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Barrett808 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-19-06 12:13 PM
Original message
Saddam could be tried posthumously: US official
BAGHDAD (AFP) - Ousted Iraqi leader Saddam Hussein could be tried posthumously for genocide if an Iraqi court decides to execute him for a separate accusation of mass murder.

According to a US legal expert who briefed reporters anonymously ahead of Saddam's trial for his alleged role in the Anfal campaign against

Iraq's Kurdish minority, the case could be delayed by a verdict in the first case.

The Anfal trial is to begin on Monday, but a verdict in the other case is expected on October 16, when Iraqi judges will rule on whether the former strongman ordered the illegal execution of 148 Shiite villagers.

If found guilty, Saddam could face execution or life imprisonment, in which case he would have an automatic right to appeal.

(more)

http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20060819/wl_mideast_afp/ira...

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tanyev Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-19-06 12:20 PM
Response to Original message
1. Well, that would be a lot simpler.
I'm surprised they didn't go for that right off the bat.
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mbperrin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-19-06 12:21 PM
Response to Original message
2. Interesting..since Kenny boy Lay was actually convicted and his
lawyers are trying to get it set aside because and only because he's dead for the appeals....hmmmm...
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TroglodyteScholar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-19-06 12:22 PM
Response to Reply #2
3. Wrong...
Not because he's dead for the appeals, but dead for the sentencing. Some technicality says if he doesn't live to be sentenced, he's not guilty.
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BootinUp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-19-06 12:30 PM
Response to Reply #3
4. that doesn't ring true
Too lazy to google it though.
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EST Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-19-06 12:58 PM
Response to Reply #4
7. It's true.
He's not guilty. Hewever, his wife is liable to be stripped of her accumulated weath to satisfy civil actions, whereas, had Kenny boy lived to be sentenced, she would have been protected.
If his verdict is set aside, she will get to keep their combined acquired assets.
I suspect this fact is behind the motive for this particular action.
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TroglodyteScholar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-19-06 01:23 PM
Response to Reply #4
10. If you're too lazy to prove your position...
...then don't speak up.
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BootinUp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-19-06 01:27 PM
Response to Reply #10
11. See post 5 someone else found it.
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mbperrin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-19-06 12:34 PM
Response to Reply #3
5. Here's the link that says otherwise...
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/headline/biz/412268...

Motion for Lay to be opposed
Government still wants assets based on verdict

By JOHN C. ROPER
Copyright 2006 Houston Chronicle

The government plans to fight to keep the conviction of the late Ken Lay in place, saying it will oppose a motion filed Wednesday by the former Enron executive's lawyers to have his criminal record erased.

The request by Samuel Buffone, a lawyer representing Lay's estate, has been expected since shortly after Lay's death and, if approved by the judge, would make it as if the former Enron chairman had never been charged with a crime.

Buffone asked U.S. District Judge Sim Lake in the motion that he vacate and dismiss "the indictment as it relates to him upon his recent death and resulting inability to pursue his planned appeal."<snip> a bit more.
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merwin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-19-06 02:13 PM
Response to Reply #3
13. Actually, the law folks were saying it was because he wouldn't be able
to go through the entire appeals process.

Although, I'm not a lawyer, so I don't know...
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Rufus T. Firefly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-19-06 12:48 PM
Response to Reply #2
6. Apparently the jury voted guilty,
but the judge didn't officially convict him. That explains how people stay out on bail until sentencing - as Lay did. The sentencing is where the person is convicted and begins to serve his sentence.
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leesa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-19-06 01:00 PM
Response to Original message
8. That would be great...THEN we'll not risk the nasty little secrets of how
we sold him the gas he used to "gas his people" and that his "mass graves" were filled with the Iraqi soldiers he killed when Bush I betrayed them after telling them to attack Saddam and we'd back them up.

Good idea.
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Virginian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-19-06 01:15 PM
Response to Original message
9. How many people did he kill?
Was it more than have died in Bush's war to save Iraqis from Saddam?
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Tellurian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-19-06 01:41 PM
Response to Original message
12. This anomaly might set a precedent for Bush. He could be TRIED
posthumously for War Crimes in Iraq!

Sleep tight after this one goes down!
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rzemanfl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-19-06 02:43 PM
Response to Original message
14. But Ken Lay gets his record wiped clean? WTF? eom
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Gman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-19-06 03:12 PM
Response to Reply #14
17. Exactly my first thought
but dovetails very nicely with how this bunch does business.
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Kagemusha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-19-06 02:48 PM
Response to Original message
15. Can Saddam appeal posthumously too?
Inquiring minds want to know.

Seriously, this was the first good laugh I had today.
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anotherdrew Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-19-06 03:06 PM
Response to Original message
16. Saddam is guilty of many crimes against humanity, but NOT genocide n/t
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daleo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-19-06 06:51 PM
Response to Original message
18. Posthumous trial
The ultimate in victor's justice.

I guess it's not too late to try Nixon then. The state could always retract the pardon first - it's not likely that Nixon would object.
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ikojo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 08:08 AM
Response to Original message
19. If Saddam Hussein can be tried posthumously then
can't Ken Lay be prosecuted and sentenced posthumously? I heard a blurb on one of the Air America shows I listen to that said that Ken Lay's lawyer is saying that since Ken Lay died before his "official conviction" he never did do those things for which he was accused. He never defrauded the Enron Corp and its employees.

I hope that Saddam Hussein ever takes the stand that he lays out all of the support he received from the US in the 1980s in the war against Iran. That's the only way most Americans will hear of the complicity of the Reagan/Bush I administrations in building up Hussein and not holding him accountable for gassing his own people.




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dbt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 08:21 AM
Response to Original message
20. Verdict now, trial later!
Or, as Arlen Specter so fucking eloquently stated this thinking, "We need to explore the possibility of re-impeaching the President." He referred, of COURSE, to the Lawfully-Twice-Elected Bill Clinton.

The Republican party actually BELIEVES the bullshit that falls from its lips.

:evilgrin:
Remember New Orleans
dbt

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PurityOfEssence Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 12:42 PM
Response to Original message
21. They'll kill him before he gets a chance to talk about U.S. ties
Why he doesn't spill his guts now or put it in some kind of safe place can only be explained by his desire to be a pan-Arab tough guy. He wanted to be Gamal Nasser or someone like that so he could puff up and strut as a macho statesman, so that's probably why he'll never come clean. His capacity for self-deception is impressive, but it's got many precedents when looking at other egocentric leaders of the past.

It would be nice if, when the jig is up, certain people would actually cop to their complicity. It would have been nice had Cliff Baxter left something behind, but that alpha-male bravado is a heady cocktail.

Saddam will either die in custody, be assassinated or be executed without ever breaking it to the world how he was sustained by the U.S. and used as an asset. It's a waste and it's silly, but it's just a question of how and when. The whole point of bringing him to trial on issues that have nothing to do with dealings with the United States is to dispose of him before he implicates us in anything. It'll work just fine.
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HuffleClaw Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 12:48 PM
Response to Original message
22. bwhahahhahhahahahahaaaaaaa
geeze, and i'd really thought this joke of a 'trial' was enough of a circus already.
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