Soldier defends decision to reveal murders of Iraqi detainees

[sabra]

Source: CNN

Bakersfield, California (CNN) -- A former Army sergeant who revealed the murders of four Iraqis at a canal in 2007 says he has no regrets about breaking his silence.

"I did the right thing," Jess Cunningham told CNN. "I'm not going to hide behind false brotherhood."

Nine months after the March 2007 murders, Cunningham told his Army lawyer what had happened at the canal. Eventually, three sergeants would be convicted of premeditated murder and conspiracy to commit premeditated murder.

"These men are not heroes. They're not saviors," Cunningham said.

...

He said he waited to break his silence until he returned to his military base in Schweinfurt, Germany. He said he was afraid of reporting the crime while he was in Iraq, fearing his fellow soldiers would turn on him.

Read more: http://www.cnn.com/2009/US/11/19/army.tapes.soldier.speaks/index.html

[T Wolf]

1. It'll be interesting to see how DU-'09 reacts to this. I would expect a split between the

pro-war & military and the peaceniks.

In the past, there might have been almost universal praise (here) for this soldier.

Now, not so much. After all, he has betrayed the brotherhood and his fellow warriors.

[Breathe]

5. His brother warriors betrayed him.

They also betrayed us, their branch of the military, their commanding officers, every other warrior they expected to protect them or whom they put in harm's way, their families and their obligations as human beings on this earth.

[Greyskye]

10. Well said.

:thumbsup:

[Demit]

17. That seems like an odd take on DU.

I've seen splits on the use of tasers, and smoking, and just recently mammogram screening, but not what you describe. Is it in a military forum?

[T Wolf]

18. I was commenting on the "support the troops" crowd that always defends those

"brave warriors" who are "putting their lives on the line to defend us" or other similar bullshit.

Just like the law-and-order types here, a lot of Democratic Underground is not Democratic - if defined as supporting Democratic and progressive/liberal positions (whatever the language in the DU rules exactly says). As many have commented, the center-right is well-represented here, now, not by trolls but people who actually think of themselves as Democrats but hold DLC or repuke-lite views.

[UpInArms]

19. history

http://healingiraq.blogspot.com/archives/2004_01_01_healingiraq_archive.html

in Samarra interviewing Zaydun's family, his cousin Marwan, an Iraqi ICDC lieutenant, as well as the American Colonel in command of the US force in Samarra. Here is the story.

UPDATE: I can't stress how disgusted and dissapointed I am with the people who are still in denial:
"Oh no our soldiers are good and educated, they would never do that!"
"Our soldiers would have no motive to lie".
"I would never trust a former Republican guard officer".
"I can't give judgement until the investigation is over".

Well people, picture this. Suppose I had published a similar account of Iraqi Fedayeen pushing two American soldiers in a river, drowning one of them in the process. Would you have reacted in the same manner? Would all you armchair analysts say "Oh no, lets not rush to conclusions. We should wait for the investigation results"? Would you all suddenly be so 'open minded'?

No, you would be jumping all over it crying and condemning the 'murderous' Fedayeen.

You have no idea how insulting this all is to me. And I'm getting more convinced day by day that some of you are not any different from the 'leftists' you are all so happy to bash, and that you are not really interested in hearing the TRUTH, you're only interested in hearing what you NEED to hear. Truly disgusting and pathetic.

***

I guess most of you are still missing my point. Read the last paragraph above carefully and stop screaming. Meanwhile I leave you with this quote:

"Have we not already seen enough of the fallacy and extravagance of those ideal theories which have amused us with promises of an exemption from the imperfections, weaknesses and evils incident to society in every shape? Is it not time to awake from the deceitful dream of a golden age, and to adopt as a practical maxim for the direction of our political conduct that we, as well as the other inhabitants of the globe, are yet remote from the happy empire of perfect wisdom and perfect virtue?"

[C_Lawyer09]

25. His actions are obviously honorable

Most in the military would agree with that. What I find shameful is the pigeon holing and all inclusive generalizations I've seen so much of on DU. I'm retired military, and even when I'm attempting to clarify (not advocate) a story or position I get bum rushed. Sure, there is plenty of fault to be found within the military structure, but no different than the civilian sector. After all the military is more or less a middle class microcosm of America. Moreover, I point out the sword which is wielded is done so by those whom are civilians, many of them elected. Two recent examples in which "the military" but primarily Army were summarily trashed, were the Hood story, and the female Soldier with the dependency issue story(I didnt see much comment on the follow on story). In reality there was one jacked up individual in her command, probably a Major or Lt. Colonel who needed to be put in check. Why would somebody trash an organization for the actions of a few? If some on here that are so constantly critical of the Army, and/or military as a whole had a realistic understanding of what we do and have done it would be great. The relief efforts after Katrina, in Kosovo, Haiti, and many other places are good examples. Don't equate service men and women strictly with our involvement in Afghanistan and/or Iraq. One poster on this topic said: The Army, What a bunch of Psychos. I still believe in service to country, and some of the best people I've ever known I've met in the service. A tremendous disservice is done when the military is dehumanized. Ironically, some on here who speak fairly constantly of inclusion, human rights, recognition of minorities, etc. don't have a big problem painting with a broad brush when it comes to the military.

[msongs]

2. "Be....all that you can be". indeed nt

[RaleighNCDUer]

3. The extraordinary thing here is the reporting of the murders,

not the murders themselves.

There is no doubt it happens far more often than we will ever hear. That's what happens when you have frightened people with total power and guns.

[Solly Mack]

4. the attorney for Hatley - one of the convicted - is threatening Cunningham

Court said, "If I were Sgt. Cunningham, I'd be worried that, having broken the band of brothers, something might happen to me."

[DBoon]

11. his "band of brothers" is no different than a street gang

I'd expect that sort of threat from someone who ratted out a fellow Crip

[dothemath]

13. "having broken the band of brothers" ?

WTF does that mean?

You just got your "15 min.", bro. This is a strange and wonderful world we live in. Maybe if something happens to Sgt. Cunningham, something will happen to you.
Did you think of that? (Calm down, trigger happy jerks, I am talking about prayer).

Back in the day, one would occasionally hear, "better to be thought a fool than open one's mouth and remove all doubt". In this day of the internet and YouTube and Twitter, et al (ad nauseum might fit better here), anonymity is a thing of the past more so than any time in the history of man.

And so it goes.

[L0oniX]

6. One who would try to change what is wrong with his country is the real patriot...

and I'd say that reporting crimes that occur in the military qualifies for that title.

[Altoid_Cyclist]

7. I might get flamed, but I support what he did.

I would have waited until reaching Germany also.

After seeing what happened to Pat Tillman, that was the pragmatic way to handle the situation.

[Zhade]

23. It's a sad comment on how insane DU has become that you have to worry about being flamed...

...for supporting someone who REPORTS MURDER.

[Altoid_Cyclist]

24. I know, but I've seen some rather strange posts here lately.

It's pretty much the same people most of the time, but at times I think that some people are just trying to get something started regardless of what the OP is about.

[Soylent Brice]

8. hopefully others will find the courage to come forward as well.

K&R

[gratuitous]

9. Reporting four murders is controversial

Thanks again, Mr. Bush. Heckuva job.

[UndertheOcean]

12. He did the right thing.

[dgibby]

14. I'm retired military,

and I commend him for reporting this. It was an execution, no more, no less. The fact that he didn't report it while in country speaks volumns about the people involved.

That lawyer better make it his personal business to see to it that Cunninham stays safe, 'cause he'd be the first one I'd go looking for if anything happened to Jess. What an idiot! Set himself up to be prime suspect if anything untoward happens.

[defendandprotect]

15. k i c k

[Sinti]

16. We as a people need to defend and protect men like him

I think things like this, whether it be to the detained or just to the innocent citizens is why so many War Partiers are afraid of the trials in NYC. There's a lot of stuff out there if you know who to talk to and where to look that could be brought out at trial....then there's the international community waiting to see if we're going to bite the bullet and deal it with ourselves. Confucius' curse, only I suppose it depends on your definition of what "interesting" is.

[Liberation Angel]

20. This is the tip of a humongous iceberg

I marched and camped at Tent State and the "Freedom Cage" (L'il Gitmo) with IVAW (Iraq Veterans Against the War) in Denver last year at the Dem convention and I can tell you when the antiwar veterans from Iraq and Afghanistan began to "share" their stories late at night while we tried to comfort each other in the free speech cage where we were forced to camp (on pavement under klieg lights surrounded by armed troops where we were surrounded by jail cages which could envelop us in a moment if we "acted up") I heard some stories that would suck the blood out of your marrow.

The courage of some soldiers to speak out when they know they too could be a torture victim or assassinated for their knowledge and protest is one of the ONLY thing that gives me hope for this country.

The troops who speak out against the murderous and treasonous and cowardly war activities of any in our military are heroes worthy of all the respect and honor any of us can muster.

It is they who can begin to bring these wars to an end with their witnessing and activism.

[chrisa]

21. Seems like our modern army is more like the mafia.

What a bunch of psychos.

[Zhade]

22. What kind of fucked-up country are we in where this has to be defended?!

NT!

[BreweryYardRat]

26. Guys like Cunningham are the sort of people we NEED in the military.

Decent, honorable human beings. (I can't fault him for keeping quiet until he got to safety. He did what it took to get justice.)

Scum like those three sergeants, on the other hand, need to dance on air.

They claimed they killed those detainees because other detainees kept getting released and coming back to fight again -- frankly, I'd be very dubious of any such claims...hell, of their whole testimony. Their testimony says they got fired on, went into the house they thought had been firing on them, and found four guys with a weapons cache. Just as an educated layman with no military experience, I can see a couple potential flaws in that...

***

First question: Were they sure they identified the right house?

Second question: Were those guns still hot? Was there gunpowder residue on the men's clothing? Iraq is a seriously complex situation. I can easily see some fanatical fuck setting up on the roof of a house inhabited by members of a different Islamic sect or ethnic group...then opening up on American troops so the inhabitants get the blame. (Fanatic doesn't necessarily mean "stupid.")

Third question: As for the weapons cache -- what are we talking about here? Guys with rifles and shotguns that might be legitimate home defense (backing up the "frame theory"), or stuff like RPGs that NO civilian should have?

Fourth question: Aren't there MPs or something who could go out and investigate the cache? Expecting troops to carry the sort of high-grade photo equipment needed for documentation around with them is a bit much, but couldn't they guard the site until the closest base sent out a relief and some people who are experienced in that sort of documentation and equipped for it?

***

Even if the guys they caught were the same ones who were firing on them, killing them was the wrong call.

This isn't a case of "fanatical gunmen burst into school, murder teachers and children, get caught in the act" where summary executions might be acceptable.

This is a case of "angry dumbasses MIGHT have fired on American troops." Complex situations are the whole damn reason we HAVE laws.

And besides, even if they didn't like the idea of getting them released, there are non-lethal ways of keeping them from resuming attacks. Lot of ways to accomplish that, only some of which require physical violence.

[sattahipdeep]

27. Breathe....

And all the suffering that you've witnessed
And the hand prints on the wall
They remind you how it's endless
How endlessly you fall

And the answer that you're seeking
For the question that you found
Drives you further to confusion
As you lose your sense of ground

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=102&topic_id=4148620&mesg_id=4148620

[MetaTrope]

28. Hell, he's the sort of person we need in Washington

Too bad there are only three or four there.