Remains of Nine More Women Found in Canada's Worst Serial Killing Case

[rodbarnett]

By Jeremy Hainsworth Associated Press Writer
Published: Jan 28, 2004

VANCOUVER, British Columbia (AP) - The discovery of the remains of nine more women raised the possibility that authorities will file more murder charges against a pig farmer alleged to be Canada's worst serial killer.
The latest discoveries, announced by police Tuesday, bring the total number of confirmed dead to 31.

Six of the latest victims vanished from Vancouver's drug-infested downtown eastside, authorities said. Their remains were found at a farm owned by Robert William Pickton.

Police did not disclose whether the remains of the other three victims were also found at the farm. Those women have not been identified.

Pickton, 54, is charged with 15 counts of first-degree murder in the disappearances of women over the past 20 years. An additional 7 counts were expected. Authorities recovered the remains of 22 women at the farm, identifying them with DNA.

http://ap.tbo.com/ap/breaking/MGA7P42CZPD.html

[Screaming Lord Byron]

1. I believe there's 64 or so missing women from the lower east side

so, statistically, there's more to come I'm afraid. At least, I hope they find something of them.

[RobertSeattle]

2. Green River killer and now this

Is there something about the Pacific Northwest that causes this?

[stevedeshazer]

11. Can't put my finger on it

There are a lot of serial killers from western North America. Maybe it's the climate...dark, cold, and wet much of the year.

Robert Pickton - Vancouver area
Gary Ridgway - Seattle area
Dayton Rogers - Portland area
Robert Yates - Spokane area
Kenneth Bianchi - Bellingham area
Ted Bundy - all over the NW and elsewhere
Randall Woodfield - I-5 from Washington to No Cal.

And many more.

[bubblesby2002]

3. Some of these girls would still be alive today...

...if the police had paid any attention to the families, friends of the missing girls when they were first informed that they were missing. Instead the cops told everyone that hookers often left town for more lucrative markets, they ran away, they went elsewhere when their pimps told them to. etc etc.

The cops also knew about a place called Piggy's where parties were often held. The cops also knew that Robert Picton had tried to murder someone previously, and had beaten girls before.

But they didn't do anything. Why because these were throw-away people. Hookers, drug addicts, low-lifes.

I can still remember statements from the Vancouver Police at the time maybe 20 or 25 women were missing. "there is nothing to link these cases together".

I hope at trial everything comes out in the open including the VPD's part in the case.

The whole thing still pisses me off completely.

[rocktivity]

6. Originally posted by bubblesby2002

...The cops...didn't do anything. Why because these were throw-away people. Hookers, drug addicts, low-lifes...

Then the killer's lawyers try to plead insanity by claiming their clients don't have the capacity to know right from wrong. Funny how they always seem to know that the "right" way to not get caught is to hide the bodies and victimize people whom the cops won't look for!

rocknation

[iverglas]

7. actually

Then the killer's lawyers try to plead insanity by claiming their clients don't have the capacity to know right from wrong. Funny how they always seem to know that the "right" way to not get caught is to hide the bodies ...

Doing things like concealing evidence of the crime is usually a pretty good indication that the person *did* appreciate the nature of his/her actions, so you're right on that point -- and pleading insanity (in Canada, "not criminally responsible on account of mental disorder") might not be what most lawyers would think wise.

By the bye, the most difficult cases in this respect are psychopaths, who fully appreciate the nature of their actions and the effects on other people and just don't give a shit, and are pretty much unaffected by threats of punishment. Dangerous they often are, and obviously wildly nuts, but not "not criminally responsible", and not capable of rehabilitation by any means we know of, or likely to be affected by a stint in prison. Lots of common or garden criminals have related personality disorders -- lack of impulse control, inability to foresee consequences (for themselves), lack of empathy -- but are somewhat more amenable to threats of punishment and/or behaviour modification techniques.

I'm sure that the killer(s) of the Vancouver women (for the benefit of bubblesby2002, women do not become children - "girls" - by virtue of being exploited for their sexual services) has some pretty serious psychological problems, but I tend to doubt that they'd amount to "not criminally responsible on account of mental disorder".

... and victimize people whom the cops won't look for!

Vancouver's downtown east side, by all accounts, is a place of some awful misery. The current problem is escalating gang (drug-related) violence and killing.

Obviously, these women were victims long before they were killed, and we failed them in many ways long before we didn't take their disappearances seriously.

I might think, though, that it is our own overall view of them as expendable, rather than the specific fact that their deaths are not vigorously investigated, that played more of a role in the killer's choice of victims. He killed them because of who they were, probably for more reasons than just that there was a better chance of not getting caught. Both his actions and our failure to vigorously investigate their disappearances stem from the same disregard for them.

And we're left with the problem of how to protect people whose own problems -- drug addiction, lack of skills, serious psychological and emotional problems often stemming from abuse -- lead them to put themselves in inherently dangerous situations.

.

[bubblesby2002]

9. Thank you for bringin the above to my attention.

In fact some of them are "girls" and if I offended you by using that term, then pardon me. The ages of the missing range from 16 to over 40.

On the whole your observations are correct. It is society that looks at them as expendable not just the system. And I agree with you.

I have actually met Robert Picton, and aside from being wierd looking he was actually kind of normal. The circumstances, however, dictated he be amenable. He was appealing the property assessment on his farm along with his brother.

Further it wasn't only marginalized people who partied at Piggy's. High school kids who had no where else to party would hire the place and drink and smoke pot there.

[DrWeird]

4. Glad they found remains.

The last I heard of the case all they found were purses and shoes, and investigators were worried they wouldn't find any remains on the concern that he had fed all the victims to his pigs.

[yellowcanine]

5. Mass graves in Canada? When do we invade?

Canada has oil also.

[iverglas]

8. sorry

But I think I find that remark disrespectful.

Not everything in the world has to do with US foreign policy. There really are some serious social and political issues in this story, some of which are even common to both the US and Canada, and all of which, like the victims here, do deserve serious consideration and not just to be taken another opportunity for a throw-away USAmerican-centric remark.

.

[yellowcanine]

10. Didn't mean to offend - it is a slam on Bush

It was satire designed to point out the absurdity of the Bush justification for war in Iraq. I agree it is a little over the edge and this may have been the wrong forum for it. So I am sorry that I offended you.