Opinion poll: Public sides with Arizona over US on new immigration law

[onehandle]

Source: Christian Science Monitor

Americans' support for Arizona’s tough new immigration law is unwavering, with the public unmoved by a legal challenge to the law filed last week by the US Department of Justice, finds a new poll released Monday by TechnoMetrica Market Intelligence (TIPP).

The US Department of Justice filed suit against the state of Arizona in federal court July 6, challenging the state's tough new immigration law requiring state and local police to ask ID of anyone they've stopped and then suspect of being in the US illegally.

“What is interesting here is that Americans are on the side of Arizona and seem to not share the US government’s views against the law, despite wide media coverage of the clash between Obama and Brewer on this issue,” says Raghavan Mayur, president of TIPP.

The most compelling figure from the poll is that 51 percent of Americans support Arizona's law as it stands, compared with 35 percent who support the US case against Arizona. The level of support is highest in the South and the West, at 55 and 56 percent, respectively. By contrast, respondents in the Northeast were equally divided in their support for Arizona versus the US, 41 percent to 41 percent.

Read more: http://news.yahoo.com/s/csm/313624

[qanda]

1. It's interesting how people support taking away the rights of others--

I guess it doesn't really matter until they come for your rights.

[WillParkinson]

2. Awesome answer...

I rec this post just on your reply!

[marmar]

3. Exactly.

nt

[No Elephants]

4. Yep. Many who can't tolerate bigotry against their own group seem fine with anti-

GLBT bigotry.

[BakedAtAMileHigh]

5. our rulers use poverty to create racial animosity

Howard Zinn does a great job chronicling this in detail.

[SemperEadem]

13. yep.. those same idiots who think nothing of stripping others of their rights

will be the ones screaming, wailing and bitching the loudest when someone starts tinkering with their little set up.

[superconnected]

14. +1

[MellowDem]

26. They don't think it's about rights...

many think it's about labor, some about fairness, and some about xenophobia.

[Iowa]

43. +1...

I agree completely. Furthermore, issues of liberty and human rights should not be subject to the whims of popular opinion.

[pampango]

44. To be fair most polls show an even bigger support for a path to citizenship as part of comprehensive

immigration reform.

http://americasvoiceonline.org/index.php/polling/entry/public_opinion_and_the_arizona_immigration_law

"A number of media-sponsored polls have showed public support for the Arizona law while many of the same polls have showed even more public support for comprehensive immigration reform with a path to citizenship. What gives? Is the public confused, or do these seemingly contradictory views actually make sense?"

"Key finding: Most Americans support both Arizona’s controversial anti-immigration law at the same time they also support proposed federal comprehensive immigration reform legislation with a path to earned citizenship for undocumented immigrants.

Overall, opinion research shows that rather than a newfound wave of anti-immigrant sentiment, most Americans support Arizona’s law as well as support for national comprehensive immigration reform is driven by a desire for action by Washington on a problem that has been left unattended for too long."

[SunnySong]

45. Yeah those lazy unemployed and underpaid are so selfish. nt

[Jennicut]

6. Is anyone really surprised? Immigrants, legal and illegal, have always been

used as scapegoats for deeper problems in this country. That we have not evolved since the 1920's on this (when my Grandparents came over from Italy into Ellis Island) is just really sad.
At least I live in the Northeast, where people are split on it. Even that # is pathetic.

[bluestateguy]

7. We do not need to be beseiged with polls

Research 2000, for example, has been accused of cooking their polls; it is questionable who these "people" are who are allegedly surveyed.

I was never polled.

[w4rma]

8. People want something done, not amnisty which is a huge loser, on immigration.

Blue collar workers see good jobs given to illegals for almost no pay and no viable way to report the illegality to the government. People want something done and something is better than nothing to most.

[Rozlee]

12. What good jobs?

My uncle owned a poultry farm where he slaughtered chickens. The place had to be kept warm because it would make the feathers easier to pluck out of the chickens. If it was cool, the vasoconstriction would cause tightness around the roots of the feathers. So, not only was the slaughering pen hot as hades, feathers, dust and the racket was awful. My uncle couldn't keep Americans employed even at a better wage than most. They'd show up for a couple of weeks, then never come back. Can you blame them? Think of that next time you go to KFC. He wrote a letter into a newspaper column once in reply to some guy that was complaining about illegals taking away good paying American jobs. His exact words were. "I've got three words for you: Pluck. My. Chickens."

[Edweird]

15. Construction. I saw wages for a skilled carpenter fall from

$30-35/hr plus benefits to $12-15 w/no benefits and 1099 at the end of the year. I made more as a carpenter's helper when I first started out than I did running a crew. This was at the height of the building boom. There was no shortage of work.

[SemperEadem]

19. I've been a tv technician for over 25 years

I've seen wages plummet from around $45/hr down to under $25 in major markets for the same skill set and years of experience. There were no illegals trying to get jobs as tv technicians, but the wages still have decreased, so the price of wages dropping has nothing to do with illegals taking anything. It has to do with jobs being shipped overseas in order for companies to maximize profits and get out of paying taxes or adhering to safe business practices.

However, as I've watched television here in the US--the US generated programming--I've noticed more and more people speaking with Australian, Scottish and British accents on American television. Why aren't people all up in arms over them taking good paying gigs from US actors/journalists?

[Edweird]

28. Two completely different sets of circumstances.

Housing construction cannot be 'sent overseas'. The economy was not in a 'slump' - this was during the height of the boom when prices were nearing their highest point. There was a reason why wages rose to over $30.hr and there is a reason why they fell and neither of them relate to your TV.

[alpine62]

42. Illegals have driven down construction wages

I own a roofing company. We have had many illegals apply for work.
We won't hire them. Unfortunately, several of our bigger competitors
do. They pay the illegals only slightly above minimum wage. As a
result of their lower labor costs they are able to bid lower. I have
had to cut wages back for my employees just to keep them working.
Contrary to what some people think installing a roof properly does
take skill. It is also hard work. My employees deserve to earn a
livable wage for their efforts. My competitors who hire the illegals
take advantage of them by paying such low wages knowing they can't
really complain about it. I would love to see these employers heavily fined!!

Illegals have also driven up the crime rate in my rural county.
I live in what was at one time a heavily agricultural area. The
local farmers hired "migrants" to work for them. These familys
came and worked for the season and then went home. They were largely
law-abiding and hard working people. Now the primary reason the
Mexicans come here is to be distributors of drugs. They have
several "gangs" and drive-by shootings happened several times a week.
This is in a county with a population of just over 100,000 that always
had a relatively low crime rate.

Figures were recently released indicating that almost 1/3 of the babies
born at our local hospital in 2009 were born to illegals. Who do you
think bears the cost of this? A friend of mine works in the financial
dept. at the hospital and tells me that most of these births are paid for
by the taxpayers or go uncompensated and the cost is passed on to other
patients in the form of higher costs.

I have been lurking here on DU for about 7-8 years. I know that some
of the more closed minded and self-rightous posters here will call me
racist for my post. FYI: I have two Mexican employees and several
life-long friends who are Mexican. They are all here legally! They
complain all the time about the illegals. They feel the illegals make
all Mexicans look bad. This is not an issue about race. Anyone who
believes it is doesn't live in an area that has been impacted socially
and economically by a large population of illegals.

[Romulox]

36. Faulty conclusion; nobody wants to repair tube TVs any more. nt

[amandabeech]

37. Actually, the screen actors guild ("SAG") made a fuss in the past

about just these kind of things.

When I see non-U.S English-speaking actors I do think about the enormous talent pool right here, and how their second or third choice U.S. citizen actor might have done. I can pick up Canadian accents sometimes, too.

Many of us here on DU don't like to see jobs shifted overseas, either, if that was what made your wages decrease.

On the stage, there was a huge issue with the stage actors when Andrew Lloyd Webber wanted to bring Sarah Brightman over to sing Phantom, I think it was. The U.S. folks thought that one of them could do it better. Well, at least one, and they were probably right. Webber got his way in the end, though.

[LanternWaste]

49. Post hoc ergo prompter hoc

Post hoc ergo prompter hoc

How then do we explain the jobs that were at one time middle class which now offer entry-level wages only (my field for example) which aren't being "given away" to undocumented workers?

Why does the answer for the above not apply to the construction field?

Post hoc ergo prompter hoc.

[ProudDad]

51. And I saw my computer programming rates drop

from over $55 per hour...

To NOTHING...

Thanks to "Legal immigration"?

Nope, thanks to the gready corporate capitalist fucks who own the system...and found it a hell of a lot cheaper to outsource my work to India and Redmond, WA...

Please place your blame on the real thieves, not on their unwilling tools...

[superconnected]

17. House painting crews, landscaping etc., but I'm still AGAINST everything Arizona is doing.

I'm for making them legal.

And to clarify about house painting and landscaping - back breaking work and work with chemicals that seriously harm you if used on a day to day basis.

[amandabeech]

40. I lived in the Harrisburg, PA, area from 1999 to 2006.

All the painters and landscapers I saw had either European or African skin tones.

Somehow, they were able to do the work, and Harrisburg survived.

[dkf]

20. So you agree that there are jobs out there?

Do you think that if unemployment was cut off Americans might take these jobs?

[Rozlee]

57. Sure there are jobs out there. You'll starve if you take them, but they're out there.

My daughter got offered a job making $9.00 an hour. Her day care would be $600.00 a month. Her rent is that much. And nine dollars is "fairly" good money if you consider that it's better than minimum wage. She's not on unemployment since she's a pregnant Coast Guard Reservist waiting to be recalled to active duty, but the choice of work out there for her is dismal. But, that's the charm of our Republican congressmen. They'll tell you they worked for a knife thrower at a circus when they were a little kid, so what's wrong with you, you lazy bum.

[Romulox]

35. The so-called "free market" means that wages must rise when a job is undesireable

Your uncle isn't entitled to cheap labor. :hi:

[amandabeech]

38. What was unemployment like when your uncle tried U.S. labor?

It hasn't been any worse now since 1981 or so, and if things keep up, the number of permanently unemployed will be enormous. When times are tough, more people might be flexible. I've certainly learned.

If things don't pick up, your uncle might want to try again.

[SunnySong]

46. Construction and trades, auto repair, landscaping ect...

Yes Americans used to be able to feed a family with those jobs... not anymore thanks to illegal immigration and the enablers that employ them.

[SemperEadem]

16. what good jobs? processing chickens? cleaning the high rise toilets?

I mean, really... what good jobs are you talking about? Where are they posted?

The good jobs have all been outsourced overseas, thanks to NAFTA and the fuckin' corpo-dems and thugs.

[Edweird]

18. You'll recall that amnesty was a Reagan deal. He was fiercely anti-labor.

[atreides1]

27. I don't understand

What "good jobs" are being given to illegals?

Why is there no viable way to report employers who hire illegals?

[MarkInSavannah]

39. As a fellow member posted above........

......many jobs in the construction field have transitioned to Mexicans, at least here in Georgia. From carpenters to concrete/curb & gutter workers, many home sites are just overwhelmed by the number of Mexicans. I personally hold no animus to these people as they are hard working, quiet, and mostly law abiding. Other fields that have mostly supplanted non-emigre' peoples are road construction/paving crews and of course landscaping. Make no mistake, in many of the more affluent neighborhoods here, landscaping can be a very profitable business and up until about five years ago, for many it was. The introduction of emigres into the mix has shown a marked decrease in the rate landscapers are receiving for their services. I think it important that we don't attempt to trend Mexicans into the category of workers who only take the jobs others won't perform because it simply is not true. Before the flood of Mexicans across our borders, someone worked in that chicken farm, someone else cleaned those toilets, and someone else washed those dishes. Many in America simply, for whatever reasons, feel that this type of backbreaking work is somehow beneath them and this 'entitled' mentality goes against everything that made this country great!

[amandabeech]

41. In my home area, there are quite a few food processing plants.

They only paid $10 an hour, but there just wasn't much of anything else around for people who did not want to move.

There was an INS raid, and suddenly, there were quite a few openings. Somehow, the jobs got filled with local citizens and permanent residents without raising the hourly rate.

[pampango]

47. Polls show people support the Arizona law and a path to citizenship (even more).

People do want something done. Of course, repubs want "secure the border" as their partisan focus so they can maintain the millions of exploitable workers that are here now. OTOH, the Progressive Caucus wants to "secure the border" too, but as a part of a comprehensive solution not as a political football.

http://cpc.grijalva.house.gov/index.cfm?ContentID=205&ParentID=0&SectionID=93&SectionTree=93&lnk=b&ItemID=203

[feslen]

9. Where were these polls taken from anyway?

the public resterooms? Give me a break. and those that answered are bigoted morons anyway, let's see how they like it if all their illegal Mexican, Asian etc just went up and left. without them there'd be nothing left running. how about if they ask the RIGHT question: hey, aren't you illegal too? shouldn't YOU give your rights to the few "Native" Americans and go back to Europe???

[Angry Dragon]

10. Perhaps the federal government should just back off

Let the law stand, sit back and watch the abuses roll in and then the public will start to see how the law is flawed.
It seems unless people actually see it for what it is then they will never change their minds.

[KansDem]

25. There could be some deaths...

I agree with your approach to a certain point. However, just let one over-zealous cop with an itchy Taser finger and one confused "illegal" (or not) come together in a incvil encounter and there will be fatal consequences.

I say to the anti-immigrant crowd: "If you don't want them here, then stop hiring them..."

[Angry Dragon]

30. This country is so focused on illegals already

I do not think a federal lawsuit is going to make any difference.

The north east, the midwest, are looking at the same tyoe of law that Arizona has.
This country is just going insane, and I just do not see anything to stop the insanity.

If you read the posts on DU one sees police tasering 86 year old women, tasering dogs, shooting dogs in front of children.
This is in places that do not have the Arizona law.

And I agree that putting the companies that hire in jail would be fair and just. But you know as well as I do that it is the ones on the bottom that pay the price and not the ones with privilege and money.

[ProudDad]

52. Tell that to my Brown brothers and sisters here in Arizona (n/t)

[L0oniX]

11. ÷

:popcorn:

[bread_and_roses]

21. "Our side" offers no alternate narrative to counter blaming "illegals" for our job woes

Since "our side" won't clearly and openly lay the blame where it belongs - on "Free Trade" deals, off-shoring, union-busting, and wage deflation, for example - all courtesy of our Corporate Masters, the "illegal" bashing is the only narrative out there. Until and unless "our side" is willing to challenge their Corporate Overlords we can expect continued xenophobia, border hysteria, etc.

[Edweird]

29. You don't see a connection between illegal immigration and union busting and wage deflation?

You think Reagan supported amnesty because he was a swell guy?
Illegal immigration isn't THE ONE issue that's killing us financially, but it certainly is one of them.
Illegal immigration is to labor jobs what H1-B's are to tech jobs.

[AtheistCrusader]

31. Exactly right.

[primavera]

34. Oh, bravo!!!

:applause:

Thank you! It's so good to see that someone gets it! Immigration is a symptom - and a relatively minor one at that - of our diseased economy. Going after migration while allowing corporations to continue outsourcing jobs to third world sweatshops with no labor or environmental protection laws as fast as they can, to continue busting unions, widening the gap between the uber-rich and everyone else, decimating the middle class... man, immigration is such infinitesimally small potatoes next to all of that.

[ProudDad]

53. Not to mention the huge ag subsidies

propping up ADM and Cargill...

And destroying indigenous cultures in Mexico driving workers up here to get their resources back.

[OrderedChaos]

22. Trick polling questions

They ask if you want the federal government to do something about illegal immigrants coming into our country. The majority say "yes" to that specific question. The more leading questions are attached, AFTER the fact, for the general publics consumption.

[MellowDem]

23. It's because most people don't know the controversy of the law...

They are just told that there is a tougher immigration law, and that's pretty much all they know about it, and so they're for it.

Illegal immigration is great for businesses and fiscal conservatives everywhere, so it is funny to see the conservative parts of the nation come out so strongly against it. They actually have some inkling that illegal immigration is bad for labor, but they just haven't really made all the connections yet.

[slackmaster]

24. Unrec just because onehandle posted it

:nuke:

[dipsydoodle]

32. Maybe what's needed

is for Mexico to introduce the death sentence for any who leaves to enter the USA illegally. In that way none could be deported back to Mexico. :shrug:

[ProudDad]

54. I hope that was satire

'cause if you were serious...

You need professional help... :puke:

[Historic NY]

33. Why doesn't Az go after the fat cat employers..who hire the illegals? ..

of course no one talks about Europeans, Eastern bloc illegals, and many other countries. Strange wouldn't you say.

[MikeW]

48. the rights of Americans ALWAYS come last

[ProudDad]

50. I seem to remember that polls regarding depriving Civil Rights for Black people

used to poll VERY WELL back in the 1950s and 1960s. In fact, depriving human beings of their rights had a lot more support than "51%" back then...

And isn't it a little fishy that they got the exact same number as the republican rasmussen "poll" recently?

And even if it reflects reality (which in racist USAmerica is entirely likely) it's based on answers from "randomly selected" ignorant fucks who couldn't understand the fucking law even if they had even bothered to read it...and were essentially LED to that result by what amounts to a push-poll.

And quite often the vast majority of the USAmerican sheeple are disastrously WRONG about most EVERYTHING!

So this "poll" really don't mean shit...

That fucked up law (pushed through by a neo-nazi, racist, mormon fucker) is racist and WRONG and is meant mainly as a vehicle for voter suppression and has little or NOTHING to do with "Immigration"!!!

On Edit:

So I'd REALLY APPRECIATE IT if you people from outside of Arizona would give those of us who live in this sick miasma of a republican wet dream the benefit of the doubt when it comes to critiquing this abomination!

We need the Feds to intervene, to STOP this Obscenity before it can begin to ruin lives, just as much as the Civil Rights Movement of the 60s needed the feds to hold off the racists...

[Egnever]

55. Absolutely spot on

Since when has doing the right thing been popular? and how come all of a sudden 51% support some how means something is right?

This is like the 10th such poll i have seen on this since this thing has been passed and every time its touted as some sort of justification of this abominable law. The sheeple will eat it up though and nod their heads as they always do and use it to justify their racist agendas.

The willfull ignorance in this country makes me madder every day.

[ProudDad]

56. And it's really sad to see willfull ignorance

so prevalent on this board too...

:hi: