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rodeodance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-25-07 05:30 PM
Original message
Earth is reaching the point of no return, says major UN environment report
Source: Times online

From Times OnlineOctober 25, 2007

Earth is reaching the point of no return, says major UN environment report
(Photographer: Alexander Nemenov/AFP/Getty Images)
2 million people are killed each year by air pollution
Image :1 of 4

Lewis Smith, Environment Reporter of The Times
The speed at which mankind is using and abusing the Earth’s resources is putting humanity’s survival at risk, scientists have said.

The bleak assessment of the state of the environment globally was issued as an “urgent call for action” amid growing concerns of worldwide waste, neglect and governmental inertia.

Fundamental changes in political policy and individual lifestyles were demanded by the United Nations Environment Programme (UNEP) as it gave warning that the “point of no return” for the environment is fast being approached.

The damage being done was regarded by the UN programme as so serious that it said the time had come for the environment to be a central theme of policy-making instead of just a fringe issue, even though it would damage the vested interests of powerful industries. .



Read more: http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/science/article2739926.ece
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Dyedinthewoolliberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-25-07 05:51 PM
Response to Original message
1. I knew I picked a bad time to stop
(fill in the blank). Man, I am just stunned by amount of bad news we are living with nowadays. I suppose it's really no different than 100 or 1000 years ago, except I wasn't there!
As always the question becomes, what can I do to contribute to the solution? :shrug:
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kestrel91316 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-25-07 05:53 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. Work on decreasing your personal carbon footprint, and pressure your
elected government officials to enact legislation making this a priority.
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Lorien Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-26-07 02:53 AM
Response to Reply #1
22. 100 and 1000 years ago the human race wasn't facing imminent
extinction, along with the extinction of most other species on earth.
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Joe Bacon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-26-07 07:26 AM
Response to Reply #1
29. "But Jesus is coming to rapture me next week"
Yep, this is what I hear from my idiot family. Every last one of them think that JC and his Sonshine Band are gonna play their gig at Armageddon after God's man bombs Iran.

I have given up on them...
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DCKit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-26-07 05:56 PM
Response to Reply #29
42. Right there with you Joe... mine too!! No personal responsibility for what they've done.
Here in the DC area, we had an incredibly wet, protracted spring, little rain all summer and, now, four straight days of rain. Seems to me we've already moved from a temperate climate to one with wet and dry seasons on the east coast. We're going to have to start planting different crops.
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dysfunctional press Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-26-07 07:33 PM
Response to Reply #1
45. 100 or 1000 years ago conditions weren't what they are now.
we're riding on a runaway train.
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SpiralHawk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-25-07 06:11 PM
Response to Original message
3. "Big deal. We've got ours." - Republicons
Edited on Thu Oct-25-07 06:13 PM by SpiralHawk
"besides, Jesus never said nuthin about no steenkin global warming and shit like that, so it can't be real. This must be a liberal plot to get our piles and piles of ill-gotten cash-money-bucks. So screw the UN, Screw the planet, screw everybody but us."

- Republicons
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Zhade Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-26-07 05:11 AM
Response to Reply #3
27. No, more like all humans.
We've been selfish - especially us Yankee assholes.

Truth hurts. : (

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mark414 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-25-07 06:24 PM
Response to Original message
4. how many centuries how human evolution and i somehow wind up in one of the last ones
what a crock
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-25-07 09:21 PM
Response to Reply #4
11. .... actually, you may have been here before . . . ?
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mark414 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-25-07 09:45 PM
Response to Reply #11
15. nah,
just this time around
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-26-07 12:25 AM
Response to Reply #15
20. "On a Clear Day" . .. you might recall something different . .. ???
It's kind of upside down to me that so many people are taught about "god" and believe it and talk about it with some naturalness -- even accepting that George Bush "talks to go" about attacking Iraq/"god" was for it ....

but so few consider Reincarnation though it used to be taught by all the major religions . . .
"until it became inconvenient for the rulers."

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CrispyQ Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-26-07 11:12 AM
Response to Reply #20
32. Years ago a woman I worked with stated:
"Since 95% of the people on the planet believe in God then it is logical to conclude that God exists."

I almost spewed my dinner all over the break room table.
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Zhade Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-26-07 02:34 PM
Response to Reply #20
40. There's just as much evidence for reincarnation as gods, which is to say none.
It's an interesting philosophical question, but yeah.

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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-26-07 02:37 PM
Response to Reply #40
41. Disagree --- few people claim to see "gods" but many people claim reincarnation . . .
and -- as I said before -- when religions were slightly more legitimate -- all the major religions taught reincarnation.

Also -- we have more proof of UFO's than "gods."

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ima_sinnic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-26-07 04:29 AM
Response to Reply #4
26. can I sell you some real estate on the Florida coast? (nt)
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superconnected Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-26-07 06:15 PM
Response to Reply #4
43. Yeah, but you get internet and rock music!
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cal04 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-25-07 06:39 PM
Response to Original message
5. Independent:Not an environment scare story

By Steve Connor, Science Editor
A landmark assessment by the UN of the state of the world's environment paints the bleakest picture yet of our planet's well-being. The warning is stark: humanity's future is at risk unless urgent action is taken. Over the past 20 years, almost every index of the planet's health has worsened. At the same time, personal wealth in the richest countries has grown by a third.

The report, by the United Nations Environment Programme (Unep), warns that the vital natural resources which support life on Earth have suffered significantly since the first such report, published in 1987. However, this gradual depletion of the world's natural "capital" has coincided with unprecedented economic gains for developed nations, which, for many people, have masked the growing crisis.

Nearly 400 experts from around the world contributed to the report, which warns that humanity itself could be at risk if nothing is done to address the three major environmental problems of a growing human population, climate change and the mass extinction of animals and plants.

The report is the fruit of five years' work by leading scientists and is the fourth in a series since the publication in 1987 of Our Common Future by an international commission into the state of the global environment chaired by the former Norwegian prime minister Gro Harlem Brundtland.

http://environment.independent.co.uk/climate_change/article3098852.ece
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Amonester Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-25-07 08:53 PM
Response to Reply #5
10. I wonder "Who's" personal wealth has grown by a third.
"personal wealth in the richest countries has grown by a third."

Alright, I admit the fact that I didn't have a laptop PC running an un-necessarily bloated OS (vista) with wireless access to the Internet in 1987, but overall, that's about all I got more, and everything else has gone way up (housing to start with, food, utilities, etc.)

Maybe it's just moi.

OTOH, I feel like nothing's gonna change for the best anytime soon. The environment will not "be saved" and my personal wealth will not grow. It's more like the other way down.

Call me a pessimist...
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Gonnuts Donating Member (525 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-25-07 10:55 PM
Response to Reply #5
19. The Mayans had it right ...
The Mayan calender ends December 21, 2012, because that's when the Mayans said mankind's rein on Earth will end.

I think they're right.

Not because of what the Mayans say, but because of what I have learned and observed over sixty-years of a not so normal life.

Some 40-odd years ago I helped put together the Institute for Environmental Alternatives headed by a brilliant man Professor Ron Cone. One day Ron qualified all my worst suspicions, that if we stopped polluting that day we've already poisoned the Eco-system to the point that we'll see the extinction of our species in our lifetime. Since that time I have witnessed nothing to change that view.

If you think that "climate change" is something that started in 1999 and we can fix it before it kills nearly everything on Earth in the short time we have, please, speak to me, I have a beautiful Timeshare to sell you in peaceful downtown Baghdad, right outside the Green Zone.

This a hard pill to swallow ... perhaps the hardest - but we are December's Children.
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Lorien Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-26-07 03:07 AM
Response to Reply #19
23. I think about that frequently
and I have not made any plans for myself beyond 2012. I'll try to wrap everything up in the next five years.

Some 32 years ago I overheard my best friend's father talking to his colleagues from the Polar research institute for climate studies. They had been taking ice core samples to study the effects of CO2 and other pollutants on our global environment. What I overheard back then as a child made me decide never to have children of my own. I felt certain that I would see the end of our species within my lifetime, and, like you, I have never found any evidence to the contrary. I do sometimes get depressed about the fact that I'll never know what it's like to be a mother, but I could never in good conscience bring another soul into this mess-one that would likely never see adulthood.
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mallard Donating Member (460 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-26-07 07:41 AM
Response to Reply #19
30. Re: as to why they may be right
According to a writer and friend, Willard Van de Bogart (vanflight) who has also named the 12/21/12 date of fate, it's got to do with both galactic and Earth's solar rotations coming back to the end of a 23,000-something year cycle. The sub-procession of the Earth (as a spinning 'top') on it's 23-degree tilt angle reaches some equinox point, with an open window looking toward the center of the galaxy. Does this ring a bell with you at all?

Thanks, just asking.
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superconnected Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-26-07 06:22 PM
Response to Reply #30
44. If gravity has anything to do with it
Edited on Fri Oct-26-07 06:32 PM by superconnected
the planet will keep spinning the way it is until some of the other planets and stars move off their axis's.

This isn't some spinning top left spinning that will slow down. This is a giant iron ball that is rotating from the pull of other iron balls.
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Barrett808 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-25-07 06:47 PM
Response to Original message
6. Download the report here:
The fourth Global Environment Outlook: environment for development (GEO-4) assessment
http://www.unep.org/geo/geo4/media/index.asp
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Teaser Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-25-07 06:54 PM
Response to Original message
7. I don't know what "point of no return" means
This kind of rhetoric is unhelpful. It doesn't communicate anything. To what point would we be returning? Agrarian lifestyles? We passed that point of no return long ago.

There is still much we can do to assure a livable planet for several generations. It will require a new President who is not a Republican, to begin with, and that looks likely.
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minnesota_liberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-25-07 08:28 PM
Response to Reply #7
9. Maybe it makes more sense if you read the whole report. nt
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-25-07 09:45 PM
Response to Reply #7
14. Point of No Return = unfixable ......
The threat is not only to humanity and all life on earth but to the planet itself --
and the damage we may have already done to the universe ---

Democrats and Republicans still speak of only minor common sense changes -- and they're not even accomplishing those--!!!

However, we need to stop burning fossil fuels -- therefore, those natural resources must be taken out of the hands of private individuals.

We need to replace all our gas-guzzlers with Electric Cars --
Please See: "Who Killed The Electric Car?"

Anyone who thinks for themselves understands the truth of these words ---

Who are nature's enemies ---?

I think we all know.


Below . . . Repeats from part of the "Warning to Humanity" ---


We must stabilize population.
This will be possible only if all nations recognize that it requires improved social and economic conditions, and the adoption of effective, voluntary family planning.


We must reduce and eventually eliminate poverty.
We must ensure sexual equality, and guarantee women control over their own reproductive decisions.
DEVELOPED NATIONS MUST ACT NOW


The developed nations are the largest polluters in the world today. They must greatly reduce their overconsumption, if we are to reduce pressures on resources and the global environment. The developed nations have the obligation to provide aid and support to developing nations, because only the developed nations have the financial resources and the technical skills for these tasks.

Acting on this recognition is not altruism, but enlightened self-interest: whether industrialized or
The threat is not only to humaity, all life on the planet . . .
the threat is to the very existence of the planet -- and what harm we may have already done to the universe at large ---

Success in this global endeavor will require a great reduction in violence and war. Resources now devoted to the preparation and conduct of war -- amounting to over $1 trillion annually -- will be badly needed in the new tasks and should be diverted to the new challenges.

A new ethic is required -- a new attitude towards discharging our responsibility for caring for ourselves and for the earth. We must recognize the earth's limited capacity to provide for us. We must recognize its fragility. We must no longer allow it to be ravaged. This ethic must motivate a great movement, convincing reluctant leaders and reluctant governments and reluctant peoples themselves to effect the needed changes.


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dysfunctional press Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-26-07 07:42 PM
Response to Reply #14
46. replacing all the gas-guzzlers with electric cars...
you do realize that's impossible, right...?

the amount of batteries, motors, cars, etc. that would need to be manufactured is astronomical- meaning that lots of energy-intensive mining, processing, manufacturing, and transporting will be needed for all the components and the finished product.

all at the same time that we're supposed to be CUTTING DOWN on fossil fuel use...

face it- mankind has painted itself into a corner with it's pants down.

we. are. fucked.

there is absolutely no way around it.
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Baby Snooks Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-25-07 08:25 PM
Response to Original message
8. The real problem...
Edited on Thu Oct-25-07 08:27 PM by Baby Snooks
"The damage being done was regarded by the UN programme as so serious that it said the time had come for the environment to be a central theme of policy-making instead of just a fringe issue, even though it would damage the vested interests of powerful industries."

Those vested interests will block any real action as long as those vested interests own Congress and Congress is unwilling to divest itself of the ownership.

It is easy to blame the Republicans, which I do, but the Democrats share some of the blame. All you need do is to look at deregulation which deregulated far more than the prices to see the collusion of our elected officials in the growing problem of increasing pollution despite regulation that remained in place and its contribution to what is really becoming a matter of a dying ecosystem and a dying planet.

How many Democrats voted for deregulation legislation in state legislatures as well as in Congress?

My personal feeling is that George W Bush is a spawn from Hell and his sole aim is merely to destroy the world. And he seems to be destined to do just that. With the approval of a silent Congress.

I am so angry over Nancy Pelosi rebuking Pete Stark for speaking the truth. Where is the anger of everyone else? It appears to be an anger silenced. Silenced by the fear of incurring the wrath of Madame Speaker. Who apparently prefers a noble lie to an impolite truth.




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hedgetrimmer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-25-07 09:28 PM
Response to Original message
12. Just four words, a couple of numbers and a punctuation mark.
Al Gore for President '08

This may not fix anything however, it will help.
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-25-07 09:28 PM
Response to Original message
13. Here's the Scientists Warning to Humanity . . .1992 ...followed by silence from the press . . ..
SCIENTISTS WARNING TO HUMANITY/
GLOBAL WARMING


http://www.ucsusa.org/ucs/about/1992-world-scientists-warning-to-humanity.html
1. Scientist Statement
World Scientists' Warning to Humanity (1992)

Some 1,700 of the world's leading scientists, including the majority of Nobel laureates in the sciences, issued this appeal in November 1992. The World Scientists' Warning to Humanity was written and spearheaded by the late Henry Kendall, former chair of UCS's board of directors.
INTRODUCTION


Human beings and the natural world are on a collision course. Human activities inflict harsh and often irreversible damage on the environment and on critical resources. If not checked, many of our current practices put at serious risk the future that we wish for human society and the plant and animal kingdoms, and may so alter the living world that it will be unable to sustain life in the manner that we know. Fundamental changes are urgent if we are to avoid the collision our present course will bring about.
THE ENVIRONMENT


The environment is suffering critical stress:


The Atmosphere
Stratospheric ozone depletion threatens us with enhanced ultraviolet radiation at the earth's surface, which can be damaging or lethal to many life forms. Air pollution near ground level, and acid precipitation, are already causing widespread injury to humans, forests, and crops.


Water Resources
Heedless exploitation of depletable ground water supplies endangers food production and other essential human systems. Heavy demands on the world's surface waters have resulted in serious shortages in some 80 countries, containing 40 percent of the world's population. Pollution of rivers, lakes, and ground water further limits the supply.

Oceans
Destructive pressure on the oceans is severe, particularly in the coastal regions which produce most of the world's food fish. The total marine catch is now at or above the estimated maximum sustainable yield. Some fisheries have already shown signs of collapse. Rivers carrying heavy burdens of eroded soil into the seas also carry industrial, municipal, agricultural, and livestock waste -- some of it toxic.


Soil
Loss of soil productivity, which is causing extensive land abandonment, is a widespread by-product of current practices in agriculture and animal husbandry. Since 1945, 11 percent of the earth's vegetated surface has been degraded -- an area larger than India and China combined -- and per capita food production in many parts of the world is decreasing.


Forests
Tropical rain forests, as well as tropical and temperate dry forests, are being destroyed rapidly. At present rates, some critical forest types will be gone in a few years, and most of the tropical rain forest will be gone before the end of the next century. With them will go large numbers of plant and animal species.


Living Species
The irreversible loss of species, which by 2100 may reach one-third of all species now living, is especially serious. We are losing the potential they hold for providing medicinal and other benefits, and the contribution that genetic diversity of life forms gives to the robustness of the world's biological systems and to the astonishing beauty of the earth itself. Much of this damage is irreversible on a scale of centuries, or permanent. Other processes appear to pose additional threats. Increasing levels of gases in the atmosphere from human activities, including carbon dioxide released from fossil fuel burning and from deforestation, may alter climate on a global scale. Predictions of global warming are still uncertain -- with projected effects ranging from tolerable to very severe -- but the potential risks
are very great.


Our massive tampering with the world's interdependent web of life -- coupled with the environmental damage inflicted by deforestation, species loss, and climate change -- could trigger widespread adverse effects, including unpredictable collapses of critical biological systems whose interactions and dynamics we only imperfectly understand.


Uncertainty over the extent of these effects cannot excuse complacency or delay in facing the threats.
POPULATION


The earth is finite. Its ability to absorb wastes and destructive effluent is finite. Its ability to provide food and energy is finite. Its ability to provide for growing numbers of people is finite. And we are fast approaching many of the earth's limits. Current economic practices which damage the environment, in both developed and underdeveloped nations, cannot be continued without the risk that vital global systems will be damaged beyond repair.


Pressures resulting from unrestrained population growth put demands on the natural world that can overwhelm any efforts to achieve a sustainable future. If we are to halt the destruction of our environment, we must accept limits to that growth. A World Bank estimate indicates that world population will not stabilize at less than 12.4 billion, while the United Nations concludes that the eventual total could reach 14 billion, a near tripling of today's 5.4 billion. But, even at this moment, one person in five lives in absolute poverty without enough to eat, and one in ten suffers serious malnutrition.


No more than one or a few decades remain before the chance to avert the threats we now confront will be lost and the prospects for humanity immeasurably diminished.
WARNING


We the undersigned, senior members of the world's scientific community, hereby warn all humanity of what lies ahead. A great change in our stewardship of the earth and the life on it is required, if vast human misery is to be avoided and our global home on this planet is not to be irretrievably mutilated.
WHAT WE MUST DO


Five inextricably linked areas must be addressed simultaneously:

We must bring environmentally damaging activities under control to restore and protect the integrity of the earth's systems we depend on.
We must, for example, move away from fossil fuels to more benign, inexhaustible energy sources to cut greenhouse gas emissions and the pollution of our air and water. Priority must be given to the development of energy sources matched to Third World needs -- small-scale and relatively easy to implement.


We must halt deforestation, injury to and loss of agricultural land, and the loss of terrestrial and marine plant and animal species.


We must manage resources crucial to human welfare more effectively.


We must give high priority to efficient use of energy, water, and other materials, including expansion of conservation and recycling.


We must stabilize population.
This will be possible only if all nations recognize that it requires improved social and economic conditions, and the adoption of effective, voluntary family planning.


We must reduce and eventually eliminate poverty.
We must ensure sexual equality, and guarantee women control over their own reproductive decisions.
DEVELOPED NATIONS MUST ACT NOW


The developed nations are the largest polluters in the world today. They must greatly reduce their overconsumption, if we are to reduce pressures on resources and the global environment. The developed nations have the obligation to provide aid and support to developing nations, because only the developed nations have the financial resources and the technical skills for these tasks.

Acting on this recognition is not altruism, but enlightened self-interest: whether industrialized or not, we all have but one lifeboat. No nation can escape from injury when global biological systems are damaged. No nation can escape from conflicts over increasingly scarce resources. In addition, environmental and economic instabilities will cause mass migrations with incalculable consequences for developed and undeveloped nations alike.
Developing nations must realize that environmental damage is one of the gravest threats they face, and that attempts to blunt it will be overwhelmed if their populations go unchecked. The greatest peril is to become trapped in spirals of environmental decline, poverty, and unrest, leading to social, economic, and environmental collapse.


Success in this global endeavor will require a great reduction in violence and war. Resources now devoted to the preparation and conduct of war -- amounting to over $1 trillion annually -- will be badly needed in the new tasks and should be diverted to the new challenges.


A new ethic is required -- a new attitude towards discharging our responsibility for caring for ourselves and for the earth. We must recognize the earth's limited capacity to provide for us. We must recognize its fragility. We must no longer allow it to be ravaged. This ethic must motivate a great movement, convincing reluctant leaders and reluctant governments and reluctant peoples themselves to effect the needed changes.

The scientists issuing this warning hope that our message will reach and affect people everywhere. We need the help of many.
We require the help of the world community of scientists -- natural, social, economic, and political.
We require the help of the world's business and industrial leaders.
We require the help of the world's religious leaders.
We require the help of the world's peoples.
We call on all to join us in this task.


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mojavekid Donating Member (993 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-25-07 09:49 PM
Response to Original message
16. Thanks for posting,
report is available here in PDF;


http://www.unep.org/


572 pages.
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shance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-25-07 10:00 PM
Response to Original message
17. Tell this to the oil profiteers. We could have had alternative energy decades ago.
n/t
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ramapo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-25-07 10:16 PM
Response to Reply #17
18. Thank you Ronnie Reagan and....
all the voters who bought his load of crap
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CrispyQ Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-26-07 11:44 AM
Response to Reply #17
34. Just think if we had stayed on the path that Jimmy Carter started us on. -nt
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-26-07 01:34 PM
Response to Reply #34
36. ...but then how could ExxonMobil have made 36 BILLION last year--???
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-26-07 01:36 PM
Response to Reply #34
37. Reflecting back on a coup on Carter . .. ? October Surprise . . .
They had to STOP Carter from rescuing the hostages ---

I've always wondered about all those rescue helicopters going down in the desert --

Evidently, they weren't supplied with some piece of equipment which blocks sand.



Kinda of also reminds us of the JFK "called off the air attack" -- which he didn't.

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silverweb Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-26-07 12:38 AM
Response to Original message
21. Too sad for words.


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truthisfreedom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-26-07 03:36 AM
Response to Original message
24. It's all about power, wealth, control of resources, and mercenaries.
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Up2Late Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-26-07 03:59 AM
Response to Original message
25. I've already heard talk that we are past the global warming "tipping point,"and after seeing this...
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tom_paine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-26-07 01:29 PM
Response to Reply #25
35. If you like that one, you'll LOVE this one


Reminds me of college chemistry lab. Titration curves? Remember, when the buffering of a solution has reached capacity and suddenly, a "tipping point" has been reached and acidity crashes.



Hmmmmm....
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Up2Late Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-26-07 01:41 PM
Response to Reply #35
38. Wow! That really does look bad!
Let's all hope next year (and this Arctic winter) is much colder than normal.
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OneBlueSky Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-26-07 07:04 AM
Response to Original message
28. "The existence of intelligent life on earth would be a wonderful prospect, . . .
and I am sure once humans are out of the way it will have a chance."

Mark Loughton, Essex

(reader comment at end of article) . . .

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yoyossarian Donating Member (821 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-26-07 10:39 AM
Response to Original message
31. EAT IT! JUST EAT IT!


http://steponnopets.com/peo">President Evil Online has risen from the grave!
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maxsolomon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-26-07 11:41 AM
Response to Original message
33. then we're PAST the point of no return
because ain't nobody going to stop making carbon cold turkey, least of all china. and billions of people across the planet are too poor to make carbon-footpring-reducing choices. like most americans, they're forced into an energy-usage box where escape is extrodinarily difficult & expensive.

the draconian measures that would be needed can't be implemented in the face of total obstruction & denial by the GOP.

it's gotten to the point where i feel guilty grilling a steak.
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-26-07 02:03 PM
Response to Reply #33
39. No -- there's a firm economy and profit to be established in GREEN technology ---

but those who monopolize our natural resources -- private families -- aren't in favor of healthier choices.

This is a question of commiting suicide -- or making fundamental changes.

We can nationalize our natural resources and stop burning fossil fuels.

We can put electric cars back on our roads, replacing all the gas-guzzlers in 5 years.

Rent the movie: "Who Killed The Electric Car?"


IMO, you have to keep trying -- but changing light bulbs won't do it --

WAR must end -- please read the "Scientists Warning to Humanity" I posted a few comments back . ..


IF the planet, itself, survives -- 10,000 years from now or more, it may be inhabitable again.

IF we stop what we're doing now, that may be possible.

IF we continue doing what we're doing now, we're also pushing our pollution out into the larger universe.


PS: Animal-exploitation is a big link to pollution of the planet --
Consider that the fuss in the Garden of Eden wasn't about an APPLE . . .
but rather violence against animals .... all the way to an animal-eating industry now.

For health reasons and every other reason, leave the steak -- take the organic carrots.




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SpiralHawk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-27-07 09:26 AM
Response to Original message
47. "Big deal - smirk, smirk, smirk" - Commander AWOL
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