GOP's Bob Turner wins special election for Anthony Weiner's NY congressional seat

[SpankMe]

Source: Breaking: MSNBC

GOP's Bob Turner wins special election for Anthony Weiner's NY congressional seat

No link yet.

---

And the idiocy continues.

[dennis4868]

1. all I have to say...

is that voters in NY09 are fucking stupid and will believe any lie you tell them...fuck you all! another vote in the House to get rid of SS, Medicare, etc...FUCK YOU ALL!

[sethgrogen]

17. idiots in the district and idiots in the dem party leadership.

And we're stuck voting for Obama. Sucks.

[No Elephants]

139. We are not stuck voting for Obama. There is still a primary.

And, regardless of how you vote, unless someone has a gun to head while you are voting, how you vote is still YOUR choice--and your responsiblity.

How long that will remain so may be debatable, but, as of today, that is still so.

Someone once pointed out to me that, even if someone had a gun at my head, I still actual;y had a choice. And that was an oddly empowering thought.

[sweetapogee]

104. temp

temporary insanity, no?

[MB149]

124. Throwing out the baby with the bathwater?

I'm not sure that's very constructive. These voters are generally ours. Do you really want to get into a GOP-style "purity" contest? The way things stand right now, you will lose big time!

[RBInMaine]

2. SHITTY race, SHITTY issues, SHITTY candidates, just SHITTY. The people are the losers.

The Dem was appointed instead of having a primary, and he was an incredibly shitty candidate. It was a narrow, old, small, angry, electorate where Jewish ethnic issues were exploited. So for a while the district gets a TeaPuke who will toe the line for Ryan and the
Medicare-Haters. Good for them. How sadly shitty.

[Skittles]

9. real Democratic leadership would help

[tblue]

38. Epic fail there. People aren't as afraid of Teapubs as we were hoping.

Anybody who thinks the Democrats can stay our current course and get a different result better wake up.

Sorry but it's true. What does this party stand for? I mean really and truly stand for? I freaking do not know so how can we expect voters in a swing district to know?

[tcaudilllg]

79. We stand for the gradual, egalitarian improvement of American living standards

by means of enhanced technology, productivity, public services, and behavioral regulation.

[kickysnana]

97. But we are not so gradually caving to massive eroding of all of those. n/t

[toopers]

121. What is "behavioral regulation"?

[MB149]

125. I agree... But...

We have no coordination. We (as a party/movement) "support" so many agendas that are at cross-purposes with each other. Democrats have often been afraid to set priorities for fear of slighting some cause or group. It's time to wake up and decide what's really important, because not all of out 3,497 interest groups are going to get what they want. Sometimes we act like spoiled toddlers.

[No Elephants]

135. Hounding Weiner out of office was very much an organized Democratic effort.

Not by rank and file Democrats, but by elected officials in Washington.

"It's time to wake up and decide what's really important,"

Yes, it is. Really, it's past time. Conservatives are already way too entrenched in the Democratic Party, which is bad for Democrats, bad for the country and bad for the world.

"not all of out 3,497 interest groups are going to get what they want."

No kidding. We all know that.

"Sometimes we act like spoiled toddlers."

maybe some of us do. and maybe some of us act like brainwashed automatons who have no desire, let alone ability, to think independently.

How about sticking to points about Weiner, though, instead of equating our fellow Democrats with toddlers simply because they see matters of opinion differently than you do?

[No Elephants]

140. LOL

[No Elephants]

141. Right. And not only generic "people," but people who had been Democratic voters for a long time.

And Turner was previously best known for creating the Jerry Springer show AND living in a restricted community.

Democrats really do need a better strategy than, "If you don't stifle yourself and vote Democratic, a Republican might win."

[cstanleytech]

54. You can blame the voters or the candidates all you want but the one to

really blame imo atleast is Wiener, no one forced him to post those pics and then lie about it multiple times to the public after it leaked out, he did that all on his own which caused this election to be handed to the GOP virtually on a silver platter.

[jeff47]

101. Actually, we can also blame the leadership that forced Wiener out, despite

polling showing his district didn't care about the scandal.

[QC]

103. Bingo. n/t

[cstanleytech]

110. Wasnt Wiener the one that called those press conferences?

You remember, those ones where he lied to the press from across the nation.
Thats when it became an issue for the party at a national level rather than just an issue for his district.

[jeff47]

111. And who exactly cared?

'Cause the voters both in and outside his district simply didn't give a damn.

But the leadership and a lot of other Democrats rushed to the mics as fast as they could to demand his resignation.

Meanwhile, Senator "Diaper" Vitter won re-election. Easily.

Unfortunately, some in the party harbor the delusion that if the Democratic party is more "moral", then they can get "morals voters" to vote for them. The problem is the "morals voters" don't actually give a damn about morality. They're trying to re-institute segregation and repress women and couch it in language of morality.

[cstanleytech]

115. Well clearly you didnt care that he was a douche bag

but clearly there were other people who did care because he was eventually encouraged to step down.

[jeff47]

120. Yes...my complaint is such people were too busy clutching their pearls to find out

...if the public cared.

[No Elephants]

127. Did you join Republicans in demanding Clinton's impeachment? What he did

was much worse than sending nude pictures via email. He got blow jobs in the frickin Oval Office, once while talking to another head of state on the phone, conducting offical POTUS business. And Clinton broke the law by perjuring himself. All Weiner did was sent pics by email to adult women who were flirting with him on the internet. GASP!

Probably a set up anyway, too, but we don't have to assume that to see what Clinton did was much worse than what Weiner did. Democrats in Congress and many Democrats who were not professional politicians supported Clinton anyway. Did you, or did you join Republicans in demanding his impeachment and/or resignation/

"clearly there were other people who did care because he was eventually encouraged to step down"

Baloney. Republicans were silent. His district wanted him. It was Democrats in D.C., from Obama and DNC head Debbie Wasserman Schultz, down, who were on TV day after day demanding his resignation.

[LanternWaste]

122. I imagine that's only relevant

"Meanwhile, Senator "Diaper" Vitter won re-election. Easily...."

I imagine that's only relevant if and only if the Democratic party holds itself to the same ethical standards as the right-wing.

However, Should republican dishonesty and blamelessness become a standard for our party platform, I myself will have no more of it.

[No Elephants]

128. Please see Reply 127.

'republican dishonesty and blamelessness become a standard for our party platform'

Oh, please. Dishonesty is not part of the Republican party platform or the Democratic party platform and never will be.

If holier than thou and hypocrisy become standard behavior for the Democrats in Washington, as they are for Republicans, both parties will become equally nauseating and repulsive.

How about letting the voters decide who represents them, as the Constitution contemplates?

[No Elephants]

138. You're clutching at straws. Who called the press conferences is an irrelevant straw man.

The press was all over the story and would have been all over it, even if Weiner had crawled into a cave for a month, which he could not very well do any.

Once he confessed and apologized, he had nothing more to say, nor was there anything new for the media to report, EXCEPT THAT Democrats went on TV day after day, making sure the media had new red meat.

And you have no idea what may have been going on behind the scenes. Neither do I, but I very much doubt that the ONLY communications by Democrats to Weiner about his were taking place on national TV and none behind closed doors.

[vercetti2021]

3. Oh well

People will never learn i guess. And the USA slowly continues to become dumbfuckinstan.

[gateley]

4. I'm mad at Weiner all over again. His ego lost us a voice.

The Republicans had lots of money and propaganda in this race and used their favorite weapon, FEAR. Always a winner. :thumbsup: :grr:

[emilyg]

6. .....

Yes.

[aquart]

20. Yep. Always blame the victim.

Can't wait till we lose the next voice. It'll be drowned out by the self-righteous howling for blood.

Unbelievable that you still can't see what happened.

[alp227]

26. how is he the victim when he chose to do that stupid stuff

and the consequences were the the Democrats turned their backs on him.

[No Elephants]

58. Democrats did more than turn their backs. One after another appeared on TV every day until Weiner

finally stepped down. And that was not the only possible result of Weiner's unfortunate actions. We know that because Vitter is still in office. Republicans did not defend him. They simply stayed out of it.

ETA: Weiner is a victim of how Democrats chose to treat him. And I have a strong suspicion that he was set up, based upon the first photo to appear and who provided it. But, of course, we'll never know that because it is hard to defend yourself when your only trial is by media circus.

I'm not saying Weiner was blameless. Far from it. And I am annoyed with him too, but this is not about him. It's about losing a Democrat seat that did not have to be lost and also about double standards (e.g., how Democrats treated Clinton vs. how they treated Weiner). And also about removing someone voters elected before voters have a chance to weigh in again. (Democrats tried that with Rangel, too--Obama suggesting none too nicely that Rangel retire--but voters chose him again anyway. I don't think anyone should try to take the voters' choice out of office for something like a photo, especially if they also defended someone getting a bj in the Oval Office.)

[girl_interrupted]

92. +1,000

Along with Vitter, there was also Larry Craig and Mark Sanford and John Ensign and a few others I'm sure I'm missing. And you are quite right about Rangel too. His constituents weren't having it either, despite what Obama suggested. Clinton was forgiven & so was Ted Kennedy. None of it makes sense.

[aquart]

100. HE WAS STALKED. He was targeted.

What you keep refusing to understand is they would have hounded him for jaywalking if they couldn't find anything else. NOTHING he did makes what they did right. Or our stupidity and cowardice in being so easily manipulated.

Please wake up and take some responsibility for being a sucker.

[LanternWaste]

123. He was also forced to lie repeatedly to his constituents, his peers and the people

He was also forced to lie repeatedly to his constituents, his peers and the people. Which may never be interpreted in and of itself as cowardice, lack of ethics or being easily manipulated. :shrug:

No one should lose their job simply for being dishonest to their co-workers and clients. That's simply crazy talk.

Party over ethics every time is a lesson we should all learn from the Teabaggers...

[MB149]

126. Finally!

A sane voice about Weiner! Is OUR scumbag better than their scumbag? Standing by the "party" is what is going to lose the 2012 election. Feeling shackled to President Obama is going to turn into feeling really sickened by President Perry.

[No Elephants]

133. Baloney.

Weiner broke no laws. Therefore he WAS, as a matter of both fact and law, better than OUR other scumbag, Clinton, as well as THEiR scumbag, Vitter, both of whom did break at least one law a piece.

And who is better or worse is not the point. The point is whether the Democratic Party (a) should have markedly dcuble standards, one for Bubba and one for Weiner, (b) should stalk a Democrat who had broken no law out of office when something very different was done for BOTH: Clinton and Vitter.


Nither the Constitution mor the Bible authorizes me or the Democratic Party to judge the relative merits of scumbags. That was for the people of Weiner's district to decide, just as it was for Senate Democrats to decide about Clinton and the people of Vitter's state to decide about Vitter. If they had voted out Weiner, that would be very differnt.

And no matter which scumbag is better, Weiner got treated worse BY THE LEADERSHIP OF HIS OWN PARTY than was either Clinton OR Vitter. So, at worst, people here said "Democrats should not have treated this scumbag WORSE than they treated our other scumbag or the Republican scumbag."

If Democrats treat the only scumbag of the three who broke no laws and never touched another woman WORSE than they have ever treated either another Democrat or a Republican, that is worth noting.

To sum up, it's about (a) equal treatment, (b) not outdoing Republicans in "holier than thou" and hypocrisy in politics and that's all.

Oh, yes, and the voters and the Constitution, though no one gives those two anything but lip service anymore.

"Standing by the "party" is what is going to lose the 2012 election."

So why are you doing that? People who are saying the Democratic Party was wrong to stalk Weiner until he resigned are not exactly the ones "standing by "the" Party in this matter.

[No Elephants]

131. Anyone with an ounce of empathy can at least understand why he lied. He never lied under oath.

And he did ultimately confess and apologize.

"No one should lose their job simply for being dishonest to their co-workers and clients."

That is not the issue. However, the only "employer" who had a right to cost Weiner his job were the voters of district, not Obama or Debbie Wasserman Schultz or any of the others who were in the media day after day hounding and shaming him. Hell, even Clinton had the gall to open his mouth against Weiner.

[gateley]

43. What happened is that he acted irresponsibly when he knew

what the repurcussions would be if he were caught.

Unbelievable that you consider him a victim! I agree that he was railroaded after the fact, but had he behaved with some discretion this never would have occurred.

I thought he should stay, I didn't want to lose his voice or vote, but I was incredulous that he used such poor judgment.

You're too much.

[bornskeptic]

96. If a Republican had done what Weiner did and had to resign

would you call him a victim? I doubt it.

[aquart]

98. Still totally and completely missing the point. And the crime.

If Democrats stalked and targeted Republicans, searching out every exposable peccadillo and then self-righteously demanded the poor schmuck depart the sacred, hallowed, saints-only halls of Congress? YEAH, I WOULD.

[No Elephants]

134. Baloney. And let's stick with facts, rather than pretending we know what other posters would do in

some hypothetic set of circumstances that may never occur.

Clinton broke a law by perjuring himself AND got a blow job in the Oval Office while conducting official POTUS business. And, while adultery is adultery, maybe there are degrees, maybe not. I'll leave that to clergy and philosophers and Oprah.

Bottom line, Clinton was defended, not hounded, by his Party, although his behavior was worse than Weiner's.

Vitter also broke a law and did more than sext, although his adultery did not occur on government property or while he was conducting government business and high school history books won't have to figure out delicate ways to explain his impeachment.

Weiner broke no laws and, as far as we know, he didn't have so much as a face to face meeting with any woman. Yet he got treated worse by his own party than his party treated either Clinton or Vitter.

If you can rationalize that, welcome to 1984.

[Arkana]

118. VICTIM?!

He was the fucking idiot who decided to text his dick to that girl. He's not stupid--he had to know that a double standard exists in the media for sex scandals, and he did it anyway.

The blame for this lies squarely on Anthony Weiner's shoulders.

[Wabbajack_]

24. He should have stayed in office

He didn't brake any laws did he?

[TheCowsCameHome]

28. He should have kept his honker in his pants.

Thanks, Anthony.

I hope the "fun" was worth it.

[gateley]

46. I don't even care about that -- He should have kept his

name and face out of it!

[No Elephants]

57. And there should be world peace. The issue is, given the reality, should

he have been run out of office or should the decision have been left to him and/or voters?

[aquart]

99. Martin Luther King, Jr. Adulterer.

JFK. Adulterer.

RFK. Adulterer.

FDR. Adulterer.

Wake up and pray the next guy you elect is stepping out on his wife.

[No Elephants]

130. We have proof only as to Clinton, whom, surprisingly, you omitted.

As to Clinton, we have both sworn testimony and, more significantly, an eventual public confession.

I wouldn't take a leaked FBI record smearing the left as proof of diddly.

[gateley]

45. I agree, I wanted him to stay. But that's not what happened

so I hold him responsible for being IRRESponsible. Had he not, had he been circumspect and not had his face and name plastered all over the place, there wouldn't be a newly elected Republican in his seat.

You guys floor me -- I'm at a loss for words.

[No Elephants]

60. Please see Replies 57 and 58.

You are posting as though putting a photo online automatically or inevitably means you're out of office. That is not the case. A lot happened between the time the first photo hit the fan and the time Weiner finally stepped down. And we know that getting a bj while you're married and in the Oval Office on the phone, with a head of state, doesn't even automatically add up to resigning, nor does having a prostitute diaper you while you are married and while seeing a prostitute is illegal.

Should Weiner have behaved better? Yes. But Turner is not the newest Rep only because Weiner sexted adults women who flirted with him online.

[gateley]

106. Turner is the newest Rep because Weiner resigned.

That was ultimately his decision regardless of the flak he took.

There wouldn't have been any flak if he'd been more discreet.

I am not implying that such behavior automatically or inevitably means one should vacate the office. I'm aware of the Dems turning on him. I agree it's not fair. But none of this would of happened had he not been so careless. And regardless of what technically can and can not be done, there isn't a person in the country, much less an outspoken Congressman, who isn't aware of this political climate and how the Republicans are out for blood and ignoring their own hypocrisy and how the Dems have capitulated repeatedly. Would he expect anything else?

I still hold him responsible. He brought it on, I like him and wanted him to stay, so that's why I'm mad at him. He didn't think it through. Bad judgment.

[No Elephants]

129. He was hounded to resign publicly and, if we saw so much of that daily on TV and in papers,

heaven only knows what may have gone on in private.

He is to blame for sexting. At most, he shares blame for his betrayal by his own Party. Don't know why people seem unable to get that. Or, maybe they do get it and are unwilling to say so.

Either way...

[tblue]

34. Only a stoned idiot would've wanted Weiner's resignation.

He did something stupid but he should've kept his seat.

And I will never forgive Obama for saying if it was him, he'd resign. If that wasn't the nail in the coffin, it was a stab in the back to a genuine fearless progressive. And now look. Ya happy now, Obama? You got what you wanted.

Hate to day I told you so, but I told you so.

[gateley]

47. I didn't want him to resign. Is it too much to ask a public

official, in whom people trust, to at least keep his name and face hidden? Is that too much to fucking ask?

I don't care what he did, I care HOW he did it because this is the result, right or wrong.

[girl_interrupted]

52. +1

[TheCowsCameHome]

105. Great role model -

Why whould I want my grandchildren to think what Weiner (or any other politician that does something similar) is someone to look up to? Is that what we have come to perceive as acceptable behavior?

He's gone, NY has a new republican in office because HE couldn't control himself. If he was my representative, I'd want him out, too.

Maybe these big-headed, self worshipping politicians will get the message, sooner or later.

[Maven]

109. +1

[HDPaulG]

44. If Anthony didn't have the 'little man' complex...

What a loser to sexually flirt to unknown people. A$$hole Mr. "I have to prove I am acceptable". Not only did you break your vows to your wife (at the time), but also to your constituents and all the House of Representatives. Thank you Anthony DICK(less).

[gateley]

48. I can't analyze him, but I do think that all the power and

fame makes so many of these people think illogically.

I don't care what he did, I care that he was reckless.

[No Elephants]

62. Plenty of blame to go around. Please see Replies 57, 58 and 60.

[LadyHawkAZ]

49. Mad about what, for pete's sake?

A man who didn't do anything, touch anyone or commit any kind of a crime? THAT'S propaganda at its best. And the Democratic community not only fell for it, but welcomed it with open arms and eager participation. We don't need Republicans to spread teh FEAR. We do it just fine on our own.

The demon on my shoulder that I usually keep strictly in check is enjoying this immensely, and I'm not bothering to make the effort to repress it. There's going to be a huge howl in the coming days from the very hypocrites that helped run him out of office, who will refuse to accept that this is the natural, predictable result of their actions, and I'm going to be sitting here snickering at that too. I am so far past the disgust threshhold with my party and its members that there is nothing left to do but laugh or go crazy. Some people just do. not. learn.

"Toute nation a le gouvernement qu’elle mérite" ~Joseph de Maistre

[Behind the Aegis]

51. +1

[gateley]

53. Mad that he used his name, didn't hide his face and use judment

when he knows better.

I've said, ad nauseam, I don't care what he did, I care HOW he did it because now we have a Republican sitting in his seat.

I wanted him to stay, it would have blown over.

I'm mad that he wasn't smarter about the whole thing. I saw the pics -- HE put them out there. That's not propaganda, that's poor judgment.

[No Elephants]

64. Belated welcome to DU.

For the most part, I agree with you, except that my personal reaction is different from yours. As they say, "individual results may vary."

[LadyHawkAZ]

114. It's a personal issue. YMMV

I would never claim to be a perfect person. I'd prefer to see lots of people becoming smart and tolerant, but after the Weiner "scandal" I've pretty much given up on that. I have to settle for vindictive smirking. We exposed, with this nonscandal, just how vicious and bigoted our supposedly "liberal" party members really are- and lo! we received in return a vicious, bigoted representative! Surprise! "Le gouvernement qu’elle mérite" indeed.

[No Elephants]

132. I am not at all a perfect person.

And I never did actually specify what my reaction was. Only that it was different from yours.

:evilgrin:

[ProSense]

5. Well

the seat is going to disappear in a year anyway.

[jpbollma]

10. Not shocking

The US is filled with idiots and the orthodox Jewish community is no different than evangelical Christians or Muslim fundies, all religious nut bags. Once again religion and racism ruins the day.

[Dawson Leery]

12. The differences between religious fundamentalists is nominal.

[Wabbajack_]

22. Not neccessarily

In keeping with tradition 1 Dem and 1 pub will get the axe but we can win that seat back so I don't know why it should be eliminated, get a safe gop seat instead.

[No Elephants]

137. Well, here's the kicker. The day afterr Turner was elected, I read an OP article on DU saying

that, as a result of Turner's victory, the NEW YORK legislature was reconsidering that seat and thinking of keeping it.

Go figure.

[No Elephants]

143. Maybe, maybe not.

http://www.google.com/search?q=New+York+lawmakers+reconsider+seat+redistrict+Turner+win+won+victory&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a

[No Elephants]

7. Weiner should not have been run out of office.

Democrats did the daily drum beat, one interview after the other, one Democrat after the other.

It was up to him, his wife and/or the voters.

[Adenoid_Hynkel]

14. basically, the same thing he did to Helen Thomas

when Weiner piled on her, claiming nothing she reported afterwards would have any credibility.
So it's hard to feel sorry for him, when he was equally willing to throw someone under the bus for a bullshit reason.

Yes, it's equally bullshit that he's gone, but Vitter stays.
But it's his fault.
If he wanted to keep his office, he shouldn't have tweeted pics of his pecker to have the universe. He knew what the stakes were, and he chose to act like a reckless egomaniac.

[Name removed]

16. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[jmodden]

19. Momzeitim.

[No Elephants]

56. Weiner was not the only one who claimed Thomas was anti-Jewish because of her remarks.

And many genuinely believed it, including, IIRC, DU adminstration.


"So it's hard to feel sorry for him, when he was equally willing to throw someone under the bus for a bullshit reason."

Funny, I don't recall asking anyone to feel sorry for Weiner.

[SoapBox]

8. Too bad...

and amazing that people will vote in a crazy.

It's all about getting that "n" word out of THEIR White House.

[Pryderi]

11. great. This is a PR disaster. We get NY-26, Repugs get NY-9. n/t

[Psephos]

13. Here is AP's report, via Seattle PI.

http://www.seattlepi.com/news/article/GOP-wins-in-NY-House-race-seen-as-Obama-rebuke-2167085.php

[ChandlerJr]

15. No biggie

It's not like there is a big ex-NY Jewish vote in a place like Florida to exploit or anything.

[Leonardo Da Biker]

39. Actually, yes there is

Florida has one of the largest Jewish populations in the U.S.

[No Elephants]

61. Perhaps Chandler opted to omit the sarcasm emote?

[Grassy Knoll]

18. They took NV as well........

The Hate for Obama is so thick here in Reno, I can't even put A DU sticker
on my car unless I want it vandalized.

[totodeinhere]

21. Yup, Amodei is winning by 20 points. If you think it's bad in Reno come to Elko. n/t

[Wabbajack_]

23. Looks like

our woman only lost Reno by 10 points. The rest of the district....is like Idaho I guess.

[jeff47]

102. It's not so much "take" when they already had the seat

NV-2 became empty when Ensign's replacement was appointed. It was already a Republican seat in a R+5 district.

[blkmusclmachine]

25. More 11-Dimensional Bull$h!t Chess Games:

We just can't see the "brilliance" of LOSING, LOSING, LOSING. Wait 'til 2012--I predict a massacre like 1980. Welcome, Pres. Perry and VP Palin. Your Theocracy is waiting.

[tcaudilllg]

31. I'm sick of your cynicism.

"America is going down. America is in decline. America is becoming a theocracy."

Blah blah blah blah.

[Grassy Knoll]

27. Drudge Report Headline:

REVENGE OF THE JEWS; DEM SEAT TURNS IN NYC

[Behind the Aegis]

29. Read something similar here; though not as obvious or crass.

[Name removed]

33. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Behind the Aegis]

37. You think it is?

Put down your copy of The Protocols and join the rest of humanity in reality.

[tcaudilllg]

69. I think Benji Neti has something other than America's interest at heart. n/t

[Behind the Aegis]

70. And he is not voting, now is he? (Nor is he orthodox.)

[tcaudilllg]

75. He's the one benefitting from the community's tough stance with Obama, regardless.

Did you not read the article? A conservative Dem has called on Obama to lie down and behave as Likud's lapdog. That's the insane nutter I was referring to, not Werpin.

[Behind the Aegis]

77. Your remarks are beyond absurd and reek of "Jew conspiracy."

Seriously, put down your "Protocols" book!

[tcaudilllg]

80. I don't have one.

And it's not a Jew conspiracy... it's just people putting the interests of one nation over another, in this case Israel over the U.S..

[Behind the Aegis]

82. Do you even have a lick of proof?

[tcaudilllg]

What that the con Dem wants subordination to Israel? It's what he requested.

[Behind the Aegis]

85. Let's see the proof, not your "claim."

Let's see some quotes.

ETA: And who is the "con" Dem?

[tcaudilllg]

90. You're ignored.

[Behind the Aegis]

91. And you're not.

I will continue to watch for more of your anti-Semitic remarks.

Edit: spelling error

[girl_interrupted]

50. David Weprin (D) is an Orthodox Jew

and a really nice guy. And guess what? So are a lot of Orthodox Jews. Was sorry to see him lose tonight. I'm not Jewish, but I think your comment is offensive. You have helluva way to get voters to come to your side.

[tcaudilllg]

67. He can be an orthodox jew if he wants.

But when he puts his faith before the national interest, all bets are off.

[tcaudilllg]

68. Seperation of church and state, remember? Let us not by hypocrites and look the other way when Dems

violate that sacred trust.

[Behind the Aegis]

71. And how has he done that?

Or is it all Jews which must pass the litmus test of "national interest before faith?"

[tcaudilllg]

81. Sound policy before faith? Sounds like a winner.

[Behind the Aegis]

84. That "wooshing" sound is the point going over your head.

[kelly1mm]

65. But that one particular district is heavily Orthodox Jewish. Don't they get to vote

their perceived interests? Shouldn't the party have seen this coming when putting up someone who does not live in the district and recently voted for marriage equality in the NY Assembly? Not to smart with the demographics of the district.

[tcaudilllg]

66. Hmm... why would a single district have most of the state's Orthodox Jews?

No I don't think they get to vote their interests. Their lobby is illegitimate because it has been unfairly created specifically to empower them.

[Behind the Aegis]

73. So Orthodox Jews shouldn't get to vote?

How democratic of you. :eyes:

"Their lobby is illegitimate because it has been unfairly created specifically to empower them."

What the fuck does that even mean?!

[tcaudilllg]

83. Do you really think they have a district all to themselves just by chance? n/t

[Behind the Aegis]

86. They don't. Well, except in your imgination.

[leftynyc]

93. Who the fuck are you

to tell people what their interests should be? Your statement about the lobby is absolutley moronic. What about the NRA, AARP? Think they should be disolved because they were specifically created to empower the pro-gun, pro-senior people? Or it just the Jews that are the devils here? Are you even thinking out what you're saying?

[tcaudilllg]

72. Finally, the founders never dreamed that congressional votes

would be the tools of foreign military lobbies. The status of Israel has nothing to do with the local interests of that district.

[Behind the Aegis]

74. You think all of them voted in the interest of Israel?

The (D) candidate was also pro-Israel, so that ignorant argument falls flat on its bigoted head.

[Spider Jerusalem]

136. The Democratic candidate may have been pro-Israel

the Democratic candidate also voted in favour of gay marriage, which doesn't go over well among the ultra-Orthodox. And the GOP candidate campaigned very hard to tie Obama's position on Israel to the Democratic candidate by virtue of party affiliation. Arguing that to some extent this election was not a referendum in this one district on the administration's Israel policy is nothing more than wilful ignorance. It is not bigoted or anti-Jewish to recognise that foreign policy concerns regarding Israel are significant to many voters in this district, nor is it bigoted to recognise that religiously based opposition to gay marriage also played some role.

[kelly1mm]

76. Shouldn't the voters of that district get to decide what is important to them

and vote however they choose based on that choice? Even if your premise is true, what would you propose be done about it? Nobody can stop them from voting.

[tcaudilllg]

87. Presumably powerful foreign lobbies are to avoided

in so far as they can turn elections. So the gerrymandering should be to such effect that they are spread out a little.

It's as good a criterion for district drawing as any.

[leftynyc]

94. Adn which foreign lobby

are you babbling about?

[tcaudilllg]

112. Ignored.

[leftynyc]

113. Just as I expected

How pathetic you are.

[girl_interrupted]

95. Yes, Same way Rangel's district brought him back despite calls from Dems to resign

Despite what the Democratic leadership wanted, and that was for Rangel to go away, he didn't, and ran for re-election and won again in 2010.

This seat (Weiner's) should have been left alone. Instead of the calls for resignation, it should have been left up to the voters who put Weiner in office, to vote him out, and that wasn't done. Starting in 1999 up to 2011 Weiner won 7 terms in NY9.

So for the 1st time since 1920, a republican won in NY9.

Dumb move by our leadership.

[kelly1mm]

78. Since both candidates are pro Israel, I think the marriage vote is what

pissed the Orthodox Jewish vote off. Also that not living in the district thing????? WTF?

[Name removed]

88. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[girl_interrupted]

89. Trouble is, Dems lost in Nevada too

If anyone sounds like a Nazi, it's you.

[ProgressoDem]

30. Why don't we just only have special elections?

Oh wait - they seem to end up with the most backwards results and give the district in question the opposite representation they ought to have. More evidence our system is completely F-ed up.

[Fearless]

32. Dems stayed home because of a shitty candidate... why does this sound familiar...

:banghead:

The best thing this president can do for our nation is LBJ the thing and let a real Democrat energize our voting base.

[No Elephants]

59. Dems need to stop staying home, especially when the alleged alternative is

a shitty candidate who lives in a "restricted" community.

Why any one, regardless of religion, would have voted for Turner is beyond me.

Anyway, staying home does only harm.

[BlueStater]

35. How do we fix the problems currently going on in this country?

By putting the fucking morons who started them in the first place back in office! Great idea! :puke:

[tblue]

36. Yeah that. And keep doing what we're doing.

We don't have the mo. We are not winning hearts and minds. Anyone who thinks we are on the path to electoral success next year better wake up. And that includes the president.

We can win, but not like this.

[Leonardo Da Biker]

40. If there is no presidential primary

we will not be seeing another four years. Wake up and read the writing on the wall people. If we run the same horse again we will lose the white house too. That horse has won all the races he is ever going to win.

[Kablooie]

41. This may very well potend the future election.

I don't believe that most swing voters examine candidate's qualities and vote for the most capable man.

If they are dissatisfied with the current party they vote for the other and if they are dissatisfied with the current candidate they simply vote for the alternate.

I read that the Republicans are not worried about losing the House and the only Senate seats that are in danger are Democrats.

Combine that with the overwhelming dissatisfaction with Obama's weak leadership there is a very real threat that the Republican, whoever he is, will take over the presidency.

We may have effectively a 100% Republican government at the beginning of 2013.

It's going to be a wild ride and may end with all the cars coming off the tracks.



whee

[Kablooie]

42. This may very well potend the future election.

I don't believe that most swing voters examine candidate's qualities and vote for the most capable man.

If they are dissatisfied with the current party they vote for the other and if they are dissatisfied with the current candidate they simply vote for the alternate.

I read that the Republicans are not worried about losing the House and the only Senate seats that are in danger are Democrats.

Combine that with the overwhelming dissatisfaction with Obama's weak leadership there is a very real threat that the Republican, whoever he is, will take over the presidency.

We may have effectively a 100% Republican government at the beginning of 2013.

It's going to be a wild ride and may end with all the cars coming off the tracks.



whee

[gateley]

55. You're right -- the party that's in power either benefits or pays the price.

We may be paying the price even though it wasn't of our doing.

That's how it goes. Sigh. :(

[No Elephants]

63. That's only how it goes if people are unhappy. We had almost unbroken

Democratic control of Congress from FDR until 1980.

Time for a return to classical Democratic principles. No more DLC types.

[gateley]

107. When they're happy they keep those in power. Look at the

Senators who get reelected time after time. Their constituents may not be aware of what they've done or if they've actually benefitted, but if they haven't been screwed they'll keep electing him/her.

So I think it works both ways. If we were on a stronger road to recovery, I'd feel less uneasy about the 2012 elections.

[JoeyT]

108. Well thank god we forced him to resign.

If we hadn't it might have gotten messy.

No one could have predicted this. Except for all the people that did, of course, but that doesn't count.

[andym]

116. So where is our progressive majority?

So where is our vaunted progressive majority?

Foe example,
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

[No Elephants]

142. I clicked on both those links and got "web page could not be found."

Also, I have no clue what "progressive" means.

By "progressive," do you mean liberal, or at least, classic, populist Democrats?

Or, by "progressive," do you mean "progressive," as in Progressive Policy Institute, "the place for pragmatic progressives," founded by Will Marshall, who was a founding member of the Democratic Leadership and one of two original DLC employees and who, in 2003, joined neocon Republicans in signing the PNAC memo and takes credit for helping mold people like Tony Blair into a DLC mold?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Democratic_Leadership_Council

http://progressivepolicy.org/

http://progressivepolicy.org/about-us/who-we-are

http://www.dlc.org/ndol_ci.cfm?contentid=1131&kaid=86&subid=191

http://www.dlc.org/ndol_ci.cfm?contentid=255026&kaid=85&subid=108

[Arkana]

117. Obama might have a bad approval rating in the district, but if Anthony Weiner hadn't

texted his dick to that girl he'd still be in Congress and we wouldn't be having this conversation.

I love how eager everyone is to blame Obama, though.

[socialshockwave]

119. It was consensual; stupid, but Weiner had enough support

to win a re-election if he had stayed.

IT was the whole "OMG A MAN TEXTED A PENIS TO ARMS, WOMEN EVERYWHERE!"

[No Elephants]

144. Weiner texted, but he wanted to keep his seat and his voters wanted him. Please see Reply 60

As far as "blaming Obama.'

Obama is the head of the Democratic Party. As such, among other things, he hires--and can fire-- the head of the DNC and commands a great deal of Party loyalty and obedience, whether anyone wants to admit that or not.

Who do you think was behind Debbie Wasserman Schulty and other prominent Democrats, including, of all ironic people, Bill Clinton, speaking out on a daily basis against Weiner until Weiner finally resigned? Who said to America that, in Weiner's place, he would resign?

Dems should have simply said, "No comment" or

"This is, first and foremost, a family matter. As far as we know, Representative Weiner has broken no laws. Therefore, it's up to him and voters, just as it was with Senator Vitter and many others."

Or, at the very least, "As far as we know, Representative Weiner has broken no laws. Therefore, it is a matter for Representative Weinere, voters and the House Ethics Committee. The House Ethics Committee has said it will look into this and we should all reserve comment until that process has been completed."

So, yes, I surely do blame Weiner for sexting while married to a woman who was carrying his child, but that is not why Turner is now in that seat.

For Turner, I sure do blame the Democratic Party and its head for hounding Weiner out of office for no good reason, when Clinton and Vitter, who actually broke laws, got either vigorous support or, at least, silence from Democrats.