ACORN comes out swinging

[tylerdee]

Source: San Francisco Chronicle

In last night's debate, Sen. John McCain suggested that ACORN (Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now) was responsible for massive voter fraud that could destroy ''the fabric of democracy.'' Now the leaders of the community organizing group have emerged with an aggressive effort to push back.

In a conference call with reporters this morning, they've accused McCain -- whose recent ad also suggests ACORN has a role in the widespread home mortgage crisis -- of an ''outlandish'' attempt to ''hoodwink the American public'' in order to distract from what they say is his "desperate'' presidential campaign.

Read more: http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/blogs/sfgate/detail?blogid=14&entry_id=31565

[louis-t]

1. They should just laugh out loud every time McCain's

name is mentioned. I thought that was the most outragious statement he's ever made. I swear I could hear giggling in the audience when he said it.

[BayjanDem]

15. Or...

They can take a group photo of about 100 ACORN employees all flipping McCain the BIRD.

[jhrobbins]

22. Or.....

they can play the tape (maybe a video) of the speech that McCain gave at an ACORN conference, where he praised the work they are doing and telling them how wonderful they are.

I just heard this the other day and I will try to find a link-maybe it was YouTube.



OK, I found it....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CdlgiqCzch8

[obamatowin]

98. Good Find!

Mc Cain appears right near the end.

[wordpix]

116. OR, they can say McBush and the Injustice Dept should stop trying to STEAL the VOTE

via their bogus "voter fraud" prosecution-propaganda.

[keekers]

24. See The Nation's "Predatory Scapegoating" (Patricia Williams)

http://www.thenation.com/doc/20081103/williams
"Some three weeks before New York Governor Eliot Spitzer was forced to resign his office in disgrace (sex! scandal! floozies!), he published an op-ed in the Washington Post. Titled "Predatory Lenders' Partner in Crime: How the Bush Administration Stopped the States From Stepping In to Help Consumers," the piece expressed Spitzer's concern that for several years there had been a marked increase in predatory lending practices, including distortion of terms, surprise balloon payments, hidden fees and deceptive "teaser" rates. These practices, he wrote, were having a "devastating effect on home buyers." In addition, the sheer number of such transactions, "if left unchecked, threaten...our financial markets." To those in the know (OK, those few egghead "elites" not enthralled by the birth of the Brangelina twins), the situation loomed so egregious that the attorneys general of all fifty states, both Democrats and Republicans, lodged suits against the worst predatory subprime lenders. A number of states, including New York, passed laws to rein in such practices....
For it is not merely a failure to regulate Wall Street; it's a failure to govern at all. The FDA is packed with industry insiders who seem content with the gross understaffing of inspections bureaus. Animal feed laced with melamine was imported from China, consumed here and has now entered the human food chain. Nontherapeutic experimentation with pesticides on humans has been given the nod." http://www.thenation.com/doc/20081103/williams

My son and his wife are mortgage holders from CountryWide. I knew it was wrong somehow but not how bad it could get. THey only use sex to discredit a critic if there is nothing else, because they are vulnerable too.

[YDogg]

38. welcome (back to) DU

[minfellman]

97. They are doing something right if the pigs are squealing

Here in Minnesota Acorn has been very active in preventing predatory lending and fighting foreclosures. They are a great organization but it would have taken help at the federal level to stop the biggest theft from the poor and "middle class" in this country. The embers from these crimes will burn a long time, but maybe we can stop it from happening in the future. Acorn's only crime is registering people to vote while poor or not white and I know they are doing a good job if these criminals are screaming. After seeing the hatchet jobs on CNN and elsewher I went over to the Acorn office and increased my monthly contribution by 5 times. Money well spent to insure that my children and grandchildren won't be victimized. I urge all DUers to join. A small monthly donation will go a long ways to support this fine organisation.

[JonLP24]

2. Off to the greatest page..... K&R

:bounce:

[Vattel]

3. I like the quote from the GOP startegist

at the end of the article:

"GOP strategist Patrick Dorinson responds that the organization is 'fighting back hard because they're afraid. The fact that they're so vigorously pushing back tells me that there's more there than is being revealed. Where there's smoke, there's fire.'"

ACORN's protesting its innocence is taken as evidence of guilt. That is truly pathetic.

[JonLP24]

5. Hypocrisy

Like how McCain's campaign was fighting the troopergate investigation, telling people to refuse subpoenas, and refusing to cooperate.

[Vattel]

13. nice comparison n/t

[JonLP24]

30. I didn't mean to draw a comparison

I was trying to state that McCain & Co have no room to talk about challenging investigations implying that they are guilty when McCain & Co did everything they could to put the brakes on the troopergate investigation. Any innocent man or woman has a right to fully to challenge charges levied against them. As far as I'm aware of ACORN has been co-operating unlike Palin so imo they are very different in comparison.

[Vattel]

52. I understood what you meant

I should have just said "good point."

[EFerrari]

14. Projection. They accuse ACORN of voter fraud

to cover their attempts at election fraud -- suppression, caging, purging, machine fraud.

[dchill]

35. But not, I take it, OVERHEAD projection?

;)

[EFerrari]

43. That would require lifting their poor heads from their normal stoop.

:)

[SavageDem]

53. Too bad McCain is so friggin' stupid that he can't tell the difference...

...between an overhead projector and a planetarium projector.

[dchill]

68. Just like Palin - he doesn't know...

and he doesn't WANT to know.

[ailsagirl]

50. Destroyed the fabric of our democracy-- huh???

The effin' rePUGS destroyed it eight years ago. Christ :mad:

[crystalwolf]

118. McCain+Palin+GOP+Bush Stealing the election!

Its not ACORN its Bush crying Wolf again! GOP crying wolf again. They are the ones manipulating people's vote. Someone reported getting a phone call, "oh you don't have to go vote for Obama, just call this number to vote..." calls # we have recorded you vote for Obama! FAKE!

from Alaska Mudflats blog:

"I had the privilege of sitting in on a conference call with Robert Bauer, Counsel for Obama for America on Friday. The situation, I think, is in good hands. And the very fact that this strategy, that we’ve seen before, was anticipated, and is not going unchallenged is a very very good thing. Attached is a copy of the letter sent by Bauer to U.S. Attorney General Michael Mukasey.

http://mudflats.files.wordpress.com/2008/10/letter-to-mukasey2.pdf
http://www.talkingpointsmemo.com/docs/Obama-Mukasey/

Also another person from said blog above, sent a letter to Obama campaing voicing concerns about voter fraud, here is what she recieved back:

Dear Friend,

Thank you for contacting us, and for sharing your concerns about voter protection. We’ve seen what’s happened in past elections and we have a clear message:

Not This Time.

We’re running the largest election protection operation in American history. We’re not waiting until Election Day; we’ve already been on the ground for months and we hope you’ll sign up to join us at the link below.

Thousands of volunteers have been working for months to get voters to sign voter registration forms, and we’re making sure that those registrations are processed.

We’re fighting to make sure eligible voters are not illegally removed from the voter rolls.

Our professional legal team is up and running across the country, recruiting and training thousands of volunteer lawyers.

We’re ensuring that counties have printed enough registration forms, and that they’ll have enough ballots and that the voting machines will be working on Election Day.

We’re taking full advantage of early voting in key states, pushing elections officials in counties across the country to increase early voting hours to make sure that our supporters have time to vote, and time to resolve any problems that may arise for individual voters.

On November 4th, elections officials everywhere will know we’re watching, because the team we’ve been building for months will be fully deployed.

Click here to get involved - you don’t need to be an attorney to help: http://my.barackobama.com/page/s/vpcvol2

There are a lot of false rumors out there too, and you can help us fight back. If you get emails making wild claims about identification requirements or making untrue statements that people who wear Obama t-shirts into polling places will be arrested, or any other questionable claims that may discourage Americans from voting, please check with us to get the facts. For more information, please click here: http://fightthesmears.com/articles/19/tshirtrumor

Then reply to anyone who may have been misled and let them know the truth. Thank you again for your support.

Sincerely,

Obama for America

:kick: :kick: "Its about time to open a can of Whup A$$!!":kick: :kick:

[Kevin Cloyd]

21. Qui bono?

Who benefits from the alleged ACORN voter fraud? The republicans.

While there are probably some lazy ACORN workers that are submitting false registration forms I suspect that there are also some republican moles that have infiltrated ACORN that are intentionally submitting false forms as a means to divert news coverage from the vast republican election frauds including voter purges, black box voting machines that can be hacked to switch votes, and bogus vote tabulations.

The Lake County Indiana ACORN fake registration forms seemed very suspicious, Indiana has the nation’s strictest voter identification law, in Indiana a voter registration card is not acceptable identification to vote, you must present a photo ID with an expiration date issued by the state or federal government so the idea that any of these false registrations would have resulted in voter fraud is absurd.

Infiltrating ACORN and filing bogus voter registration forms would fit exactly with the pattern of voter suppression the republicans have used in the past.

[ailsagirl]

51. Exactly.

[DemoTex]

20. "Where there's smoke, there's fire." Cheney's office again?

:rofl:

[fifthoffive]

26. It's the old witch trial logic.

Throw the "witch" in the water, if she floats, she's a witch and must be killed. If she drowns, she was innocent.

[DissedByBush]

42. Innocence?

Sorry, but with several convictions of voter fraud for their members behind them and continuing evidence of mass voter fraud, any protest of innocence is laughable.

But this is all a side show that's feeding McCain's distraction from the issues. Throw the guilty in jail for 5-7, throw those who allowed it to happen repeatedly in jail for 2-5 for conspiracy, tell ACORN to clean it up or be dissolved under RICO, and let's get on with this election according to the issues.

[Pastiche423]

46. Ignorance?

You really should get to know the FACTS before you go spewing ignorance on a Liberal website.

[DissedByBush]

47. Facts? (might as well keep with the motif)

Their employees have been charged and/or convicted of voter fraud in four states. That is an extremely conclusive FACT.

In addition to that, investigations are ongoing in many more states.

I see a pattern of criminal activity here. Anyone who doesn't is just excusing their illegal acts because they help Democrats. I'll tell you, I don't want any help like that. I'd rather lose than win on fraud. Republicans can commit fraud and still feel good about themselves, but I can't.

[BronxBoy]

49. Hey Genius

But they still commit fraud and NOTHING is done about it. The Republican party has done more to deny Americans the vote that ACORN has ever done.

Wake me when their transgressions are trumpeted mightily on all the MSM

[DissedByBush]

55. So lower ourselves to their level? n/t

[BronxBoy]

56. Missing the point

ACORN hasn't kept anyone from voting.

The suppression of minority voting has long been a staple of Republican poltical strategy. WHere's the outrage and the calls for jail terms for those transgressions?

[DissedByBush]

59. Two sides of the same fraudulent coin

ACORN tries to get fraudulent votes, Republicans try to prevent valid votes.

Two wrongs make a right? I've never believed that.

[BronxBoy]

61. Funny how

people who nake that argument always want to crush the lesser offender.

Yada Yada Yada

[DissedByBush]

70. I want to crush all offenders

I simply have no tolerance for fraud in our most precious right. You apparently do if the fraud benefits us.

[rgbecker]

87. OK, Time to back up the charge " ACORN tries to get fraudulent votes". Link?

[DissedByBush]

94. I said they do fraudulent registrations

It has been proven with criminal convictions and ACORN's own admission. Look at what happened in Washington.

[bjobotts]

107. ACORN required by law to turn in all registrations even ones they flag as fraudulent

[bjobotts]

108. In last 8yrs 5...FIVE...votrer fraud convictions.NONE linked to ACORN

[bjobotts]

109. Those were accidents and unintentional fraud votes. Who is stupid enough...

[bjobotts]

110. Stupid enough to risk jail time and to make any difference in election would need thousands of peopl

[bjobotts]

112. Voter fraud does not exist.Anyone claiming is lying...like McCain/Palin

[DissedByBush]

115. Wake up

Those CONVICTED in Washington were working for ACORN.

The more you continue to deny the corruption on our side the more it will fester, and soon we'll be as bad as the Republicans.

I don't understand why so many people here are excusing corruption. Is it because it's for our side? Do you actually condone it?

[rgbecker]

88. OK, Time to back up the charge " ACORN tries to get fraudulent votes". Link?

[fascisthunter]

104. once again... ACORN Committed NO Fraud

You keep repeating a lie. ACORN reports fraud and people like you keep claiming they are behind the fraud...... seriously, stop trying to stir shit here.

[Pastiche423]

67. PAY FUCKING ATTENTION TO THE NEWS!

This is a transparent deflection of the ELECTION fraud the republicons have been perpetrating since at least 2000.

Please provide a link to your idiocy.

[DissedByBush]

76. You haven't been paying attention to the news

Investigations/arrests/admonishment for fraud in Missouri, Indiana, Ohio, Pennsylvania, Wisconsin, Michigan, Arkansas, North Carolina and Nevada.

Indictments in Ohio.

Convictions in Colorado, Washington and Missouri. Sorry, the Washington ACORN employees weren't convicted, they plead guilty.


The worst part of all this is the damage ACORN is doing to those legitimate registrations they make. There could be legitimate registrations for real people in those piles among the thousands of fraudulent registrations they're submitting.

[AlbertCat]

72. have been charged and/or convicted of *voter fraud * in four states

OK...enough!


It's not VOTER FRAUD

It's VOTER REGISTRATION FRAUD

It's crooked employees who get paid by the name, padding their lists with fake names.
It is low but no danger to Democracy. If the jerk padding his list registers Mickey Mouse and Lily von Schtupp, those two really aren't gonna show up to vote.

Voter Fraud is when someone who is ineligible to vote tries to vote.... not register.

Voter fraud is dangerous to Democracy.
Voter REGISTRATION fraud is not...it's just a pain in the ass and low.

[DissedByBush]

77. Voter fraud

is a violation of voting laws. Quite simple, and very common with ACORN.

I've heard that argument before, it doesn't actually hurt someone unless a fraudulent vote based on those registrations is made (they have been). Well, if I put a gun to your head but don't pull the trigger I didn't actually hurt you, did I? I still think I should go to jail for it though.

[AlbertCat]

106. Oh please!

Well, if I put a gun to your head but don't pull the trigger I didn't actually hurt you, did I? I still think I should go to jail for it though.

********************

No you didn't hurt me, and you should not be punished as if you did. Where did I say I approved of or thought Voter REGISTRATION Fraud should go unnoticed or unpunished anyway? Your analogy is over the top.

But it is not Voter Fraud. Threatening me with a gun is not the same a shooting me. Your definition is too broad. There is a difference that is very important. You can ignore it, but I won't.

[BronxBoy]

48. Yada Yada Yada

And while everyone is getting their panties in a twist about ACORN, the senior management of Choicepont Inc just got paid a shitload of money by Lexis-Nexis to buy their company. Choicepoint was instrumental in disenfranchising thousands of Black Americans in the 2000 election and was a key factor in getting Bush elected. No let's just jail some well meaning but flawed community organizers who have done WAY more good than bad

Let's through them in jail while people who actually SUPPRESSED votes light their cigars with 100 dollar bills on pristine beaches.

Asshole

[DissedByBush]

57. Jail for them all

I've said this before. I don't care whether someone is fraudulently registering, suppressing votes or flat-out voting more than once, I want that person in jail, period. If it is an organization, I want its officers in jail. If there's a pattern of fraud I want the organization dissolved and its assets seized as a criminal organization.

Choicepoint is a good candidate for some or all of this, and ACORN is equally. I don't care how well-meaning they are, I care about the crimes they commit. Maybe their well-meaning can be a mitigating factor at their sentencing after conviction.

Some local Republican party bosses need to sit in a cell too, but I won't hold my breath for that.

[BronxBoy]

60. Jeez you are clueless

Explain to me how the transgressions of ACORN and Choicepoitn, aided and abetted by the Repblican party are equal?

Explain to me how what ACORN has allegedly done rises to the same level as to what Choicepoint and the Republican party did in 2000?

[DissedByBush]

69. They're equal in both being guilty of voter fraud

That is a simple fact, irrefutable. To what degree they are to be prosecuted would be up to the the prosecutors depending on how bad the fraud is.

[AlbertCat]

73. They're equal in both being guilty of voter fraud

ACORN employees are guilty (apparently) of Voter REGISTRATION Fraud, not Voter Fraud.
There is a big difference.

The misinformation on this subject is astounding!

Fall right into the GOP trap, guys....fall right in.

[Vattel]

54. A few bad apples

does not make a bad apple tree. I'm open to hearing arguments that ACORN is a criminal organization. Do you have any?

[DissedByBush]

58. But one bad apple spoils the barrel

You started it with the metaphors. :)

ACORN has been cooperating in the investigations, but their methods breed this fraud. There is no other reason the fraud has been recurring for years. They either need an immediate and complete restructuring of their voter drive methodology to prevent fraud and eliminate any incentive for it, or they are complicit as an organization in criminal activity.

[BronxBoy]

62. Oh Please

Wake me when you can speak as forcibly about the more outrageous election transgressions comitted by Republicans.

Can you even talk about them. Humor those of us who have watched the most egregious election fraud committed by Republicans and NOTHING was done.

[DissedByBush]

71. Diversion is a bad tactic

"Just because they commit crimes and get away with it means you should ignore ours."

Doesn't fly for honest people.

[defendandprotect]

78. Keep in mind Acorn HIGHLIGHTS these invalid applications ...

when they submit them -- and they must submit ALL applications --

Government then ignores that Acorn has pointed them to invalid applications they

must submit -- and then months later government comes back citing them as though

they were never informed--!!!

[DissedByBush]

81. and they must submit ALL applications

Only in some states. In others ACORN submits them with no requirement to do so.

[defendandprotect]

91. ACORN BUNDLES THOSE REGISTRATIONS THAT THEY KNOW ARE BOGUS--

ACORN BUNDLES THOSE REGISTRATIONS THAT THEY KNOW ARE BOGUS--BY LAW THEY MUST STILL SUBMIT THEM!!!!!

From post #58 above ...

[Tigress DEM]

93. BECAUSE of Nevada's bags of DEM registrations (2004?) that almost got thrown out.

Some Republican with integrity could not stomach misusing the position and reported the election fraud and more care has been taken to see THAT doesn't happen again, but it requires HONEST organizations to hand in marked ballots so it shows they are following legal measures.

[DissedByBush]

95. Read again -- in some states

Florida is the one I know for sure. All or most of the others, that was ACORN's discretion to hand in the fraudulent ballots.

[defendandprotect]

96. Whatever they hand in anywhere...invalid ballots are brought to attention...

as invalid ballots ---

[defendandprotect]

113. Again..WHEN they hand them in --they are FLAGGING the invalid ballots --

[newspeak]

90. so, I bet you were absolutely offended

when Voter Outreach (a Repub voting registration machine) came into places like Nevada and registered voters and then some of the workers were told to destroy those registrations that had checked Democratic Party. This happened in the 2004 election. The judge who is now running unopposed determined that those who had registered could not re-register, thus disenfranchising those Democratic voters. Where was the national media, then? Oh yeah, it is only Democratic registrations. And, the head of Voter Outreach, instead of wearing orange, he was invited to *'s inaugural ball. Imagine that!!!!

ACORN BUNDLES THOSE REGISTRATIONS THAT THEY KNOW ARE BOGUS--BY LAW THEY MUST STILL SUBMIT THEM!!!!!

[DissedByBush]

114. Yes

It's strange that people consider voter fraud a party issue. Republicans don't think their side does it, and it's obvious that many Democrats here don't think our side does it either.

[BronxBoy]

64. No he doesn't n/t

[fascisthunter]

102. prove it.... not one case

[Tigress DEM]

92. "protesting its innocence is taken as evidence of guilt..." pure projection by guilty parties

Projection:


11. Psychology. a. the tendency to ascribe to another person feelings, thoughts, or attitudes present in oneself, or to regard external reality as embodying such feelings, thoughts, etc., in some way.


EX:

THE GOP fights like hell the more in the wrong they are, ergo, everyone else must be doing the same when they vigorously push back when accused.

[fascisthunter]

101. Nice Spin....

your attempt is what is most pathetic

[CitizenPatriot]

4. massive voter fraud...gee, McCain, this comes out today

the same day as it is revealed that Rove used MASSIVE amounts of tax payer money to fund trips for GOP operatives to push the agenda of the pukes in 2006. That is illegal. Hello?

it is also illegal to push voter fraud issues right before an election -- you might want to have a little chat with the DoJ, Inspector Fine, and the fired DoJ attorneys as I am sure they can enlighten you as to what "massive fraud" looks like -- only it's election fraud, my "friend", my clueless, elitist out of touch friend.

[DissedByBush]

79. I'm still wondering why Rove isn't in jail

Nevermind, I know why . Maybe President Obama will get the prosecutors off their asses.

But I don't see how it's illegal to push voter fraud issues right before an election, especially when that is when the voter fraud is happening. Did we lose our freedom of speech just because of elections? Oh yeah, we did, and McCain's name was on that law.

[Pastiche423]

83. Stay as ignorant as you seem on this post

Other DUers have tried to explain your use of RW talking points, yet you don't listen and keep making them.

Buh bye!

[CitizenPatriot]

84. it's not illegal to pursue the issue

it's illegal to use the pursuit of it around an election to impact the election -- hence, when they are investigating voter fraud (as they do every election), they are not supposed to leak those stories to the press. It was HIGHLY irregular for McCain to mention that on national TV, for example. The GOP does this every election to make it appear as if there is massive voter fraud, however they never have one instance of actual voter fraud in the end. It's meant to disparage the Dems, cast aspersions on them, and cause lower voter turn out. IN other words, accusations of voter fraud are not supposed to be used politically.

Election fraud, which is what the GOP is doing, is not being investigated by the DoJ (even though this is their job). The GOP perpetrated election fraud and it is up to the Dems to fight it, and the states and counties. hence, all of the lawsuits going on right now -- that Dems are paying for in large part -- just so people won't be purged from the voter rolls.

If you don't know all the story, you can goolge Fine, DoJ, election fraud, voter fraud and the fired DoJ attorneys to learn a lot about this issue -- warning, it will piss you off big time.

[shadowknows69]

6. They should sue him for slander

[qb]

7. I am glad they are setting the record straight

(from the link...

Responding to allegations made recently regarding their voter registration activities, ACORN officials said the group "has helped 1.3 million citizens from all parties and all walks of life apply for voter registration."

"In most states, ACORN is required by law to turn in every voter registration card -- even in cases where the cards are not valid," the organization insists, adding that ACORN "has reported almost all of the issues regarding voter registration cards."

Some other points they made in today's call:

*"Invalid voter registration cards do NOT constitute voter fraud. Even RNC General Counsel Sean Cairncross has recently acknowledged he is not aware of a single improper vote cast as a result of bad cards submitted in the course of an organized voter registration effort."

*"ACORN hired 13,000 field workers to register people to vote. In any endeavor of this size, some people will engaged in inappropriate conduct. ACORN has a zero tolerance policy and terminated any field workers caught engaging in questionable activity."

*"At the end of the day, as ACORN is paying these people to register voters, it is ACORN that is defrauded."

[Sam Ervin jret]

8. Where there's smoke there's fire? Not with the Rep. party. Where there's smoke there's usually

mirrors.

Deception is there best weapon.

[Matariki]

16. That statement was despicable.

As if fighting back against lies is a bad thing...

'But GOP strategist Patrick Dorinson responds that the organization is "fighting back hard because they're afraid. The fact that they're so vigorously pushing back tells me that there's more there than is being revealed. Where there's smoke, there's fire."'

[Enthusiast]

36. Deception is all they have!

The bad part is that their efforts are being rewarded. And the media is backing up any and all claims by Republicans. Don't take this lightly, this will probably cost Obama the election.

Look at it like this. Now we see why Alberto Gonzoles fired the judges. The honest judges are fired and the replacements are in place to vote on behalf of Republican efforts to suppress the vote.

Which media outlet is on our side? Fox? Certainly not. CNN? No way, all they talk about is Acorn and voter fraud, never once giving a true picture of Acorn. MSNBC? Are you kidding? Have you ever heard "Morning Joe"? So our side doesn't even get to be heard.

This is what has happened to our democracy. Worse than 2000.

[marshall]

80. Obama is going to have to take this bull by the horns

He's going to have to refute all these bogus charges the same way he is tearing down that fool Joe the Plumber.

[Boudica the Lyoness]

9. I wish McCain could get that worked up about

the real issues that are hurting Americans.

[tylerdee]

10. Amen!

[change_notfinetuning]

11. You can't go wrong hoodwinking the American public, usually, but . . .

fortunately this time is not usual. If not for the economic crisis, the sad truth is that any optimism regarding this election would be as misguided as the exuberance of a Chicago Cubs fan. It hasn't been difficult to convince Americans that up is down, black is white, night is day, war is peace, or that wrong is right. Only now, with the economy in the toilet, even though we are not in an official recession according to the experts, can the nation face the prospect that seeing "Morning in America" requires standing on one's head. Reaganomics, with its trickle-on rather than trickle-down essence, has caused it's only logical conclusion. The robust economy was always a GOBUST economy waiting to happen.

It took a possible Depression to wake up the easily hoodwinkable, and thank God for the timing of this crisis. They may be political and current events illiterates, they may be racists, they may be ignorant. But, this time, by George (W), they are not going to be stupid. You can fool some of the people all of the time, all of the people some of the time, and enough of the people every four years. But, by George (W), they can't be hoodwinked this time.

Can they? (Sorry, I'm a lifelong, diehard Cubs fan.)

[LynneSin]

12. When I went to work I saw Acorn people out on the street protesting for Healthcare

I thought it was great!

[groovedaddy]

17. They're sure getting alot of free publicity. I doubt what McCain says about them is all that

damaging. It probably has the opposite effect. McSame's denuniciation will drive more people to them.

[tylerdee]

I was thinking the same thing

[NorthCarolina]

18. The GOP is challenging over 600,000 newly registered voters in Ohio

as well as voters in several other states and yet have the gaul to sling accusations of "voter fraud" at others?

[EFerrari]

28. We should expect efforts at massive voter suppression and

election fraud in ALL of the swing states.

[The Wielding Truth]

41. Don't the registration applications have to get authenticated

before they are issued? How could they be challenged if the counties where they are registered, are overseen by Dems and Repubs? These county offices may be overwhelmed and annoyed by the bad applications but don't they ahve the responsibility to get the good registrations to the voters lists.

[tylerdee]

99. I thought the same thing

[indepat]

19. Outlandish attempts, often successful, to hoodwink the American public are what 'pukes do best, else

they would not get even 20% of the vote in any national election and would win very few Congressional seats. :P

[JohnWxy]

23. Given the Republican party's animosity towards increased participation in the voting process by

citizens it's not surprising they would be attacking such a laudable organization as ACORN.

The Republican party has a history of vote suppression and voter intimidation. I guess it's not un-expected they would be hostile to any orgainzation which promotes increased participation in the democratic process by our citizens.

It's a clear admission of their fear of and hostility toward increased citizen participation in running our government. They work for the powerful and wealthy who want to limit democratic participation by the citizenry. What a shameful motive to be so obviously admitting to.


http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=108x134110

RECOMMENDED!

[bushmeister0]

25. Here comes the FBI.

AP reported about 40 minutes ago the FBI is looking into the activities of ACORN. Nice to see the Justice Department isn't being used a a partisan battering ram anymore.

I like this part:

"House Republicans have been pushing for the Justice Department to investigate ACORN, calling on Attorney General Michael Mukasey to make sure ballots by ineligible or fraudulent voters are not counted on Nov. 4."

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20081016/ap_on_el_pr/voter_fraud_fbi

By "ineligible or fraudulent voters read Democratic votes.

Who would all these zillons of fraudulent voters be anyway? I mean, if you're an American adult you have the right to vote, right?

[EFerrari]

27. FBI is as rotten as the rest of the Bush DoJ.

They won't find anything. But, I fully expect them to keep pushing on this.

[bushmeister0]

31. Well, if the FBI is looking into this there must be something to it, right?

What a pathetically desperate maneuver. Lucky they got the likes of David Iglesias and Co. out of the DoJ. Now they can really get after all this massive fraud going on.

I expect they'll drop this whole thing at about 12 am Nov. 5.

[EFerrari]

32. Agree. And meanwhile, all kinds of people will be harrassed

and intimidated on their way to an election. I can't wait until we have a new president -- a brainiac who surrounds himself with smart people. We're going to need every single one of them to clean up this mess.

[bushmeister0]

29. Maybe, they should go after Joe the Plumber?

According to the NYT, his voting registration is a little fishy.

"Mr. Wurzelbacher is registered to vote in Lucas County under the name Samuel Joseph Worzelbacher.

'We have his named spelled W-O, instead of W-U,' Linda Howe, executive director of the Lucas County Board of Elections, said in a telephone interview. 'Handwriting is sometimes hard to read. He has never corrected it in his registration card.'”

http://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/10/16/joe-in-the-spotlight/?hp

Maybe he's voting as both Worzelbacher and Wurzelbacher? Not that really needs to be looked into.

[The Wielding Truth]

105. He may be doing us a favor. Everyone gets to see how McC

jumps on unsubstantiated positions and has to retract his strong stands. It's so embarrassing for him and his campaign and his party.

It shows again his bad judgment and lack of investigation and study of his actions. We can't afford his recklessness when it comes to the important decisions that our President must make everyday.

This will serve as another, in your face, example of his erratic, shot the dice, personality.

[fascisthunter]

33. Very Good....

[underpants]

34. Dorinson, that smoke is coming out of your ass just like your spin

But GOP strategist Patrick Dorinson responds that the organization is "fighting back hard because they're afraid. The fact that they're so vigorously pushing back tells me that there's more there than is being revealed. Where there's smoke, there's fire."

[amb123]

37. From the M*A*S*H Episode "Are You Now Margaret?"

Congressional Aide: "Where there's smoke, there's fire!

Hawkeye Pierce: "Yeah, just ask Joan of Arc!"

Where there's smoke, there's fire! - The Battle Cry of the McCarthyist Smear Merchant!

[EFerrari]

44. Exactly. And Margaret needed friends who knew "how to look"

just like in baseball.

[emlev]

39. NEUTRALIZE THE LIES!

Every time you hear a lie about "voter fraud," which the corporate media and the GOP are pushing as a way to disenfranchise voters and detract attention from the real issue of election fraud, please give a small donation to a group working FOR democracy!

More at the Velvet Revolution Election Protection Strike Force, including a list of several groups you might consider donating to, including ACORN.

[chelsea0011]

40. This is nothing more than the Republicans hatred for working/urban families that

live in cities. They hate these people. It is the reason they always talk about samll town America as the place where real Americans live. The Republican Party are racist to the core and McCain didn't fool anyone yeaterday with is over the top charge.

[mikec11]

45. MUST READ for stock market - Democrat President = BIG market gains!

pass this link around so we can hit the GOP with facts

http://www.buysellshort.com/dow.htm

[jeff30997]

66. "McCain didn't fool anyone yesterday with is over the top charge."

Oh I'm sure that he certainly fooled a lot of fools AKA his supporters. :evilgrin:

[chelsea0011]

100. Can you fool a lemming?

[Joe Chi Minh]

63. Yes, Patrick "Dumbo" Dorinson, submissive acquiescence to the

accusations would conversely have proved that the accusations were false. Not.

With an apologist such as Dorinson, either accusing them on such an incredibly stupid basis, either haplessly or in bad faith, of course, Acorns' vehement response to the Republicans scurrilous, false witness was clearly "just what the doctor ordered". Truth is the only remedy for false witness - together with a firm grip on the collar of the malefactors.

[mistertrickster]

65. It's another CONspiracy by poor and powerless people! Damn them!

You have to wonder why if the poor and powerless are able to bring down the world financial system (subprime mortgages) and steal elections, they're still poor and powerless.

Are the RepubliCONs really that dumb to believe their own propoganda?

[humbled_opinion]

74. HYPOCRISY

The rethugs steal elections almost every year and they have the nerve to accuse Community Organizers?

Oh thats right Community Organizers code word for minority inner city people... those people... That One .... I see... so those ones are gonna steal the election because of course anyone can see

that America wants more of the BUSHCO years...

What a JOKE....just not funny.

[AlbertCat]

75. ONE MORE TIME

It's not VOTER FRAUD

It's VOTER REGISTRATION FRAUD

It's crooked employees who get paid by the name, padding their lists with fake names.
It is low but no danger to Democracy. If the jerk padding his list registers Mickey Mouse and Lily von Schtupp, those two really aren't gonna show up to vote.

Voter Fraud is when someone who is ineligible to vote tries to vote.... not register.


Don't fall for this GOP malarkey!

[defendandprotect]

82. They get paid by HOUR and Acorn REPORTS invalid applications ...

when ALL the applications are submitted.

[Don Davis]

85. Guess Who’s On ACORN’s Registration List? Joe the Non-Plumber!

http://satiricalpolitical.com/?p=4068

[Life Long Dem]

86. McSame last night from the transcript.

"We need to know the full extent of Senator Obama's relationship with ACORN, who is now on the verge of maybe perpetrating one of the greatest frauds in voter history in this country, maybe destroying the fabric of democracy."

Not much of an exaggeration is it?

[ut oh]

89. The proverbial damned if you do, damned if you don't...

This is classic Repuke strategey:

"But GOP strategist Patrick Dorinson responds that the organization is "fighting back hard because they're afraid. The fact that they're so vigorously pushing back tells me that there's more there than is being revealed. Where there's smoke, there's fire.""

Of course if ACORN didn't respond that very same person would have said something similar to:

It's obvious ACORN is doing something underhanded, otherwise they'd be responding to the attacks by now. Why are they saying nothing? Have they got something to hide?

[fascisthunter]

103. Awesome... and now the Freeps are FLipping Out over this

Awesome... spin away ya lying pathetic losers.

[EFerrari]

111. Exactly. I've come to so admire ACORN this week.

They are now on my donation list and I'll do anything to support them.

Thanks, freeps!

[gorbal]

117. I know I have heard so much good about them.

I know....Obama is being targeted for representing them as an attorney and teaching "leadership" while I googled McCain and "Linked" and found he is much more closely related to people and groups who actively commit atrocities-

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x4241475