George Wallace's shooter to be released

[underpants]

Source: WRIC

BALTIMORE (AP) - The man who shot Alabama Governor George Wallace as he campaigned for president in 1972 is going to be released from prison.

Officials at the Maryland Correctional Institute in Hagerstown say Arthur Bremer is scheduled for release in mid-December, but will likely be out earlier. He's been accumulating credits for good behavior and working as a prison clerk.

Bremer was sentenced to 53 years in prison for shooting Wallace and three bystanders at a campaign stop in Laurel, Maryland, in May 1972. A bullet lodged in Wallace's spine, leaving his legs paralyzed.

The shooting forced Wallace to quit the presidential race. But he was elected to two more terms as Alabama's governor. Wallace died in 1998.

Bremer has served 35 years of his sentence.


Read more: http://www.wric.com/Global/story.asp?S=6972678

[jody]

1. IMO Bremer should serve the full 53 years. n/t

[Name removed]

5. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[jody]

6. The crime was a premeditated assassination attempt. IMO 53 years is right. n/t

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

9. So 60 years would be excessive? -nt

[Raine]

14. He wasn't sentanced to 60, he was sentanced to 53

it's about serving the full sentance whatever the amount is.

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

16. So if he had been sentenced to 35 and getting out now you wouldn't mind? -nt

[Raine]

20. Hmmmmm good comeback

I'll have to give that some thought.

[ProudDad]

31. Bingo!!!

:rofl:

[Raine]

13. I think so too

some crimes deserve the full amount of time.

[slackmaster]

2. This release will send the wrong message to the Children

:nuke:

[John Kerry VonErich]

11. I highly doubt it.

What Wallace did will be remembered but I don't think anyone will remember the shooting and who shot him.

[ProudDad]

27. Wallace is an interesting case

George Wallace was a rabid racist prick, one of the WORST of the WORST. He was that especially when he was running for president on the "I'm a RACIST FUCK and proud of it" ticket in 1972.

Then, over time, he realized the error of his ways and repented. He redeemed himself. He disavowed that racist aspect in himself and made peace with many of the people he had wronged.

Gee, I wonder why the possibility of Mr. Bremer's redemption is denied by those who begrudge him early release for good behavior?

I guess it's because once incarcerated you are no longer a human being but become a THING, an OTHER, a THEM, eh?

[ProudDad]

32. Crap

the "children" don't even know who the last President was before shrub...

They sure as hell don't know who Arther Bremer in or who George Wallace was -- except maybe a few in Alabama where the old racist Wallace is probably still revered as a god by some...

[alcibiades_mystery]

3. 35 years is a sufficient sentence

This sounds about right.

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

8. I agree. -nt

[ProudDad]

33. Sounds like WAY TOO MUCH

to me...

It doesn't take that long to cure a head case like Bremer of his insecurities and delusions...

He would have been out in much less than 20 years in a civilized country...

[Grins]

4. Actually, this is unusual

He should have been released long ago.

I was on a jury once and a defense witness was asked if he had ever committed a crime. He replied, "Yes". Asked to explain, he said that he had committed murder 9 (NINE) years earlier and was released. He was late 20's, early 30's - tops.

Stunned, I looked around on the web. The average time served for murder in this country is about 20 years.

Bremer is there because of who he shot. He's there because of political and publicity reasons.

[LiberalFighter]

7. What is the average time served for those killing law enforcement?

[ProudDad]

28. It depends

It depends on the jurisdiction...

It depends on the race of the shooter...

It depends even more on the race of the shot...

It depends on how much money the shooter has for his/her defense...

It depends on how the prosecutor feels about the defendant...

It depends on how the judge feels about the defendant...

It depends on how good the jury picker is (more money, better jury)...

It depends on the racial makeup of the jury vis a' vis the defendant...

It depends on how the jury feels about the defendant while deliberating...

It depends on how hard the prosecutor pushes...

It depends on how well the Defense Council defends (money again)...


As you can see it's a very objective, reasoned process with the ultimate goal of Justice always acheived in the end...

:sarcasm:

as if you needed it?

[FredScuttle]

15. Bremer also shot three bystanders

including a Secret Service agent, an Alabama State Trooper and a Wallace campaign volunteer.

Opening fire in a crowd intent to kill one guy but hitting three others as well? He should have served his full sentence.

[ProudDad]

34. "He should have served his full sentence."

"Three other people present were wounded accidentally: Alabama State Trooper Captain E C Dothard (Wallace's personal bodyguard), Dora Thompson (a campaign volunteer) and Nick Zarvos (a Secret Service agent). They all made a full recovery."

[TheUniverse]

10. He should get the same punishment as everyone else.

A crime is a crime is a crime. It seems kind of standard to let someone go after 35 years of a 53 year sentence. That's a real long time. I know he shot a public figure, but I don't like keeping people in prison longer to "set examples." I believe justice should be equal.

[John Kerry VonErich]

12. Welcome to DU

:hi:

[ProudDad]

29. "I believe justice should be equal."

It NEVER is, and NEVER can be. Not under a system based on vengeance, classism and racism.

[ProudDad]

17. Some of you are amazing!

You seem to actually think that there's ANY kind of rational basis to sentences meted out by the criminal-injustice system!

AMAZING!!!

What a delusion...

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:


As a great man once said, "The only Justice at the Hall of Justice is in the halls!" Lenny Bruce...


It was a bullshit sentence from a bullshit system that was INDEED based on who he shot at not what he did...

And the bloodthirsty among you don't seem to have any concept of Justice...

[Wcross]

21. Just take a look at the crack cocaine/powder disparity.

The punishment for having powder is much less than for crack. Of course rich white guys tend to get caught with powder. The same is not true for crack.
Nothing fair about that.

[Phrogman]

18. Will they be awarding him the "Medal of Freedom" also?

e0m

[happyslug]

22. First mention of the possibility of a Conspiracy to Kill Wallace.

Of the five Assassination attempts (JFKs, Bobbie Kennedy, Martin Luther King, Malcolm X and George Wallace of the 1960s and early 1970s, Wallace is the one with almost no claim of Conspiracy, but where you have Strong evidence of one.

For more see:
http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk./USAwallaceG.htm

http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m1571/is_44_15/ai_57893700

The assassination attempt of George Wallace occurred when he was under Secret Service Protection (Based a law passed by Congress after Robert Kennedy's Assassination in 1968). You could make the claim that the since the Secret Service had to know where Wallace was to protect him, such information would be know to Nixon who was President and controlled the Secret Service (and you can add the fact Nixon DROPPED Secret Service Protection a few years after he resigned, could it be Nixon did not Trust the Secret Service so he dropped them?).

The above two websites contain more concerns about this Assassination attempt. You can make the argument that Nixon FEARED Wallace more than any other Candidate. A McGovern-Wallace ticket would have killed Nixon's plan to paint McGovern as weak on Defense, and a left wing "Nut" on desegregation. Wallace as McGovern's VP may have tipped the election from the Landslide Nixon wanted to a slim Democratic win.

If Wallace decided NOT to run as a Democratic VP, he could run as an Independent. This also would have affected Nixon's victory. Many of the people Nixon was counting on to vote for him, would have switched to Wallace (Wallace carried five states as an Independent in 1968). How many people who voted for Nixon would have voted for Wallace instead? Such votes probably would NOT have made Wallace President, but McGovern may even have won the election with the "Conservative" vote split.

All of the could be how Nixon looked at the Election, and all of it would have ended with one bullet (And it did, Wallace was to injured to run in 1972, so he dropped out of the race, he ran again in 1976, but that was Carter's year who was viewed as a Southern Democrat without the racist background of Wallace).

My point is simple, Conspiracies plots to kill JFKs, Bobbie Kennedy, Martin Luther King, and Malcolm X are all over the net, but one for the assassination of Wallace, where we have some strong evidence, is ignored. See the above to websites for details.

[defendandprotect]

23. Thought we all just took for granted that it was "conspiracy" . . .. and Nixon benefited --- so . .

Haven't read the websites yet -- thank you !!

Manchurian Candidates .... not such a fiction --

Meanwhile, imagine that there are still people who don't know that Oswald was a CIA agent
working on high level assignments --

We have this from at least two sources -- one being John Tunnheim who headed the JFK 1992 Classified records act -- and the other CIA correspondence.

[happyslug]

24. The CIA hired Oswald? Before or after he defected to the Soviets?

If it was before, I do NOT see the CIA using him for anything (unrealistic for defecting). If afterward, why? Oswald was a Nut, and probably acted alone. The biggest problem with the JFK investigation was the number of people CYAing themselves, this included the following:

1. Dallas police for NOT guarding JFK and Oswald to prevent them from being killed.

2. The FBI, who had Oswald on their list of people to watch but did not forward it to the Secret Service.

3. The Secret Service for going to a go-go club the night before instead of checking out all of the tall buildings JFK's care was to go by (Also the possibility that one of the Bullets that hit JFK came from an Agent's Gun fired by Accident during the Confusion, if true, explains even more some of the Cover-up by the Secret Service).

4. The KGB, for Oswald had married the daughter of a KGB agent (Internal Security NOT Spying), but enough of an embarrassment for the KGB.

5. The Kennedy;s themselves (And this was an official cover-up) who wanted to avoid War unless they had clear evidence that Castro or the Soviets were involved.

6. The Marines for training Oswald to shoot (and he was NOT that great a Shot based on released KGB reports on his shooting while living in the Soviet Union).

7. The CIA for not knowing anything about Oswald and what he did in the Soviet Union OR his visits to the Cuban Embassy in Mexico City.

I can go on, but I have to agree with the Warren Commission finding that Oswald had the weapon and skills to do the damage he allegedly did. Is it possible other were involved? Yes, but given the above CYAing they is no way to know one way or another (part of the CYAing is releasing information of another agency's failure to get people to stop looking at your own agency's failures).

Maybe it is my background, but most people do NOT conspire EXCEPT to protect their jobs (or their income). The above agencies and the agents within the agencies had reasons to cover up evidence INDEPENDENT of being part of a conspiracy to kill JFK. The Right Wing in the US feared Johnson as President more than JFK (Whose voting record as a Senator most closely tracked Nixon's, In fact a comment at the time called JFK and Nixon people who thought the most alike in the Senate, Nixon was VP and thus President of the Senate form 1953-1961).

As to Wallace shooting, Wallace's shooter was capable of of the Crime (and he was caught). The real issue is WHY? Did he do it for personal gain? Was he insane? or was he used by other people? Was it a job where people close to Nixon knew of the Assassin's desire and directed him from Nixon to Wallace? That all that was needed, no conspiracy, except to talk to the Shooter and tell him of an easier target. This is the allegation in the case of Wallace, and can be said of JFK's assassination (and the rest of the assassinations, i.e. leave it happen, don't do the little extras that could prevent it). For that to work all you kneed to know is knowledge. Where would be a good place for an attack? Then direct the agencies who are suppose to protect the President of other Threats. The Nuts would step right into the gap sooner or later. That is a defendable position much more defendable that a full blown conspiracy, to many people who can talk to be even thought of. To many people who will know enough for other to connect the dots. If you just nudge the damage can be done WITHOUT to many people knowing.

[defendandprotect]

35. Wow -- come out of the cold and get unbrainwashed . . ..

See the thread I just posted with the CIA memo stating that they trained Oswald and sent him to the Soviet Union --

See information from 1992 JFK Assassination Classified Records Act --
Chaired by John Tunnheim --
Panel concluded that . . .


'OSWALD WAS EMPLOYED BY THE CIA WORKING ON HIGH LEVEL ASSIGNMENTS AND PROBABLY ALSO FOR THE FBI."

Oswald was not a "nut" as myth would have you believe -- he was a very intelligent man who was trained to speak Russian as well as any Russian -- and the PATSY in the JFK coup.

Once you have this information firmly in mind .... I'd suggest you read CROSSFIRE by Jim Marrs and
High Treason I and II by Edward Harrison Livingstone -- great books.

Also, go rent JFK by Oliver Stone --

That should clear your head.

[happyslug]

37. The KGB even considered him a :"Nut".

The KGB looked at him carefully while he lived in the Soviet Union. Even leaving him practice at a Rifle range when under their observation (The report was he was a poor to average shooter). When Oswald decided to go home, no one in the Soviet Union objected. While Oswald was trained as a Radar operator, his Russian seems to be self-taught (Which may explain the lack of record of his learning Russian as while as being "Secretly" taught Russian by the CIA). In Russia, Oswald had a job, but in a occupation of no military interest. If Oswald was an agent of the CIA he failed in that regard for the Russian never trusted him and he never had access to information we would want.

As to Oliver Stone, the critics of the movie (Not the Movie Critics, but the Critics of the underlying depute) indicate Stone went on evidence that is suspect at best. Could the evidence be true, maybe, but it is equally possible for it to be false (No necessary lies, just not what happened). The burden of proof is on the person making the claim NOT on the person against who the claim is being made. Stone in JFK, reversed that, saying people who disagree with him HAVE TO PROVE HIM WRONG. Some parts of Stone's idea on JFK assassination were shown to be wrong, but most of the "Facts" can NOT be proved or disproved. You can NOT make a case on speculation, but on hard facts. You can NOT jump in with unverified facts (as in the case of the CIA training of Oswald). Hard facts make cases, and the hard facts do not support anything. Thus the Warren Commission when it looked at the lack of hard facts, reached for an explanation that explains the hard facts (for example, four wounds but only three bullets fired). People dislike the "magic Bullet" theory but given the fact the bullets with aluminum tipped bullets (such as the Italian rifle used by Oswald) are known to tumble in unexpected ways while maintaining its basic shape (This dual nature of aluminum tip bullets came out of the need for increase effectiveness of light bullets, the British was the first to adopt Aluminum tipped bullets when British came under pressure to drop its previous use as soft-point bullets,i.e. Dum-Dum bullets, as inhuman around 1900, Aluminum Top bullets stay solid while tumbling sideways through a body, the Italians adopted Aluminum tipped bullets for the same reason, and these were the bullets used by Oswald).

Anyway, I bring up he "Magic bullet" for it is always being attacked and claim to be "proof" of a Second Shooter, but no proof of a second shooter has even been found (a lot of people reporting seeing people, but that is all). While the "Magic Bullet" theory has problems, it explains three shots causing four wounds and then the bullet being found almost intact (The parts of BOTh Bodies, hit by the bullet would NOT cause the bullet much damage and absorb a lot of the power of the bullet so it is possible the bullet was found almost intact down the street given the number of officers looking for evidence afterward). No one has ever truly disproved the Magic Bullet theory, it has been attacked, but not disproved. The Warren Commission even had concerns about it, but once no reliable evidence surfaced of any other shooter, the Magic Bullet explained he known facts.

Stone (and other)s tris to disprove the Magic Bullet theory, but fail. The Magic Bullet Theory is NOT liked and would NOT stand in the way of convicting anyone else if they was evidence of a Second Shooter, but all we have is speculation of a second Shooter (Including locations of the Second Shooter showing how they could have done it, but no real evidence of the Second Shooter).

My point is one has to look at the evidence with a harsh eye. Some fats ARE not disputed, that Oswald could only have fired Three Shots (This is the limit of shots his bolt action rifle was capable of, given the time the Car was in sight) and the four bullet entrance into Kennedy and Connelly. On the other hand reports of other shooters (including reports of shots from other Directions) are unreliable (For example a "combat Veteran" reported hearing shots from other directions, but when was he in combat with all the glass in an area still intact? Glass is know to reflect gunshots, but most combat causes glass to be destroyed early in battle, thus the experts dismissed such reports as sounds bouncing off the glass). You may put more value on these reports then I do, but I look at all of them with a skeptical eye, is they another explanation? Another example are the reports of "Bums" running form the area, if you know the homeless, they hear trouble they leave the area for they know they will be blamed even if Innocent, thus the shooting would have caused them to leave, not some plan to get away (Through one could assume the Police to know that also, thus assume the police would less likely look at bums leaving the area then better dressed people).

I have read many of the Conspiracy theories, most depend on facts that do not exist, facts that MAY have happened, reports without verification etc. The burden is on the people alleging a conspiracy to prove a Conspiracy, not on me to prove no conspiracy occurred. The hardest thing to do is to prove a negative, and the conspiracy advocates rely on that fact more than anything else. You need more than what I have read over the years to show a Conspiracy other than CYAings.

[defendandprotect]

38. OK, I see you prefer to remain brainwashed --

[happyslug]

39. And you do NOT want to accept Oswald could have worked alone

That is what the Warren Commission had to deal with. Could Oswald have killed Kennedy by himself? And the answer to that is YES. You do NOT like that answer and refuse to accept it, but it is the base ANY real investigation has to start from. You can NOT assume conspiracy unless you DISPROVE Oswald's ability to do it himself. That has NEVER been disproved, it has been attacked, dismissed and even ridiculed, but never disproved. Oswald was a good enough shot and had a good enough weapon to get three shots off. He had a area to shoot from and an escape route (I know people dismiss his escape route for it was on foot after abandoning his rifle, but it is possible). YOU DO NOT WANT TO ACCEPT THAT POSSIBILITY.

People get hang up on the explanation of three shots causing four wounds, but that is not unknown. Military Full Metal Jacket bullets are know to stay more or less intake (They are design to do to international Treaty) thus the "Magic Bullet" is possible. Could other people have been involved? maybe, but mere knowledge of Oswald is NOT enough. You need more than what I have read, something called "Facts" not speculation, not theory but hard verifiable Facts. What we do have as Hard Verifiable facts do NOT Contradict the Warren Commission Report. Example of such a Fact is someone saying "Id id it" WITH facts that only a known conspiracy would know (False Confessions occur quite often, thus someone saying he was part of a conspire is NOT enough, that person has to state facts that only a Conspiracy would know).

I am sorry you can NOT accept the story that Oswald acted alone. That is your decision, but I need something more than a dislike of the idea that one person acting alone killed the President of the United States. Could Oswald have killed JFK? The Answer is Yes, did he? is another question, right now I will have to say yes for I do NOT see any other reasonable explanation for the facts, unpleasant as I might find them to be.

[defendandprotect]

40. Dir of the CIA John McCone is telling you that Oswald was employed by CIA . . ..

I think that kind of dismisses your case.

[ProudDad]

30. Naw, that only goes to Wholesale killers

and war criminals, not to small fry like Bremer.

[olddad56]

19. some of you act as if the guy chose his own sentence.

He did his time, like it or not. A 1/2 day of good time for every day of time served is pretty much standard. He was give 53 years and with his good time, he served his sentence. Get over it.

[sleipnir]

25. Those who complain would likely see him hanged tomorrow as an extra punishment.

The whole idea of prison is to reform people to return to society.

If the system works, and we hope it does, it says that he is ready to return after his heinous crime.

One should not be punished beyond what is needed, that friends is called "Revenge."

[ProudDad]

26. I wish that were true

"The whole idea of prison is to reform people to return to society."

Unfortunately, the decision was made in the 70s/early 80s to follow the advice of bloodthirsty know-nothings like some who've posted on this thread to lock 'em up, throw away the key (for a long time), torture and torment "them", do NOTHING substantive to aid "them" in rehabilitation, then let them loose again. They don't realize that these folks are our brothers, sisters, sons and daughters -- not some aliens from another dimension...

It's been an expensive failed experiment and should be ended.

It probably won't soon though -- as this thread seems to indicate, that sort of ignorance is still prevalent here in the incarceration capital of the world...

It's easy to torture someone when you don't recognize their humanity.

It's easy to spout some of the shit I've read on this thread when you turn someone into an object instead of a human being.

[defendandprotect]

36. It's more than likely that Bremer never fired on Wallace and that he was simply . . ..

another "Manchurian Candidate" --

Sirhan, Sirhan is, of course, another example of this ---

In his case, however, the evidence seems clearer and I doubt that they will release him.

Some have suggested that his condition can be detected and disconnected -- however, the

access by those who could help him has been denied.