FBI Agent Testifies Libby Learned About Plame from Cheney

[RamboLiberal]

http://www.editorandpublisher.com/eandp/news/article_display.jsp?vnu_content_id=1003540604

The "CIA leak" trial resumed today, after two critical days of testimony from reporters Judith Miller and Matt Cooper. As in past days, E&P will provide running updates here.

After a long day or legal wrangling and no witnesses, an FBI agent took the stand shortly before 3 p.m. She is Deborah Bond, a 19-year veteran, called into the probe of who may have leaked name of classified agent.

She described the bureau's interview with I. Lewis "Scooter" Libby on Oct. 14, 2003. Asked where he first learned of Ambassador Joe Wilson's wife, Valerie Plame, he had told the FBI then -- from the vice president, on or about June 12 that year, in a telephone conversation.

Vice President Cheney had also said that she worked in "CP" or counter-proliferation at the agency. How did Cheney know this? From someone at the CIA -- possibly director George Tenet, but Libby wasn't sure.

How to explain Libby originally claiming he had first heard about Wilson's wife from NBC's Tim Russert in July? He had simply forgotten he had actually heard it from the vice president a month or more earlier, Libby said. But Libby's notes, produced by prosecutors during this testimony, did show notations from June 12 regarding Wilson's wife. And Libby later confirmed this in a second FBI interview.

Cheney should be up on Treason charges!

[CountAllVotes]

1. Cheney should be up on Treason charges!

I agree!

:kick: & Recommend!

[MGKrebs]

28. That may be, but probably not for that conversation.

As far as I know, they were both authorized to have classified info. How the leak then came about however.... :-)

[Mugsy]

43. Uh, this is NEWS??? Cheney confessed on NATIONAL TV!

...four months ago.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=idPFHEdp-Qo
.

[Bzzzz]

59. This is the spin...

that the WH is going to use on this...that they declassified it. But, my take on it is if there is an agent in the field and they declassify and then name drop, this is the same as treason, because it puts the agent in danger. This is all a time line situation.

[Wiley50]

2. From What I Understand, Fitz Has A Second Sealed Indictment From The Grand Jury

I bet it's for Cheney on Treason Charges

and he plans to serve him as he leaves the witness stand

Oh Boy!

Fitzmas at last!

[CountAllVotes]

3. oh boy is right!

:popcorn: :popcorn: :popcorn:

THE TRUTH WILL SET WE THE PEOPLE FREE!

:kick:

[Kagemusha]

4. It's sealed (if it exists) so we don't know. We can only guess.

But hey, even if there wasn't, the important thing is to see if the trial gets the sand out of the umpire's eyes, so to speak, and allows a better assessment of charges up the line.

[yodermon]

5. Wiley! I'd love to know how you have come to Understand

that Fitz has sealed treason indictments for big dick.
:popcorn:

[ryanmuegge]

12. Poetic justice it'd be, but it isn't going to happen...

It'd take some serious balls to indict the Vice President. I doubt anyone has the balls to actually nail the sitting VP. People in general lack balls to challenge authority anymore.

[Demeter]

26. I'll GLADLY Do It!

You don't need balls, just nothing left to lose....

[The Wizard]

36. Spiro Agnew ring a bell? (nt)

[ryanmuegge]

51. Of course. That was a different time, eh?

[knight_of_the_star]

16. Whoever it hits

It will hit them like a semi going 80.

[EmperorHasNoClothes]

37. I picture a scene like that at the end of "The Untouchables"

Cheney, being dragged out of the courtroom by the baliff, yelling, "YOU'RE NOTHING BUT A LOT OF TALK AND A BADGE!!!"

[antiimperialist]

6. Reports that Armitage was the 1st leaker were WRONG

The media screwed up in this one, if it turns out that Cheney disclosed Plame's identity before Armitage told Woodard in "mid June", as Woodard stated.

All we need to know is what Woodard meant by "Mid-June".
If this "Mid-June" turns out to be a date later than June 12th, 2003 (The date Cheney told Libby), then Cheney is the leaker...or...did Bush tell Cheney?

This is getting very interesting.

According to Woodward, Official #1 made a "casual and offhand" comment that "Wilson's wife worked for the CIA on weapons of mass destruction as a WMD analyst," in a "mid-June 2003" conversation.

[struggle4progress]

7. Wingnuts like Debra Saunders are still pushing that line today

... Saunders' political experience includes stints working as a writer/researcher and account executive for Russo Watts & Rollins, a Republican lobby shop in Sacramento, Calif., and Todd Domke Associates, a Boston-based Republican media consulting firm specializing in strategy, public relations, and advertising ... http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=Debra_J._Saunders

[Rosa Luxemburg]

10. what about tenant?

tenet

[Garbo 2004]

19. Those reports refer to leaks from gov't officials to the press. Armitage had a mtg with Woodward

on June 13, 2003, presumably when Armitage told Woodward:

"Official State Department calendars, provided to The Associated Press under the Freedom of Information Act, show then-Deputy Secretary of State Richard Armitage held a one-hour meeting marked "private appointment" with Woodward on June 13, 2003." http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/14458302/

To date there's no indication that Armitage was part of the Cheney/Libby conspiracy against the Wilsons.

Libby leaked to Judy Miller on June 23.

That Cheney told Libby about Plame is not exactly news, it was in Libby's indictment back in October 2005: "9. On or about June 12, 2003, LIBBY was advised by the Vice President of the United States that Wilson’s wife worked at the Central Intelligence Agency in the Counterproliferation Division. LIBBY understood that the Vice President had learned this information from the CIA."

The OVP had been asking the State Dept and CIA for info on Wilson and the Niger trip so briefers in the State Dept and the CIA were getting back to Cheney/Libby providing them with information, including that Wilson's wife worked in the CIA and had been involved in his being sent to Niger. This also is mentioned in Libby's indictment.

6. On or about June 11 or 12, 2003, the Under Secretary of State orally advised LIBBY in the White House that, in sum and substance, Wilson’s wife worked at the CIA and that State Department personnel were saying that Wilson’s wife was involved in the planning of his trip.

7. On or about June 11, 2003, LIBBY spoke with a senior officer of the CIA to ask about the origin and circumstances of Wilson’s trip, and was advised by the CIA officer that Wilson’s wife worked at the CIA and was believed to be responsible for sending Wilson on the trip.

Additionally, a State Dept memo, prepared in response to Libby's inquiry regarding the Wilson trip also mentioned Valerie Wilson. That memo was dated June 10, 2003.

PDF file of Libby indictment: http://www.usdoj.gov/usao/iln/osc/documents/libby_indictment_28102005.pdf

[ChairmanAgnostic]

32. to the contrary - Armitage was set up, prolly by the Bushies

remember, they disliked his even handedness and open thinking. I can easily see Cheney's staff giving him info, then setting him up with a reporter. I don't think we can overestimate the evil, greed and underhandedness of this admin.

[Name removed]

8. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[antiimperialist]

9. Everyone contact your representative/senator

Mine are Hillary and Schumer.

Warn them that you demand that any high-level official, including vice-presidnet or president, be impeached if it is proven during this trial that they outed one of our clandestine agents.

[Rosa Luxemburg]

11. they seem to have bad memories or simply 'forget' where their notes were

they thought they wouldn't be found out!

[DesEtoiles]

13. Bush would not ask Cheeney to resign even if Cheeney ate a live puppy on TV

[goforit]

33. Hell, if someone comits treason he is usually arrested on the spot.

[hippiechick]

40. Palpatine Cheney is not just 'someone'.

[Contrite]

14. Russert's testimony is crucial. n/t

[Divine Discontent]

17. in what way?

if you would, please? and, no one has said it, but could the potentially sealed indictment be for rove, or is that what everyone thinks so noone mentioned it, but how would he get the info, it all seems to me that Cheney got the info from Tenet or someone in the CIA, right? So, if he did and leaked it, he's going to be indicted, I'd think!



www.cafepress.com/warisprofitable <<-- antibush prodem stickers/shirts

[Contrite]

18. In this way

How to explain Libby originally claiming he had first heard about Wilson's wife from NBC's Tim Russert in July? He had simply forgotten he had actually heard it from the vice president a month or more earlier, Libby said. But Libby's notes, produced by prosecutors during this testimony, did show notations from June 12 regarding Wilson's wife. And Libby later confirmed this in a second FBI interview.

But he said it seemed like news to him -- he'd forgotten all about it -- when Russert asked him if he knew that Ambassador Wilson's wife worked at the agency and, allegedly, other reporters knew this. Then Libby told other reporters who might not know about it, including Glenn Kessler of The Washington Post and NBC's Andrea Mitchell.

"She (Bond) said Libby did say he had discussed Wilson's wife with Cheney sometime after discussing her with NBC reporter Tim Russert on either July 10 or July 11, 2003."

Russert says he did not discuss Plame with Libby, a recollection that is directly at odds with the former aide‘s testimony.

+++++++++

Apparently, Russert never discussed Plame with Libby at all, though his testimony indicates that he talked with Cheney about Plame after Russert told him about her.

It's clear that Libby was trying to throw suspicion off Cheney and onto Russert for spilling the information about Plame, and also planting the idea that Cheney learned about Plame from Libby after he learned about her from Russert.

The article also states:

"Some witnesses, such as officials from the CIA and State Department, said they told Libby about Plame."

Again, throwing it off Cheney.

[The Backlash Cometh]

22. Why, exactly did Libby think Russert would be a good fall guy?

[Contrite]

52. I think possibly he/Rove thought they could set him up

This article delves into it some more:

http://thenexthurrah.typepad.com/the_next_hurrah/2007/01/the_scooter_lib.html

[Skink]

15. I'll go head and delete this.

there.

[The Backlash Cometh]

20. I'll bring it up again.

If Cheney knew beforehand that Plame's wife was in counter-proliferation, and we know now that it involved Iran, wouldn't it make sense that Cheney would want to get rid of this husband-wife team in one stroke since they both had information that would stop him from going into Iraq and Iran?

[acmavm]

21. Not to mention all the juicy proof that Halliburton was dealing in

nuclear technology with Iran while Cheney was CEO and dealing with Iran was a no-no.

[The Backlash Cometh]

23. His company also did business with Iraq.

Though, I understand this was approved.

[ItsTheMediaStupid]

38. I wonder if this is where A. Q. Khan comes into the picture

I know he is a gun runner and was supposedly involved in getting Pakistan either information or materials for their nuclear weapons program.

[The Backlash Cometh]

45. I haven't quite grasped the connection, but his name keeps coming up.

[seemslikeadream]

54. robertpaulsen KNEW Dick Cheney exposed Valerie Plame to cover up his association with A.Q. Khan's

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=389&topic_id=95825

[ItsTheMediaStupid]

58. Thanks. I saw that thread shortly after I posted, but too late to edit

Cheney had at least three motives to out Valerie (Plame) Wilson:

1. Joe Wilson was undermining the fake case for WMD in Iraq.
2. Cheney has shady dealings with Khan re: Pakistan, Iran and several other countries.
3. If Brewster-Jennings continued to operate, the CIA would undermine the coming fake claims of WMD in Iran.

[Springster]

24. It's not that simple - your typical CP Analyst is a normally a HQs weenie as opposed

to a clandestine field officer.

It's like saying "Bill's brother Bob is in the Army" and the listener writing a story that Bob is a Special Forces Officer assigned to a classified unit.

[The Backlash Cometh]

25. Maybe.

But, until the last poster mentioned it, I hadn't realized that Halliburton was involved with selling nuclear items to Iran. Makes you wonder if Cheney was doing some damage control while he was VP, the way he tried to do damage control with the asbestos problem.

Even a desk jockey can be a problem for him, if they read the right files.

[Frank Cannon]

30. Gee, Springster, all this fuss over a mere "HQs weenie".

Imagine that. Yeah, I'm sure Valerie Plame was of just no importance whatsoever. :eyes:

[gatorboy]

44. Hey now, don't be too hard on Springster.

Seems like he's got this figured out. Maybe they should put him in charge! ;)

[ms liberty]

39. You might want to learn a bit more about Ms. Plame...

She was no some "HQ weenie" as you term it. She had been in the field, for a long time, and was a NOC (Non Official Cover). Outing her outed a business that the CIA had been using as a 'front' for a long time. She was a covert officer, and it was NOT open knowledge; she had been at HQ for near 5 years (she had married and had small children, that's why she was there - you know, family values), but had not been reassigned or reclassified, whatever the term is. Her specialty IIRC, was Iran, I'm not sure if it covered other middle eastern countries...the point is that this was a person that was a specialist in her field, had contacts, knew and was associated with covert operatives in other countries, and was working to track WMD's and related issues in the very area that the people who so casually outed her say they are so worried about. They did major damage to our intelligence networks for political reasons and maybe more. If you're really concerned about keeping your country safe, is it a good idea to expose your spies with contacts in the area...just how Patriotic and Secure is that? They definitely wanted to discredit Joe Wilson in order to distract America from the truth about the yellowcake lies - they knew they were lying, but they did it anyway, and it was to start a war - and for that reason alone they should all be removed.

[gatorboy]

42. And you'd know, right James Bond?

:rofl: enjoy your stay. :hi:

[Rosa Luxemburg]

61. hey leave the HQ weenies alone!

LOL!

[Contrite]

53. Yes. I have thought that for some time now.

Two birds with one stone...and quashing inside information about the lack of WMD in both countries.

[Epiphany4z]

27. well we knew this

remember all the talk about what the VP could do as far as declassifying information?

[SpiralHawk]

29. Cheney: "So I lied and outed a US agent. Big deal. F*ck you."

"sneer, sneer, sneer. Don't bother me again, I am busy counting up my republicon war profits."

- Dick 'Five Military Deferments' Cheney


SNEER

[Massachusetts]

31. Keep it simple CSI style

You've got the motive, You've got the evidence, You've got a credible witness, and you've I.D'd the Perp, tie it all together and you have an air tight case. Go Fitz.

To much CSI...

[Bonobo]

34. Death Sentence for treason?

http://www4.law.cornell.edu/uscode/html/uscode18/usc_sec_18_00000794----000-.html

TITLE 18 > PART I > CHAPTER 37 > § 794

§ 794. Gathering or delivering defense information to aid foreign government


(a) Whoever, with intent or reason to believe that it is to be used to the injury of the United States or to the advantage of a foreign nation, communicates, delivers, or transmits, or attempts to communicate, deliver, or transmit, to any foreign government, or to any faction or party or military or naval force within a foreign country, whether recognized or unrecognized by the United States, or to any representative, officer, agent, employee, subject, or citizen thereof, either directly or indirectly, any document, writing, code book, signal book, sketch, photograph, photographic negative, blueprint, plan, map, model, note, instrument, appliance, or information relating to the national defense, shall be punished by death or by imprisonment for any term of years or for life, except that the sentence of death shall not be imposed unless the jury or, if there is no jury, the court, further finds that the offense resulted in the identification by a foreign power (as defined in section 101(a) of the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act of 1978) of an individual acting as an agent of the United States and consequently in the death of that individual, or directly concerned nuclear weaponry, military spacecraft or satellites, early warning systems, or other means of defense or retaliation against large-scale attack; war plans; communications intelligence or cryptographic information; or any other major weapons system or major element of defense strategy.
(b) Whoever, in time of war, with intent that the same shall be communicated to the enemy, collects, records, publishes, or communicates, or attempts to elicit any information with respect to the movement, numbers, description, condition, or disposition of any of the Armed Forces, ships, aircraft, or war materials of the United States, or with respect to the plans or conduct, or supposed plans or conduct of any naval or military operations, or with respect to any works or measures undertaken for or connected with, or intended for the fortification or defense of any place, or any other information relating to the public defense, which might be useful to the enemy, shall be punished by death or by imprisonment for any term of years or for life.
(c) If two or more persons conspire to violate this section, and one or more of such persons do any act to effect the object of the conspiracy, each of the parties to such conspiracy shall be subject to the punishment provided for the offense which is the object of such conspiracy.
(d)
(1) Any person convicted of a violation of this section shall forfeit to the United States irrespective of any provision of State law—
(A) any property constituting, or derived from, any proceeds the person obtained, directly or indirectly, as the result of such violation, and
(B) any of the person’s property used, or intended to be used, in any manner or part, to commit, or to facilitate the commission of, such violation.
For the purposes of this subsection, the term “State” includes a State of the United States, the District of Columbia, and any commonwealth, territory, or possession of the United States.
(2) The court, in imposing sentence on a defendant for a conviction of a violation of this section, shall order that the defendant forfeit to the United States all property described in paragraph (1) of this subsection.
(3) The provisions of subsections (b), (c) and (e) through (p) of section 413 of the Comprehensive Drug Abuse Prevention and Control Act of 1970 (21 U.S.C. 853 (b), (c), and (e)–(p)) shall apply to—
(A) property subject to forfeiture under this subsection;
(B) any seizure or disposition of such property; and
(C) any administrative or judicial proceeding in relation to such property,
if not inconsistent with this subsection.
(4) Notwithstanding section 524 (c) of title 28, there shall be deposited in the Crime Victims Fund in the Treasury all amounts from the forfeiture of property under this subsection remaining after the payment of expenses for forfeiture and sale authorized by law.

[NashVegas]

35. Who's Ass is the NYT Covering?

In an intriguing but unexplored exchange with a prosecutor, Peter Zeidenberg, Ms. Bond also said that Mr. Libby had acknowledged in one of the interviews that he might have talked to Mr. Cheney aboard Air Force Two about whether to tell the press about Ms. Wilson as part of the effort to rebut Mr. Wilson’s criticisms.

No mention in the Times of the bombshell in E & P, but it does show up in other accounts.

[gatorboy]

41. I can her the right wing fuck nuts now: "He's a hero...A HERO!!"

PLEASE tell me that this is what will bring this smug prick down.

[Supersedeas]

46. Nuthin' to see here--feed them more poll #'s for the Nov 08 election--call it news

[sbyte]

47. Viewpoints from a prosecutor: see link

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/christy-hardin-smith/libby-trial-where-every_b_40259.html

[robertpaulsen]

48. The big bombshell isn't that Cheney told him ABOUT Plame.

It's that they talked about OUTING HER.

Agent: Libby may have talked of outing operative with Cheney
http://www.boston.com/news/nation/washington/articles/2007/02/02/agent_libby_may_have_talked_of_outing_operative_with_cheney/

[Contrite]

55. Yup. n/t

[Rosa Luxemburg]

62. what were they discussing on AF1

or was the outing arranged prior to that?

[sattahipdeep]

63. Osama's in the Bahamas

The billions of dollars already spent in Iraq have "produced little of lasting value,"
Rep. Henry A. Waxman, Democrat of California, charged in a recent letter to his colleagues.
"Too often, the administration has failed to learn from its mistakes in Iraq, wasting
billions in taxpayer dollars. ... We should not make the same mistake ourselves."

Waxman, chairman of the House Government Reform Committee, has scheduled an inquiry into
the U.S. reconstruction effort, summoning L. Paul Bremer III, former head of the Coalition
Provisional Authority in Iraq, to a hearing next week.

"Be prepared to discuss ... more than $8.8 billion in cash" that was disbursed under Bremer's
authority in Baghdad "without adequate financial controls or accountability," Waxman warned
Bremer, citing an audit report by Bowen's office in 2005.
http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/nationworld/iraq/bal-te.reconstruct31jan31,0,7706051.story?coll=bal-nationworld-headlines

[yellowcanine]

49. George W. Bush is going to be a busy little beaver in December 2008.

Issuing pardons to all those who paid the price for his crimes.

[MasonJar]

50. Can a sitting VP be indicted or do we have to wait until he is out

of office?

[Contrite]

56. Technically and legally, yes.

Technically and legally, a sitting vice president can be indicted. In fact, there’s a precedent.

Not long after he killed Alexander Hamilton in their famous 1804 duel, Vice President Aaron Burr was indicted for murder in both New York and New Jersey. No constitutional crisis ensued.

And as this 2000 Department of Justice memo lays out, the department researched the issue thoroughly in 1973.

Back then, Vice President Spiro T. Agnew was trying to stave off a grand jury investigation into kickback, bribery and tax evasion charges by insisting that he was only answerable to Congress.

After all, only Congress holds the power to remove the president or vice president from office — and presumably it would be impossible to function as vice president from a jail cell.

But none other that then-solicitor general Robert Bork concluded that, while “the indictment or criminal prosecution of a sitting President would impermissibly undermine the capacity of the executive branch to perform its constitutionally assigned functions,” the vice president was fair game.

The “brief from the solicitor general argued that, while the president was immune from indictment, the vice president was not, since his conviction would not disrupt the workings of the executive branch.”

Agnew ended up resigning his office as part of a plea bargain.

[FreeStateDemocrat]

57. Correct me if I'm wrong but Spiro Agnew was indicted and resigned the vice-presidency.

I don't remember the exact timing but he pleaded nol contendere and was convicted of accepting bribes while Governor of Maryland, this is from my faulty memory.

[Contrite]

60. I re-checked

Agnew pleaded Nolo Contendre to a single count of failing to report on his tax form $29,500 he had received in 1967. He was sentenced to 3 years unsupervised probation and fined $10,000. He was also found guilty by the state of Maryland and was ordered to pay back $268,482.00, and was disbarred.

Following Spiro Agnew’s resignation President Nixon, following the rules of the 25th Amendment, asked the Congress to approve House Minority Leader Gerald Ford of Michigan to be the new Vice President.

No longer allowed to practice law and not particularly welcome at political events the former Vice President started a business helping international investors make contracts.

Agnew never did admit that he was guilty, but felt that he could not fight the pressure from the White House to cave in and resign.