Records show agents fired beanbags in fatal border gunfight

[nalnn]

Source: Arizona Daily Star

Border Patrol agents shot beanbags at a group of suspected bandits before the men returned fire during a confrontation in a remote canyon, killing agent Brian Terry with a single gunshot, records show.

And an illegal immigrant wounded in the gunbattle who is now the only person in custody linked to the slaying contends he never fired a shot, according to FBI search warrant requests filed in the U.S. District Court in Tucson.

The documents provide the most detailed version yet of what happened in the deadly gunbattle Dec. 14 in Peck Canyon, northwest of Nogales.

The documents say the group of illegal border entrants refused commands to drop their weapons after agents confronted them at about 11:15 p.m. Two agents fired beanbags at the migrants, who responded with gunfire. Two agents returned fire, one with a long gun and one with a pistol, but Terry was mortally wounded in the gunfight.

Read more: http://azstarnet.com/news/local/crime/article_681d29cf-845a-5aea-9f34-3837d70b8a31.html

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Question: Are the bean bag rifles the only arms these agents had? Are they equipped with weapons that can fire either bean bags or bullets?

[TheWraith]

1. The article shows that they had other weapons.

"Two agents returned fire, one with a long gun and one with a pistol"

"Beanbag" type rounds can only be fired from shotguns, usually modified specifically for use with non-lethal rounds. I'm not sure whether they could still fire regular lethal shotgun ammo. However, the pistol would definitely not be firing non-lethal rounds.

[Kennah]

2. Borders Agents are cops who have real guns that go bang

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Border_Patrol#Equipment

Most LEOs in the U.S. carry Tasers, and I suspect that in the environment where most Border Agents operate the bean bag guns make more sense--a less than lethal level of force with greater range than a Taser.

[Maine_Nurse]

3. Wow, that was pretty stupid.

[Kennah]

4. Not necessarily

I suspect most Border Agents know they are usually arresting and deporting people looking for a better life, not Public Enemy #1.

[Maine_Nurse]

5. Uhhh, those people were armed, which is why the agents ordered them to drop the weapons.

I could see it (although you shouldn't be shooting anyone that isn't a threat, even with beanbags) if it was just some people crossing, but when you already know they are armed, time to put away the non-lethal options and be prepared to defend yourself. My kid is a deputy and I'd kick his ass if he ever did something that stupid.

[Kennah]

6. Politics affects LEAs

I'm suggesting it's possible this wasn't a case of stupid Border Agents.

This is all "what if", but they might have been chastised in the past not to appear too "confrontational".

[Maine_Nurse]

7. Agreed, but to engage an armed enemy with LTL weaponry was not smart. Either...

do the real thing if you think its justified, or GTFO.

[Kennah]

8. People get justifiably shot while wielding a knife or an impact weapon ...

... so the Border Agents were clearly justified in shooting.

However, use of force is not something which responds well to bureaucratic intervention. "Rules of Engagement" aren't appropriate for LE, but I think the concept sometimes creeps in.

An overzealous supervisor may have admonished agents not to appear "too aggressive". They might have made strong indications that "we'd prefer that you use the bean bag guns".

All speculation on my part, but I'm loath to blame dead cops.

[Maine_Nurse]

9. Oh definitely justified, and I agree it is sad either way. Sometimes you have to say screw the boss