STOCK MARKET WATCH, Friday September 17

[ozymandius]

Source: du

STOCK MARKET WATCH, Friday September 17, 2010

AT THE CLOSING BELL ON September 16, 2010

Dow 10,594.83 +22.10 (+0.21%)
Nasdaq 2,303.25 +1.93 (+0.08%)
S&P 500 1,124.66 -0.41 (-0.04%)
Gold future... 1,283 +9.00 (+0.71%)
10-Yr Bond... 2.79 +0.02 (+0.80%)
30-Year Bond 3.94 +0.01 (+0.31%)

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Market Conditions During Trading Hours

Euro, Yen, Loonie, Silver and Gold

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Handy Links - Videos:
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    William Black: This Economic Disaster    Bill Moyers with Kevin Drum and David Corn

Bush Administration Officials Convicted = 2
Names: David Safavian, James Fondren

Bush Administration Officials Charged = 1
Name(s): Richard Lopez Razo

Financial Sector Officials Convicted since 1/20/09 = 11

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This thread contains opinions and observations. Individuals may post their experiences, inferences and opinions on this thread. However, it should not be construed as advice. It is unethical (and probably illegal) for financial recommendations to be given here.

Read more: du

[ozymandius]

1. Today's Reports

Briefing.com is down. Here is Bloomberg's listing of economic reports instead.

Consumer Price Index
8:30 AM ET
CPI - M/M change
Prior 0.3 %
Consensus 0.3 %

Consumer Sentiment
9:55 AM ET
Prior 68.9
Consensus 70.0

http://noir.bloomberg.com/markets/ecalendar/index.html

[ozymandius]

13. Briefing is back.

08:30 CPI Aug
Briefing.com 0.1%
Consensus 0.2%
Prior 0.3%

08:30 Core CPI Aug
Briefing.com 0.1%
Consensus 0.1%
Prior 0.1%

09:55 Mich Sentiment Sep
Briefing.com 70.0
Consensus 70.0
Prior 68.9

http://www.briefing.com/Investor/Public/Calendars/EconomicCalendar.htm

[Ghost Dog]

46. US August CPI rises more than expected

NEW YORK, Sept 17 (Reuters) - U.S. consumer prices increased slightly more than expected in August as food prices rebounded and energy costs remained elevated, but core prices were flat, a government report showed on Friday.

/... http://www.finanznachrichten.de/nachrichten-2010-09/17991747-instant-view-3-us-august-cpi-rises-more-than-expected-020.htm

[jtuck004]

2. What an appropriate cartoon for today. 1 in 7 in poverty.

43.6 million people of our neighbors.

[ozymandius]

4. It says so much about what is wrong with supply-side economics.

The attitude being: "I got mine. So everything is fine."

[ozymandius]

5. Census: 1 in 7 Americans lives in poverty

WASHINGTON – The ranks of the working-age poor climbed to the highest level since the 1960s as the recession threw millions of people out of work last year, leaving one in seven Americans in poverty.

The overall poverty rate climbed to 14.3 percent, or 43.6 million people, the Census Bureau said Thursday in its annual report on the economic well-being of U.S. households. The report covers 2009, President Barack Obama's first year in office.

The poverty rate increased from 13.2 percent, or 39.8 million people, in 2008.

The share of Americans without health coverage rose from 15.4 percent to 16.7 percent — or 50.7 million people — mostly because of the loss of employer-provided health insurance during the recession. Congress passed a health overhaul this year to address the rising numbers of uninsured people, but its main provisions will not take effect until 2014.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100917/ap_on_bi_ge/us_census_poverty

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Poverty increased among all observable groups and income fell at all levels -except- the top 2% income bracket.

[florida08]

19. are you as worried as I am ozy?

It feels like our country is dying..slowly, painfully. Yet the right is so consumed with hatred for Obama and democrats they willfully ignore the obvious..to the point of speeding up the downfall. The unemployment numbers are reaching the stats of the Great one. The trade deficits are much worse now than then. They say we began coming out of the 30's breadlines in about 4 years although the effects lasted for about 10 or a little longer. Friedman blamed the fed because of the gold standard..but that just doesn't seem to be true in this scenario.

It's the same problem now that it was then. Income inequality and lost assets like jobs, pensions,housing and savings. Treasury bonds continue to drop. The PPT/free market is not only moronic but criminal. The coming inflation won't be kind. Is there a way through?

[ozymandius]

23. I don't have an answer to your last question.

This is uncharted territory. We now experience similar personal dynamics like debt-to-income ratios and rampant unemployment at the levels that reflect the worst episodes going back eighty years. Despite the similarities, the economic structures have been altered dramatically in the past thirty years. Remedies are elusive because so much has changed - even the mechanisms for correcting wretched unemployment.

Sentiment remains a big issue. We are still so sentimental over the Reagan era and the disastrous economic policies his presidency established. Obama cannot even say an unkind word about the supply-side nonsense because it is so closely tied to the Reagan legacy. Criticism of Reagan-the-icon invites ferocious attacks even among Democratic partisans who suffer from selective amnesia from the Reagan years.

Just as Reagan inscribed his 'X' on every document that enacted his horrible economic policies, Friedman was right there beside him, guiding his hand. Friedman was a monetarist. Criticism of him and his policies has been dim whereas he deserves painfully bright and scathing rebuke. We still pursue monetarist remedies for the deregulatory zeal Reagan championed. We need to get past these past thirty years and recognize them for what they were: mistakes. Stupid mistakes.

On an upwards note - we appear to be strangely fortunate in that the vast quantitative easing from the Fed has not made the United States into another Zimbabwe. International agreements between entities and the United States appear to have stalled inflation for the moment.

[AnneD]

37. Morning Marketeers.....

:donut: and lurkers. I am at work today even though we are off. I have so much to do in so little a time that I came today to try to catch up. So I am taking a moment to post and I don't give a damn if they read this or not. My project-going through the kids shot records and target those that need them. My impediment-our piece of shit computer program that we have been dealing with for 5 years that can't read the data properly, drops it, mis-reads it. It wasn't a problem in the past because most Nurses threw up their hand, ignores it, or left their jobs screaming. Well, now the state is putting heat on our district and they are putting heat on us. I want to immunize those that need it but I don't want to pincushion these kids unnecessarily. The city of Houston will come out to catch us up at the end of this month so I am working hard to get as accurate a count as I can. What a fresh hell.:evilfrown:

Poverty in America. As a School Nurse in the inner city, I feel that I have more knowledge than most. I see the effects come into my clinic every day. Kids that don't have breakfast come in to the clinic from 9 on until they have the free lunch. Kids come in from 1 on with headaches because they haven't or can't get glasses because their parents are the working poor. Now we do have some angel docs that help me get glasses but they do it out of their own pockets and out of the goodness of their heart. The rest of the time I have kids that have unmet dental needs that lead to other problems (behavior,learning, etc because it is hard to focus when you are in pain).

And then I have the kids that are raising themselves because their parents are working so long and hard at a minimum slave wage job just to keep a roof over the head, a little food in the house and gas in the tank to get to work. Their doctor of choice is the local emergency room. They are angry, angry and the lash out. They are teens that see things on TV and see how some people live and they don't even come close. They see the nice shoe and clothes, but they shop at the dollar store-Wal-mart and Target are up scale to them. They have on raggedy chain supermarket that doesn't even have the same decent selection that they do at other chain stores. Their eat out choices all involve deep frying chicken or fish. We do have a few small chinese and vietnamese places that have more of a variety, but not much.

These kids know they are getting the short end of the stick. Thank God for the churches, grannies, grandpas and aunties. They are trying to hold it together but they are old and tired from a lifetime of hard work. We have developer eying the land with lust on their mind and greed in their heart. This is the last cheap property in this city and it is only a matter of time. And then where will this community, these kids go.

And this is poverty just in this area. I haven't even covered the neuvo poor middle class.

Happy hunting and watch out for the bears.

[florida08]

45. admire what you do

and I'm afraid that the situations you've described will become more of the norm. Am absolutey shocked to see this country actually advocate this kind existance. You make a difference in an overbearing society.

[JNelson6563]

48. Always good to see you AnneD

Even when your posts contain heartbreaking stuff. You are a grand Dame. :toast:

Julie

[AnneD]

53. Thanks for the support....

You are right, Nursing will break your heart in more ways than you ever thought possible. And School Nursing...I sometimes feel like I am on the Tiatanic, listening to the band playing while I scoop out the water with my tiny bucket. I just can't figure how people can miss seeing the big picture.

[DemReadingDU]

116. The kids are fortunate to have you looking after them

Thanks for all you do
:hug:

[wordpix]

72. story: after I got a big FU from a scary road rage man b/c I stopped car for an emergency vehicle

with siren wailing, I passed through a scary part of DC that I bet no one in Congress ever goes to. It was scary b/c there were a lot of people on the street, doing nothing except hanging out in the middle of a weekday. I thought, "This is not right."

[Po_d Mainiac]

25. But you are ignoring the real important issues

Flag burning
School prayer
Mosque construction
American Idol
French Open
PGA tour
Any new gadget from Apple
:sarcasm:

[florida08]

27. (smiling)

thanks for that..I am very worried about Lindsey Lohan :crazy:

[DemReadingDU]

26. We are moving into deflation, not inflation

Think of inflation as lots of credit. Anyone with a credit card can purchase just about anything with a credit card.

Deflation is the opposite. Credit gets harder to come by. The limit to purchase things using credit, is lowered and possibly canceled.

Prices can go up and down whether we are in inflation or deflation...supply and demand.

In the ongoing deflation, people will need cash dollars to purchase things because more businesses will not accept credit cards.

If people don't have cash, anything and everything will seem expensive. No matter how cheap something might be, if you don't have cash, it will seem expensive.

[florida08]

30. have a little cash

but everything seems expensive. Yes..we were in the negatives last year. My house value has dropped so what does the mayor do? Increase property taxes. Electricity and water rates too. So while purchasing power may rise as prices fall the state government will be forced to seek revenue elsewhere which kinda puts the kibosh on consumer spending. I actually hate going to the grocery store anymore. TV dinners aren't looking too bad right now. ;)

[DemReadingDU]

35. There are people who no longer pay their bills

They stop making the mortgage payment, they don't pay their property taxes, nor electric nor nor water bills. So what do cities do? They raise rates on those of us who still pay their bills. In effect, we taxpayers are making the payments for those who don't.


Edit: Oil prices go up, thereby increasing transportation costs which will increase prices of foods delivered to the groceries. I feel we are on the merry-go-round and can't get off.

[AnneD]

41. The most crowded restaurant...

I have seen on a week night was a local hot dog chain restaurant that was celebrating their 87th year in biz by offering chili dogs for $0.87. But even at that it was not crowded. It is so sad when an eating out 'treat' means an 87 cent chili dog.

[florida08]

47. you have it

Health insurance too. It's the spiral of Dante's Inferno

[jtuck004]

68. We were driving home from Idaho a few months back

listening to NPR. They were doing a report on a some teabaggers at a rally. One lady they interviewed made it perfectly clear that
she considered the destruction of the United States economy or our political system quite accepatable to save us from a)Obama b)Democrats.

Since that time I have spoken to a few others who evince the same notion. They literally would vote in people that would kill the country, just to see Obama, and perhaps the democrats, gone. I have asked them more in depth - some get social security, one was actually a government employee, but they all stand to lose terribly if something like that happens.

They don't care. They think killing the patient to save them is an acceptable choice. Incredible.

[AnneD]

88. If it wouldn't be so horrible for the rest of the country....

I would love to have them experience what they advocate for just a week and see what they learn. I have met many a person that went through a life altering event that came out sining a different tune. It can be very humbling and enlightening.

[jtuck004]

89. Absolutely. n/t

[ozymandius]

3. Oil rises above $75 as stock markets advance

SINGAPORE – Oil prices rose above $75 a barrel Friday in Asia as regional stock markets rose and investors looked to U.S. economic indicators for signs crude demand may be improving.

Oil prices have traded near $75 a barrel for most of the past year as the global economy emerges from last year's recession, but crude demand remains weak in developed countries. Crude traders pay close attention to U.S. economic indicators to shed light on oil consumption and to stock markets as a barometer of overall investor sentiment. Most Asian and European stock markets were higher Friday.

Economic news Thursday suggested the U.S. economy is stabilizing, but growth may be sluggish. The Labor Department said first-time claims for unemployment benefits fell to a two-month low last week of 450,000. The Producer Price Index, which indicates prices at the wholesale level, rose more than expected last month, easing concerns about deflation.

In other Nymex trading in October contracts, heating oil was up 1.47 cents at $2.114 a gallon and gasoline gained 2.02 cents to $1.945 a gallon. Natural gas was steady at $4.065 per 1,000 cubic feet.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/oil_prices

[ozymandius]

6. Senate passes small business aid, in victory for Obama

WASHINGTON (AFP) – The US Senate Thursday passed a bill providing billions of dollars in aid and tax benefits to small businesses, handing a victory to President Barack Obama in his bid to rekindle economic growth.

The bill, which had been held up for weeks by Republicans using procedural tactics, passed by a vote of 61 to 38.

Two Republican senators, George Voinovich and George LeMieux, joined the Democratic majority in voting for the bill, which most Republicans argued was yet another government-sponsored bailout.

The House of Representatives, which adopted a similar measure in June, is expected to pass the Senate version of the bill to send to the president.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20100916/ts_alt_afp/uspoliticseconomybusiness

[ozymandius]

7. SEC eyes new rules on banks' debt-level disclosure

WASHINGTON – Federal regulators are set to propose new rules that could make it harder for financial firms to disguise their level of debt.

The expanded disclosure requirements would apply to banks' practice of temporarily trimming their debt at the end of quarters to make their financial statements appear stronger. The practice is legal but regulators say it can give investors a distorted picture of a bank's debt and level of risk.

Lehman Brothers used so-called repurchase agreements as an accounting trick in the months before its collapse into the biggest bankruptcy in U.S. history two years ago. The demise of the Wall Street titan triggered a panic in financial markets.

The term "window dressing" to sometimes used to describe the practice of big banks and financial firms sweeping away debt at quarter's end, then buying back the assets and building up debt again in a new quarter.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100917/ap_on_bi_ge/us_sec_banks

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It's about damn time this happens. It barely skirts Sarbanes-Oxley disclosure rules that require quarterly statements to be factual about a publicly traded company's financial status.

[Po_d Mainiac]

21. So once the SEC proposes

The banksters just send out their army of lobbyists, en-masse. If the rule is actually adopted, the banks will get the same terms of Basel III. Just buy the banks stocks and trust the CEO's to safeguard your investment.:sarcasm:

Banks don't even have to worry about being shuttered anymore. Mary's crew are working with little more than pocket change.

So many distressed institutions, so little money.

Explains the breakout of PM's

[Demeter]

8. Exporting Jobs, Importing Workers

http://www.truth-out.org/jim-hightower-exporting-jobs-importing-workers63319

Maybe you're one of the thousands of young lawyers in America working in some low-skill, part-time job because law firms have cut so many of the starting positions you were educated to take. If so, I have good news: Jobs for young lawyers are now mushrooming in companies that provide legal services to U.S. corporations.

Unfortunately, you'll have to move to India to get one. And the pay will be -- how shall I put this? -- "disappointing."

Lawyering has become the latest category of good jobs disappearing from our Land of the Free, as corporate chieftains continue to offshore the American workplace. The average student loan debt for a recent law school graduate is upward of $100,000, and now law school grads are finding that jobs are scarce -- especially since Wall Street banks, insurance corporations, mining giants and others are shipping more and more of their law business to Pangea3, CPA Global, UnitedLex and other rapidly expanding legal outsourcing outfits in India...

[Demeter]

9. In Germany's Case, Up Means Down PAUL KRUGMAN

http://www.truth-out.org/in-germanys-case-up-means-down63307

Many people are pointing to the German economy's recent upturn as solid proof that austerity measures work.

But this is a foolish argument.

The austerity policies will not come into effect until 2011 — at the moment, economic policy is actually quite Keynesian...

GRAPHIC PORN AND LOTS OF HARD DATA!

[ozymandius]

16. What works there does not mean it works here.

Germany and the United States have very different economic models. To the uninitiated who engage in public policy debates- ignorance of this concept is a very dangerous thing.

I heard a story on NPR yesterday in which a conservative candidate for Congress (take your pick because I do not remember the name) opined the best way to fight persistent joblessness is to lower taxes (of course) and to reduce government spending.

NO! NO! NO! NO! NO! BAD! BAD! BAD!

Bad--stupid--politician. That is the worst way to address our current circumstances. We should in fact be doing the exact opposite with tax rates targeting those who are able to contribute more to the public fund (i.e. the über wealthy).

You may be able to tell how positions like this and the simplistic reasoning behind them infuriate me. A dummy like the one on the radio will recognize one successful austerity story and consider it a one-size-fits-all approach to every problem because they are in love with austerity. Never do they seem to consider the underlying causes of the problems we face and how one nation's sickness can be different from that of another.

[bread_and_roses]

38. Speaking of NPR, I too have a question about a story yesterday on "Small Business" owner taxation

Story highlighted "small business" person who's company earned about a million in "profit" but the owner accounted the profit as "personal income" so would be hit if tax cuts for rich expired - and the owner says that since the "profit" actually goes into business - new equipment and such - it would hurt his business and "cost jobs" - so of course, making the tax increase of personal income a "bad" thing for economy.

Now, I realize that for a business a million is not "a lot" but are there not other ways that a small business can file its earnings? And a multitude of tax write-offs, depreciation and such, that businesses use to distinguish "profit" from repair, new investment, etc? Are not those sorts of things "expenses" rather than profit? Would it be accounting the business income as "personal income" that would make those breaks unavailable? Don't we have - and just passed more - all sorts of tax breaks for small business income? So, there must be some advantage to this owner to accounting the business income as "personal" income?

So does he want to have his cake and eat it too?

[jtuck004]

91. I think his accounting is suspect

First of all, it's probably not a sole-proprietorship (even so, cash in the bank of a sole-proprietorship might still be there to buy material goods, tools, pay salaries, etc, so it couldn't be considered as and taxed as ordinary income). With a million dollars on the line that would be a huge risk for liability, so it is probably a corporation. The money is not taxed as income until he is written a paycheck.

And, frankly, if he is getting a million in salary while 30 million people need work for which there is no demand, and most especially while 85% of the privately held assets of the country are held by just 20% of the people and at the same time 1 in 7 people are living in poverty, and while tens of thousands of people older than 50 have worked the last job they will ever have and the PTB threatening to increase the age at which they can get the only help (Social Security) that they can look forward to, he is just being selfish. And selfish is not a good foundation for policy.

Why the Dems don't put Warren Buffet on tv and tell people that if HE, with all his money, thinks that higher taxes would be more equitable, then other people making near a million dollars a year or more should be ashamed to not pay their FAIR share.

[florida08]

20. exactly

Thom Hartmann talked about this a few months ago. It's where the stimulus should have went imo.

This is partly due to the kurzarbeit program of work-sharing — a system in which the government subsidizes most of a worker's salary if his hours are cut.

[Demeter]

10. Good Morning Ozy and All!

What shall this weekend bring? With the extra work I've been doing this week, my imagination is kaput. Theme? Artist? Suggestions?

[ozymandius]

11. Good morning.

:donut: :donut: :donut: Lately, thoughts of Andy Griffith and Don Knotts have crossed my mind. From "No Time for Sergeants" to "The Andy Griffith Show" and the wonderful solo work Griffith produced with his highly simplified 'explanations' of "Romeo and Juliet" and "Hamlet."

Just a suggestion.

[Demeter]

15. Those Are Unfamiliar to Me

Don Knots as the Incredible Mr. Limpet is the extent of my exposure...I never cared for Mayberry, no doubt too hick for a big city girl.

[ozymandius]

31. Andy Griffith - Football

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aKSo7QO7ceo

[florida08]

40. lol

Barney Fife: Oh, you're just full of fun today, aren't you? Why don't we go up to the old people's home and wax the steps?

Floyd Lawson: You know, everyone complains about the weather but nobody does anything about it. Calvin Coolidge said that.
Andy Taylor: No, Floyd, that wasn't Calvin Coolidge that said that, it was Mark Twain.
Floyd Lawson: Then what did Calvin Coolidge say?

[TalkingDog]

66. Emancipation Proclamation

(Barney) “Emancipation proclamation was a proclamation, is what it was”
(Andy) What was it about?
(Barney) “It was about Emancipation !!! What do you think it was about? Use your head man !! Its common knowledge” There was these folks. And how else was they gonna get themselves emancipated, unless there was a proclamation.” “So they got themselves a proclamation, and they called it “The Emancipation Proclamation” I’m surprised at you for not knowing that Andy !! And I’ll tell you something else.” “I’m even more surprised that you think I don’t know about the Emancipation Proclamation”

[florida08]

69. hahahhaha

[TalkingDog]

67. My absolute favorite Barney speech: Selfish Giraffes

(Opie has freed some dogs into a field and a thunderstorm is approaching)

Barney: Opie, you don't have to worry about 'em. What could happen?

Opie: Well, that lightning, what about that?

Barney: Oh, a dog can't get struck by lightning. You know why? Because he's too close to the ground. See, lightning strikes tall things. Now if they were giraffes out there, then we'd be in trouble. You sure don't have to worry about dogs. (Thunder)

Opie: I'm worried about 'em, Pa.

Andy: Ah..

Barney: What were dogs a million years ago, wild animals, right? Wolves, coyotes, they know how to hunt and fish and look for shelter. You take them two big Airedales. Why they looked as healthy as horses to me. And the little spotted one, he was in fine shape.

Opie: But the little one I first came in with, he was a trembler, wasn't he?

Barney: Him? why, the big ones will take care of him. The big ones take care of their own. (Thunder) And you know dogs have a way of keepin' dry. Ya know that, They're insulated, you see, they've got this fur...it keeps them cool in the summer and warm and dry in the winter. They're really set up better than human beings as far as that goes. (Thunder and lightning) And as far as the little one goes, why the big ones, they'll take care of him...the little trembly one...(Thunder) and they're short, you see, close to the ground, that way they can't get struck by lightning. Now if they wuz giraffes they'd have been hit by now, uh..., but dogs are short and they take care of their own. Giraffes don't. No, giraffes don't at all. Boy, giraffes are selfish, just run around looking out for number one, getting hit by lightning, but dogs....(Thunder) You just gonna sit there or you coming with me??

Andy: What?

Barney: To get them dogs, are you coming with me?

[florida08]

70. oh yeah

I remember that one well. One of my favorites too.

[ozymandius]

92. Oh! That's great!

"giraffes are selfish, just run around looking out for number one, getting hit by lightning" :rofl:

[TalkingDog]

64. What it wuz, wuz football....

hilarious.

Always loved that.

[Papa Boule]

44. No list of Andy Griffith's career highlights would be complete

without a mention of his performance as Lonesome Rhodes in "A Face in the Crowd."

[ozymandius]

12. Wall St futures rise, consumer sentiment data eyed

LONDON (Reuters) Futures for the Dow Jones industrial average, the S&P 500 and the Nasdaq 100 rise 0.8 percent to 1 percent, pointing to a stronger start on Wall Street on Friday.

Labor Department releases the August Consumer Price Index (CPI) at 1230 GMT. Economists in a Reuters survey expect a 0.2 percent increase compared with a 0.3 percent rise in July.

U.S. stocks were little changed on Thursday as mixed economic data and a cautious forecast from economic bellwether FedEx kept the market locked in its recent tight trading range.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20100917/bs_nm/us_markets_stocks

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This story contains information about many global companies.

[ozymandius]

14. Consumer Prices in U.S. Probably Rose, Confidence Strengthened

Sept. 17 (Bloomberg) -- The cost of living in the U.S. probably rose in August for a second month, easing concern that the cooling economy will cause a protracted drop in prices, economists said before a report today.

The consumer-price index increased 0.3 percent for a second month, according to the median forecast of 77 economists surveyed by Bloomberg News. Separate figures may show consumer confidence climbed in early September.

Some of the gain in optimism this month may be traced to higher stock prices. The Standard & Poor’s 500 Index has increased 7.2 percent since the end of August. Retailers’ shares have outpaced the broader market, with the S&P Supercomposite Retailing Index rising 10.6 percent this month through yesterday.

The report on consumer prices may show a gauge excluding volatile food and fuel costs, the so-called core rate, increased 0.1 percent for a second month, economists projected. From August 2009, the measure likely rose 1 percent following a 0.9 percent year-over-year gain in July.

http://noir.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&sid=abW5ql76.YYY&pos=3

[Po_d Mainiac]

50. Pssst

Mich Sentiment didn't quite move as expected...

I'm envisioning once green shoots that the dogs have taken turns pissing on.

[Demeter]

76. Believe Me, You Don't Want to Know What the Sentiment Is Out Here

Looks like the vulture capitalist from Ann Arbor (Libertarian) is gonna sweep the Governorship. It will be the end of the state if he does.

You'd think the rednecks would turn their noses up at any candidate from the People's Republic of Ann Arbor, as my uncle so charmingly named it....

Who knows? The Tea Party might as well have poured their tea all over the election. Things are that strange.

[Papa Boule]

17. Good morning everyone :) I have a question about currency

... and I really hope it's not a dumb one.

Which of these would be more likely to do the most harm to the world's confidence in the US dollar as the "flight to quality" currency:

Would it be runaway deflation -- huge increases in the purchasing power of the dollar (while dollars become harder to get)?

Or would it be runaway inflation -- the value of the dollar plummeting as the printing presses gush out billions and billions more of them?

(Thanks for all your welcomes yesterday, by the way. :) )

[Demeter]

18. Inflation Would Be Worse

Nobody respects toilet paper. Ask Zimbabwe.

The very worst for the US reputation world-wide is the erosion of America's organizing principles: the Constitution, bill of Rights, and all the treaties and traditions violated since Reagan. Gratuitous torture, denial of habeas corpus, rampant military weight-throwing, kidnapping and executions without trial in foreign ands, all this does NOTHING for the US. The class warfare waged on the little people by the Obscenely Wealthy and the Corporations is destroying more than the American Dream and the fruits of liberty, it is destroying the hopes of all peoples. If the US cannot defend its "brand" against the oppression of darkness, who can?

[Po_d Mainiac]

22. How about the answer being "yes"

Not sure where I read it but I liked the analogy.

The future could bring us the $20 BLT and another 25% drop in real-estate. Ow joy!

[DemReadingDU]

24. runaway inflation = hyperinflation

bad, bad, bad

Why would the wealthy want to use truckloads of their money to purchase expensive items?

"The Powers That Be" are already deflating the economy. The wealthy can use their wealth to purchase even more wealth at cheaper prices.

[ozymandius]

28. First, there is a difference between Price Inflation and Wage Inflation.

There is a corollary between the two. Wage Inflation is closely watched by the Fed in the form of Average Hourly Earnings. An increase in wages would dampen a nation's competitiveness against other nations. This, however, would have an inverse effect on interest rates. Rates tend to go up during periods of rising wage inflation. This strengthens a currency. As a result, a stronger dollar would mean that prices decline for imported products. This scenario also makes the dollar more attractive as a "safe haven" overseas.

Price inflation is indicative of a weak currency, whereas wages cannot keep up with the rising cost of living. Weak dollar equals weak demand overseas. This scenario can be considered punitive for people paid in $US.

Deflation is a different animal and the one the Fed fears the most. Deflation is internally damaging in three major ways: wages decrease significantly because spending falls; productivity falls (read: worker competitiveness) because of falling wages; the economy falls into recession and can quickly slip into a depression if these conditions persist. The Fed attacks Deflation with massive infusions of currency and dropping interest rates.

External damage to the nation's currency is exhibited in its value in the Forex markets. The Fed will flood the economy with money. The most common forms of this money are cheap corporate debt, block grants to states and stimulus programs (i.e. federal jobs programs). The Fed would take this drastic action on a wild bet that the economy can spark back to life before too much damage occurs to the currency which would culminate in price inflation while deflation symptoms persist in all other areas of the economy.

I invite anyone to add, correct and rephrase my comments.

[Papa Boule]

32. "flood the economy with money"

The Fed would take this drastic action on a wild bet that the economy can spark back to life before too much damage occurs to the currency which would culminate in price inflation while deflation symptoms persist in all other areas of the economy.

Quite a tightrope to walk.

[ozymandius]

34. That it is.

I would not want that stinkin' job. Even less - I would not want the stinkin' job of being President, who relies heavily on the monetary stewardship of the Fed for an economic legacy.

[Po_d Mainiac]

36. Exactly!

And this is where major policy failures for the last decade really bite us (US) in the ass.

The FED cannot use lower interest rates as a weapon....That magazine is out of ammo. FED policy fail

We are still highly dependent on foreign energy, and with the emergence of growth in Asia (and their increased use of the automobile) we are now competing with greater numbers for a finite resource. energy policy fail

We no longer produce the items consumed on a day-to-day basis (other than groceries) thanks to offshoring. Unless the rest of the world's economies deflate proportionally to the US, the U$D is going to lose additional purchasing power.trade policy fail

The only asset many people have is real-estate backed. It's also where most debt is concentrated. As the cost of imports (esp. oil) rise, domestic assets will come under even more price distress. national saving rate fail

This list could go on and on and on.........

[florida08]

43. that's it

Failure all around us. The usual shuck and jive is not going to work this time.

[Ghost Dog]

108. The list could go on, but that's an excellent, concise summary

of some of the most salient points, to my eye.

As regards energy policy, I'd add the relative failure in terms of development opportunities in new energy tech.

As regards trade policy, I'd foresee some concomitant deflation in the rest of the world as economies seek to preserve as much access to the shrinking US market as possible. The US will be looking inward, concentrating on the process of re-thinking, re-imaging and eventually, no doubt after much tearing-apart, re-designing and re-building itself. The US has the enormous advantage of its ability to feed itself, and what's more to do so completely organically, without fosssil-fuel inputs to natural soil cycles. And it will always comprise an enormous internal domestic market with, both in terms of resources and cultural capacity, enormous potential to regenerate itself. During this process, though, the rest of the world will be irresistably pulled into closer orbit around the rising Asian economic powers.

You will note that I see (donning my 'eco-philosophy' shiny hat) eventual capitulation to the necessity of adoption of ecologically-oriented economic systems throughout all societies on this planet. Note also that I speak not of political systems nor processes o0f change in this sphere and can only hope that the fabled four horsemen do not ride far.

Then, after catharsis, inevitable release.

[tclambert]

104. Wage inflation? Where can I sign up for some of that?

[Papa Boule]

29. Thanks for the responses. I thought it might be pretty simple.

And it is. No one would call an investment that rapidly loses value "quality" or a "safe hedge."

BTW I like it here. I'm moving in a few things and staying a while, hope you don't mind. I'll just put my recliner over (oof) here... and my Xbox and big screen over (uff) here... and I'll sleep on the sofa... and, oh, don't mind the trombone. I only play it at night.

[Po_d Mainiac]

39. What, no accordion?

:rofl:

[DemReadingDU]

42. Polka time

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qacs2hsOOcY

[florida08]

49. love it

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N4sqC4U7Ln8&feature=related

[DemReadingDU]

59. One of my sisters played accordion

long, long time ago, early 60's

[AnneD]

56. Did you hear about ...

the guy that accidently left his accordian in his car. When he went to get in his car, he noticed the window had been smashed. Nothing had been stolen but some had left 2 more accordians in the back seat. :spray:

[TalkingDog]

73. Ha!

I know a guy who wanted to learn to play guitar as a teen. His father bought him an accordion.

Needless to say there were parent/child "issues".

[alterfurz]

96. Q. What's the difference between an accordion and an onion?

A. No one cries if you cut up an accordion.

[florida08]

52. use to play alto sax

in high school..louie louie was a fav..

[Ghost Dog]

110. Tin-whistle, here.

:hippie:

[Po_d Mainiac]

115. Ow..Sax....nevermind n/t

[Demeter]

77. I Played Trombone, Too!

It helped develop lung capacity for arias (or was another way to use what capacity I had). Maybe we could pull a few duets...

[Dr.Phool]

80. I can play the radio.

But, I bought this synthesizer a couple of months ago. I'm still trying to figure it out.

So far, I can make the wife and the dog crazy.

[florida08]

84. LOLOL

there you are..good to see ya

[AnneD]

86. Mission Accomplished!!!!!

:thumbsup:

[Demeter]

107. Is that like being a DJ?

Another in a long list of useless jobs...

[Ghost Dog]

109. At least not a learner on a trumpet, through a partition wall.

:hi:

[Festivito]

33. Debt: 09/14/2010 13,440,225,498,627.42 (DOWN 3,217,490,265.98) (Tue)

(Up a little. Good day.)
Sturgis, Lansing (crash on Natutzi, missed meeting(ouch), on the road.
(Debt under Obama seems to jump up big then drop slowly maybe up a little and down a little for days--repeat.)
= Held by the Public + Intragovernmental(FICA)
= 8,942,704,712,188.55 + 4,497,520,786,438.87
UP 150,853,245.21 + DOWN 3,368,343,511.19

Source: Debt to the penny:
http://www.treasurydirect.gov/NP/BPDLogin?application=np

THINKING IN BILLIONS: Think 3 or 4 dollars per billion in a 310-Million person America.
If every American, man, woman and child puts in $3.22 THAT'S 1B$, and $3,224.92 makes 1T$.
A family of three: Mom, Dad, Child: $9.67, ABOUT TEN BUCKS for a 1B$ federal program.
I hope that is clear. However, I'd suggest using $3 per 1B$ to underestimate it.
Use $4 per 1B$ to overestimate the cost when thinking: Is the federal program worth it?
Aid to Dependant Children: 2B$/yr =$8/yr(a movie a year) Family of 3: $24/yr(an hour of bowling)

PERSONALIZED DEBT:
Every 13 seconds we net gain another American, so at the end of the workday of the report, there should be 310,085,162 people in America.
http://www.census.gov/population/www/popclockus.html ON 04/09/2010 15:49 -> 309,034,742
Currently, each of these Americans owe $43,343.66.
A family of three owes $130,030.98. (And that is IN ADDITION to their mortgage.)

ANALYSIS:
There were 22 reports in the last 30 to 32 days.
The average for the last 22 reports is 5,673,070,306.93.
The average for the last 30 days would be 4,160,251,558.41.
The average for the last 32 days would be 3,900,235,836.01.
There were 252 reports in 365 days of FY2007 averaging 1.99B$ per report, 1.37B$/day.
There were 253 reports in 366 days of FY2008 averaging 4.02B$ per report, 2.78B$/day.
There were 75 reports in 112 days of GWB's part of FY2009 averaging 8.03B$ per report, 5.38B$/day.
There were 174 reports in 253 days of Obama's part of FY2009 averaging 7.33B$ per report, 5.07B$/day so far.
There were 249 reports in 365 days of FY2009 averaging 7.57B$ per report, 5.16B$/day.
There were 239 reports in 349 days of FY2010 averaging 6.40B$ per report, 4.39B$/day.
Above line should be okay

PROJECTION:
There are 859 days remaining in this Obama 1st term.
By that time the debt could be between 14.6 and 17.9T$.
It could be higher. It could be lower.

HISTORICAL:
President's term begins and ends on Jan 20.
(Guess who might want to hide the Reagan Bush years. Jan 20 data is missing before 1993.)
01/20/1993 _4,188,092,107,183.60 WJC Inaugural
01/22/2001 _5,728,195,796,181.57 WJC (UP 1,540,103,688,997.97)
01/20/2009 10,626,877,048,913.08 GWB (UP 4,898,681,252,731.43)
09/14/2010 13,440,225,498,627.42 BHO (UP 2,813,348,449,714.34 so far since Obama took office.)

FISCAL YEAR DEBT CHANGE, Sep 30 prior year to Sep 30 named year:
(One "* " for each 40B$ reached)
FY1994 +0,281,261,026,873.94 ------------* * * * * * * WJC
FY1995 +0,281,232,990,696.07 ------------* * * * * * * WJC
FY1996 +0,250,828,038,426.34 ------------* * * * * * WJC
FY1997 +0,188,335,072,261.61 ------------* * * * WJC
FY1998 +0,113,046,997,500.28 ------------* * WJC
FY1999 +0,130,077,892,735.81 ------------* * * WJC
FY2000 +0,017,907,308,253.43 ------------WJC
FY2001 +0,133,285,202,313.20 ------------* * * C&B
01-WJC +0,053,598,528,417.78 ------------* WJC 31% of FY, 40% of FY-Debt
01-GWB +0,079,686,673,895.42 ------------* GWB 69% of FY, 60% of FY-Debt
FY2002 +0,420,772,553,397.10 ------------* * * * * * * * * * GWB
FY2003 +0,554,995,097,146.46 ------------* * * * * * * * * * * * * GWB
FY2004 +0,595,821,633,586.70 ------------* * * * * * * * * * * * * * GWB
FY2005 +0,553,656,965,393.18 ------------* * * * * * * * * * * * * GWB
FY2006 +0,574,264,237,491.73 ------------* * * * * * * * * * * * * * GWB
FY2007 +0,500,679,473,047.25 ------------* * * * * * * * * * * * GWB
FY2008 +1,017,071,524,649.92 ------------* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * GWB
FY2009 +1,885,104,106,599.30 ------------* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * B&O
09GWB +0,602,152,152,000.60 ------------* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * GWB 31% of FY, 32% of FY-Debt
09-BHO +1,282,951,954,598.70 ------------* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * BHO 69% of FY, 68% of FY-Debt
FY2010 +1,530,396,495,115.70 ------------* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * BHO
Endof10 +1,600,557,939,017.85 ------------* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * Linear Projection

LAST FIFTEEN REPORTS OF ADDITIONS TO PUBLIC DEBT(NOT FICA):
08/24/2010 +000,493,029,883.18 ------------********
08/25/2010 +000,455,932,262.67 ------------********
08/26/2010 +015,329,518,146.29 ------------**********
08/27/2010 +000,056,877,341.30 ------------*******
08/30/2010 -000,093,227,691.02 ---- Mon
08/31/2010 +077,584,457,403.73 ------------**********
09/01/2010 -002,618,329,750.58 --
09/02/2010 +008,773,043,668.95 ------------*********
09/03/2010 +000,065,447,919.59 ------------*******
09/07/2010 +000,022,960,425.76 ------------******* Tue
09/08/2010 +000,399,922,819.12 ------------********
09/09/2010 +008,813,573,460.79 ------------*********
09/10/2010 -000,055,297,184.77 ----
09/13/2010 +000,091,299,524.00 ------------******* Mon
09/14/2010 +000,150,853,245.21 ------------********

109,470,061,474.22 Total of 15 above reports.

Heavy borrowing seems to start after 09/18/2008 while Bush was in power JUST BEFORE fiscal year end.
Bush admin borrowed $962,245,245,654.01 in those last 124 days in office crossing two fiscal years.
$360,093,093,653.42 in last 12 days of FY2008, and $602,152,152,000.59 in subsequent 112 days before leaving office.

For a prettier and more explanatory view of our nation's debt:
http://www.brillig.com/debt_clock
http://www.usdebtclock.org/
DUer primer on National debt

(Debt to the penny keeps changing. Stuff is missing. Best to keep our own history.) LAST REPORT:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=102&topic_id=4541058&mesg_id=4541067

[Festivito]

117. Debt: 09/15/2010 13,498,026,949,136.56 (UP 57,801,450,509.14) (Wed)

(Up a lot. Good day.)
Dropped an update.
(Debt under Obama seems to jump up big then drop slowly maybe up a little and down a little for days--repeat.)
= Held by the Public + Intragovernmental(FICA)
= 9,007,121,861,472.49 + 4,490,905,087,664.07
UP 64,417,149,283.94 + DOWN 6,615,698,774.80

Source: Debt to the penny:
http://www.treasurydirect.gov/NP/BPDLogin?application=np

THINKING IN BILLIONS: Think 3 or 4 dollars per billion in a 310-Million person America.
If every American, man, woman and child puts in $3.22 THAT'S 1B$, and $3,224.85 makes 1T$.
A family of three: Mom, Dad, Child: $9.67, ABOUT TEN BUCKS for a 1B$ federal program.
I hope that is clear. However, I'd suggest using $3 per 1B$ to underestimate it.
Use $4 per 1B$ to overestimate the cost when thinking: Is the federal program worth it?
Aid to Dependant Children: 2B$/yr =$8/yr(a movie a year) Family of 3: $24/yr(an hour of bowling)

PERSONALIZED DEBT:
Every 13 seconds we net gain another American, so at the end of the workday of the report, there should be 310,091,808 people in America.
http://www.census.gov/population/www/popclockus.html ON 04/09/2010 15:49 -> 309,034,742
Currently, each of these Americans owe $43,529.13.
A family of three owes $130,587.39. (And that is IN ADDITION to their mortgage.)

ANALYSIS:
There were 23 reports in the last 30 to 33 days.
The average for the last 23 reports is 7,939,521,620.07.
The average for the last 30 days would be 6,086,966,575.38.
The average for the last 33 days would be 5,533,605,977.62.
There were 252 reports in 365 days of FY2007 averaging 1.99B$ per report, 1.37B$/day.
There were 253 reports in 366 days of FY2008 averaging 4.02B$ per report, 2.78B$/day.
There were 75 reports in 112 days of GWB's part of FY2009 averaging 8.03B$ per report, 5.38B$/day.
There were 174 reports in 253 days of Obama's part of FY2009 averaging 7.33B$ per report, 5.07B$/day so far.
There were 249 reports in 365 days of FY2009 averaging 7.57B$ per report, 5.16B$/day.
There were 240 reports in 350 days of FY2010 averaging 6.62B$ per report, 4.54B$/day.
Above line should be okay

PROJECTION:
There are 858 days remaining in this Obama 1st term.
By that time the debt could be between 14.7 and 18.2T$.
It could be higher. It could be lower.

HISTORICAL:
President's term begins and ends on Jan 20.
(Guess who might want to hide the Reagan Bush years. Jan 20 data is missing before 1993.)
01/20/1993 _4,188,092,107,183.60 WJC Inaugural
01/22/2001 _5,728,195,796,181.57 WJC (UP 1,540,103,688,997.97)
01/20/2009 10,626,877,048,913.08 GWB (UP 4,898,681,252,731.43)
09/15/2010 13,498,026,949,136.56 BHO (UP 2,871,149,900,223.48 so far since Obama took office.)

FISCAL YEAR DEBT CHANGE, Sep 30 prior year to Sep 30 named year:
(One "* " for each 40B$ reached)
FY1994 +0,281,261,026,873.94 ------------* * * * * * * WJC
FY1995 +0,281,232,990,696.07 ------------* * * * * * * WJC
FY1996 +0,250,828,038,426.34 ------------* * * * * * WJC
FY1997 +0,188,335,072,261.61 ------------* * * * WJC
FY1998 +0,113,046,997,500.28 ------------* * WJC
FY1999 +0,130,077,892,735.81 ------------* * * WJC
FY2000 +0,017,907,308,253.43 ------------WJC
FY2001 +0,133,285,202,313.20 ------------* * * C&B
01-WJC +0,053,598,528,417.78 ------------* WJC 31% of FY, 40% of FY-Debt
01-GWB +0,079,686,673,895.42 ------------* GWB 69% of FY, 60% of FY-Debt
FY2002 +0,420,772,553,397.10 ------------* * * * * * * * * * GWB
FY2003 +0,554,995,097,146.46 ------------* * * * * * * * * * * * * GWB
FY2004 +0,595,821,633,586.70 ------------* * * * * * * * * * * * * * GWB
FY2005 +0,553,656,965,393.18 ------------* * * * * * * * * * * * * GWB
FY2006 +0,574,264,237,491.73 ------------* * * * * * * * * * * * * * GWB
FY2007 +0,500,679,473,047.25 ------------* * * * * * * * * * * * GWB
FY2008 +1,017,071,524,649.92 ------------* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * GWB
FY2009 +1,885,104,106,599.30 ------------* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * B&O
09GWB +0,602,152,152,000.60 ------------* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * GWB 31% of FY, 32% of FY-Debt
09-BHO +1,282,951,954,598.70 ------------* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * BHO 69% of FY, 68% of FY-Debt
FY2010 +1,588,197,945,624.80 ------------* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * BHO
Endof10 +1,656,263,571,865.86 ------------* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * Linear Projection

LAST FIFTEEN REPORTS OF ADDITIONS TO PUBLIC DEBT(NOT FICA):
08/25/2010 +000,455,932,262.67 ------------********
08/26/2010 +015,329,518,146.29 ------------**********
08/27/2010 +000,056,877,341.30 ------------*******
08/30/2010 -000,093,227,691.02 ---- Mon
08/31/2010 +077,584,457,403.73 ------------**********
09/01/2010 -002,618,329,750.58 --
09/02/2010 +008,773,043,668.95 ------------*********
09/03/2010 +000,065,447,919.59 ------------*******
09/07/2010 +000,022,960,425.76 ------------******* Tue
09/08/2010 +000,399,922,819.12 ------------********
09/09/2010 +008,813,573,460.79 ------------*********
09/10/2010 -000,055,297,184.77 ----
09/13/2010 +000,091,299,524.00 ------------******* Mon
09/14/2010 +000,150,853,245.21 ------------********
09/15/2010 +064,417,149,283.94 ------------**********

173,394,180,874.98 Total of 15 above reports.

Heavy borrowing seems to start after 09/18/2008 while Bush was in power JUST BEFORE fiscal year end.
Bush admin borrowed $962,245,245,654.01 in those last 124 days in office crossing two fiscal years.
$360,093,093,653.42 in last 12 days of FY2008, and $602,152,152,000.59 in subsequent 112 days before leaving office.

For a prettier and more explanatory view of our nation's debt:
http://www.brillig.com/debt_clock
http://www.usdebtclock.org/
DUer primer on National debt

(Debt to the penny keeps changing. Stuff is missing. Best to keep our own history.) LAST REPORT:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=102&topic_id=4542302&mesg_id=4542308

[Festivito]

118. Debt: 09/16/2010 13,464,896,653,374.11 (DOWN 33,130,295,762.45) (Thu)

Debt: 09/16/2010 13,464,896,653,374.11 (DOWN 33,130,295,762.45) (Thu)
(Down a lot. Good day.)
All over the state, lost a day of updating. Saw the woman who played with fire.
(Debt under Obama seems to jump up big then drop slowly maybe up a little and down a little for days--repeat.)
= Held by the Public + Intragovernmental(FICA)
= 8,970,475,166,793.21 + 4,494,421,486,580.90
DOWN 36,646,694,679.28 + UP 3,516,398,916.83

Source: Debt to the penny:
http://www.treasurydirect.gov/NP/BPDLogin?application=np

THINKING IN BILLIONS: Think 3 or 4 dollars per billion in a 310-Million person America.
If every American, man, woman and child puts in $3.22 THAT'S 1B$, and $3,224.78 makes 1T$.
A family of three: Mom, Dad, Child: $9.67, ABOUT TEN BUCKS for a 1B$ federal program.
I hope that is clear. However, I'd suggest using $3 per 1B$ to underestimate it.
Use $4 per 1B$ to overestimate the cost when thinking: Is the federal program worth it?
Aid to Dependant Children: 2B$/yr =$8/yr(a movie a year) Family of 3: $24/yr(an hour of bowling)

PERSONALIZED DEBT:
Every 13 seconds we net gain another American, so at the end of the workday of the report, there should be 310,098,454 people in America.
http://www.census.gov/population/www/popclockus.html ON 04/09/2010 15:49 -> 309,034,742
Currently, each of these Americans owe $43,421.36.
A family of three owes $130,264.08. (And that is IN ADDITION to their mortgage.)

ANALYSIS:
There were 23 reports in the last 30 to 31 days.
The average for the last 23 reports is 4,691,411,523.16.
The average for the last 30 days would be 3,596,748,834.42.
The average for the last 31 days would be 3,480,724,678.47.
There were 252 reports in 365 days of FY2007 averaging 1.99B$ per report, 1.37B$/day.
There were 253 reports in 366 days of FY2008 averaging 4.02B$ per report, 2.78B$/day.
There were 75 reports in 112 days of GWB's part of FY2009 averaging 8.03B$ per report, 5.38B$/day.
There were 174 reports in 253 days of Obama's part of FY2009 averaging 7.33B$ per report, 5.07B$/day so far.
There were 249 reports in 365 days of FY2009 averaging 7.57B$ per report, 5.16B$/day.
There were 241 reports in 351 days of FY2010 averaging 6.45B$ per report, 4.43B$/day.
Above line should be okay

PROJECTION:
There are 857 days remaining in this Obama 1st term.
By that time the debt could be between 14.6 and 17.9T$.
It could be higher. It could be lower.

HISTORICAL:
President's term begins and ends on Jan 20.
(Guess who might want to hide the Reagan Bush years. Jan 20 data is missing before 1993.)
01/20/1993 _4,188,092,107,183.60 WJC Inaugural
01/22/2001 _5,728,195,796,181.57 WJC (UP 1,540,103,688,997.97)
01/20/2009 10,626,877,048,913.08 GWB (UP 4,898,681,252,731.43)
09/16/2010 13,464,896,653,374.11 BHO (UP 2,838,019,604,461.03 so far since Obama took office.)

FISCAL YEAR DEBT CHANGE, Sep 30 prior year to Sep 30 named year:
(One "* " for each 40B$ reached)
FY1994 +0,281,261,026,873.94 ------------* * * * * * * WJC
FY1995 +0,281,232,990,696.07 ------------* * * * * * * WJC
FY1996 +0,250,828,038,426.34 ------------* * * * * * WJC
FY1997 +0,188,335,072,261.61 ------------* * * * WJC
FY1998 +0,113,046,997,500.28 ------------* * WJC
FY1999 +0,130,077,892,735.81 ------------* * * WJC
FY2000 +0,017,907,308,253.43 ------------WJC
FY2001 +0,133,285,202,313.20 ------------* * * C&B
01-WJC +0,053,598,528,417.78 ------------* WJC 31% of FY, 40% of FY-Debt
01-GWB +0,079,686,673,895.42 ------------* GWB 69% of FY, 60% of FY-Debt
FY2002 +0,420,772,553,397.10 ------------* * * * * * * * * * GWB
FY2003 +0,554,995,097,146.46 ------------* * * * * * * * * * * * * GWB
FY2004 +0,595,821,633,586.70 ------------* * * * * * * * * * * * * * GWB
FY2005 +0,553,656,965,393.18 ------------* * * * * * * * * * * * * GWB
FY2006 +0,574,264,237,491.73 ------------* * * * * * * * * * * * * * GWB
FY2007 +0,500,679,473,047.25 ------------* * * * * * * * * * * * GWB
FY2008 +1,017,071,524,649.92 ------------* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * GWB
FY2009 +1,885,104,106,599.30 ------------* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * B&O
09GWB +0,602,152,152,000.60 ------------* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * GWB 31% of FY, 32% of FY-Debt
09-BHO +1,282,951,954,598.70 ------------* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * BHO 69% of FY, 68% of FY-Debt
FY2010 +1,555,067,649,862.40 ------------* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * BHO
Endof10 +1,617,093,140,170.30 ------------* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * Linear Projection

LAST FIFTEEN REPORTS OF ADDITIONS TO PUBLIC DEBT(NOT FICA):
08/26/2010 +015,329,518,146.29 ------------**********
08/27/2010 +000,056,877,341.30 ------------*******
08/30/2010 -000,093,227,691.02 ---- Mon
08/31/2010 +077,584,457,403.73 ------------**********
09/01/2010 -002,618,329,750.58 --
09/02/2010 +008,773,043,668.95 ------------*********
09/03/2010 +000,065,447,919.59 ------------*******
09/07/2010 +000,022,960,425.76 ------------******* Tue
09/08/2010 +000,399,922,819.12 ------------********
09/09/2010 +008,813,573,460.79 ------------*********
09/10/2010 -000,055,297,184.77 ----
09/13/2010 +000,091,299,524.00 ------------******* Mon
09/14/2010 +000,150,853,245.21 ------------********
09/15/2010 +064,417,149,283.94 ------------**********
09/16/2010 -036,646,694,679.28 -

136,291,553,933.03 Total of 15 above reports.

Heavy borrowing seems to start after 09/18/2008 while Bush was in power JUST BEFORE fiscal year end.
Bush admin borrowed $962,245,245,654.01 in those last 124 days in office crossing two fiscal years.
$360,093,093,653.42 in last 12 days of FY2008, and $602,152,152,000.59 in subsequent 112 days before leaving office.

For a prettier and more explanatory view of our nation's debt:
http://www.brillig.com/debt_clock
http://www.usdebtclock.org/
DUer primer on National debt

(Debt to the penny keeps changing. Stuff is missing. Best to keep our own history.) LAST REPORT:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=102&topic_id=4543519&mesg_id=4546054

[florida08]

51. Where is Tansy and the Dr?

Miss their pithiness. Are they at the bar again..?

[AnneD]

54. They probably are togather....

and when I find out where that bar is, I join them. :toast: :beer:

[florida08]

58. lol

now there's a plan for world peace

[Po_d Mainiac]

55. Mdme Gold sent me this link yesterday (warning: spew alert)

http://maine.gov/doc/nrimc/mgs/explore/minerals/facts/stmineral.htm

She may have injured herself laughing (I almost did)

I believe the picture on the right of the page is supposed to be a mineral, not a marital aide..No doubt it is a GEM though!

[AnneD]

57. What was it that Mae West use to say...

a hard man was good to find. I might be moving to Maine because that is surely an illegal mineral aide in Texas, unless it is a gag gift.. :rofl:

[Po_d Mainiac]

60. Anne: If you plan on driving up,

make sure you schedule a stop in Kentucky. You'll want to purchase some of their jelly

[AnneD]

62. Actually had a complaint about ...

the hospital food from a patient once. Said she likes everything on the breakfast tray except the Kentucky jelly. I couldn't figure it out until I took a closer look at the try. She had gotten a packet of KY from an earlier proceedure and applied it to her toast. No need for a stool softener I guess. I swear you can't make this stuff up sometimes. :rofl:

[wordpix]

63. oh, YUCK!!!!

[AnneD]

65. Actually,

it peaked my curiosity. It is VERY bland and tasteless. If I were offered it for my toast-I would complain too. :rofl:

[DemReadingDU]

71. That was funny!

yucky, but funny
:rofl:

[ozymandius]

93. A friend of mine pulled a prank on a nurse just a bit like that.

The nurse dropped off a bottle to collect urine just after breakfast was served. My friend, Jimmy, requested apple juice with his breakfast.

He poured the apple juice into the urine sample bottle.

The nurse returns a few minutes later to collect the sample, looks at the liquid and says, "Your urine looks a little funny."

Jimmy grabs the bottle and says, "Here -- let me run it back through," then he presses the bottle to his mouth and starts gulping.

A moment passes before the nurse picks herself up off the floor.

[AnneD]

I've pulled that on on the new doc too

I add a few graham cracker crumbs for sediment.

My best joke ever was to come out of the exam room with a clean vaginal speculum with a liberal coat of vanilla pudding on it. I told the doc that the patient had a heavy discharge that smelled funny and looked funny. At that point I held up the speculum swiped my finger over it and put my finger in my mouth and told him it tasted funny too.

The site of him gagging at the sink was priceless. Hey, I grew up with two brothers and gross out was their favorite dinner time game. Oh, by the way-I always won.

[Ghost Dog]

111. Olé.

:9

[AnneD]

105. gag warning

and double post

[Roland99]

83. Being as I'm from Ky, I could chime in but, uhhh....

I'll just relish in laughing at this for a while!

:)

[Po_d Mainiac]

98. If you're from Ky

You might wanna think of K-Y jelly as a top shelf chassis lube
:hide:

[Roland99]

103. Oh, the joke stewing around in my head right now

You have to consider that my gf is of Polish descent.


K-Y Jelly being used as, oh, maybe a.... grease?

[Ghost Dog]

112. It's petroleum jelly, right?

Like vaseline?

[Po_d Mainiac]

114. Chassis lube?

Kentucky is one of the few regions where axle grease is used as a cologne

[florida08]

61. uhhhh

[Tansy_Gold]

90. Further info on the Maine "gem" (no, not YOU, you silly!)

from the discussion board at mindat.org, where I also posted the link, with some delightful responses, including:



You guys will get us in trouble with the Governor!

When the information on the Maine State Mineral was being written for the MGS website, that was one of the best photos of Maine elbaite in our digital files. It was supplied by Gary Freeman, who had recently found this fine large matrix specimen at Mount Mica. Anything else is in the eye of the beholder!

Woody Thompson
Maine Geological Survey



As for me, I'm buried in work right now. Hope to get out from under the pile soon, soon, sooooon.



TG, NTY

[Po_d Mainiac]

99. I'd expect "Woody" to say something like that...n/t

[AnneD]

106. LOL LOL LOL .....

the jokes just write themselves some days. :spray:

[Dr.Phool]

75. The Dr. Had to go to the back Dr.

Then hit the gym, and I just scored tickets for Pink Floyd meets Xmas, aka, Trans Siberia Orchestra.

Now, I'm ready for the bar. Tansy is probably already there.

[Demeter]

78. Is It Even Dawn There Yet?

maybe it's a 24 hour bar?

[Dr.Phool]

79. It's always Beer O' Clock!

[florida08]

85. ah man

Love the TSO. Got their CD last year for Christmas. Tansy must have a hollow leg

[Dr.Phool]

87. St Pete Times Forum, Dec 11th. Two shows.

I saw them last year. It was awesome. Tickets go on sale tomorrow.

I got back from the doctors office, and found an e-mail, saying I could pre-order, so I jumped on it. Got seats almost on the stage. It will get hot, with all the pyrotechnics.

[florida08]

97. omg doc

I just checked their website. They'll be in Jacksonville Dec. 9th at the Veterans Memorial Arena! woohoo! hot damn..thanks for the ifo.

[ozymandius]

94. Oh man. I'm sorry about that.

I hope the back issue is nothing serious.

[Dr.Phool]

100. You think I act like this because I'm NOT on drugs?

Herniated disc, stenosis, and arthritis from spending too much time driving trains(that's me in the tunnel).

It doesn't bother me normally, but when it does, it does. I can do everything I would normally do, except for a few episodes. Then it's oxycodone and snuggle up to this.

[TalkingDog]

74. The future of enterprise: Crowdsourcing prices

http://www.priceofweed.com/

What is Marijuana really worth?
We want to crowdsource the street value of marijuana from the most accurate source possible: you, the consumer. Help by annonymously submitting data on the latest transaction you've made.

[Roland99]

82. heh... and I just watched Pineapple Express last night!

[Roland99]

81. Gold hits new record. $1,278.

[ozymandius]

95. Hope springs eternal.

Taking on Trickle-Down Economics: The Public Rejects Conservative Tax Cuts as a Means of Economic Stimulus

At a time when bailouts for America’s rich proceed unimpeded and Americans are left to fend for themselves, support for further subsidies for the rich is limited among the public. Gallup polling finds that a majority of Americans (56 percent) oppose extending the Bush-era tax cuts, which went overwhelmingly to the wealthiest of Americans. Just one in three support extending the cuts, despite the current rhetoric of the Republican Party.

Opposition to the Bush-era tax cuts is entirely rational among the public in light of the cuts’ failure to promote economic growth. The Bush tax cuts concentrated the greatest benefits toward the rich, and benefits for the affluent became even greater in their later years (during the 2008 to 2010 period specifically). They are set to expire this year, unless Democrats and Republicans in Congress renew them. Although massive amounts of cash from the cuts fell into the hands of America’s wealthiest one percent, these elites have looked at the increased volatility of today’s market and decided to hoard the cash instead of investing it. To make matters worse, extending the cuts will result in an additional transfer of $31 billion into the hands of America’s billionaires.

more...

[Roland99]

101. Heck, when "Maestro" Greenspan, himself, says tax hikes are needed

what the hell else could possibly be a clearer sign?


What in the hell do those 38 "Democrats" need to see/hear in order to wake the hell up?!?

[Dr.Phool]

102. Even Bush had second thoughts about his second round of cuts.

According to Treasury Secretary Paul O'Niell, in Ron Suskind's "The Price of Loyalty", Bush remarked "But, I thought that we already took care of the rich". He said Rove put a harness on him real quick, and told him "Be true to your principles".

Orwell's Double-think is working overtime in Washington. The ability to hold two opposing beliefs in one's mind, and believe them both to be true. We have an enormous budget deficit and national debt. The need for revenue is about as obvious as an elephant sitting in your lap. And they want to keep rates low on the two percent richest portion of the population.

You can expect stupidity like this out of backwater Republican representatives, but the Blue Dogs are even worse. Their only concern is that they might lose their jobs for doing the right thing. Don't they know that once they lose their seat, they can make more money doing honest work as a lobbyist?

[Ghost Dog]

113. A summary, for those interested, of systemic economic change policy in Cuba,

from the Guardian.

Since being handed power by his brother in 2006, Raúl Castro has taken measures to reform the economy, including using some market mechanisms and allowing more citizens to work for themselves. In order to shrink the state (and the deficit – Cuba is in the same boat as the rest of us), something like a million government workers are set to lose their jobs in the coming months.

The government has recently handed out more than 2.5m acres of land to individuals and co-operatives, in order that they produce more food, and has accordingly loosened controls that prohibit Cubans from selling fruit and vegetables. In an effort to build a modern tourism infrastructure it has eased property laws to give lease periods of up to 99 years for foreign investors.

However, at the same time the government has announced that workers will be encouraged to take over the ownership of the companies in which they work. In a move that the government has actually called a deepening of socialism, the Cubans are about to launch what could potentially become the biggest co-operative project the world has ever seen.

The government is saying that the old centrally planned Soviet-style of socialism has finally hit the buffers – a new form of socialism is required, in which the state ceases to be the administrator of economic activity but the regulator. That's a different model of socialism – it may not work either – but it is not capitalism.

I would say such a model would have considerable chances of success.