Cash-strapped Cuba says toilet paper running short

[robcon]

Source: Reuters

HAVANA (Reuters) – Cuba, in the grip of a serious economic crisis, is running short of toilet paper and may not get sufficient supplies until the end of the year, officials with state-run companies said on Friday. Officials said they were lowering the prices of 24 basic goods to help Cubans get through the difficulties provoked in part by the global financial crisis and three destructive hurricanes that struck the island last year.

Cuba's financial reserves have been depleted by increased spending for imports and reduced export income, which has forced the communist-led government to take extraordinary measures to keep the economy afloat.

"The corporation has taken all the steps so that at the end of the year there will be an important importation of toilet paper," an official with state conglomerate Cimex said on state-run Radio Rebelde. The shipment will enable the state-run company "to supply this demand that today is presenting problems," he said. Cuba both imports toilet paper and produces its own, but does not currently have enough raw materials to make it, he said.

One of the measures taken to address the cash crunch is a 20 percent cut in imports, which in recent days has become evident in the reduction of goods in state-run stores. Cuba imports about 60 percent of its food.

Despite the shortages, prices will be cut between 5 percent and 27 percent for some food, drugs and personal hygiene products, officials said.

...Cubans receive a subsidized food ration from the government each month that they say meets their needs for about two weeks.

Read more: http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20090807/lf_nm_life/us_cuba_crisis_toiletpaper_1

---

Lowering the prices on items that are in short supply will only increase the black market for those goods.

[doc03]

1. Back in the old days we used the Sears and Roebuck

catalog or a corn cob and we loved it.

[imdjh]

3. One of the reasons I don't romanticize the past.

Outhouses and wiping hiney with newsprint. My god, even with Charmin, indoor plumbing, and wet wipes I still get a rash now and then. Can you imagine how miserable I would have been walking out of Egypt and wandering in the desert for 40 years?

[doc03]

6. The house my father was born in was still

standing back when I was a kid, they used the newspaper for wallpaper. We ate either fresh or canned vegetables from the garden and deer, rabbits and squirrel for meat. A piece of beef or a chicken on Sunday was a luxury for most people back then. You know I think people were more happy in those days and families stuck together..

[WriteDown]

8. Yeah, lets go back to that!

I'm going to opt out though :).

[svpadgham]

12. Nothing Like aGood Laugh...

to start my day. I can't help but read the post with Mel Brook's voice in my head. :D

[UTUSN]

14. K&R #2 for t.m.i. n/t

[marshall]

82. What about using tobacco leaves?

With the health trend pushing people away from cigarettes, those leaves have to be good for something.

[imdjh]

2. 20 million rolls coming right up.

Castro, who replaced his ailing older brother Fidel Castro as president last year, also has complained that Cuba's productivity is too low.
He has taken various steps to boost output, including putting more state-owned land in private hands and pushing for salaries to be based on productivity.

Those are good long term changes. But can't we send these folks some TP?

[doc03]

4. How about the Tribune Review, American

Spectator etc.?

[Lagomorph]

26. OK

End the embargo and tell them we'll take Cohibas for TP.

[Dreamer Tatum]

78. So, Castro means to fix the problem by taking capitalist measures?

...e.g., putting public land in private hands and paying wages based on productivity?

How in-ter-es-ting.

Wonder why no one has noticed that part yet.

[Mika]

84. So many DU Cuba "experts". So little actual observation.

Gee. No one has noticed that yet? What a surprise.(NOT.) I guess that Americans have a great excuse.... After all, we are travel banned by our own government from going there (unless you are a new Obama sanctioned 1st class citizen/resident - that 1st class citizen/resident being Cuban-Americans and Cuban resident aliens ONLY - the rest of us can fuck off).

So the Cuba "experts" of DU can continue wallowing in ignorance and uninformed preconceptions of the evil "Communist Island" of the evil Dr Castro.

---

[Dreamer Tatum]

85. I don't need to be a Cuba expert to interpret what Castro said

unless, of course, he was mis-translated. :eyes:

[Mika]

86. And one doesn't need to know anything about Cuba to be a DU Cuba "expert".

I wasn't criticizing your observation.

I am criticizing the fact that our own government prevents us from going there to see for ourselves.

I have relatives in Cuba (I am not Cuban-American nor a Cuban resident alien, but have lived there in my past), but I can't legally visit them now as US policy stands.

President Obama (post his Miami flip flop on Cuba policy) has endowed Cuban-Americans and Cuban resident aliens with 1st class citizen/resident status, while the rest of us are travel banned, and for those who have never been - ignorant on the actual goings on in Cuba.

Doesn't seem to stop the DU "experts" from engaging in online stereotyping and negative fantasizing/propagandizing about the "evil island" of Dr Castro.


:hi:

---

[tocqueville]

5. Holy Shit ! how about tobacco leaves... ?

would be like smoking from the other end...

no I won't make any jokes about cigars...

[Paladin]

16. Compare George W. Bush With Barack Obama.

That's the difference between using a Cuban cigar leaf for toilet paper, as opposed to using it in making a Montecristo Corona Gorda.

How about we end the idiotic embargo immediately and stop depriving the Cuban people of basic necessities?

[tocqueville]

21. carpet bomb'em with rolls...

Operation "Streamers"

[Regret My New Name]

40. hehehe...

now I have vision of a B-52 dropping rolls of toilet paper...

[moonbatmax]

31. That calls to mind an interesting story

The 45 Steps, by Peter Crowther.
Read it in The Mammoth Book of Best British Mysteries.

I don't know how valid the science is,
but I'd be reluctant to use tobacco leaves
in loo of toilet paper.

[dysfunctional press]

65. and then use THOSE leaves to make rush's stogies...

[Ohio Joe]

7. President Obama should act on this immediately

I see this as a perfect opportunity for President Obama to ease tensions even more between the US and Cuba. Offering aid right now would be the right thing to do on many levels and could do both our countries only good.

[Berry Cool]

19. Call it "Tee-Pee Diplomacy."

Hey, fellas, we'll give you all the johnny paper you need, just lay off the threats, OK?

Too bad JFK didn't have this option during the missile crisis. Back then, we could've even offered them a choice of colors.

[Mika]

76. "just lay off the threats" You can't be serious.

What the hell has Cuba ever done to threaten us? (Since you bring up the Soviet Missile Crisis - Cuba never had any control over any of the Soviet missiles. Never. Ever.)

If Americans feel threatened by Cuba, then Americans are the weakest and, collectively, the most fearful nation on earth.

---

[Buns_of_Fire]

25. Well, we DO seem to have more than our share of asswipes in Washington... n/t

[Regret My New Name]

41. or allowing some company in the US to donate them...

I bet there are a more than few companies who would love the publicity.

[Xithras]

69. It would make less difference than you think.

There have been a few attempts to determine what the exact result on the economies would be. Cuba, in general, would contribute almost nothing to the U.S. economy. It might become the destination for a few extra vacations, but it's effect on our overall economy would be incalculably small.

Cuba, in turn, would see a relatively small boost to its economy, but the average Cuban wouldn't see much difference. Tourism would increase, but a look at other Caribbean nations quickly demonstrates how ineffective tourism is at pulling those nations out of poverty. Some of the most popular are also some of the poorest. Cuba only has one major export that might sell well in the American market, and that's tobacco. However, Cuba's tobacco plantations already operate at full volume and are unable to expand because of Cuban land laws. The overall volume of the tobacco exported wouldn't change much, but they might see a small appreciation in the price of that tobacco because American buyers are willing to spend more than their European counterparts

Cuba's other exports are already imported by the U.S. from other nations that can produce it at prices lower than those available in either country. It's also been repeatedly demonstrated that U.S. companies will largely be unwilling to relocate any production or to do any investment in Cuba until they rework their socialist employment policies. While Cuban workers are cheap, the government controls employee assignments. A foreign company building facilities in Cuba would tell the Cuban government that they need "X" number of workers, and the government provides them. The government can then change or rotate that staff without the employers permission, and the employer has no power to terminate or discipline those employees. American companies won't tolerate that, when there are dozens of nations willing to bend over backward for those jobs and make any concessions the companies ask for.

I think that the embargo is pointless and should be eliminated, but people are kidding themselves when they assume that Cuba will become some paradise once those evil Americans stop being so mean to them.

[Wizard777]

9. Rut Roh! This is the same problem the USSR had right before the fall.

I guess it's just God's way of saying, You're shit out of luck.

:rofl:

[SpiralHawk]

10. Wipe Out !

[Deja Q]

11. Oh shit...

[Boku-Wa]

13. If people could get by the sophmoric chuckles, you'd see

a different message here. So Cuba has been affected by the international crisis just like everyone else. And certainly for a small country and economy that has been sodomized by the US for decades, there are serious problems.

But Cuba tries to spread - so to speak - the impact of the crisis, similar to the war time rationing that existed in the US during WW2. So by rationing necessities in short supply they stay available. Yes, there's a black market that will benefit those with dollars, which this also existed in the US during rationing.

Certainly this a more democratic response than making these commodities only available to those with high incomes.

[robcon]

15. An economy "sodomized" by the U.S.??????

The U.S. doesn't trade with Cuba - that's a mistake, but the other 150+ countries in the world do. How has the U.S. 'sodomized' Cuba? (talk about sophomoric thinking!!!)

The problem with Cuba is that it doesn't produce much of what the world wants, so it finds it difficult to finance its imports, because its exports, since the collapse of the Soviet Union, are no longer subsidized. Venezuela, I understand, is subsidizing their imports of oil, but Cuba still remains an economic basket-case because its economic production is so poor.

Their situation, being unable to finance their imports with exports, is not unique. Not sodomized.

[Berry Cool]

20. I was gonna say, if they've been sodomized,

their butts may have worse problems than a mere TP supply can cure.

[Boku-Wa]

29. Yeah, very funny like the other sophmoric comments.

[Boku-Wa]

28. You need to do some more homework. Other countries are

prohibited from much trade with Cuba b/c the US threatens sanctions over 'trading' technology, intellectual property, etc.

The US trade embargo has sodomized Cuba.

[robcon]

34. Your credibilty has been sodomized, IMO, Boku-Wa.

Pathetic.

[Boku-Wa]

36. That's a very intelligent response. Shows how little you know

about the issue. I guess an anonymous outlet like this one provides little incentive for withholding uneducated opinions.

I'm not offended, it comes with the territory.

[robcon]

37. I assumed that anyone who says one country sodomized another

is incapable of logical discourse, and incapable of being offended.

[Boku-Wa]

47. Really? And you think that spewing free market platitudes is

intelligent?

Prices are also a system for rationing goods according to income. Cuba rations basic necessities to insure that they are available on the basis of need and not just ability to pay.

As for my comment about the US sodomizing Cuba, apparently you don't know much about the US relationship with Cuba - before and after the revolution. You just harbor the usual prejudices and the intellectual curiosity of Dubya.

[watrwefitinfor]

51. I like you already.

Welcome to DU

[Boku-Wa]

54. Thanks. I know that Dems cover a wide ideological swath, but

I really expected more reasoned discussions than I've found on this site. In fact, I'd settle for unreasoned discussion, rather than the ridiculous one liners that seem to come from Young Republican frat boys.

And it's definitely NOT underground. I'm curious where that title came from. Any idea?

Thanks again for the welcome.

[iverglas]

55. me too

But then I'm just a Canadian (who's been to Cuba quite a few times), so I don't count.

:hi:


(Oh, and when I was going to Cuba in the 70s and 80s, TP was always in short supply. I took my own to have with me when I travelled around. I guess the problem was addressed more recently, and now has re-emerged.)

[Boku-Wa]

57. Greetings and thanks. I've traveled in Mexico and Central

America but never made it to Cuba. I tried in '71 with the Venceremos Brigade, it's a long story! Cuidate

[bitchkitty]

49. You should see the Chavez threads.

They're a sewer of one-liners.

There are a few posters on this site who are very right wing and quite blatant about it. It was inevitable, I guess, since the Democratic Party has moved steadily right and in 10 years will not be recognizable.

Back to topic! I tend to doubt this hit piece too - toilet paper? That's a crisis?

[Regret My New Name]

42. I've heard that numerous times...

I have yet to see it actually refuted. Is that untrue?

[Boku-Wa]

48. Why do Americans hate and fear Cuba so much?

The Question of Cuba and the USA - A Canadian's perspetive

Why do Americans hate and fear Cuba so much? The American reaction towards Cuba is not merely the normal American xenophobia towards other nations - France, Germany, Canada, Mexico, the entire Middle East, Japan… and pretty much the rest of the world. No, this is something deeper, a chasm in the already suspicious American political psyche. Mention Iran, North Korea, Pakistan, China or even Russia and most Americans will hardly flutter their eyelids. Say Cuba and they’ll go off kilter, launch into a wild tirade and scream invectives about Castro, freedom, human rights, and Communism.

Cuba, it seems, weighs more heavily on the American mind than almost any other nation. So heavily that Americans will lash out at anyone who even suggests a more temperate approach to the small island, even to the point of legal action against citizens of other nations who deal with Cuba in their own country.

Yes, bizarre - and unethical - as it sounds, the US has taken legal action against foreigners who even remotely appear to befriend the Cuban people. Take, for example, James Sabzali, a Canadian businessman. On February 28, 2004, he stood in American court charged with 75 counts of violating a 1917 US law – the "Trading with the Enemy Act" and a count of conspiracy.

His crime? Arms? State secrets? Military blueprints? No - he sold water purification supplies to Cuba – most of which were done while he was living and working in Canada where trade with Cuba is legal.(1)

For that humanitarian – not military - business, for a mere $3 million in sales over several years, he faced a possible life sentence and up to $19 million in fines. That’s less than a single M-1 Abrams tank ($9 million). American arms manufacturers sell more weaponry to sworn enemies of America in a week than Sabzali sold water treatment systems in his career to date. But American arms manufacturers have lobbyists who pay a lot of money to US politicians and their election campaigns to keep their trade flowing. Sabzali is merely a single, honest businessman doing business that is legal in his home country.

Cont. at http://www.ianchadwick.com/essays/cuba.html

For a history of Cuban-American relations and list of sources. http://www.ianchadwick.com/essays/cubahistory.html.

[Zhade]

52. You're a conservative, so you HAVE no credibility.

NT!

[excess_3]

45. OK, name something that Cuba can't buy from Russia .nt

[Spouting Horn]

64. Fidel Castro

has sodomized Cuba. He and his family will not be going without toilet paper, that's a guarantee.

True Communism is only achieved when Toilet Paper becomes a luxury item.

[ohio2007]

17. They still have all those pictures of Fidel hanging on the walls don't they ? well...there ya go,

crises averted, nipped in the butt

[Bacchus39]

83. lots of old Che T-shirts too n/t

s

[Berry Cool]

18. Maybe Cuba needs a "Cash for Crappers" program. n/t

[flamingdem]

23. uuuuuuuuuuuuuuuhhhhh nt

[Blue_Tires]

22. maybe it's just time to end the charade and normalize trade relations

both respective economies could use the boost...Still one of the most idiotic and counterproductive chapters in U.S. foreign policy that lost any true purpose a couple of generations ago...

[SOS]

24. Despite TP shortage, Cuba ranks #7 in the Americas Human Development Index

and is #48 out of 179 nations ranked.

Cuba enjoys a higher HDI than Russia or Argentina and far surpasses almost every nation in the Western Hemisphere.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_Human_Development_Index#Complete_list_of_countries


And products that are illegal or highly taxed or scarce develop thriving black markets.
How does lowering the price encourage the black market?

[slackmaster]

38. I'll bet that index does not take availability of toilet paper into consideration

TP is a pretty high priority for me.

[roody]

53. Water works well.

[slackmaster]

62. How many people in Cuba have bidets installed in their bathrooms?

:rofl:

[Vidar]

27. I wish we had a government that had the courage to reduce prices

when its people hit hard times, instead of simply giving more money to those that caused the problem.

[robcon]

35. Lowering prices is a stupid reaction to shortages.

Unless the government wants to increase the already-thriving Cuban black market in essentials.

[slackmaster]

39. The only way our government can help people is by lowering taxes or increasing giveaways

It doesn't have any control over the price of most things, and that is generally a good thing.

[kestrel91316]

30. If this ever happens in the US, I am set. I have a large ziploc bag

full of washable flannel "wipies" of suitable size stored under my bathroom sink, lol.

It's my TEOTWAWKI toilet "paper".

[Regret My New Name]

43. eeeeeyuuuucky...

[kestrel91316]

44. Not as yucky by half as reusable cotton diapers, my dear.

And I assume my mom washed my tush with a terry cloth when I was in infant, back when there were no disposable diaper wipes.

People need to get a grip about basic hygiene. Sheesh. What a baby.

[Regret My New Name]

56. damn straight I'm a baby...

but please don't make me wear reusable diapers.

Then again, my boxers usually function very similar to washable diapers... Oh my... ewww.

[Turbineguy]

32. Maybe some fundie churches

can help out and send their supplies of never-been-read Scientific Americans.

[moonbatmax]

33. Actually, I'm sort of surprised no one's brought up THIS guy yet:

Or would this be a more freeper style? :blush:

[Vinca]

46. Maybe Americans could trade Charmin for medical care.

[EFerrari]

60. This article is pure propaganda. Cuba trades with just about everybody.

Only in America do you find anyone willing to believe this spew.

[WriteDown]

67. That would seem to fly in the face of post 55...

they must be spreading propaganda.

[IndianaGreen]

50. There is no rationale that justifies the US embargo

This is like throwing a man overboard, then throwing heavy objects at him until he drowns, then claiming that the man couldn't swim. This is the tactic the US has used since 1959 to make Cuban socialism fail.

I am sure some on this board will think that Cubans will be better off with the Religious Right running the country, Big Pharma replacing Cuban health care system, public schools being run to the ground as they are in America, Cuba's public beaches becoming the property of the nouveaux rich and large hotel chains, and a Cuban version of our MSM taking over their airwaves.

Some on this board also thought that Iraqis would be better off once we removed Saddam.

[robcon]

58. The U.S. and Cuba would be better off without the embargo.

But Cubans would be better off if they had a capitalist system, a free electoral system, and a competitive party government system.

Iraq is better off w/o Saddam.

[EFerrari]

59. Why do you think Iraq is better off?

I've seen zero evidence of that, myself.

[WriteDown]

68. For the Kurds...

it definitely is. As for the whole, that may be debatable.

[Prometheus Bound]

61. "Iraq is better off w/o Saddam," you say. For the gravediggers?

[meow2u3]

63. Stranded--stranded on a toilet bowl

Stranded--stranded on a toilet bowl
What do you do if you're stranded
and you don't have a roll
First thing you do
is take it like a man
Take it like a man
Then wipe with your hand!

:rofl:

[AlphaCentauri]

66. Home made Bidets are very handy

and Eco friendly

[robcon]

70. Cuban retirees resell news as toilet paper

"HAVANA, Aug. 27 (UPI) -- A Cuban retiree says the country's toilet paper shortage has created a lucrative business for seniors -- buying and reselling newspapers as an alternative.

The Havana retiree said he and other seniors line up before dawn to buy surplus newspapers from distribution points for factories and offices that have closed for economic reasons and shortages of electricity and raw materials, The Miami Herald reported Thursday.

The man, who requested anonymity to prevent trouble with authorities, said the seniors buy the newspapers, including the Communist party's Granma, for 20 Cuban cents -- about .007 U.S. cents. They then resell them to neighbors for up to 20 Cuban pesos, about 71 U.S. cents, for use as toilet paper.

Cuban officials were quoted by the official Radio Rebelde as saying the government plans to import a lot of toilet paper by the end of the year to ease the shortage."
http://www.upi.com/Odd_News/2009/08/27/Cuban-retirees-resell-news-as-toilet-paper/UPI-83801251409191/

[oct2010]

73. Stop the presses ! "Newspapers clogging the sewage system" - terrorism suspected

collaborators to be brought up on charges

[nodehopper]

71. in the USSR you could win toilet paper as a lottery prize...

[junior college]

72. People are always saying that the Cuban people are miserable

but whenever I see them in pictures and on TV they are always laughing, dancing, eating and seem to be generally having a great time.

[roody]

74. Or working together to make sure everyone is safe from a hurricane.

[robcon]

75. Did you ever think those pictures are propaganda, JC?

Did you ever consider that pictures of smiling Cubans are the result of state control of the press?

[Judi Lynn]

77. Not when you find them in searches and study each site long enough to determine

they were taken by individual citizens from all over the world, as there are many people from Europe, Australia, Asia, etc. who have their vacation photos on the internetS or Americans visiting Cuba for any number of reasons, including American students there with college groups studying things like organiponicos (organic gardening), or visiting Cuba privately as medical professionals, etc., people who have absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with the Cuban government. There are also photos taken by people who got to Cuba on their sailboats and took photos. Saw some just the other day.

Wake up. You won't be able to take anyone in with lame claims like that.

[Mika]

88. Um. What about Castro's socialistic health system death panels?

Think about it - how does socialist Cuba have the highest numbers of centenarians and ranks among the highest in age of mortality?

The socialist death panels pulls the plugs on all the grandparents - of course.

:crazy:


There's plenty of Americans who will believe any absurdity.

Proof ....

---

[Judi Lynn]

90. That's gotta be what they've been doing. Sure, that's it!

Those damned death panels!

[Dreamer Tatum]

79. Yeah, it's like a Chili's that never closes

It's called PROPAGANDA.

[slackmaster]

80. I'm thinking more like a Mojito ad for Bacardi rum on TV

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5RFxGn6C6ak

Only with no toilet paper in the bathrooms.

[Mika]

87. Every Cuban has a gov minder making sure they smile for tourist photos.

At least 50% of Cubans have jobs minding that the other 50% are smiling for any and all cameras.

:sarcasm:


Anyone who believes such nonsense about Cuba is out of touch with reality - or a travel banned American.

---

[Judi Lynn]

89. Those minders are given tiny, TINY guns they hold on people whose photos are being taken

by tourists, etc.

No one can see them but the other Cubans! And boy, are they ever scared to death!

http://cache.gizmodo.com.nyud.net:8090/assets/resources/2006/08/gun_tiny.jpg

[704wipes]

81. I just thought my handle needed to be in a toilet paper thread

nt