Japan shows whale slaughter to 10-year-olds

[Barrett808]

Source: London Daily Telegraph

Video: http://article.wn.com/view/2008/06/27/Tenyearolds_watch_whale_slaughter/?template=whaling%2Fmediumphoto.txt


Japanese children as young as 10 are watching whales being slaughtered to teach them the "cultural importance" of Japan's controversial commercial whaling industry.

As the whaling season gets under way, children in Wada, 50 miles south-east of Tokyo, have been on field trips to see the first Baird's beaked whales of the year winched up the concrete slipway and carved up with razor-sharp flensing knives.

Smartly dressed and in bright yellow caps, the children took notes and sketched parts of the 36 foot whale as it was sliced apart. From their small boats, local fishermen will harpoon up to 26 of the whales during the three-month season. Wada is one of just four communities permitted to hunt whales.

Much of the blubber is carved into bricks that are sold to local people, most of whom have eaten whale all their lives, and the remainder is sold to supermarkets.

Japan defies the International Whaling Commission's 1986 ban on commercial whaling by claiming that its catches are for scientific purposes and that the by-product of this research is not wasted.

Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/news/whale-watch/tenyearolds-watch-whale-slaughter/2008/06/27/1214472734076.html

---

This is the photo that comes with the story and caption, but as onehandle points out below, there aren't any Japanese people here. This looks like a stock photo of the Faroese "grind hunt".

[spooked911]

1. Barbaric, disgusting, horrible

Whales are beautiful creatures and should be protected at all costs

[alarimer]

2. With any luck this will backfire.

And create a bunch of anti-whaling people.

[nachoproblem]

12. Don't worry, it's doomed.

The Japanese have been trying to force their children to like whale meat by institution for a long time, and you know how well that works with anything else. It's like fruitcake that bleeds. No way will it last beyond this generation.

[Algorem]

3. sure that's not suicide class?

June 19, 2008
Japan gripped by suicide epidemic

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/asia/article4170649.ece

[OhioChick]

4. Beyond disturbing.....

:puke:

[kristopher]

5. I don't see anything wrong with living in the reality based community

I only wish that every child here had to go to a beef/pork/chicken slaughterhouse/processing plant and make sketches of what they see there.

[onehandle]

6. Where are the Japanese people in that photo?

I think that photo doesn't go with this story.

[Barrett808]

7. Indeed, this looks much more like the Faroese "grind hunt"

Which is similarly horrifying.

[flvegan]

8. That would be correct.

[LeftyMom]

9. Here are some links to photos from the correct town.

Here's a shot of schoolchildren watching a whale being disassembled at Wada:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/japan/2200175/Japanese-10-year-olds-taken-on-school-trips-to-whale-slaughter.html

another whale slaugher pic from Wada:
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/19352213/

here are several pictures of the whale slaughter process at Wada:
http://www.alertnet.org/thenews/pictures/MIN505.htm

another photo set:
http://www.zimbio.com/pictures/KFAZqPQiMQW/Fishermen+Process+Whale+Caught+Approved+Coastal

[Barrett808]

10. Thanks, LeftyMom!

Too bad my editing period just expired. X(

[LeftyMom]

11. No problem. I was surprised how many pictures I could find.

Since so many people get roughed up taking pictures of the drive fisheries. Though these pics all appear to be staged shots where the whale is already dead, rather than shots of them dying at the shore.

[rainbow4321]

13. No kidding..

Looks more like a crowd in, oh, Sweden, than Japan! Bizarre.

[XemaSab]

14. That was my first thought

XOMG! It's a village of albino Japanese people! :o

[ladjf]

15. Sometimes I fear that simple blood lust is behind the whale slaughterer's

motives. If true, the Japanese and other nationalities that are continuing to hunt whales for no logical reason, have some serious philosophical, cultural issues that need to be addressed.

[kristopher]

16. You mean like we continue to eat beef for no logical reason?

What do you actually know about the reason the Japanese continue to engage in whaling? Better yet, what do you know about why Westerners have suddenly turned against whaling without having a reason that passes the basic logic smell test.


I don't like the killing of whales, but the sanctimonious bordering-on-racist criticisms that are thrown at them are just as disturbing as the Japanese behavior.

[ladjf]

17. Kristopher, I have repeatedly supported your good posts and

arguments in the area of energy production.

I don't know why you decided to jump all over me with the race accusation concerning the whale slaughters.

The only reasons I've heard for the continued whale hunts were that hunting whales was part of their culture. The Japanese are unable to sell all they slaughter and are giving the meat to school lunch program in an attempt to revive interest in eating whale meat. Further, the continue hunting under the ruse of "research".

I'm not sure why Westerners have ceased their interest in whaling. Could be that it wasn't very profitable and perhaps some environmental issues became important to them.

As for your presumptuous accusation of "racism", I clearly included other Countries, which primarily means Norway in the group. So are you saying that I was "racist" in regard to the Japanese but not so in regard to the Norwegians or I was racist about both?

Anyway, I am most definitely not a racist. I am a person who loves life and is against the senseless
misuse of life. In fact, I don't give a damn about race one way or the other. That is to say, I have no racial pride or shame, nor to I evaluate others on that basis. And as a result, I am as willing to
criticize one race as another, including my own.

People eat beef for some very logical reasons to well know to you for me to have to list them. Personally, I eat very little beef, but make up for that in fish and poultry. Ethically, it would probably be better to go vegetarian. However, I feel that if fish and poultry are cultivated without harming the environment, it's not too far off the ethical scale to do so.

Kristopher, if you consider my speculation that those who are continuing to kill whales might be doing it just for reasons of blood lust to be on a par with those who are sailing the high seas with modern kill ships and murdering whales, that are near extinction, by the thousands, I would have to have doubts about how you evaluate things.

[kristopher]

18. You don't see it, that's fair enough.

Then it incumbent upon me to share with you what I see.

You have asserted that the Japanese are 'murdering' whales that are "going extinct".

In the first place, none of the whales that the Japanese have taken are even close to being in danger of going extinct. You have, however, clearly displayed your real objective. You object not because the whale is in danger of going extinct, because it isn't; you object because you have experienced a shift in the structure of your morality. If you had used the term 'murder' in reference to whaling in 1938, I suspect most people would have thought you a bit touched in the head.

Now, let me be clear, I also have experienced this shift in values. I also place a special value on the unknown potential of a whales intelligence. While I respect other life forms in general, I can't help but be more sympathetic to the creatures who have minds. Be it my dog, a big cat, a horse, a simian or ape relative, an elephant or a whale; when there is a connection possible there is a special bond possible.

What is important in my view is that people stop caricaturing the Japanese on this issue. They haven't gone along with us on this but the problem, in my view is that they simply haven't been given the courtesy of an honest and open discussion. Instead of that the approach by Western representatives on this matter has been deceitful and slanderous.

If you really want to stop the whaling, get together about 5000 people who will go to Japan and stand around the subway stations passing out leaflets saying something like "Please forgive us for caring so much about whales that we must ask you to change for our benefit. We understand it is very hard to make such changes under harsh criticisms and unfortunate statements of arrogance. We humbly ask you to please understand that we have no choice. Our new understanding of the whale's intelligence has made us feel that to kill a whale it to kill a human; that to eat a whale is to eat a human. Surely you can understand our feeling. If you felt we were eating people how could you endure us? Please, we beg you, stop."

No one, not once, has had the courtesy to be honest with the Japanese on this subject. The reason? Because to admit the motive is to be reduced to asking for their understanding. To ask for their understanding is to place yourself in a vulnerable position. So we argue from arrogance instead and then call them bloodthirsty for refusing to succumb to our coercion.

[Doremus]

19. If there's no profit in it, why do they do it?

From what I've read they have to stockpile unsold whale meat and force school districts to serve it for lunch.

Doesn't sound like a profitable enterprise to me. If it isn't profitable, what is the motivation?

Are you saying they're doing it to spite those who criticize them?

[LeftyMom]

21. Political advantages in the fishing villages, and nationalism.

There really isn't much demand. Whale is really only a traditional food in a handful of villages, everywhere else it's a food associated with postwar-deprivation and poverty. Think something that had all of the economic and cultural associations of beans, spam, SOS and karo, along with the ethical repuation of veal. Can you imagine what a hard sell that would be in trend-driven and modernity obsessed Japan? Which is why they try to get the kids used to eating it, they'd have to reverse some enormous societal trends to increase demand enough to sustain a profitable private whaling industry (the whaling fleet was bought by the national gov't a few years back when the fishing companies pulled out.)

They also use the stuff for dog food, because there's that much surplus.

[kristopher]

24. That's one perspective, and not untrue, either.

But it isn't the entire story. Have you ever had someone try to make you publicly do something by using a tactic that, if you submit, you would be made a fool of in your family's eyes?

That is the best metaphor I can give for what has thrown a wrench into the diplomatic works. I've talked to hundreds of Japanese on this topic and it is always the same. The can't back down until we ask them properly to do so. To bow to our will on this topic is unthinkable as long as we refuse to ask them, in a manner crafted to their cultural outlook, to stop.

If it means this much to us, we need to show them and treat them as trusted friends instead of duplicitous antagonists.

[kristopher]

22. Sheer cussed stubbornness and national pride.

It isn't just "criticism" it is deceitful methods, dishonesty about motives and arrogance in failing to really try and understand them.

Look at the history of colonialism and try to spot the one, single lone country that avoided being co-opted into the colonial system. Right, that would be the Japanese.

They agreed to a system of whaling with US when our national values were the same as theirs, the mission of the organization was proper management of an exploitable resource. Along the way, we changed the rules and never really asked them if it was OK; we more or less shoved it down their throats by bringing non-whaling nations into the process to stack the deck in our favor.

Not once has there ever been a request for the Japanese to understand our change. We treat it as if we are ashamed of our own values by not defending it for what it is - we have extended the murder/cannibalism taboo to cover whales. Believe it or not, the Japanese approve of the merits of that argument.

[Barrett808]

25. In addition to the reasons listed upthread, Japan is also laying claim to the last ocean biomass

As the oceans are strip-mined of biomass, Japan wants to be sure to have a large share of the last fish.

Then, as the oceans become acidified and anoxic due to human carbon emissions, we can fight over the remaining jellyfish. After that, the oceans will be filled, top to bottom, with anaerobic algae and bacteria, which will provide yummy protein but with the unfortunate side effect of mass extinctions on land due to hydrogen sulfide emissions.

:)

[ladjf]

20. Well Kristopher, you certainly aren't lazy. That's good.

There are so many other terrible issues facing the inhabitants of Earth that I must say, saving the whales isn't in the top ten for me. If I spent half of my life savings to go to Japan to protest the whale slaughter I would have wasted my money and time and would have had no effect on the policy of the Japanese whalers. And, by the way, why do you keep harping the fact that I oppose Japanese whaling? I also oppose Norwegian whaling just as much.

And,why should we deal "honestly" , as you put it, with the Japanese when they are dealing dishonestly with us by claiming to be using the dead whales for research.

You say that "I don't get it". You say that I'm a racists and that I'm arrogant.

You are trying very hard to beat me down with major insults to my intellect and ethics.

What I do get is that the Japanese and the Norwegians are continuing kill whales, when their only explanation is that it is the culture. They can't even sell all of the meat. And as for my speculation that perhaps they might enjoy the killing,I don't think my suspicion is as outrageous as you seem to believe that it is.

Personally, I think that the human race in general is an extremely brutal species and America actions in recent years don't exonerate us at all.

Bush and Cheney forced the Iraq war on us using false pretenses for two reasons (1) to get control of Iraqi oil and (2) the help the Republicans win the President al elections of 2000 and 2004.
Why would invading Iraq and hanging Saddam help in the elections? Because the rank and file Republicans relished the idea of going over to Iraq and killing those "rag heads" asses. No matter that they had nothing to do with 9-11. No matter that they have not taken any aggressive actions against us. They were plotting to make nukes that they were going to use against us.

I believe that many of the people that voted for Bush were people who love the idea of killing the
sub-human Iraqis for reasons that they themselves didn't fully understand. It was a mixture of race, culture and religious hatred. All bad.

So please Kristopher, lets not get bogged down in the whale thing. It's peanuts compared to the massive overthrow of our government that has been carried out during the past eight years.


You don't agree with my disapproval of the whalers and I don't agree with your assessment of my intellect and character. But, I wouldn't have even bothered to respond to your post except for the fact that I have read some very constructive posts by you in the area of renewable energy issues.
Keep up that good work.

Ladjf, your arrogant, stupid racists.

[kristopher]

23. I don't disagree with your assessment of our capacities

I'm just add that there can be in each of us the fundamental elements of such actions. How well are we equipped to judge the degree of our own biases and prejudices? You said a brutal and wrong thing that attributed evil intent where there is none; yet you object that I've attributed malign motives to you unfairly and untruly.


I don't attack your intellect, however by saying that you don't understand. You clearly don't and you aren't interested in addressing that lack. That's fair enough and honest enough for me. So please, feel free to consider yourself intelligent, you have my permission...

Arrogance is a common American trait that we are much too often blind to; so we can go forth on that point as kindred spirits.

[Number9Dream]

26. Against whaling, but defending whalers

If you are against whaling as you sometimes claim, why do you invariably defend whalers and attack anti-whalers? We've had some good intellectual go-rounds in the past. I respect your intelligence, so I'm disappointed that your leaflet idea has been your only suggestion to help end whaling. There are a number of native Japanese anti-whaling activists (some of whom were recently arrested in Japan) and they understand that the whaling industry won't be stopped with leaflets. I just wish someone who claims to be against whaling would spend less effort defending whalers, and offer more suggestions to end the slaughter.

[kristopher]

27. My suggestion is a serious one and, I think, the only chance for change

I have an understanding those Japanese activists probably lack - I know better how the Japanese interact with Westerners.

I've a long history in the country, I've lived there and studied their culture at university there. I've spoken at length with hundreds of Japanese from all backgrounds on this topic. The fact is they are insulted by what they perceive as our arrogance. We made a pact with them then we changed the rules. To the Japanese, that actually is no big deal, they change the rules in important contracts all the time and there is little friction that results. What we did wrong was failing to understand our own motives which led us to use obviously contrived and increasingly weak rationales to justify our desire that they should accept our point of view. When that failed we brought in nonwhaling countries and forced a vote to enact a "temporary" halt to whaling. When it became clear that this was just another ruse they resorted to thumbing their nose at us with their equally obvious sham "research whaling".

Leaflets aren't going to stop the whaling, but a sincere, sizable, well publicized and public apology made directly to the mass of the Japanese people would put the whaling decision makers in a completely untenable position. The Japanese ethic that places value on harmony is compelled to recognize sincere pleas addressing unbearable actions that can be adjusted.

No one can ultimately predict how complex interactions like that I propose will turn out. But I think this is the only real chance of achieving change in the behavior of the Japanese. Trust me, they are as sick of dealing with it as we are, but to back down in light of our arrogance would be unthinkable - unless we give them the means of doing so honorably.

[Barrett808]

28. Your suggestion strikes me as similar to the Grenpeace approach...

...in which Greenpeace activists have sat down with Japanese folks and eaten whale meat with them.

The other approach that may bear fruit is to publicize the large-scale taxpayer handouts that subsidize the (unprofitable) industry. This has started to happen, with front-page coverage in Asahi Shimbun. The "pocket-book" appeal should get some traction with Japan, don't you think?

[kristopher]

29. No, I don't.

The issue isn't the economics of whaling, it is wounded national pride.

I don't see the similarity with Greenpeace unless they were trying to explain the shift in OUR values. It doesn't take much, just the acknowledgment that our feelings are formed in the same manner as are taboos against murder and cannibalism. We should acknowledge that it isn't a rational decision, it is an evolution in morality brought on (IMO) by distance from the reality of starvation. Many Japanese alive today have experienced starvation firsthand. How many generations has it been since the West has had to face such a reality? I believe that difference is at the heart of the different values.

If you haven't seen it, I'd recommend a manga that is shown in every Japanese elementary school: Hotaru no Haka (Grave of the Fireflies). It deals with two children in Japan trying to survive the war, and it is an excellent insight into the memories that permeate the japanese culture even today.

I think the Japanese will change as a favor to us, but I wouldn't expect a real shift in cultural awareness until another generation reaches maturity.

[Barrett808]

30. K, thank you for the perspective. n/t

[Zachstar]

31. This is a good thing.

Because they will likely not support it when they become adults after seeing how it is done.