WP: War Crimes Act Changes Would Reduce Threat Of Prosecution

[RamboLiberal]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/08/08/AR2006080801276.html

The Bush administration has drafted amendments to a war crimes law that would eliminate the risk of prosecution for political appointees, CIA officers and former military personnel for humiliating or degrading war prisoners, according to U.S. officials and a copy of the amendments.

Officials say the amendments would alter a U.S. law passed in the mid-1990s that criminalized violations of the Geneva Conventions, a set of international treaties governing military conduct in wartime. The conventions generally bar the cruel, humiliating and degrading treatment of wartime prisoners without spelling out what all those terms mean.

The draft U.S. amendments to the War Crimes Act would narrow the scope of potential criminal prosecutions to 10 specific categories of illegal acts against detainees during a war, including torture, murder, rape and hostage-taking.

Left off the list would be what the Geneva Conventions refer to as "outrages upon personal dignity" of a prisoner and deliberately humiliating acts -- such as the forced nakedness, use of dog leashes and wearing of women's underwear seen at the U.S.-run Abu Ghraib prison in Iraq -- that fall short of torture.

[msongs]

1. will lieberman vote to get his republican friends off the hook? nt

[Tempest]

2. A war criminal supporting weakening war criminal prosecution

He's getting ready for when he's brought before the Hague after he leaves office.

[Purveyor]

3. Even if they changed the law, can it be made to be retroactive

to crimes already committed?

[Anus Retainus]

4. Wait for the signing statement! n/t

[Up2Late]

39. That's what they are hoping for, it's in the draft to make it apply to...

...anytime after September 11, 2001. That was in the NPR report, see link in my post below.

[3waygeek]

40. The Constitution specifically

forbids passing ex post facto laws. Of course, these guys have been wiping their asses with that document for years, so it probably won't slow them down.

[Canuckistanian]

5. I thought there was nothing wrong with torturing

After all, they WERE muderous criminals, right? Right?

Are you saying that Bushco is admitting guilt for war crimes and is just covering it's ass?

Why, that's scandalous!

[rodeodance]

6. so, even Rummy would be off the hook by this (seems to me)

[Eugene]

7. Anything short of actual physical violence would be exempt.

The article states that threats of violence and other abuses
that are considered war crimes by international courts would
be exempt. Mock executions, "stress positions," sleep
deprivation, or even food deprivation could be permitted.

Institutionalized impunity for human rights abuses is a classic
hallmark of dictatorship.

[gratuitous]

16. That worked so well for Pinochet

Let's see if Chimpy can avoid prosecution for his crimes until he's a feeble old man.

[Barrett808]

8. So, it's the GOP giving itself exceptions to a GOP bill, to forestall...

...prosecutions of GOP politicians.

The irony would be delicious if it didn't involve institutional torture.

[Omaha Steve]

9. US seeks to shield its war interrogators: report

Full story: http://reuters.excite.com/article/20060809/2006-08-09T060525Z_01_N09207907_RTRIDST_0_NEWS-RIGHTS-CRIME-USA-DC.html



US seeks to shield its war interrogators: report
Email this Story

Aug 9, 2:05 AM (ET)

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - Political appointees, CIA officers and former military personnel would not face prosecution for humiliating or degrading wartime prisoners under amendments to a war crimes law drafted by the Bush administration, the Washington Post reported on Wednesday.

The amendments are part of the administration's three-pronged response to a June 29 Supreme Court ruling that struck down as illegal and a violation of the Geneva Conventions the military tribunal system set up to try Guantanamo prisoners, the Post said.

The court's ruling gave prisoners captured in Afghanistan protections under the Geneva Conventions, which the administration previously maintained did not apply to them.

Citing unidentified U.S. officials, the newspaper said the administration plans to amend the 1996 War Crimes Act, which makes it a crime to violate the Geneva Conventions, by narrowing the number of potential criminal prosecutions.

[Donnachaidh]

10. K & R

[msongs]

11. sieg heil nt

[leveymg]

12. That means that the other signatories to these treaties have to enforce

them. There are provisions for mandatory referral of violators to international tribunals when any signatory fails to enforce its own responsibility to prosecute offenders.

If Congress passes this amendment, and Bush signs it, is a clear breach of the Geneva Conventions and the UN Convention on Torture.

They are forewarned not to do this.

[High Plains]

13. Freedom to torture. Ain't America grand?

[hootinholler]

14. First, how can this shield anyone?

The law was the law when the acts occured, or can we retroactively outlaw things?

Second, help me raise the stench of this into the public awareness, visit the link in my sig.

-Hoot

[saigon68]

15. THEY ARE THE THUGS WHO MURDERED THIS MAN

AND GAVE SABRINA THE PHOTO OPPORTUNITY

[donkeyotay]

17. So, Pvt England WASN'T a bad apple after all?

Why are the bad apples in prison then if they were just following orders?


Left off the list would be what the Geneva Conventions refer to as "outrages upon personal dignity" of a prisoner and deliberately humiliating acts -- such as the forced nakedness, use of dog leashes and wearing of women's underwear seen at the U.S.-run Abu Ghraib prison in Iraq -- that fall short of torture.

. . .

But humiliations, degrading treatment and other acts specifically deemed as "outrages" by the international tribunal prosecuting war crimes in the former Yugoslavia -- such as placing prisoners in "inappropriate conditions of confinement," forcing them to urinate or defecate in their clothes, and merely threatening prisoners with "physical, mental, or sexual violence" -- would not be among the listed U.S. crimes, officials said.. . . Deputy Defense Secretary Gordon England, who had signed the memo, responded at the hearing that he was concerned that "degrading" and "humiliating" are relative terms.
"I mean, what is degrading in one society may not be degrading in another,

In our culture it's as American as apple pie. Asshole.

[Supersedeas]

18. eliminate the risk of justice--by changing the letter of the law--hearts

and minds anyone...Karen Hughes, please explain.

[aggiesal]

19. WaPo - Bush changing War Crimes Act

The Bush administration has drafted amendments to a war crimes law that would eliminate the risk of prosecution for political appointees, CIA officers and former military personnel for humiliating or degrading war prisoners, according to U.S. officials and a copy of the amendments. ...

<http://www.rawstory.com/showarticle.php?src=http%3A%2F%... >

Once again, it's not illegal if we change the laws to make legal, "I'm the decider..."

[w4rma]

20. That way Bush can tell them to torture Americans without them fearing

procecution (unless the Supreme Court later decides the law is unConstitutional).

[Marnieworld]

21. I'm just a bill just a lonely old bill

Correct me if I'm wrong but what the hell is the executive branch doing drafting law? Ammendments to laws? Any child with Schoolhouse rock knows the division of powers in our country but the current office holders think all of that is quaint. I am endlessly surprised at their audacity. Just when I thought we have seen it all they go ahead and try this. Will they get away with it or is the tide turning? I have hope but then I remember Diebold.

[TechBear_Seattle]

24. The president is free to DRAFT legislation

Heck, industry lobbyists do it all the time. For the draft to become law, however, it still must be passed by Congress.

From the subject title, though, the first thought in my head was a long-after-the-signing "signing statement."

[krkaufman]

28. Ha! I'd love to see someone talented do an update to that old classic.

Have the Bill/Law get seriously pissed-off when the President does the signing statement, treat it as an assault and requiring a shower to rinse off the legalese filth.

[Marnieworld]

33. That would be great

I would like the bill to actually fight back though. Stick his signing statement pen where the sun don't shine.

[kimmerspixelated]

32. Touche!

I hate to think what else the Bushies are capable of!

[louis-t]

34. I'm beginning to think it wasn't a gaffe when * said

"The Executive Branch is the law interpreting branch" during the 2000 election recount period.

[Julius Civitatus]

22. They are above the law. Acting like monarchs!

Shameless.

[unda cova brutha]

23. no dout to protect his ass from jail for war crime

[indepat]

25. I'm the grrr-rate decider: go git 'um boys and have at 'um

[krkaufman]

26. Not sure how changing the law NOW ...

... would protect those who've already committed the crimes. The "rule of law" concept begins to fall apart when those in power get to sidestep it whenever convenient.

[chill_wind]

27. This is no doubt all going beneath the state-run media radar again.

Are they talking by chance about this today at the CNN Pentagon?

K&R!

[genieroze]

29. link doesn't work

try this one
http://www.rawstory.com/showarticle.php?src=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.washingtonpost.com%2Fwp-dyn%2Fcontent%2Farticle%2F2006%2F08%2F08%2FAR2006080801276_pf.html

[aggiesal]

31. Try this

<http://www.rawstory.com/showarticle.php?src=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.washingtonpost.com%2Fwp-dyn%2Fcontent%2Farticle%2F2006%2F08%2F08%2FAR2006080801276_pf.html>

[chill_wind]

30. Here's another DU thread

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=102&topic_id=2444575&mesg_id=2444575

[Up2Late]

35. NPR just reported this too, it played at about 5:35pm so it will probably

...be on-line before it replays in two hours on Mountain and west coast NPR stations. Can't say this surprises me anymore.

Here's the link to the report:

White House Wants to Amend War Crimes Act

by Ari Shapiro

(Audio for this story will be available at approx. 7:30 p.m. ET)

All Things Considered, August 9, 2006 · The law covers combat offenses committed by people who aren't active military personnel. NPR has obtained a draft copy of the administration's proposed changes, which would reduce the types of mistreatment that constitute war crimes.

(more soon)

<http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=5630790>

[Megahurtz]

36. Unbelievable! n/t

[Up2Late]

37. This needs some K & R's folks! This is BIG! Check out this quote!

(Btw, K & R = Kick and Recommend)

...But (Army Lt. Col. Geoffrey S.) Corn, (who was recently chief of the war law branch of the Army's Office of the Judge Advocate General) the Army's former legal expert, said that Common Article 3 was, according to its written history, "left deliberately vague because efforts to define it would invariably lead to wrongdoers identifying 'exceptions,' and because the meaning was plain -- treat people like humans and not animals or objects." Eugene R. Fidell, president of the nonprofit National Institute of Military Justice, said that laws governing military conduct are filled with broadly described prohibitions that are nonetheless enforceable, including "dereliction of duty," "maltreatment" and "conduct unbecoming an officer."

Retired Rear Adm. John D. Hutson, the Navy's top uniformed lawyer from 1997 to 2000 and now dean of the Franklin Pierce Law Center, said his view is "don't trust the motives of any lawyer who changes a statutory provision that is short, clear, and to the point and replaces it with something that is much longer, more complicated, and includes exceptions within exceptions."

(more at link):kick:

<http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/08/08/AR2006080801276_pf.html>

[klook]

38. Read this -- horrific practices allowed under Bush/Gonzalez doctrine

This is the kind of stuff they're doing to detainees.

In one (statement), an Iraqi lawyer says he was hooded and stripped naked in a building known as the "disco".

Yasir Rubaii Saeed al-Qutaji describes how loud western music was played and cold water poured over his body; he said he was also threatened with sexual abuse. "For the next 15 hours they tried to break me down by taking me frequently inside and repeating the stripping, cold water and loud music sequence," he says.

"Due to the very loud music," he adds, "they would talk to me via a loudspeaker that was placed next to my ears."

The beatings did not leave a mark on his body because his attackers wore special gloves, he says.

more: http://www.guardian.co.uk/Iraq/Story/0,,1304042,00.html

Oh, but that's just like a fraternity prank, isn't it?

[bdamomma]

41. the bush regime apparently

think that they are above the law, they are war criminals, this is outright arrogance and ignorance to the laws. They should all be hung.

[donkeyotay]

42. America has been destroyed, and Osama didn't do it. nt

[Poll_Blind]

43. K&R! n/t

PB

[InternalDialogue]

44. Kick!

:kick: