Chavez Says Bush Belongs In Asylum For WW3 Comment

[Purveyor]

Source: Reuters

PARIS (Reuters) - Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez said on Tuesday that U.S. President George W. Bush belonged in a mental asylum for referring to the possibility of World War Three if Tehran developed nuclear weapons.

--
"Bush spoke of the possibility of this Third World War and the use of the atom bomb," Chavez told a news conference in Paris, where he met his French counterpart Nicolas Sarkozy.

"A Third World War? With an atom bomb? He said it, with an atom bomb. There would be no more world. The world would end. Humanity would no longer exist," he said, speaking through an interpreter who translated his comments into French.

"I think he has to be put in an asylum. He has to be put in an asylum," said Chavez, an ally of Tehran, adding that Iran was not building nuclear weapons, echoing Iran's own denials.



Read more: http://www.reuters.com/article/politicsNews/idUSL2062324220071120

[kurth]

1. Jail, not asylum

[boricua79]

6. actually

when someone casually advocates for World War III, I'd say that's pretty insane.

Besides, we're talking about "I talk to a higher father" here...mr. "I like to put firecrackers in frogs and blow them up" here.

Plenty of evidence of insanity on record.

But Jail will do too as well (he deserves it.

[coalition_unwilling]

123. Trial, not jail (unless we are willing to join Bush in

denying habeas corpus and "presumed innocent" until proven guilty).

Of course, one outcome of the trial could be a lengthy (for life) stay in an asylum for * and his cronies. Thereby I square the circle of Chavez' and Kurth's comments :)

[meegbear]

2. The Fletcher Memorial Home

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Dpyjvo3XWk

[reggie the dog]

29. "for incureable

tyrants, and kings"

or was it

"for wasters of life and limb, is everybody in???"

[bdamomma]

3. I think other leaders are noticing that we have a mental case

in the WH.


very unfortunate that the Congress has not noticed, unless they do know.

[Seabiscuit]

82. Outside the U.S., the entire planet has noticed we have a mental case and a national disease.

which unfortunately has spread its cancer-like tentacles everywhere.

If this were to continue for another 8-16 years, the world's history books might someday reflect that that WWII was a minor blip on the radar compared to the war the entire planet may someday be forced to wage to end the worldwide nightmare caused by a totalitarian and utterly vile U.S.

[SyntaxError]

85. Nearly all Americans have that disease...

We're a nation of crazy morons.

[Seabiscuit]

94. Watching "Sicko" reminded me also that the rest of the world not only thinks we're nuts but

they're also laughing at us because we look pitiful to them. Like a sick, diseased, joke.

[coalition_unwilling]

124. 70% of Americans now oppose the Bush agenda in most of its

evil manifestations. Granted a majority of that 70% in opposition came late to the party, as opposed to those of us who knew the truth from the start. But a nation of 'crazy morons' we are not.

I take comfort in Lincoln's nostrum that you can fool all the people some of the time, some of the people all of the time but you can never fool all of the people all of the time. Truer words were never spoken, as today's opinion polls make eminently clear.

[Cha]

131. The majority in the US congress..

are of the bushites(nancy) but for moveon.org and Pete Stark..you damn well better believe they "notice".

Fascist creeepy dinos.

[rAVES]

4. So true Mr Chavez, but he's just the tip of one huge rotten apple.

[peacetalksforall]

5. He is a puppet that is not always in control, doncha know. Why doesn't

Chavez refer to Cheney? Anything Geroge says is targeted at their base the religious right, the more-haves, and otherwise good people who supported the war - bought the story about terrorists who hate us. What he says is not meant for all the world to acknowledge. Don't people get it?

[rAVES]

7. Because GWB is president...

[dbackjon]

8. Actually, they both belong in an asylum, or jail.

Both are rotten, corrupt, wanna-be dictators (Chavez is further along the path) imbeciles. The world would be a better place without either free to reek havoc.

[Warren Stupidity]

10. If Chavez keeps on invading other countries and killing their people

and destroying their public infrastructure and stealing their natural resource the world must take action!

Oh wait, that would be Bush. Bush is the rotten corrupt unitary executive signing statement using hiding behind executive privilege and national security usurper who came to power through shenanigans and outright theft. Chavez? He just wants to get re-elected in fair free and internationally monitored elections, and he wants the people of Venezuela to decide in a free and free referendum vote if that would be okay with them too.

[dbackjon]

11. Keep deluding yourself on Chavez

He is a dictator, plain and simple. Hitler was elected too, don't forget.

[High Plains]

12. Got anything to back that up, or are you just blowing wind?

[dbackjon]

14. It doesn't take a Republican to figure it out

Just a little critical reading/thinking.

Chavez is NOT a good guy. Just because he hates Bush doesn't make it so.

[Warren Stupidity]

18. empty flatulence.

You have nothing of substance to bring to this argument, do you? At least try to make a case.

[boricua79]

40. i'd like to see this

"critical" thinking

Sources/links please?

[SyntaxError]

84. What has he done that makes him such a bad guy?

[bitchkitty]

16. Wind. n/t

[DutchLiberal]

92. People who are against Chavez *never* back up their statements.

It's universal. Seriously. They just keep repeating he's a "dictator", and they will say it over and over again, no matter how much evidence to the contrary you bring up. They will ignore evidence that says he's not a dictator, they will ignore facts; they just keep repeating the mantra. They're brainwashed. And they accuse pro-Chavez people of being brainwashed.

[Warren Stupidity]

13. Hitler was directly elected in a free and fair election?

Do tell. He was appointed chancellor, last I heard, after having lost his bid to be elected president. But that is a separate argument. He was legitimately appointed Chancellor of course, but the NSDAP never outright won an open election.

Comparing Chavez to Hitler is ludicrous. Are there mass arrests in Venezuela? Have opposition parties been outlawed? Are elections a farce? Do you have one single clue?

[dbackjon]

15. There have been arrests in Ven.

And give Chavez time. I will be the one correct on this. But you Chavezistas can't handle the truth that Chavez is just as much a petty tin-horn blow-hard dictator as Bush.

[Warren Stupidity]

17. Oh I see, sometime in the future he might be a dictator

so we should just act as if he were one now. That is a much easier position to defend, as it does not require any actual verifiable facts, just your powers of prognostication.

As for your assertion of facts: "There have been arrests in Ven." please do document these egregious violations of human rights where the Venezuelan government has arrested people for political reasons. How many political prisoners are currently detained in Venezuela?

And while you are at it, is Venezuela being accused of torturing detainees? Of holding an unknown number of people in secret detention centers for indefinite periods of time? Is Venezuela engaged in widespread surveillence of its citizens? Has Venezuela asserted a right to attack any nation anywhere on the planet if it feels that nation might present a threat to its global military supremacy? Has Venezuela acted on such an assertion?

[LynnTheDem]

35. Got another one, I see.

Amazing how often far too many Americans can be MSM-duped over & over & over again, isn't it!

:eyes:

[ooglymoogly]

19. Last refuge of an idiot...."well he will be sometime in the future"

Blah blah blah blah. Someone light a match to this gasbag.

[Andrushka]

21. "I will be the one correct on this."

:freak:

eom

[Judi Lynn]

23. We'll wait while you go look for some articles on these arrests Hugo Chavez has made.

Until that time, some of us will have to wonder why it is that Venezuela, after receiving a tip-off, found over 100 armed paramilitary men from Colombia (death squad members) quartered at a ranch near Caracas owned by rabid anti-Chavez Cuban-Venezuelan militant, Roberto Alonso, who lives exactly next door to coup-plotting media mogul, and friend of _{George H. W. Bush,} Gustavo Cisneros, whose tv stations crank out 24/7 anti-Chavez crap 365 days a year, yet eventually set them free.

After they rounded them up, took them to town, questioned them, they were told the Venezuelans hired them to come to Venezuela for violent political purposes. You would have thought Venzuela would have thrown them into the remote corners of the slammer, but, NO! Hugo Chavez turned them back to Colombia, and said this plot had not been their creation, they were following orders.

I guess his jails would have been too crowded holding the imaginary political prisoners you claim Venezuela has bagged.

The Venezuelan elite imports soldiers
by Marta Harnecker
May 23, 2004

venezuelanalysis.com

If anything has become clear following the discovery of an incursion of a significantly large paramilitary group into the country, it is that the 'anti-Bolivarian and anti-Venezuelan oligarchy and its masters in the north' have not been able to recruit Venezuelan soldiers for their subversive objectives and 'have been forced to recruit them in another country,' as expressed President Chavez in front of tens of thousands of people, who gathered in Caracas this past Sunday, May 16th, to demonstrate their rejection of paramilitary activity and to express their support for peace.

Since 'the conspiracies against Venezuela do not end with the capture of mercenaries in Caracas,' there must be many other infiltrators in other areas of the country; since this is not an isolated action, but one whose efforts to stop the process continue, one can reach but only one conclusion: it is necessary to prepare oneself for self-defense. This is why the President considered it opportune to take advantage of the occasion and to announce three strategic lines for defending the country. The most radical proposal was a call for the population to massively participate in the defense of the nation.

A week earlier, on the 9th of May, on the outskirts of Caracas, a paramilitary force was discovered, dressed in field uniforms. Later, more were found, raising the total to 130, leaving open the possibility that there are still more in the country. The three Colombian paramilitary leaders of the group are members of the Autonomous Self-Defense Forces (AUC) in Northern Santander state in Colombia.

Some of the captured Colombian fighters have a long history as members of paramilitary forces. Others are reservists of the Colombian army and yet others were specifically recruited for the task in Venezuela and were surely tricked. Among these there are several who are minors.

A colonel of the Venezuelan air force was also detained, as well as seven officers of the National Guard. Among those implicated in the plot is a group of civilians headed by the Cuban Roberto Alonso, creator of the 'guarimbas,'<1> and Gustavo Quintero Machado, a Venezuelan, both who are currently wanted by the Venezuelan justice system.
(snip/...)

http://www.zmag.org/content/showarticle.cfm?ItemID=5579

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Colombian paramilitaries prepare coup in Venezuela

11.05.2004 (By Jhony Valetta, ANNCOL)

The first group of Colombian paramilitaries was captured this Sunday on a country estate near Caracas belonging to Robert Alonso, leader of the opposition Democratic Coordination, according to the government television station Venezolana de Televisión.

In a joint operation Venezuelan security forces “succeeded in capturing more than 50 Colombian paramilitaries, clothed in battle dress, who were waiting to receive arms before being transported to different locations in the country”, said Miguel Rodríguez, director of the Venezuelan Political Police, Disip.

Among the arrested is “a known Colombian paramilitay commander from the area of Cúcuta”, on the Venezuelan frontier, according to the director of Disip. Some hours later 32 more arrests were made outside Caracas.

The journalist Darvin Romero reported on the testimony of one the detainees, according to whom 130 paramiliaties had been clandestinely transported to Venezuela from Colombia to be trained for more than a month on the aforementioned estate. They were to have been moved this Monday to a place close to the Urban Security Command of the National Guard, which was to have been assaulted for the purpose of capturing weapons.

These would have been used 15 days later to arm a further 1,500 paramilitaries, trained in Colombia, to attempt a campaign of destabilization with the ultimate purpose of toppling the government of Hugo Chávez.

https://indymedia.ie/article/65020

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Please rush right back with all your information about Venezuela's political prisoners. You will be doing DU'ers a BIG favor, disabusing us of our illusions by putting your money where your mouth is.

[ronnie624]

93. Interesting.

How fascinating it is, watching these events unfold.

Chavez is indeed a gracious captor:

Aware that a group of the recruits are minors, 'sons of poverty, who end up being recruited for narco- trafficking,' Chavez announced that they would not go to jail, offering them instead to return them to their families or to stay and study at a Bolivarian school, should they want to.

You'll notice, they are not being tortured and raped, as is the practice of another government we know.

I see your little friend has not yet returned with links to support his bold claims.

Thanks for the articles.

[Warren Stupidity]

98. Notice also: no hoods.

We put our captives into our torture regime from the moment they are taken prisoner. Hoods are mandatory as the sensory deprivation regime starts from the first possible moment.

[Judi Lynn]

102. Uh, oh! Here's something which is far more recent. Just stumbled across it:

On 20 November 2007, the Venezuelan government announced it has discovered a house in - Urbanización Miranda -Eastern Caracas with 78 mobile phones, US military uniforms, guns and ammunition. Another house was searched in Hatillo municipality.This news came out as four people were arrested and detained this morning: José Angulo Guayabal, Iván Álvarez Pina, Miguel Antonio Dávila Pereiray Luber Jacinto Atencio González; their nationality is yet to be confirmed. It later emerged, they are presumably paramilitaries intending to attack and create havoc during the Constitutional Reform campaigns or promote a coup. This has been used by the government to promote the idea of foreign intervention in domestic affairs and denouce the rightist opposition to President Chavez.

This event resembles the detention of 120 Colombian Paramilitaries at Hatillo Municipality, Caracas, in 2004. In 2006, President Chavez freed the 120 Colombian paramilitaries on humanitarian grounds as the itelectual planner of their plot was discored. Robert Alonso, brother of Cuban American (ex Venezuelan) Actress Maria Conchita Alonso owns the farm where the paramilitaries were living and training. While she has been critical of the visit of famous American actors like Sean Penn, Kevin Spacey and Noami Campbell to Caracas, he is currently on the run. Colombian Security agencies were also blame in the paramilitary affair.

Sources: Telesur, Globovision, ABN, IPS, BBC

Photo:
http://www.nowpublic.com/politics/paramilitaries-venezuela-0
http://www.nowpublic.com/politics/paramilitaries-venezuela-1

http://72.14.205.104/search?q=cache:X6VoFZ3D320J:www.nowpublic.com/politics/paramilitaries-venezuela+Venezuela+Colombian+paramilitaries&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=8&gl=us

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
On the surface, this one looked like the original one, but, at closer range, you can see it's an entirely DIFFERENT incident with MORE mercenaries caught inside Venezuela, this time, at the time of the reform demonstrations by the opposition. Odd. Not good.

[ronnie624]

111. What a bummer that Maria Conchita Alonso's brother is involved.

I've always liked her acting. I've always found her to have an appealing presence in movies, for some reason. If she's a rabid Chavez hater (supports oligarchy in Venezuela), I hope she keeps her mouth shut. I would not want to feel the same way about her, as I do about Gloria Estefan, after seeing her on CNN, blathering her support for the attempted public kidnapping of Elian Gonzalez, a thoroughly disgusting spectacle.

[Judi Lynn]

112. Ha! That was choice, wasn't it? Gloria Estefan and Andy Garcia stood so solemnly,

trying to look heroic,



as they gazed out across the crowd of shrieking, moaning, mumbling, cursing, flag-waving loons, people shouting someone had seen the Virgin Mary in the vanity mirror in the Gonzalez bathroom, telling each other the whopper that blessed dolphins had surrounded Elián across the Straights, and protected him from crabs, and that noble couple demanded that this country should refuse to let the little boy go home to his closest living relative, his four grandparents, his many cousins, aunts and uncles, his schoolmates, his neighbors, his baby brother, and his stepmother.

What a couple of tools.


They won't ever be "right" until they stop being so "right wing!" More thinking, less scheming, less reacting.

[boricua79]

41. if all you have is

wait and see arguments, you're not ready for prime time.

Come back when you actually have SOME proof.

Off to the kiddie table you go!:spank: :rofl:

[Name removed]

51. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[pberq]

62. Of course Chavez is a big threat

since he might become a dictator at some future date.

But Musharraf - now there's a guy we have to stand up for, since he's aiding us in the "war on terror". Never mind that he has political opponents in jail, shut down the judiciary, and rounded up lawyers who want to reestablish the rule of law.

:sarcasm:

[Yupster]

32. But the NSDAP did win the biggest vote

which made Hitler's party the largest party in the Reichstag.

The NSDAP never won a majority of the vote, but then again neither did any other party in that era. He won a plurality and then the President appointed him Chancellor which is the same way every other Chancellor was chosen during that era. Except many of them had no where near the vote that Hitler had. Many were not even close to a plurality when they were chosen.

[Warren Stupidity]

33. I noted that his appointment was entirely legitimate.

The poster was attempting to compare Chavez's repeated direct election by wide majorities to the office of president with the appointment of Hitler to chancellor as the head of a political party with barely 1/3 of the seats in the legislature. There really isn't a valid comparison there. There is a valid comparison with Hitler's unsuccessful run for president: he lost, Chavez won.

There was no legitimate election in Germany where the Nazi party won a majority of the votes, nor was Hitler directly elected to any position in a legitimate election. While democracy failed in Germany, and their republic permitted fascist totalitarianism to develop from within the established structures, the parallel to be drawn is not with Chavez and Venezuela, but much closer to home.

[coalition_unwilling]

128. That little weasel von Papen and the quasi-senile Hindenburg

appointed Hilter Chancellor, because Papen and Hindenburg thought they could control sworn enemies of the Weimar Republic and its treaty obligations.

Yes, the election of November 6, 1932 made the NADAP the largest party in the Reichstag. The NSDAP's return in the November election was 33.1% However, that return masked a significant decline in the fortunes of the NSDAP from the previous election of July 31, 1932, when the NSDAP had scored 37.4%. Thus, between July and November of 1932, the NSDAP's electoral fortunes actually declined from 37.4 to 33.1%. The KPD (Communist Party) increased its share of the vote by 2% during the same period.

Were Papen and Hindenburg not such total scheisskopfen (shitheads), we need never have had to endure Hitler in power. There was no requirement that Hindenburg name Hitler Chancellor. About the only reason I can think of is that von Papen was an opportunist who was willing to place in power a sworn enemy of republican principles to advance his own pathetic agenda.

Until Gerhard Schroder told * to fuck himself over Iraq (and campaigned on a similar platform), I was very unwilling to forgive Germany for this repudiation of democratic principles. However, Schroder redeemed Germany and the German people in my eyes. Now we are the Nazis, in an ironic twist of fate. Oh, I forgot: we are the Nazis but with 'nucular' weapons this time around.

[reggie the dog]

30. A dictator?

Are you out of your mind?? He was elected democratically, he does not have goons that intimidate the opposition. He put programs into place that help to redistribute wealth and improve the quality of life of the people. He is in no way a dictator. His idea for the bank of the south would liberate hundreds of millions of people.

[boricua79]

39. ahaha...

I knew THIS one was going to happen.

Let me know when the Stars of David start showing up there, loony tunes.

oh, and in your dreams doesn't count in reality.

[SyntaxError]

83. Until Chavez does anything bad, I don't your claims mean much...

Could he be an evil person who plans on oppressing his people? Perhaps, but there isn't much evidence to support such claims.

[SOS]

122. Hitler was not elected to anything

"In the presidential election held on March 13, 1932, Hitler got over eleven million votes (11,339,446) or 30% of the total. Hindenburg got 18,651,497 votes or 49%.
Hindenburg failed to get the absolute majority he needed, making a run-off election necessary.

On April 10, 1932, the people voted. They gave Hitler 13,418,547 or 36%, and Hindenburg 19,359,983 or 53%.

Hindenburg was elected by an absolute majority to another seven year term."

"Hitler entered into a series of intrigues with conservatives such as Franz von Papen, Otto Meissner, and President Hindenburg's son, Oskar. In spite of a decline in the Nazi Party's votes in November 1932, Hitler insisted that the chancellorship was the only office he would accept. On January 30, 1933, Hindenburg offered him the chancellorship of Germany."

(Chavex received a landslide 64%)

[coalition_unwilling]

125. Chavez won re-election in a landslide or did you forget that little fact???? -n/t

[BornagainDUer]

25. You are so absolutely full of SHIT. nt

[boricua79]

38. PROVE IT

Prove the corruption and "rotteness".

put up or stay quiet.

[grahamhgreen]

74. At least Venezuela has universal health care...

[Warren Stupidity]

9. NO ASYLUM FOR BUSH!

The war criminals must be made to pay.

[Zorra]

20. Bu*h belongs in an asylum because he is a clinically insane sociopath.

The WWIII thing is just an expression of his severe mental disorder.

[Mz Pip]

22. Takes one to know one

I guess. Who better than to recognize a nutcase than another nutcase.

Mz Pip
:dem:

[boricua79]

37. oh whatever...

Let me know when Chavez flirts with the idea of waging World War III.:eyes:

[Mudoria]

24. Please post this tripe in

the Latin American forum and not LBN. Every word that issues from Chavez is not newsworthy. Keep LBN uncluttered with useless threads like this.

[BornagainDUer]

26. Yer at the wrong website if you are backing Bush.

which is what you are doing. You know the son-a-bitch is whacko and Chavez was elected.

[nick303]

104. Logic

1. Not everything Chavez says is newsworthy
2. ????
3. I support Bush!

Can anyone fill in step 2?

[Judi Lynn]

28. Yet when anything he says can get spun by the corporate media to repudiate him, we'd have to beat

right-wingers back with a stick to keep them from jamming up the thread featuring those anti-Chavez spins.

Yeah, got yer number.

[Tom Joad]

27. Pelosi and Bush should share the same hospital wing...

[Amonester]

109. Yup! And they should have DiFi for a three's company in there. - eom

[coalition_unwilling]

129. Hillary and Bush shoudl share the same hospital wing, as both

are IMPERIALISTS who will not forswear a first-use policy of nuclear weapons on Iran. Or am I missing something, aside from the fact that Hillary's imperialism is wielded inside the velvet glove of her femininity?

[laylah]

31. And for many other things as well! nt

[pinniped]

34. That dictator dude in Pakistan could join the asshole in the wh.

.

[roamer65]

36. Busharraf.

I have heard that is his nickname in Pakistan.:rofl:

[Peace Patriot]

42. Now that's hilarious, when the Pakistanis start making fun of OUR dictator!

Chavez's problem is he is a dictator when it comes to fascists like Exxon Mobile, the World Bank and the Bush Junta. He is throwing their sorry asses out of South America. That's my kind of dictator. And he wants the people in the hovels and shanytowns to have a say. Look out! Here comes the "dictorship of the proletariat"!

Christ, these phantoms and specters that the robber barons deploy, in defense of their ungodly greed, are so OLD, you'd think people would smarten up. Well, many are. But not our little fascist echo chamber here at DU.

As for Bush, I don't think he's insane; I think he's spoiled rotten. The perfect punishment for him would be a life sentence of community service--cleaning bedpans in veterans' hospitals. I don't really believe in jail; I believe in redemption--and in giving the people joy. Can you just imagine the joy of billions of people if Bush got a punishment like that--so perfect, so fitting to the crime(s)!

[coalition_unwilling]

130. AKA "Benevolent despotism" - I really like your idea of * having

to do a lifetime of community service cleaning out bedpans. Who knows? I might even start believing in humanity's prospects a little bit were such a thing to happen. (Of course, it would have to be accompanied by Kissinger being sentenced to build orphanages in Vietnam, Laos and Cambodia.) Still, thanks for brightening up my holidays a little with your vision :)

[EFerrari]

71. That's a keeper!

lol

[Peace Patriot]

43. Greg Palast has a new film--"The Assassination of Hugo Chavez"--the story of

our next oil war, reported in advance.

Check out the Greg Palast DVD Christmas present thread...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x2327538

[Judi Lynn]

46. That film would be a great item to share with someone(s). n/t

[cigsandcoffee]

44. Bush should get all bloated and huffy and demand an apology...

...threatening to cut off economic ties with Venezuela.

That would show Hugo, for sure.

[Judi Lynn]

45. You'd be doing yourself a favor if you knew about the subject you attempt to discuss.

The Miami Herald and El Nuevo probably won't publish as much information as you need to have any idea at all what is happening in Venezuela.

Making fun of Chavez's weight doesn't seem as worthwhile as having real information on what's happening there would for sharing at an adult message board.

If you want to smear people with infantile insults, the Miami Herald's message boards are just the place.

[cigsandcoffee]

47. What's infantile is Hugo's tantrum when an adult finally told hum to shut up.

He's still crying about it today.

He reminds me of a movie I saw the other day about Idi Amin - there was a great line in it that also applies to Chavez: He's a child, and that's what makes him so scary.

[Warren Stupidity]

52. You should read up. It seems that Mr. King might have been

involved in the aborted CIA sponsored coup a few years back, along with his refromed 'ex' fascist pal Aznar. Spain under Aznar backed the coup, an unprecedented, for modern Spain, anti-democratic intrusion into the internal affairs of Venezuela. The background to this public fight has been kept out of the Bullshit Media System.

[cigsandcoffee]

53. Oh, Lord, here we go again with the "educate yourself" jive.

Come down offf your high horse.

No amount of education or book reading will change the fact that Chavez made himself look like a whining and crying baby when rightly being told to shut his fat trap. Open your eyes and believe your ears.

A fellow who can dish it as hard as Hugo does - but not take it - is a spoiled child, and any book on the subject which doesn't reveal that simple truth just isn't worth reading.

[boricua79]

61. so you're gonna ignore

the behind the scenes story of the how King supported the coup.

I'd get all pissed if some piece of shit King who wasn't elected and who tried to have me overthrown was trying to get all moralistic and imperial with me. The nerve of the king for even saying "porque no te callas". Chavez should have said, "cuando tu dejes tu reino" (when you leave your kingdom).

Royalty makes me sick.

[cigsandcoffee]

65. Petulant children make me sick.

Chavez has been using this failed coup like a cross to hang himself on. He needs to get over it and move on. And if he's going to open his fat mouth to let out childish tirades of name-calling against people on the world stage, then he shouldn't be so surprised when one of them smacks him back down.

[boricua79]

66. easy for you to say

I'd rather have an elected petulant "child" than a petulant unelected monarch.

As for name calling, if the shoe fits...

He wasn't surprised...he fought off the idiot pretty easy. The media made into a "someone smacks Chavez down" game. If you actually understood spanish, you would have seen Chavez respond in kind.

You get over getting abducted, thinking you're going to get killed (like Allende was). THEN come tell us your thoughts.

[nick303]

105. The king of Spain is generally well respected, and deservedly so

Certainly not petulant. Your "if you actually understood spanish" comment in condescending, not to mention irrelevant since Chavez did just sit there like a moron after being smacked down. A day or two later he made his response back in Venezuela--you know, like a real man.

[Warren Stupidity]

70. "using this failed coup "

"He needs to get over it and move on"

Yeah what is the big deal with foreign powers conspiring to overthrow the democratically elected government and install a military junta in its place? No big deal. For example, see Chile. A few thousand disappeared, 20 years of Fascism, and then things get back to normal.

"Petulant children make me sick." sniff, sniff, hmmmm smells like unintentional irony to me.

[EFerrari]

73. Do you work for the Miami Herald?

lol

[Judi Lynn]

80. They have a violent, specific audience they have to bow to there, due to the sudden

awakening the Herald's publisher, David Lawrence got years ago, when he dared to print articles the Cuban right-wing scum self-appointed leader, Bay of Pigs participant (who never got out of his boat!) Jorge Mas Canosa didn't like. Canosa kicked up a campaign of terrorism against Lawrence who started getting death threats to the point he and his wife got outside help to start their cars for them every day, due to their fear of being carbombed. The Herald's newspaper vending machines across town were covered and jammed with excrement, and billboards and city buses blazed with anti-Herald slogans.

They succumbed to the pressure, and eventually David Lawrence got the hell out of there, leaving behind a crappy newspaper which does all the news just the way they like it, instead of referring to the truth from time to time.

Human Rights Watch's "Americas Watch" designated Miami as a town with a very damaged right to free speech.

The FBI designated Miami as the "Terror Capital of the United States."

Jorge Mas Canosa told the newspaper, El País, in Spain, in response to a question about what he would do if the Americans took over Cuba, eventually, ''That's bull----. They haven't even been able to take over Miami. If we kicked them out of here, how could they possibly take over our own country?''

These idiots have their own version of the truth they share with other American right-wingers and if they have any say about it, there will eventually be NO OTHER voice heard, anywhere at all, but their ignorant ravings, hideously simplified, for simple minds, and wildly distorted to fit their own designs.

[EFerrari]

87. Thousands rally for Chavez's reforms

(The last right wing student they quote has the unfortunate given name of "Stalin". lol)

CARACAS, Venezuela: Tens of thousands of President Hugo Chavez's supporters filled the streets to back his proposed constitutional changes, while anti-government student leaders announced a bold plan to march on the presidential palace.

The demonstrations have grown as a Dec. 2 referendum nears on reforms that, among other changes, would let Chavez run for re-election indefinitely, create new types of property to managed by cooperatives and lengthen presidential terms from six to seven years.

Wednesday's sea of red-clad demonstrators, including students and other government supporters, marched to the Miraflores presidential palace to show their support for the constitutional overhaul, beating drums, waving flags and blowing whistles.

"Here is the demonstration that the students are with the revolution!" Chavez told the crowd from a stage outside the palace. "A solid Venezuelan revolutionary student movement has been born!"


http://www.iht.com/articles/ap/2007/11/22/america/LA-GEN-Venezuela-Constitution.php?WT.mc_id=rssfrontpage

[Judi Lynn]

89. Such an odd name, it sticks in your mind, doesn't it? You will remember this information, taken from

a recorded conversation between two anti-Chavez operatives, which has gotten a lot of play in some circles in Venezuela:

June 9 / 10, 2007

Who's Pulling the Strings?
Behind Venezuela's "Student Rebellion"
By GEORGE CICCARIELLO-MAHER

~snip~
Firstly, opposition parties made a clear decision to stay out of the spotlight, emphasizing the "independent" and "spontaneous" nature of the student protests. Beyond anything else, this gesture proves the degree to which the opposition has been discredited, garnering a reverse Midas touch through years of poor decisionmaking and supporting coups. From the beginning, the government was arguing that opposition politicians were behind the student mobilizations, and so when government-run channel 8 covered one of the early student demonstrations in Plaza Brion in Chacaito, the headline read "opposition demonstration disguised as a student demonstration."

This claim was perhaps justified by the appearance at the demonstration of Leopoldo López, mayor of opposition stronghold Chacao, formerly of far-right party Primero Justicia, which he more recently abandoned in favor of Manuel Rosales' nominally social democratic Un Nuevo Tiempo. Opposition news channel Globovisión countered with the thoroughly unconvincing claim that López, 36 years old and an established politician, was a "youth leader." López himself wouldn't help the situation when at a press conference he "accidentally" called for the students to employ "non-peaceful" tactics (he later claimed that he had meant to call for "non-violent" forms of protest).

That the "student leaders" are tied to the opposition is far from controversial: for example, spokesperson Yon Goicochea is a member of Primero Justicia and the aptly-named Stalin González belonged until recently to the strangest of opposition organizations, Bandera Roja. BR is a nominally Marxist-Leninist group which made the unlikely transition from a respectable guerrilla organization to the attack dogs of the far right, claiming to use the opposition as a vehicle to topple the fake communism of Chávez and institute a true dictatorship of the proletariat. But González recently revealed the extent of his opportunism by joining Rosales and Un Nuevo Tiempo.

But the contours of the opposition's hands-off strategy wouldn't be fully clear until the revelation of a taped phone conversation in which Un Nuevo Tiempo leader Alfonso Marquina spoke of the need to remain in the background, but to pull the strings regardless: "Let's mobilize all the kids We have a strategy as an organization Let's mobilize all the kids, because you know {UCV student leader} Stalin {González} is our vice president here in Caracas Let's mobilize the kids from the Catholic {University} We've decided that the politicians won't intervene, that we'll leave it to the kids in their natural environment. We'll give them support, stick them in trucks If I go out there, they'll say it's the politicians that are calling the kids out"

"The only thing that can save us in this situation is if something extraordinary happens," replies Elías, an advisor to RCTV head Marcel Granier, on the leaked tape. It's comments like this that lead the Vice President of the National Assembly Desiree Santos to argue that the political opposition to Chávez was "looking for a death" among the students, to "repeat the actions of 2002" in which pre-meditated deaths were inserted into a pre-fabricated media strategy to overthrow Chávez.
(snip/...)

http://www.counterpunch.org/maher06092007.html

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Right on schedule, they are sending the students out to do the front work for the opposition which has discredited itself by failing in its earlier ventures.

God only knows what they've got planned next if their students failed. You can be sure someone's going to get killed, or MORE than someone, when they decide they'll just "kick it up a notch."

Creepy, slimey, self-centered, nasty bastards.

[cali]

54. that's nothing but the same kind of smear you object to

(rightfully) about Chavez. There's one or two fringe people in Spain demanding an investigation. That's hardly proof. And Aznar wasn't "his". That's another smear. Funny how you're exactly the same as the people you denounce.

[Warren Stupidity]

55. Smear?

Spanish Foreign Minister, Miguel Angel Moratinos, said in a television program on Monday that Spain’s ambassador to Venezuela during the coup, by rebel generals and business leaders, was instructed by the ‘Partido Popular’ government of then-Prime Minister Jose Maria Aznar to support the coup plotters.

“Under the previous government,” Moratinos admitted, “in an unprecedented move for Spanish diplomacy, the Spanish ambassador (to Venezuela) received instructions to support the coup.”

http://www.world-crisis.com/news/1106_0_1_0_C/

Spain’s foreign minister claims Aznar government supported Venezuela coup
By Keith Lee
10 December 2004
Use this version to print | Send this link by email | Email the author

Spanish foreign minister Miguel Angel Moratinos has refused to retract his claims that the former Popular Party (PP) government under the leadership of Jose Maria Aznar supported the coup that temporarily ousted Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez Frias in 2002.

The right-wing PP has denied the claim and called for the resignation of Moratinos. Speaking at a parliamentary hearing on December 1, Moratinos said that his remarks had been misinterpreted and denied that he said that the former government instigated or help prepare the coup
http://www.wsws.org/articles/2004/dec2004/vene-d10.shtml

Spain says former government backed Venezuela coup
Daniel Flynn (Reuters) | 23.11.2004 20:01 | Venezuela | London

the cards are falling...


MADRID, Nov 23 (Reuters) - Spain's Socialist government accused the previous administration of backing a short-lived coup against Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez in 2002, a charge the conservative opposition labelled a "lie".

The shock accusation by Spanish Foreign Minister Miguel Angel Moratinos threatened to boil over into an embarrassing political spat during a visit by Chavez to Madrid to patch up relations damaged by the coup.

http://www.indymedia.org.uk/en/2004/11/301754.html

Following the unsuccessful coup d’etat aimed at toppling the constitutional government of Hugo Chávez, a journalist from Spain said last week that “it smells like hamburgers, jabugo (Spanish cured ham), and oil!” Obviously, he knew what he was talking about: the participation of officials from the United States, Spain, and El Salvador in the revolt headed by business leader Pedro Carmona Estanga.

The claim doesn’t sound far-fetched, since U.S. Ambassador to Venezuela Charles Shapiro (who formerly managed the Cuba desk at the State Department) and Spanish Ambassador Manuel Viturro met with de facto president Pedro Carmona after he had dissolved the National Assembly and the country’s principal institutions.

According to private investigations, one of the coup’s consequences was the privatization of Petróleos de Venezuela, S.A. (PDVSA), turning it over to a U.S. company linked to President George Bush and the Spanish company Repsol; plus the sale of CITGO, the U.S. subsidiary of PDVSA, to Gustavo Cisneros and his partners in the north; as well as an end to the Venezuelan government’s exclusive subsoil rights.

http://www.worldpress.org/Americas/581.cfm

Should I continue? Yes you won't find it in the Bullshit Media System Cali, they are too busy with the Holloway case.

[cali]

57. yes, mr. stupidity smear.

that's about Aznar, not about Juan Carlos as your previous post claimed.

[boricua79]

63. and Aznar

was the guy Chavez called a fascist...and rightly so.

The unelected monarch came to the defense of a guy who had supported a coup against Chavez. He should stayed out it, looked pretty, and gone back to his castle.

[Warren Stupidity]

67. It was about both of them.

Mr. King was defending his former fascist buddy Aznar, scion of a long line of Spanish fascists. As the official head of state at the time of the 2002 CIA sponsored coup, how exactly does Mr. King get off without any responsibility? He just gets to be the monarch of good things done by Spain, is that it?

[boricua79]

60. an adult...

who hasn't earned jack shit in life...and whose claim to power and fame is an unelected monarchy dynasty.

Yeah...THAT great example of an adult.

[Warren Stupidity]

68. In defense of Mr. King

Juan Carlos did one great deed: he maneuvered the fascists out of power after the death of Franco. He deserves a lot of credit for that. On the other hand, Spain's participation in the 2002 coup in Venezuela was really not so good, and Mr. King sticking up for his buddy Aznar was arrogant and insulting to Venezuela and Chavez.

[EFerrari]

69. Chavez won that round. He got the channel changed to the culpability

of the Spanish government. He has nothing to cry about. And he's not scary because he's a child. He's scary because he's challenging American hegemony.

[boricua79]

76. really...

why do people hate on Chavez so much? The guy rules over a Latin American country that's not really consequential to world affairs. The only people I see foaming about Chavez are the same people that would foam in the mouth about the domino theory of communism coming their way up through Central america.

Some people are just scared of brown and black people having self-determination. If Latin America's recent politics have been any indication, when brown and black people there get a fair chance to elect leaders they want, you get Lula, Morales, Chavez, Correa, Kischner, and others. And that scares a lot of people, including Aznar, the king, and anti-Chavistas.

[EFerrari]

77. I've come to pretty much the same conclusion.

It's visibly irrational. Look at the anti-Chavez posters and try to find a fact.

[boricua79]

59. a DUer

who would support Bush over Chavez.

hmmm...I sense the Dark Side in this one, my young padawan.

[grahamhgreen]

75. Agreed. The 'smear Chavez daily' machine is now on your TV.

[leaninglib]

48. The fat little fascist Chavez is the one that belongs in an asylum.

Bush will be back on his ranch soon enough. Well, maybe not seen enough, but his lame duck status renders him nearly harmless.

[Andrushka]

49. "fascist"?

Oh please. Mature arguments only here, if you will.

[leaninglib]

95. Any mention of the word "mature" in a thread about Chavez is an oxymoron.

After all, we are talking about one the most irresponsible and immature heads of state on the planet.

A memorable Chavez quote:

"Remember, little girl, I'm like the thorn tree that flowers on the plain. I waft my scent to passers-by and prick he who shakes me. Don't mess with me, Condoleezza. Don't mess with me, girl."

Another:

"Don't be shameless, Mr Blair. Don't be immoral, Mr Blair. You are one of those who have no morals. You are not one who has the right to criticize anyone about the rules of the international community.

You are an imperialist pawn who attempts to curry favor with Danger Bush-Hitler, the number one mass murderer and assassin there is on the planet.

Go straight to hell, Mr Blair."

_____________________________________________
Very mature indeed... The guy is a clown.

[EFerrari]

110. It's funny. Those quotations echo the sentiments of DU pretty well.

How do you disagree with them?

lolol

[leaninglib]

114. There was a DU poll a while back which asked what sort of Democrats were here at DU.

The overwhelming response was those Democrats on the fringe. Based on your support of Hugo Chavez, I would say that there are some here (like you) who are in fact, not Democratic at all.

Let's see what some real Democrats have to say about Chavez:

Sen. Tom Harkin of Iowa also called Chavez's statements "incendiary and unworthy of a nation's leader."

"The manner in which he characterized the president demeaned himself and demeaned Venezuela. He fancies himself a modern day Simone Bolivar ... But he is an everyday thug," said Pelosi, D-Calif. Bolivar was a statesman known as "the Liberator" for leading Venezuela's revolt against Spain in the early 19th century.

"Don't come to the United States and think, because we have problems with our president, that any foreigner can come to our country and not think that Americans do not feel offended when you offend our chief of state," New York Rep. Charles Rangel said in remarks delivered on Capitol Hill.

Furthermore, Hillary Clinton, Barrack Obama, Howard Dean, John Kerry, Joe Biden and Joe Lieberman have all referred to Chavez as a "dictator."

My friend, if you are a Democrat, you are certainly a misguided one.

[fascisthunter]

126. Actually, You are the Clown

and don't seem to have a good grasp of the english language either. Chavez is not a fascist. Bush is.

[Warren Stupidity]

50. leaninglib ?

But trending right. Wake up. Turn off the False Noise Machine. You are being lied to.

[leaninglib]

96. Chavez has trended so far towards authoritarianism that he has gone off the deep end.

My hope is that the next Democratic administration deals with him accordingly.

[Warren Stupidity]

99. Please document all that deep end authoritarianism.

For example: the mass arrests, the abolition of free speech and a free press, the abolition of opposition political parties, the end of constitutional representative democracy, the widespread surveillence of the people of Venezuela. I eagerly await your persuasive case that Chavez has gone off the deep end of authoritarianism.

Or perhaps you have no case?

[leaninglib]

115. Ah, games... I'm quite certain that any documentation of Chavez's evil deeds

would simply be dismissed as right wing propaganda, so I will not waste my time.

If you think that Hugo Chavez is the man with the utopian plan, there is no hope for you, my friend.

[Warren Stupidity]

118. Ok leaning "lib" here is how it works on the internets:

If you join into a debating society like this and post an assertion of fact and are asked to provide some evidence to back up that assertion of fact, you have three choices:

1) put up;
2) shut up;
3) be an asshole and do neither.

[boricua79]

58. PROVE IT!

where's the wedding of private sector corporations with state institutions (fascism)? I don't see it.

I see a press operating in Venezuela that is mostly owned by the sectors in Venezuelan society who hate Chavez. Not very "fascist" like there.

I see people congregating in favor and AGAINST Chavez...not very fascist there.

I don't see one party rule...many parties exist, but the Venezuelan people have chosen to largely support Chavez party...no fascism there.

You got some reading to do on Venezuela. You're not ready for prime time.

Off to the kiddie table! No SOUP for you!:spank:

[leaninglib]

97. Proof...? I don’t need a weatherman to tell me it's raining outside.

Chavez has a penchant for wearing military uniforms during his tenure as a civilian leader. That is very fascist like.

Chavez has indicated that he would like to take Venezuela in the same direction that his mentor, Castro, has taken Cuba. That is very fascist like.

It is true that Venezuela remains freer than the slave-state of Cuba; nevertheless, Chavez has telegraphed his intentions much the same as Hitler did in Mein Kampf.

Chavez has also praised Mahmoud Ahmadinejad and Robert Mugabe for being "freedom fighters."

You can call him what you want, but to most he is nothing more than an a two-bit fascist dictator.

[Warren Stupidity]

100. Ah another one.

You have nothing.

For example, I examined the first five pages of google's images of Hugo Chavez, 69 actual photographs of Chavez, of which exactly 6 showed him wearing a military uniform. the other 63 had Chavez in either a business suit or the red jacketed party outfit. Not exactly a "penchant for wearing military uniforms".

[EFerrari]

107. Remember, the clothes make the man.

[EFerrari]

108. This one is even better and more timely:

[Judi Lynn]

113. I may be confused, but I'll be darned if I can recall seeing Hugo Chavez turned out in a perplexing

fashion statement like this!



Don't know how the people on the ship suppressed devastating laughter attacks.

[EFerrari]

106. So there is no fact or credible source you can point to.

Thought so.

[leaninglib]

116. If you need to be spoon-fed, you wouldn't understand.

[treestar]

56. Gotta love Hugo

He always says what needs to be said about *. Oh that a Democrat would have this type of balls when it comes to commenting on *.

[Honeycombe8]

64. I don't give a flip what that fascist dictator says. He should concentrate on his own country's ...

problems, of which there are many.

[Warren Stupidity]

72. Yeah Bush should shut the fuck up. Right on!

[EFerrari]

78. This thread died because we all have each other on ignore.

:rofl:

[Froward69]

79. Musharriff= Right , Chavez = Left

whom does bushiboy want to support? All three are dictators, Musharriff is further along than Chavez or bushiboy. make no mistake, they all are power hungry. I wouldn't doubt chavez will hold on to power much the same as musharriff. bush knows his days are numbered. I fear he (b)will attempt to do something stupid, "for our own good" really trying to stay in power, as he knows he deserves to be imprisoned.

[Judi Lynn]

81. It might be appropriate to acquaint yourself with the facts of Venezuela's history, and of

what has actually happened in Venezuela since Hugo Chavez took office in February, 1999.

It would do you serious good to know more about the subject.

[Peace Patriot]

86. "I wouldn't doubt chavez will hold on to power much the same as musharriff"

Where do you get this idea? Show me one bit of evidence that Chavez has ANY tendency to kill, torture and imprison dissenters, or to suspend the Constitution and civil rights. His rightwing, Bush-backed OPPONENTS have these tendencies, and have, in fact, acted on them. Chavez has NOT. You see any political prisoners in Venezuela? You see even the slightest evidence of a "crackdown on dissent"? Or do you see a free people arguing things out and VOTING ON them?

It was Chavez's OPPONENTS who suspended the Constitution, the National Assembly (congress), the courts, and all civil rights, and kidnapped the democratically elected president, and threatened to kill him? How long do you think free debate would have lasted, in Venezuela, had they succeeded?

Chavez and his government has been scrupulous in their adherence to the rule of law, and furthermore have done everything they can to MAXIMIZE citizen participation in government and politics. In fact, several of the constitutional amendments they have proposed (for a VOTE OF THE PEOPLE) specifically enhance people power and widespread participation, and ADD civil rights protections (for gays, for instance).

And you are comparing him to Musharraf? No, let me pinpoint this more specifically. You are saying he's GOING TO BECOME Musharraff. He's GOING TO BECOME a "dictator." Do you understand WHY that is the current war profiteering corporate news monopoly "talking point"? Because they have NO EVIDENCE that he is "dictatorial" NOW. And, in order to get their "Saddam, the dictator" shadow stirred up in your mind--so that you will not object, when they make their next violent move against him, and his government, and the people of Venezuela--they have to use the word "dictator"...somehow. They have to get it out there. "Increasingly authoritarian." "Increasingly dictatorial." ("According to his critics..." is often the phraseology--no attribution, no quotes--straight from the CIA.) Vague phrases, that, when you look into the facts, simply evaporate. It's called the "Big Lie." Whenever "Chavez, the dictator" pops into your head, just think "Iraq's WMDs," and you will understand what they are doing to you...AGAIN.

Chavez is NOT a dictator, and has shown NO tendency to BECOME a "dictator."
Chavez has jailed no one unfairly, or without due process.
Chavez has done nothing but ENCOURAGE widespread participation.
Chavez approves of honest, transparent elections (unlike our own).
Chavez permits hundreds of Carter Center, OAS and EU election monitors to crawl all over Venezuela during elections.

Chavez permits blistering criticism of himself and his government in the news media, and only denied a license renewal to use the public airwaves to *ONE* TV station that had participated in the violent rightwing military coup attempt against the legitimate government. (Most governments hold the power to de-license broadcasters, and do so routinely with less cause than Chavez had.)

Chavez permits thousands of rightwing, U.S.-funded students and others to protest against him, in raucous street demonstrations that are only curtailed when they become violent (as any government would do), and his government has furthermore gone out of its way to accommodate them.

The Chavez government has held hundreds of town meetings, throughout Venezuela, over several months time, to discuss the proposed constitutional amendments. They were passed by the National Assembly, and are now to be voted on by all Venezuelans. The Constitution even contains a RECALL provision for the president (wish we had that here), which Chavez readily agreed to, when the Bolivarian Constitution was first written.

What kind of "dictator" is this?

He's a strong politician and leader. But since when do we call strength "authoritarianism"? Where did we get that idea? From fascists, corporate predators and rightwingers, and their news monopolies, who only object to strength when it is of, by and for the people.

They did the same thing to FDR--called him the same names ("dictator," etc.)--and HE ran for and won FOUR terms in office, and died in office. He was a "president for life."

It is crap. The crappiness of it is provable, on all the evidence. There is no evidence to support the idea that Chavez "is increasingly authoritarian," or would "hold on to power much the same as musharriff." None.

[Andrushka]

88. Peace Patriot

Once again, I think I speak for most here when I 'say':

:yourock:

Excellent post, again!

[Judi Lynn]

90. You're surely speaking for me, Andrushka, and for those who take the time to know

what the hell is happening there due to doing actual research, and paying attention, and even, oh,no, THINKING things through! It seems too hard a task for some.

Peace Patriot has taken the time to get informed and stay informed, and it's very clear to anyone who reads what Peace Patriot writes. Every single time.

[DutchLiberal]

91. HUGO! HUGO! HUGO!

:applause: :woohoo: :headbang: :applause:

I wish my government had the balls to say this.

[Honeycombe8]

101. What is your government? nt

[DutchLiberal]

103. Well, the Dutch government...

At present, a coalition of three parties. The Christian-Democrats (who are not that Christian anymore), the Social-Democrats (who are not that social anymore) and the Christian Union (a small very extreme Christian party the Dutch would never have believed they would someday be in government). It's the fourth cabinet in 5 years for prime-minister Balkenende.

He supported the US-led invasion in Iraq. He told us he believed Hussein had WMD's, but more and more sources tell us he knew this was not true and he supported Bush for personal gain (a few months later, fellow Christian-Democrat Jaap de Hoop Scheffer became Secretary-General at NATO). Till this day, a majority in parliament has blocked an investigation of this. Also, to this very day, Balkenende keeps insisting it was "necessary" to remove Hussein, which is of course a lie.

Our current 'Secretary of State' is what you would call a 'hawk' and the coalition is very friendly toward the Bush-administration. However, they don't like leaders like Chávez very much.

[Honeycombe8]

117. I see. VERY interesting. The tentacles of our corrupt government have reached everywhere it seems!

A post at NATO? Yep. It'd be my guess that he sold out for personal gain.

[DutchLiberal]

132. Too bad the Social-Democrats (Labor) has also sold out to form a coalition with them.

They promised to investigate the Dutch government's support for the Iraq War, but they caved so they could get in power. Like a large portion of Democrats (at least on DU) feel betrayed by Democratic leaders in Congress, we feel betrayed by them. Funny thing is, polls show they would only get 21 seats if elections were to be held today (they now hold 33 seats) and every week it seems the coalition is about to collapse. :evilgrin:

[Bonobo]

119. More dangerous than a monkey with a razor blade!

[Judi Lynn]

120. Stealing a quote from the person you hope to smear? What sense does that make? n/t

[Bonobo]

121. You got me all wrong, pootie-pootie-pootie.

[ohio2007]

127. Poll says Chavez loses Venezuela referendum lead

since this article isn't allowed to be posted as a new thread and the "other Hugo" thread has been locked.....


Poll says Chavez loses Venezuela referendum lead

CARACAS (Reuters) - Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez has lost his lead eight days before a referendum on ending his term limit, an independent pollster said on Saturday, in a swing in voter sentiment against the Cuba ally.

Forty-nine percent of likely voters oppose Chavez's proposed raft of constitutional changes to expand his powers, compared with 39 percent in favor, a survey by respected pollster Datanalisis showed.



http://www.reuters.com/article/worldNews/idUSN2333983120071124?feedType=RSS&feedName=worldNews&rpc=22&sp=true

only choice is to post it in this thread