FDA wants suicide warning on antidepresents

[CatholicEdHead]

Source: AP

Last update: May 02, 2007 – 10:56 AM

WASHINGTON -- Young adults beginning treatment with antidepressants should be warned about an increased risk of suicidal thoughts and behavior, federal health officials said Wednesday.

The Food and Drug Administration proposed labeling changes that would expand a warning now on all antidepressants. The current language applies only to children and adolescents. The expanded warning would apply to adults 18-24 during the first month or two of treatment with the drugs, the FDA said.

The proposed labeling changes also would note that studies have not shown this increased risk in adults older than 24, and that adults 65 and older taking antidepressants have a decreased risk of suicidal thoughts and behavior, it said.

Last month, a comprehensive analysis of antidepressants for children and teenagers found the benefits of treatment trump the small risk of increasing suicidal thoughts and behaviors in some patients. The Journal of the American Medical Association study also found that risk is lower than what the FDA identified in 2004, the year the agency warned the public about the risks of the drugs in children.

Read more: http://www.startribune.com/587/story/1158234.html

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This is a good thing, anti-depressants tend to be over prescribed. You can loose yourself with the "magic pill". Depending on the situation, long term talking therapy may be better. For better or worse you need to feel the range of emotions to feel better. Of course this varies by person.

[SmokingJacket]

1. I think they're extremely valuable to the seriously depressed.

The side-effects might be too potent for the mild to moderately so. Exercise has proven to be as much or more effective for those folks. I'll go see if I can find a link for that.

Here:
http://www.hdlighthouse.org/see/diet/triad/exercise/duke.htm

Vigorous exercise three times a week or more is the *only* thing that has worked for me. Drugs have worked temporarily; therapy was enlightening but ultimately didn't crack the nut.

[maggiegault]

2. Key Phrase: The Only Thing That Worked For YOU.

I have bipolar disorder and I only experience "moderate" depression when I have depressive troubles. My mania is more severe.

That "moderate" depression recently reared its ugly head in my life. The result? Total loss of interest in activities, irrational anxiety, loss of appetite, catastrophizing, persistent gloomy thoughts.

No suicidal notions, hence the "moderate" label.

Exercise wouldn't cut it, my friend. And what they say on those commercials is so true: depression HURTS.

Oh, I functioned. But I had lost my zest for life, my essence.

Two and a half weeks ago, my shrink started me on Lexapro. I felt an immediate difference in my mood, which is actually unusual, because Lexapro usually takes a little time to work.

Two and a half weeks later, I feel like I have my life, my essence, back. I'm still not 100%. However, i am able to look forward to things that I always enjoyed, things that the depression took away from me.

Exercise is a component of any aspect of wellness, but I frankly find your statement to be a lot of dangerous nonsense. What if someone in a dangerous depression read your post and decided to go the "exercise" route, thus never getting the medicinal help that has helped millions and millions of others manage this terrible disease?

I mean, what do you suggest diabetics do? Do you treat that with exercise, too? It's the same ludicrous notion. It's chemistry, sorely out of whack.

[Exiled in America]

6. An aside: I don't think suicidal thoughts are a requirement for "severe" depression.

According to the DSM-IV (Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders Fourth Edition), to be diagnosed with Major Depressive Disorder, five of the following seven traits must be present over a two week period or longer:

1. depressed mood

2. diminished interest or pleasure in activities

3. significant appetite/weight loss or gain

4. insomnia or hypersomnia

5. feelings of worthlessness or excessive guilt

6. diminished ability to think or concentrate

7. recurrent thoughts of death or suicide


(I am now entering "preaching to the choir" mode) :)

If you are formally diagnosed with Major Depressive Disorder, it is sort of by definition "severe." It distinguishes itself from bouts of "feeling down" or specific feelings of sadness directly connected to a very specific trauma. Usually it will be quantified as "acute" (not persistent) or "chronic."

The biggest problem with the disorder is that our culture totally misuses the word "depression." People say "I'm depressed" so casually, that it is easy to become totally insensitive to people who are genuinely suffering from a true disorder that can be tragic if left untreated or unnoticed.

[maggiegault]

12. I Have A History.

My "major" episodes involve suicidal ideation, and once, an attempt. I should have made that plainer.

[Exiled in America]

18. Yeah... sorry about that, I understood you later.

:hug:

[SmokingJacket]

11. Just read the study.

Exercise IS as effective as drugs for mild to moderate depression -- several studies have shown it. (I'm not, however, talking about bipolar disorder, which is a very different animal -- often people with bpd find their manias are exacerbated by SSRIs.) The benefits of exercise kick in a little slower, but appear to last longer. And it IS about chemistry. Exercise changes your body chemistry. Humans are not designed to sit on their asses 20 hours a day. Being sedentary is incredibly bad for our mental and physical health.

Obviously if a depression is "dangerous" a person should try all available treatments -- and those people are probably unable to exercise anyway.

Don't be surprised if the Lexapro stops working 6- 18 months down the line and you end up trying more drugs, other drugs, just trying to get back to how you felt the first time you were on Lexapro. It feels SO GOOD when the depression finally lifts. I know! It feels like you're alive again.
I've been there. I'm sure there are some people for whom the drugs work forever and it's all fine. But for lots of us it's not.

And I know I'm only talking about my own experience, but I'm not from Mars, and I'm sure my body is more or less like other people's -- or a lot of people's, anyway. For my mental health and stability, I need to run three miles at a time, three times a week. Two miles, two times won't cut it. Recently I had the flu and there was a bunch of snow and I quit running for a month or two. A terrible mistake. I felt fine for a while and the depression began insidiously sneaking back -- you don't even notice it. Sleep gets f-ed up, etc.

More studies:

http://www.depression-help-for-you.com/exercise-and-depression.html

http://www.betterhealth.vic.gov.au/bhcv2/bhcarticles.nsf/pages/Depression_and_exercise?OpenDocument

I know I'm evangelical on the subject of exercise, but I think every depressed person should try it, even with drugs if their doctor thinks that's appropriate.

[Name removed]

13. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[SmokingJacket]

16. Um.... huh?

Sorry, I'm just reading studies and living through my own thing. I'm not being the slightest bit condescending.

Pointing out that SSRI's are not always the secret to eternal happiness does NOT make me a scientologist, but it sure does inflame people!

Try it -- try jogging. A lot, and hard. It fucking helps.

[Pastiche423]

28. And for those that can not jog?

Or exercise?

[Pavulon]

33. Exercise is a PART of recovery

but postpartum mothers and the elderly (who do suffer from depression) may not be a able to do this. Again mental disorders should be treated by psychiatrists not GPs.

[RobinA]

25. Well...

I have mild to moderate depression, and exercise doesn't do crap, because when I'm depressed I don't feel like exercising. Prozac works just peachy, thanks, then I can exercise.

[Javaman]

27. I jog, actually I run and I'm still depressed. explain that. nt

[phylny]

23. I'm so happy you've had a good experience.

A family member, too, is on Lexapro and the change in their life has been staggering - and POSITIVE. And, they're an athlete, who exercised more than most, but that exercise did nothing to alleviate depression.

FIVE days after starting Lexapro, we noticed a change that was nothing less than astounding and wonderful.

Lexapro gave my family member their life back as well.

[Exiled in America]

3. They were (are) life saving for me.

I have battled with chronic major depression for as long as I can remember. People who say anti-depressants are over prescribed are probably correct. I think most medication is over-prescribed. Having said that, there is such a thing as chemical imbalnaces in the brain that no amount of "talking it out" along is going to fix.

When I said medication has been life saving for me, I'm not necessarily saying I think I would have killed myself without it. But I enjoyed no quality of life. I had a hard having even the most basic functionality. My case, though is serious - and clearly goes beyond situational or short term bouts with "feeling down." I've been under medical supervision for a while now, and finding the right kind of medication helped my brain "level out" enough for me to enjoy a better quality of life.

The one thing we should all be careful not to do, is to make people who seriously need to see a medical professional and receive medical treatment for a medical condition shy away from that because they feel that their problem is stigmatized. People who really do need to be treated often won't seek medical attention for a psychological problem because they feel that it isn't "socially acceptible."

But it's like my doctor said... telling a person with diagnosed major depression to simply "walk it off" without medical treatment is like telling a diabetic to just "make more insulin" by act of will alone. Depression, when properly diagnosed, is a medical condition. We don't want to create an environment wherein people who need treatment are afraid / embarrassed to seek it.

[mopinko]

4. do you know that suicides spiked after these warnings

started appearing? it is really irresponsible to be spouting medical advise. it looks to me like you do not know what you are talking about. it is hard enough to be in need of these kinds of meds, without idiots who say stupid shit like this. harder still if you are talking about parents choosing to get help for depressed kids. i hope you have never been in that spot. i doubt you would be posting shit like "magic pill" if you did.
and btw, no responsible professional recommends taking meds without getting therapy as well.

[Exiled in America]

8. A medical professional recognizes the following:

When a formal diagnosis of major depressive disorder is made:
1) Therapy is needed for the psyche
2) Medication is needed for the chemical imbalance that can't be fixed by "will power" any more than someone can "will themselves" to stop having cancer.

By the way, I just want to point out that the "magic pill" comment (of the OP) is pretty offensive and the "you need to feel the range of emotions to feel better" is totally ignorant.

When you suffer from major depressive disorder, it's like your brain is cross-wired and constantly making errors. The conclusions your brain makes from your experiences are incorrect. These wrong conclusions then amplify the symptoms of major depression which go totally beyond simply feeling bad emotionally. That is another ignorant assumption about major depression. Major depression can be life debilitating.

Medication is treatment that attempts to "un-cross" wires in the brain by bringing brain chemicals into a normal balance. When a person finds the right kind of medication that works with their chemistry, what happens is not the "removal" of a normal range of emotions. What happens is the wrong conclusions the brain makes leading to multiple symptoms including the experience of exaggerated, unhealthy and totally inappropriate negative emotional response is lessened, along with (hopefully) many of the other symptoms of major depression.

The worst part about this condition is that treatment is largely trial and error until a doctor finds the kind of medication that will work best for you. This experience can be extremely difficult.

People need to experience a normal and healthy range of emotions to feel better. People do not need to feel amplified horrific emotions that are a symptom of a dysfunction in the brain in order to feel better. Receiving medical treatment for a medical condition isn't masking the problem. It's treating an illness that stops people from taking further steps towards health and wellness.

[Sapere aude]

9. Very well said. I suffered from clinical depression for 3 years. I let thoughts like that of the

OP keep me from the professional help I could have gotten early on. My in-laws kept telling me to "snap out of it" and that I really knew what I needed to do so just get on and do it. I still have what my doctor calls a low grade depression and only when I take my meds regularly do I feel "normal."

One thing you did not mention is what the depression does to your family members. They also become depressed if you don't get help. Life in the family becomes a living hell.

[Roon]

22. I have a friend that is mentally ill

Most of my friends have issues of some sort. Anyway, she is totally against taking meds and tells me that I can get by without meds. It really pisses me off.

[Sapere aude]

5. I think you don't know what you are talking about. Coming from one who is taking anti depressants.

I'm 100% sure your opinion is based on anecdotal information and that is very disturbing because your thoughts keep many many people in the dark and away from the help they could get. Suicide is a danger to many depressed people who do not get professional help and in that vein you are helping to cause more suicides than you think you are preventing.

It really pisses me off that people with your opinion get such a big soap box to preach from.!

[DemGa]

7. It's always the transition period that the mania and

split-with-reality can occur. Too late for my sister in law; She was twenty-three.

[maggiegault]

15. I'm So Sorry.

:cry:

[nealmhughes]

10. And on the other hand, Lexapro at 20mg per diem saved my life, while

Zoloft had me ready to jump off a 10th floor balcony.

Anyone beginning antidepressants needs to be closely monitored for at least 2 weeks in my own family's experience by someone close to them who can tell if they are "just down" or really at the edge.

Psychotropics aren't one size fits all, nor are many other drugs. Some drugs that hop one person up makes another incapable or driving or operating heavy machinery (as the ads say).

[maggiegault]

14. ME TOO! Zoloft almost killed me, I got so manic I couldn't even sit down.

Now I am on 10 mg. of Lexapro and I feel so much better. SO MUCH BETTER.

Incidentally, depressed or otherwise, I go to spinning classes that last 90 minutes three times a week, and I do hardcore Pilates and Yoga every day, alternating days. I am remarkably physically fit and am a champion swimmer.

Still bipolar, though.

[Withywindle]

17. Whereas I found that Zoloft is my friend!

So far, anyway. It's only been a few months (50mg). And at first, as I was adjusting to them, I DID have random suicidal thoughts. No really concrete ideation, though, and I've also been in talk-therapy for 7 years so I was able to work most of it out. It went away after a while--and after I increased the dosage.

It's not a "magic pill" that's for sure. It doesn't get me high. I'm not falsely happy all the time--far from it--and I have to monitor myself consciously and constantly. Every thought in my head I have to evaluate now, and probably always will. But I can think like myself, and be creative, and have the confidence to stand up for myself, and go out and face the world a lot more than I used to. In fact, I think I'm improving so much I might soon start having AMBITIONS again--wow, haven't had those in years! Amazing!

You are so right that it's so different for every person. And it is trial and error, and it's costly and risky--but if you find something that helps even a little, the difference is HUGH!!1!! I'M SERIES!!1!

[maggiegault]

24. Good luck with it. I know tons of people who use Zoloft and swear by it.

Truly, "your mileage may vary" with these psych meds, you know?

[Pavulon]

34. JAMA

released a study that suggests the use of combinations of primary and booster drugs. IE lamictal and seroquil (or lithium and lexapro) for bi polar. You nailed it with the monitoring. No family medicine doctor is capable of properly handling these cases.

There are dozens of combinations and it can take time to get them correct.

Sadly the treatment is expensive.

My wife is a doc and refers patients to local treatment centers. Most are so expensive that normal people can not get adequate care.

[melody]

19. Not true

Forgive my anger, but ignorance about mental illness is one of my major irritations.

To GET to the therapist for "long term" therapy, you need to give a damn enough to get in your
car and drive to the therapist often enough. Medication is the key to survival and is as effective as therapy. You do not "lose" (or "loose") yourself with medication ... I found myself for the first time in thirty years with it. I had been suicidal since the age of eight.

Of COURSE you'll see suicide in patients on anti-depressants. No anti-depressant is 100% successful with every person. And depressed people are the ones who kill themselves.

>For better or worse you need to feel the range of emotions to feel better. Of course this varies by >person.

BULLSHIT. You don't understand what the emotions feel like or you wouldn't suggest we suffer through them. Would you tell a cancer patient in intense pain that "the range of emotions" he has is what he needs?

[depakid]

30. That's a common misconception

At least in a sizable number of cases. Talk therapy is proving to be more effective than previously thought- and SSRI's are proving to be far less useful than "advertised."

Do they help some people? Certainly they do- but they're also well known to cause an "activation effect" which can and does- trigger suicidal actions and other self destructive behavior.

They do this in basically the same way as the change of seasons does- in winter, people tend to be more depressed, but they also tend to lack the energy and motivation to act on their dark thoughts. That changes in spring and early summer, which is why the data (which goes back centuries) shows the incidence of suicide spiking during this time. People still have their dark thoughts and unresolved issue- but NOW they have the will to act on them.

[melody]

31. That's my immediate experience

I've been clinically depressed since childhood and have read everything I could lay my hands upon regarding
these matters. I know the findings you cite, but this all seems to me pop science extrapolation from limited data.
Talk therapy was never effective for me. SSRIs saved my life. I'm sick and tired of the "just say no" New Age
version community talking down medication that saves peoples' lives. Insulin has dire side effects, too. Do we
have pundits warning against using it?

Your theories on the trigger effects, I've not come across before so I can't expand upon them. All I know is that
Zoloft saved then changed my life. I have six friends who stalled taking SSRIs because of well-intended pharmo
puritanism, desperately trying to keep people from taking medication they require. Five of those friends are now
leading far happier lives that they're medicated. The sixth one is dead -- she never made it to the psychiatrist.

[depakid]

36. Part of the trouble is that there's often an underlying bipolar spectrum

particularly with refractory depression. The latest research supports "degrees of bipolarity" that don't necessarily involve noticeable mania or hypomania (in contrast with DSM IV-TR, which relies on 17+ year old research for its diagnostic criteria and coding).

Dr. Jim Phelps discusses this on his excellent site:

In my view, the simplest way to explain all that the FDA has recommended patients understand about this risk issue is to combine the warning with an education about "soft" or subtle bipolarity.

Several authors have speculated that such underlying bipolarity might account for much if not all of the adverse events the FDA is warning about (e.g. Berk). Children may be at greater risk because those depressed enough to warrant consideration of antidepressants are much more likely to have bipolar disorder than a similar sample of adults; and children may also be more likely to experience this particular effect of antidepressants.

Therefore the solution, in my view, to this problem of antidepressant-associated suicidality, is to screen all depressed patients for bipolar disorder, as the FDA recommends prior to prescription of an antidepressant; and then educate all who manifest even subtle signs (even if well less than DSM diagnostic thresholds, or MDQ cut-off scores) about soft bipolarity. Only after that education should one then discuss with the patient the diagnostic likelihood of bipolar disorder and her/his risk-tolerance regarding antidepressants.

http://www.psycheducation.org/bipolar/FDAwarnings.htm

He also has a great section on various other anti-depressant controversies:

http://www.psycheducation.org/bipolar/controversy.htm

(Another phenomena people should be aware of is called "kindling").

Back in 2004, the Australian Adverse Drug Reactions released a bulletin on this while the FDA, which was involved in a Bush league cover up that attempted to suppress the meta-analysis performed by it's own lead researcher, Dr. Andrew Mosholder.

See: Drug report barred by FDA: Scientist links antidepressants to suicide in kids

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/c/a/2004/02/01/MNGB64MJSP1.DTL

Here's how the Ozzies describe the risk:

...individual case reports, including some describing dechallenge and rechallenge, support an association between SSRI use and new onset suicidality.

When this syndrome occurred it tended to develop soon after introduction of an SSRI, or an increase in the dose and to be associated with akathisia, agitation, nervousness and anxiety. The effect often persisted with continuing treatment. Similar symptoms can follow withdrawal of the SSRI.

http://www.tga.gov.au/adr/aadrb/aadr0508.htm

[melody]

39. And I suppose I could cite twenty contradictory studies

My question is why the wish to avoid medication?

Again, I think this pharmopuritanism does nothing but place depressed people at risk, merely to march along with some desired philosophical ideal.

[depakid]

40. You reckon?

Feel free to cite some and we can discuss them rationally from both patient centric and provider angles.

[melody]

41. Studies don't count ... there's a simple difference between meds and therapy

Medication immediately saves lives. All other forms of "therapy" take time -- and clinical depressives have a very difficult time motivating themselves to do *anything*. I know this first hand.

I'm still waiting for why you think medication is "bad", given its obvious immediate benefit to the sufferer.

[depakid]

42. Medications prescribed inappropriately can easily cause harm.

and even kill.

There's a word for it. Check it out:

Iatrogenesis

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iatrogenesis

[melody]

43. There's a word for the act of not rx'ing meds because one doesn't personally approve of them, too

It's Malpractice.

[Pavulon]

35. This is a highly technical area

there are hundreds of treatment combinations for depression alone. Therapy is helpful in conjunction with medication. Depression is a medical disorder. You can not talk away cancer, you can not talk away major depression. period.

It takes no energy to place a weapon in your mouth and blow your brains out.

serotonin is one of many chemicals in the brain at play in depression. Other drugs like lithium have no impact in it but can make major changes in a person.

Oddly this topic is like gun control. There is a technical language that surrounds it. Unless you are a medical professioanl it is hard to put this data in perspective.

These drugs save lives.

[depakid]

37. Understood

However, you'd be surprised by how many providers (including psychiatrists) are remiss about keeping current and/or fail to take a proper patient history or screen for bipolarity.

I can't tell you how many times I've heard of docs prescribing SSRI's (or giving out samples) that end up throwing their patients into hypomania or worse, mixed states- which as I indicated are much more common in the spring and early summer.

Dr. Kay Jamison has some impressive charts on that in her book "Night Falls Fast: Understanding Suicide."



Also, in case anyone's interested, some of the more comprehensive material comes from NIH's Sequenced Treatment Alternatives to Relieve Depression (STAR*D) Study.

It's available here: http://www.nimh.nih.gov/healthinformation/stard.cfm

[olddad56]

20. from what I understand about a higher rate of suicide ...

for young adults on anti-depressants sort of makes sense for me. When you are severely depressed, it isn't that uncommon to have thoughts of wanting to commit suicide. For those that are seriously a threat to do this, the have a plan. What they often lack is the energy to carry out the plan. Most of the SSRI class anti-depressants can have a stimulative effect initially. They also take a few weeks to start relieving depression. In the relatively few cases where people have committed suicide after starting a course of anti-depressants, then can develop the energy to carry out the plan before the medication takes effect.

I think that a risk exists, but the risk of depressed people committing suicide while not being medicated is much higher.

[Shallah Kali]

21. Any studies showing this comparing medication vs talk and/or other therapy in teen suicide?

I went through the medication thing as a teen with anxiety and depression. Some did nothing, some made me a bit less depressed, a few had me beating my head against the wall for the next few days scaring my poor parents half to death. After those few my parents took me out of drug therapy. I and they would rather deal with my panic attacks than wondering if I was going to flip my lid.

i wonder if part of the problem with mind altering medications is that some think they are like antibiotics - you take them the problem goes away after a certain time with no further effort required. no getting to the root of the problem, learning coping skills, etc. in my case depression was caused by the anxiety disorder not knowing why I had it, getting treated like a brat by the school system instead of someone with an illness, the stress and strain of the anxiety. as my anxiety disorder got better the depression got better. used properly medications can do wonderful things. in other situtions it's not so good.

[depakid]

29. Yes- there are two meta-analyses

and both show that with the exception of prozac (which has only a very slight effect) none of the SSRI's showed any significant efficacy when compared with a placebo and talk therapy and there's also a recent study that indicates anti-depressants are not efficacious for bipolar depression- whereas intensive therapy is.

http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/medicalnews.php?newsid=69387

The OP is exactly right. Anti-depressant are over prescribed- and in fact, they can and DO make some patients' conditions worse and leave them with a considerably poorer long term progosis.

[tinrobot]

26. Depressed people are much more likely to be suicidal

So, of course there's going to be a higher rate of suicide for a sample of patients taking drugs to treat depression. Saying antdepressants cause suicide is like saying aspirin can cause headaches (because sometimes the aspirin doesn't work and the headache remains.)

As someone who took antidepressants for years, I do know they can be very helpful, but they are not a cure. They are simply one step on a long road. Antidepressants are a lot like a painkiller. If you break your arm, the painkiller will make it hurt less, but it won't fix the broken arm. It's the same with antidepressants, all they do is lift the pain. You still need to work on yourself and fix the underlying psychological/self image problems. That's one place where a lot of people fall short. They expect the antidepressant to be the cure, and when it isn't, they blame the antidepressant when they don't ultimately feel better. But in reality, only have themselves to blame for not doing the personal work. A lot of doctors also fall into the trap of seeing the pill as the cure, and this needs to stop.

While the drugs are generally safe, there are a few caveats, one of which is that people can abuse these drugs just like any other drug (abuse of this drug includes not doing some form of therapy as part of the treatment.) From experience, I can say that going off of some antidepressants cold turkey is not a pleasant experience at all. I can see an unstable person snapping if they went cold turkey. This means these pills need a lot more oversight by doctors, people need a lot more one on one counseling to fix the underlying problems.

[Pavulon]

32. OP is off

Depression, bi-pole, and other mental diseases impact people across socio economic barriers. Talk therapy works in conjunction with medication. It is a real disease, not a state of mind.

Psychoactive drugs should NOT be prescribed by GPs. These meds should be administered by a psychiatrist under close care.

Most of these diseases are not diagnosed with things like pet scans but depression does change brain function and can be measured with empirical means.

[StarryNite]

38. How about they put suicide

warnings on our food since they are so badly contaminated?

[Jennicut]

44. I take 10mg of Lexapro a day.

I suffer from terrible PMS. I have had it since I was 14 and I am 31 now. Its actually called PMDD (Prementrual Dsymorphic Disorder). I get severe depression right before it, to the point of suicidal thoughts. I can barely function. My Lexapro dose is low but enough to ease the symtoms during that time. I have to take it every day, however, or is has no effect (needs to be built up in your system to work). I have taken Zoloft which made me a zombie, I just slept all day. I took Prozac for years but it lost its effectiveness after a while. I think getting therapy and getting enough exercise are helpful but without an antidepressant my moods are just so out of control during my PMS and I have a 2 year old and 3 year old to take care of. I don't know where I would be. I am also a diabetic and the diabetes just makes my moods worse during the PMS. Hard to control your blood sugar during that time. Everyone has to do whats right for them.

[davsand]

45. We call them "side effects" but most of our drugs mess with somebody out there.

I am not gonna even touch the debate about anti-depressants and talk therapy and suicide...

ALL I'm observing here is that any drug on the market is not gonna work 100% of the time the way they think it will on EVERY person who takes it. We call them "side effects" and they are so common that it is cliche.

You put any substance in your body (food and water included) and it will create a reaction in your system. It might be a "good" or desirable reaction (Hey--I'm not hungry any more!) or it might be a bad reaction that nobody expected (Damn--who KNEW I was allergic to this particular food? I got a rash!!) Drugs create a reaction and you just can't predict with certainty what that will be if they are new to your system.

From personal experience, I took Ambien (a sleeping pill) for exactly two nights. First night I slept great and felt super the next morning. The second night I slept ok, but the following morning I started to hallucinate have crying jags and panic attacks. It took three days for that crap to work out of my system and I made my husband watch me the entire time because I was not in control.

When I saw my Doc the response was, "Hmm, I'm never heard of that reaction before. Don't take it again." (Well, Duh!) Based on that single experience I have completely reformed my opinions about prescription drugs and how our nation uses them.

We are told from the time we are little kids that if the docs give it to you it is ok--it is safe. I always knew that was a load of crap--that drugs CAN kill you--but I never realize just how untrustworthy this stuff all is--especially if our docs are not monitoring us with new scripts. I don't care WHAT it is, I am really paranoid now about taking anything new.


Laura