directly recant trial testimony, he said.

---snip----
Davis was convicted in the shooting of another man on the same day MacPhail was shot. That conviction has never been disputed. But, the gun that fired the shots in both crimes was never recovered.

"There is ballistic evidence based upon the cartridges fired from the gun," Lawton said. "The cartridges match."

http://www.11alive.com/news/article/206167/40/Ex-DA-Doubt-recantations-manufactured-in-Troy-Davis-case

[msanthrope]

33. He's right about the recantation evidence, sadly.

Davis's defense attorneys did a piss-poor job last year in front of Judge Moore, including their failure to call key witnesses, and fumbling the recants.


It's too bad, because properly handled, he might have had a good case.

[No Elephants]

70. They should have bowed out of the case and let their replacement argue

that former counsel had been ineffective.

[NOMOREDRUGWAR]

32. Davis is a scumbag, he still deserves life without parole though

Our system of capital punishment is inherently flawed and the risk of executing an innocent person is too great to allow executions to take place in this country. The death penalty is disproportionately applied to blacks and to the poor. That said, Davis is a murderer and deserves to spend the rest of his life in prison. His supporters can cry all they want about his innocence, but Davis will never be released from prison, even if his life is spared.

[truebrit71]

38. ..and you KNOW this how?

..or are you one of the two eyewitnesses that are still sticking to the prosecutions story even though seven others eyewitnesses have recanted?

[NOMOREDRUGWAR]

41. Wow, yes, those eyewitness recantations are so impressive. /sarc

Why did it take them until a few months before his first execution date for them to recant? The witnesses were either lying then or they are lying now. What do you think should happen to these recanting witnesses if they were lying 20 years ago? Don't talk to me about police pressure. If you perjure yourself on the stand then you should face the same penalty as the person that committed the murder. I'll support releasing Davis if you would support imprisoning these recanting witnesses for life without the possibility of parole. No? Go figure.

[truebrit71]

46. Yes, because your false equivalency makes so much sense right?

Your open mind is impressive, "Don't talk to me about police pressure". Really? I live in chicago, a city that has just recently jailed a former top cop for excessive "police pressure" so pardon me if I suggest you blow that out your own ass.

I am very glad, however, that you don't get to make laws in this country, to whit: "If you perjure yourself on the stand then you should face the same penalty as the person that committed the murder"...yes, that would stop false testimony dead in its tracks, right? Nothing remotely draconian or reactionary about that in the least...

As long as I condemn 7 people to a life in hell for caving in to pressure from the cops, you would then be okay in releasing Troy Davis? You live in a very dark and twisted world, and one I am glad I have no part of...

[NOMOREDRUGWAR]

68. Ouch

Hurts?

Well, one man (Brewer) who I am 100% sure was guilty died tonight, and another man (Davis) who I am only 97% sure was guilty also died tonight.

[hack89]

43. That same night he shot a man in the face and pistol whipped another

They found identical shell casings at the scenes of both shootings. He is a violent man.

[truebrit71]

44. Oh well, in that case fry the bastard....

:sarcasm:

[hack89]

47. Sounds good to me. nt

[marmar]

48. Sounds sick to me.

nt

[hack89]

51. OK. nt

[truebrit71]

49. He is alleged to have done those things, by the man many now believe actually committed the crimes..

..no gun though right? No prints? No DNA? No actual evidence.

The casings may have matched but there was no chain of evidence, and there was no certainty that the casings had been fired from the same gun.

[hack89]

52. Two separate trials, two separate convictions - I can see a pattern.

people believe many things - many of which are wrong. I have faith in two separate juries.

[truebrit71]

53. Yes many of them are wrong. Like you.

nt

[hack89]

54. OK. nt

[Dogtown]

57. So sad for you.....

it won't be televised.

[hack89]

59. OK. nt

[NOMOREDRUGWAR]

56. Boom boom

Let it ride yooo, let it ride.

I oppose the death penalty, as I already mentioned, because I don't want to execute innocent people. It almost seems like you want Davis freed from prison, however. Please explain yourself.

[No Elephants]

69. Did you read Reply 30? If that post is true, then Davis has been convicted

of two murders, only one of which convictions he has contested.

I realize that failure to contest the other murder conviction does not necessarily mean he was guilty (or innocent) of that other murder, but I can see how another poster might think so.

[midnight]

34. K&R Where is the civil rights division of our DOJ-wake up.

[GreenTea]

39. Georgia pure & ugly elitist racism!

[RebelOne]

42. I know. I live in this state. n/t

[RT Atlanta]

45. ITS LIKELY OVER - judge rejected stay

EDITED TO ADD "LIKELY" - still slim hope with GA supreme court and US Supreme ct

Per AJC's twitter feed

ajccourts Bill Rankin
GA judge rejects #TroyDavis bid for stay of execution.
7 minutes ago Favorite Retweet Reply

This is a terrible day for Georgia and our country's thirst for the death penalty.

[lsewpershad]

55. What are they affraid of?????

[hack89]

73. An inconclusive result that proves nothing

but merely adds to the ongoing circus. Polygraphs are based on pseudoscience - there is a reason that most enlightened justice systems refuse to allow them in judicial proceedings or criminal investigations.

[MrSlayer]

71. Polygraph tests are easily defeated and are inadmissable in court.

They are not scientific in the least and prove nothing.