(Bill) Clinton's Winnipeg visit draws fans, foes - CBC

[Screaming Lord Byron]

http://www.cbc.ca/stories/2003/12/09/clinton_speech031209

Winnipeg Mayor Glen Murray is situated firmly in the Clinton cheering section. Murray thinks so much of the man that he volunteered to introduce him at the speech.

"I think he's one of the more intelligent and global-thinking leaders," said Murray. "There was a greater understanding of Canada than I think we've seen from many, many presidents."

Not everyone is excited about Clinton's visit. Retired physics professor Jovan Jovanovich decided to organize a protest outside the hall hosting the speech.

" reminding people that Bill Clinton was a bad president and that he's done great injustice to Yugoslavia, and that he's responsible for enormous damage," said Jovanovich.

[Catherine Vincent]

1. Didn't realize there are freepers in Canada.

Oh how I miss Clinton.

[BayCityProgressive]

2. not just freepers

Many on the Left think Yugoslavia was bad. I don't know enough about the details to comment either way.

[xchrom]

6. gatt and nafta

besides yugoslavia. i'm conflicted about ygoslavia -- what i will say is that while in london i met a good many grateful folk from kosovo.

[lancdem]

8. "while in london i met a good many grateful folk from kosovo."

That's an important affirmation to me. I have no problems with Kosovo, but that's just my opinion.

[glarius]

4. Most Canadians welcome Clinton with affection and respect

when he comes to Canada....All thinking Canadians are SO AWARE of the difference in the way Clinton interacted with the leaders of our country and the rest of the world, compared with the current occupant of the White House....As a matter of fact Clinton and Prime Minister Chretien were and still are good friends....Just a couple of days ago I saw a piece on CBC about Chretien's political career (he's about to retire) and there were several clips of Clinton saying how much he liked and respected Chretien....The thing is, Clinton didn't arrogantly expect Canada to follow his lead in everything, like Bush does...Oh if only Clinton were still president!!!!!!

[GalleryGod]

3. Jovnovich is a Gadfly on a Good Day

A Crank & a Professional Malcontent the remainder.

[lancdem]

5. Sounds like you've heard of him

:)

[lancdem]

7. I'm pretty sure Clinton's very popular in Canada

It'll be interesting to see how many people Jovanovich gets for his protest.

[EV1Ltimm]

16. literally tens, i'd imagine.

if that.

[David__77]

9. I protested Clinton in the past.

I agree that the war against Yugoslavia was wrong. In the current climate, however, I would not protest against Clinton. His past error are but spots on the sun now compared with those we face from the current regime.

[Frederic Bastiat]

11. Why was the Kosovo campaign wrong?

How would you have gone about it differently?

[David__77]

13. well...

I would not have rained bombs on Yugoslavia. I would not have invaded the territory of that country. I would not have aided the Kosova Liberation Army. I would have first and foremost considered this a matter of the internal affairs of Yugoslavia. Accounts of wholesale slaugter are not supported by facts. I would have diplomatically worked with that government in support of the civil rights of Yugoslav citizens, including the Albanian minority.

[MrTriumph]

14. Say what!?

Serbia was out of control and was waging genocide on the Kosovars. Sometimes there is no alternative to the military option.

BTW, if you think the whole genocide story was cooked up, you are in denial.

[tameszu]

17. You already seem to have some of your facts wrong

No one invaded Yugoslavia; the Europeans and much of the Pentagon (although not Clark) were too afraid to use ground troops, so the war was resolved merely through aerial strikes. That's one of the criticisms the left makes of the war; that the war was waged in a cowardly manner that didn't minimize casualties.

The U.S. and much of Europe worked diplomatically for years with the former Yugoslavia, and did achieve a partial peace for part of the former territory through the Dayton Accords, after their neutrality left 250,000 dead in Bosnia. Milosevic still didn't respect that agreement, however, and more talks went on for months before it was finally obvious that Milosevic wouldn't respect it and wasn't serious about reigning in his ambitions or his Serb security forces. The KLA and the Serb police were already too polarized to make peace without some serious concessions from the side with the upper hand, the Yugoslavs--just as in Israel, we progressives expect the people who have more power to show their faith first, right?

What this proved was that in some cases, the situation is dire enough that you have to use force. If none of us on the left can get it together enough to distinguish more or less just uses of force from unjust ones like Bush's Iraq invasion, then it's unlikely that the public will ever trust us with security matters.

[HawkerHurricane]

10. Trying not to sound racist...

But Jovanovich sure sounds like a Serbian name, and it doesn't surprise me that a Serb would object to Clinton's policies in Yugoslavia.

[louis-t]

12. Did they put Jovanovich in a pen

1/2 mile from the hall?

[mzmolly]

15. What's it like in Winnipeg?

Totally off topic I know ;)

I've considered Winnipeg, Toronto, Montreal, Thunderbay, Vancouver??? That is if * is elected...

[Avis]

18. MN

But I live about 2 hours south east of Winnipeg. I go there often and have many friends there. Lovely city - much diversity and nice people.
My son is looking at going to the U of Manitoba - good schools. Cold though - January we will see -20 or lower. Flat, prairie farmland mostly south of Winnipeg - Red River goes north from the US. I can't tell the difference going to Winnipeg as being here - we are so isolated from the world that we pay no attention to the borders. We are losing population up here - maybe you could even add NW MN or ND to the list?
I think Vancouver etc has a much high cost of living than Winnipeg.

[tameszu]

19. Watch out for humongous-ass mosquitoes

And windy winters if you move to the 'Peg.

I'm clearly Ontario-biased, though--I suppose it's nice that Carol Shields' novels did wonders for that city, I've heard...