Welsh muslims say aircraft bomb plot 'a fake'

[ECH1969]

YOUNG Welsh Muslims have accused the Government of master-minding this week's plot to blow up transatlantic jets mid-air to justify Tony Blair's war on terror.

Some followers of Islam have claimed the arrest of more than 20 people on suspicion of scheming to kill thousands of passengers travelling to America using liquid explosives is designed to bolster the Prime Minister's flagging credibility over the Iraq and Lebanon-Israel crises.

"I believe this so-called plot is all a fabrication aimed at covering up the actions of George Bush and Tony Blair," said Abdul Ullah, 26. "Sadly, people will believe whatever they are told these days."

Dr Sam Ben, 29, added: "As far as I can make out, people have been arrested but none have been charged with anything or were caught at the scene of any crime. I believe the whole operation has been a smoke-screen."

http://icwales.icnetwork.co.uk/0100news/0200wales/tm_objectid=17555315&method=full&siteid=50082&headline=welsh-muslims-say-aircraft-bomb-plot--a-fake--name_page.html

[AzDar]

1. Wouldn't surprise me one bit....... n/t

[OKthatsIT]

10. They aren't the only ones with doubt

[leesa]

2. They aren't able to charge them after months of investigation. Very

peculiar. Bliar's government is even having to go back and grab their anti-civil liberties law to hold them for 90 days without charges.

[NVMojo]

6. Bush forced the investigation out into the open NOW

Also, what a coincidence that Bush and his poodle, Blair, are both on vacation at the same time ...NOW!

[Dont_Bogart_the_Pretzel]

34. I wonder where the "lovebirds" went? n/t

[NVMojo]

3. I agree, for various reasons ...

For one thing, Bush was being pressured to get congress to continue the subsidized war-related airline insurance that is due to expire in two weeks:

http://www.chicagotribune.com/business/chi-0608120185aug12,1,4851649.story?coll=chi-business-hed

and there are other reasons:

no passports, no airline tickets

Bush forced the outing of this investigation that had been going on for a year to happen NOW. Why? You connect the dots.

And then there is this info below from Earth Changes, Michael Mandeville, that I tend to agree with, tinhat and all:

MWM: All you don't need to know about liquid bombs for airliners. I reccomend you subscribe to their bulletins

From: "Brasscheck TV" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Brasscheck TV: Bogus Terror Stories

NAME,

Liquid bombs made by homegrown UK terrorists
to down ten planes simultaneously...

The most chilling terror plot since 9-11?

Not quite.

To see recent examples of "Terror Plots"
and the truth that ultimately emerged
about them, go here:

http://www.brasscheck.com/videos/911/9114.html

OR - to get a much fuller understanding of
recent events, read this first and then
watch the videos (link below.)

--- Bogus Terror Stories

If you take a look at some simple chemistry...
... and examine the gaping holes in other recent
terror stories... you'll be in a better position
to judge the latest terror story out of the UK.

Three points:

1. Liquid bombs
2. London 7-7 and "homegrown" terrorists
3. What ever happened to the Sears Tower plot?

1. The reality of "liquid bombs"

Yes, it's possible to combine acetone, hydrogen peroxide
and an acid to make triacetone triperoxide (TATP),
the so-called "liquid bomb" scenario.

It's what I-D-I-O-T-S do when they want to make their
own home-made explosives.

TATP is an extremely unstable substance and prone to explode
unexpectedly - and it requires refrigeration of 10 C
or less to be manufactured with any degree of reliability.

The idea that this process could be carried out in
the cramped washroom of an airliner is fanciful at best.

That this feat could realistically be accomplished on
ten different airplanes simultaneously is as likely as...
the US government's 9-11 story or the UK London's government's
7-7 story.

You can get confirmation of this in less than a minute
by searching the terms: "triacetone triperoxide" or "TATP."

If this plot is evidence of al-Qaeda's ability to launch
sophisticated attacks against the freedom-loving West,
then we have nothing to worry about.

But meanwhile, no water bottles or lipstick on US or UK
planes.

2. Last year's UK terror story

Take a look at how the London 7-7 story - as told
by UK officials - has completely fallen apart under
examination.

The UK government said the bombs used in those
attacks were made of TATP and carried in knapsacks
by "suicide" bombers made up of young British
Muslims.

More reliable analysts - including at least one surviving
eye witness - say that there were no exploding knapsacks,
that the bombs were military-grade and that they were placed
underneath the train's carriages - and that's just the
tip of the iceberg on this story.

Even UK police investigators now admit that none of
the supposed "suicide" bombers even remotely fit the
fanatic profile and theorize they were used as "dupes"
by the real bombers.

3. Remember the Sears Tower plot?

Just a few short months ago, Americans were terrorized
by news reports that a "homegrown" terrorist cell
based in Miami was planning to destroy Chicago's Sears
Tower with the help of al-Qaeda.

It turns out the suspects had no weapons, no
bomb making materials, no contact with al-Qaeda
- and no clue. In reality, they were a group of
impoverished and mentally deficient homeless men
who'd been sucked into a whacked-out Christian
cult.

Here are video clips featuring some of the
"Bogus Terror Stories" that sweep the US and
the UK every time Bush or Blair are in trouble
politically or feel the need to stir up bias
against Muslims to justify their unpopular military
operations in the Middle-East:

http://www.brasscheck.com/videos/911/9114.html

- Brasscheck

[Demeter]

8. Robert Heinlein Talked of Mixing Bleach and Iodine

in his SF novel Farnham's Freehold, I believe it was.

[TheMadMonk]

15. Amonia & iodine.

The result is that fun little joke your grandfather might have made. Touch poweder.

The stuff can pack a punch in bulk, but it is so incredibly unstable that only someone who was incredibly stupid would attempt to mix up more than milligram quantities. I'm told that just the contraction caused by a cloud passing in front of the sun can set it off as it dries.

[mogster]

27. The first one was perhaps the funniest video

I've ever seen :spray:
But the theme is really tragic; tricking people into being scared about being blown up. And the implications ...

See also this lenghty post about their previous lies.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=364x1896248

[MissWaverly]

4. very interesting; these new powers

of holding terrorists for 90 days; well, August 13 plus 90 days is December 13th in my book;
well after our November elections. I am so glad we have these new rules which enable them
to hold people w/o showing cause.

[stepnw1f]

5. I Already Am Leaning in This Direction

from what I have read about Hydrogen Peroxide, the plot seems ludicrous.

Here's a good thread here on DU about Hydrogen Peroxide and it's alleged use:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=364x1878524#1879327

[stray cat]

7. Why do peoples opinions without any facts qualify as news?

A major problem with what passes for news is that its focused on uninformed opinions instead of facts. We really need more investigative fact finding reporting that actually can get to the facts of a matter. Hopefully facts will eventually be clear with this latest case.

[GoddessOfGuinness]

33. But if we have more investigative fact-finding reporting...

people won't be as confused.

[reprobate]

9. "Even nitroglycerin is not nearly as sensitive as acetone peroxide."

From Wikipedia

The more you know about the world, the less you can believe the administration (and by that I mean ours and Britains) or the media, who believe and parrott everything they are told. If some reporter just had the gumption to google TATP as we did, he'd blow the story apart.

And then you have to ask why terraists would go to the trouble of making such an explosive from components they have to smuggle aboard, and then assemble them in such controlled circumstances and has to be kept at less than 10 degrees C during the process (and just how will they do that?).

Plastique is stable, easily found on the black market, and can be formed into whatever they want it to look like. If there were a plot to down airliners how much more likely would it be that they would use readily available explosives than this Rube Goldberg plan?

[theHandpuppet]

12. Well said, reprobate

"Plastique is stable, easily found on the black market, and can be formed into whatever they want it to look like. If there were a plot to down airliners how much more likely would it be that they would use readily available explosives than this Rube Goldberg plan?"

From the beginning this "terrorist plot" has sounded more like a plot a The Three Stooges two-reeler.

[Sherman A1]

18. Sums it up rather well

[Psephos]

17. Plastique sets off the electronic sniffers at security checkpoints

as do other ready-to-use explosives containing nitrogen. Acetone and peroxide compounds do not.

That's the reason for the Rube Goldberg plan.

Peace.


Edit: typo

[Canuckistanian]

11. I'm still trying to wrap my head around "Welsh Muslims"

Still, their stories are more beliveable than Blair or Bushco's

[theHandpuppet]

14. Actually, there are nearly 22,000 Welsh Muslims

http://www.wales.gov.uk/keypubstatisticsforwalesfigures/content/population/2001religion.htm (figures from 2001)

This is in a country with about 3 million folks, among whom over three quarters of a million claim no religion.

[nine30]

13. Do any of us believe that the plot could have been real ?

What if it had..and what if the execution had gone forward and thousands of lives lost? Where would we be ?

[CJCRANE]

16. Go and read

David Ray Griffin's "New Pearl Harbor". Then come back and we'll talk about what's real and not real.

[and-justice-for-all]

35. I knew this "PLOT" was bullshit! I could smell it.

[Isere]

19. Of course!

While some will rush immediately to adopt a tin-foil-hat position, most people still engage in critical thinking, even on DU.

[drduffy]

24. Another nice ad hominem attack

Go look at the data at scholarsfor911truth.org. Then go to www.911blogger.com and debate the issue and see how long your "critical thinking' holds up. I doubt you have what it takes.

[rman]

25. "could have been" - so what?

Many things "could have been", any one of us "could be" run over by a car tomorrow - question is whether or not all those "could be's" are reason for concern.

[eridani]

36. Might have been. IMMINENT, it damned well was not.

And if it was real, that Bush outed the investigation early means that one or more of the perps have gone to ground and won't be found.

[Tellurian]

20. The First TIPOFF IS:

According to UK Security officials...No containers with liquids or gels or mother's milk (unless sampled first by the mother)
placed in carryons maybe taken onto the plane. However, these items may be packed in your suitcases, if you wish to keep
your belongings, for loading in your flight's cargo area.

It's isn't a secret , there isn't any screening of luggage, before loading in the cargo areas of planes.

Are they saying the cargo hold is BOMBPROOF?

Or is this analysis indicative of a worldwide HOAX?

[WhoWantsToBeOccupied]

26. Passenger luggage gets screened, but not other cargo (like mail)

[Tellurian]

31. The screening is limited to bomb sniffing dogs..

If vapors indicating explosives are given off from a suitcase and the dog detects it...
that suitcase is suspect.

By and large there is no examination by screeners, no x-ray, physical exam, or any equipment
capable of screening every piece of luggage loaded into the cargo hold of airplanes.

That is why the whole premise of security is ridiculous and insulting to everyone's intelligence.

[Laughing Mirror]

21. Thank you Welsh Muslims for stating the obvious

Thank you.

[Tellurian]

37. WhoWantsToBeOccupied

read....the obvious, then turn to page 2:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/14325177/site/newsweek/

"Then there's the problem of air cargo. As they empty their pockets and throw away the bottled water, travelers assume the rest of what's onboard has been screened, too. Not so. Passenger airlines ship nearly 2 billion tons of commercial cargo annually, and they don't have machines that can handle the varied shape and content of so many packages. Less than 7 percent is actually screened"

So, I suppose your job is helping terrorists by peddling misinformation to the masses, coming off as some type of authority on a subject you clearly know nothng about.

[Ecumenist]

22. BING-THE"F"-O!!

I haven't bought it from the first and still don't buy it. I think it's a crap filled lying-palooza made to try to wrest the American and I suppose, British, determination away from throwing these idiots out on their ears.

[bainz]

23. I'm confused.

Do the opinions of "YOUNG Welsh Muslims" now count as LBN?

[zreosumgame]

29. which part disturbs you?

Young, Welsh or muslim?

[nsd]

30. I was wondering about that too. /nt

[Jed Dilligan]

32. News report on national website of Wales

One could just as easily ask of a cnn-linked story, since when do the opinions of old white Americans count as LBN?

[Stella_Artois]

28. I have my own claims

I claim that this bomb plot is the work of young Welsh coal miners who seek to take over the world.

I have exactly as much, if not more, hard evidence of this as they have for their claims. If I make a webpage can i have it posted as LBN as well ?

[saigon68]

38. TATP

What a joke -----set off with a disposable camera

WHAT THE FUCK IS THE MEDIA SMOKING?