Hizbollah fighter tells Israel he trained in Iran

[sabra]

http://www.alertnet.org/thenews/newsdesk/L07622106.htm

Hizbollah fighter tells Israel he trained in Iran

JERUSALEM, Aug 7 (Reuters) - A Hizbollah fighter captured by Israel has told interrogators he received training in Iran and arrived there on a flight from Syria, a tape of the interrogation released by the Israeli army showed on Monday.

During questioning the man also confessed to taking part in the cross-border raid on July 12 in which two Israeli soldiers were captured, the incident which sparked the current conflict.

"We trained in Iran," the man, who gave his name as Mahmoud Ali Suleiman, told the interrogator. "We went from Beirut in civilian cars... to the airport in Damascus."

Suleiman, who gave his age as 22, said between 40 and 50 people went with him for the training, which involved instruction in the use of anti-tank weapons. He didn't say when the training took place or how long it lasted.

[Norquist Nemesis]

1. Imagine that! If he'd trained in Iraq we'd never have known! n/t

[jpkenny]

45. So what? IDF come to the US and US go to Israel to train.

What's the diff. The IDF are every bit as much a terrorist org. as Hizbollah, without the social services. The big difference is the IDF are state sponsored and have much more lethal weapons and are fighting to retain land and resources they took from others while Hizbollah is fighting to get back land and resources that were taken from their government. You mean to tell me that no other nation or resistence groups in the world are allowed to have allies and get help from those allies except the US and Israel?

And, any confession made while under arrest by Mossad or the IDF should be suspect.

[Norquist Nemesis]

51. Yes, and we don't hear about the IDF trained here in the US

I agree with everything you said, btw. I was just pointing out that "trained in Iran" is simply fodder for the echo chamber.

:hi:

[Name removed]

58. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[saigon68]

78. Israels pilots are trained in US to bomb villages

The US has experience in that area




Of all the photographs from the Vietnam War (and there were many), one of the most memorable was that of a young girl running down a road in terror from a napalm attack in 1972. The girl was Kim Phuc, and that picture would indeed cause Americans to ask once again the question, "What are we doing in this war?" Another question might have been, "Why did we introduce napalm in a ground war where villagers and the enemy are so close together?" Napalm is a gel-like substance that clings to the skin, burning it with intense, painful heat. Because it also draws oxygen from the body, many victims asphyxiate before they can be treated. Barely alive and burned over 30 percent of her body, Kim was taken to a hospital in Saigon. By the time her parents found her, she had been taken from the main hospital to an outbuilding where she was expected to die. Through the intervention of two foreign journalists, Kim was transferred to a hospital where her horrible burns could be properly treated.

[question everything]

72. No one has ever claimed that Israel and the US are not working

together.

You may want, however, to check in a dictionary the meaning of terrorism and of militia, and of states, and of military.

Here is a question for you:

Of the 800 or so Lebanese killed, how many are Heabollah? No one knows. So when we see doctored pictures of dead Lebanese, except for women and children, how many are "innocent" civilians and how many are terrorists?

Or does Islam has its own rapture, whereby when a terrorist dies, he becomes a martyr, in a rush to bed 70 virgins, while his body remains in a form of a civilian?

[Caution]

2. Was he trained by the government?

If not i don't see how this is something that would actually implicate the Iranian government. We have any number of "training camps" right here in the good ol US of A where neo-nazis, white supremacists, etc are trained in survival skills, hand-to-hand combat, demolitions and firearms.

Now if the Iranian military or government was responsible for the training, well that's another matter entirely.

[rodeodance]

5. oh, those pesty little details

[bvar22]

15. The US Government....

...trains people from other nations in "assassination, Black Ops, Propaganda, unconventional weapons, and de-stabilization" at the old School of the Americas ( Western Hemisphere Institute for Security).

[The Magistrate]

44. The Iranian Revolutionary Guard, Sir, Handles The Training

There is nothing particularly obscure or new about this; it is common knowledge and has been for years. That body is certainly an arm of the Iranian government, more particularly of the ruling council of clerics that is the real power there.

[Caution]

56. Thanks for the info

I was not aware of this. Definitely a major problem.

[The Magistrate]

59. You Are Most Welcome, Sir

But it is not really any major problem, Sir, in my view. The ties are old, and of some strength, but Hezbollah is an independent actor, pursuing its own policy and goals. Taking this sort of thing as a real cause for levying war against Iran would be a serious mistake.

[stop the bleeding]

3. interesting

he is telling the US and Isreal everything they want to hear except that he knows where OBL is

[Nickster]

4. My, my, what a coincidence. Tied in Iran and Syria all in one shot. n/t

[Missy M]

6. Not to mention he confessed he took part in the capture of the...

two Israeli soldiers.

[QuettaKid]

7. Hey , if the Mossad was yanking

your fingernails out with pliers, you'd tell 'em anything they'd want to hear.

[Missy M]

8. Ouch!!! You bet I would.

[question everything]

73. And, obviously, you have a first hand knowledge of this method

right?

Do you know that Israel does not have the death penalty (except for the Nazis from WWII)? Can you name another country from that region with a similar law? Or even, oh my, our own US of A?

[pokercat999]

48. Funny how his figner nails and toe nails are now

attached with scotch tape. Guess he broke em off typing his "confession".

[question everything]

74. Oh, yummy. Can you show us the picture?

or at least provide a link? From a non-biased source?

The knowledge and expertise shown on this board are amazing.

[pokercat999]

77. Gee sorry I forgot again for the deep thinkers out there

:sarcasm: OK?

[LivingInTheBubble]

62. And gave an excuse for israelis to bomb civilian cars...

[MrPrax]

9. Blast from the past...

Whatever happened to this kid:

'Little bomber' fascinates Israeli media

The case of a 14-year-old Palestinian boy captured wearing a vest packed with explosives at a West Bank checkpoint makes the headlines in Israel's media and prompts condemnation of the people who sent him out to die.

Viewers saw footage of what Israeli television called a "mentally challenged" boy stopped at a checkpoint south of Nablus.

The boy, Husam Abdu, was shown standing at a distance from the Israeli soldiers whilst he was instructed in Hebrew how to remove the vest.

BBC

Needless to say that IF Israel thinks Syria and Iran are to blame, maybe they should be bombing those countries instead of Lebanon -- it's not like Israel is going to lose or anything, the US will jump in if the battle goes bad...hopefully.

[xultar]

10. PROPPA-FUCKIN-GANDHA

WOW. Where did he get his shoes? I suppose we should bomb the country his shoes came from too.

[ckramer]

16. LOL

Israeli can make that guy say anything they want to hear.

[choie]

65. Propaganda is right...

Why the hell should we believe this guy? He may not even be Hezbollah - he may not be muslim - he may even be Israeli for all we know? I believe the Israeli government about as much as I believe the Bush administration.

[question everything]

75. No, why should you believe the pictures of Beirut on fire

and of death and destitutions when they found out to be doctored? Or is this a propaganda, too?

[Hoosier Dem]

11. This just in...

It turns out that there is other stuff here, too. Apparently, in addition to tying in Iran and Syria ever so conveniently, the Bush White House has just announced that this man is a supporter of Ned Lamont. :sarcasm:


I'm sorry, but this whole thing is just WAY too convenient. :puke:

[Jeanette in FL]

55. Welcome to DU Hoosier Dem

LOL, supporter of Ned Lamont. Too funny.

[bluedog]

12. Hizbollah fighters are willing to die for their cause

even to become suicide bombers.......I'm sure the Israel handlers are getting the truth from him........he'd rather die than tell anything....as they are not afraid to die......I question anything that comes out of Israel and the United States news media........

[rustydog]

13. Of course, the captive wasn't tortured into this confession

Israel would never over react and actually torture someone to get information.

[mom cat]

30. Right ... just like the US would never resort to those tactics.

[movonne]

14. How much torture was used?

[bvar22]

17. He also admitted....

to sinking the Titanic, and the assassination of Archduke Francis Ferdinand in 1914.

/sarcasm

[godai]

37. They also discovered that he was on...

Saddam Hussain's Christmas card list.

[endarkenment]

18. A tape of the interrogation?

A video tape? That would be a direct violation of the Geneva Conventions both for showing an image of a POW and for using the POW for propaganda purposes.

[BrotherBuzz]

19. They hit the Trifecta!

Iran, Syria, and the fall guy for the cross-border raid.

Church Lady: "Well, isn't that special?"

[daleo]

20. It doesn't seem unlikely

Although the IDF gets U.S. training, so it seems like a wash to me. Both sides have received foreign help, which is nearly always the case in these types of wars.

I had hoped that all this proxy war stuff might go away after the U.S.S.R. was dissolved, but I guess that was unrealistic. Empires and wanna-be empires are always looking to expand. Local populations have their own disputes and grudges, and willingly take whatever help is offered.

Will this become fodder for widening the war, and give Bush the opening he wants to attack Iran? It's too early to tell, but you know there are forces at work looking to do that very thing.

If this is true, it shows that the training and tactics are pretty good. They seem to be giving as good as they get. That might make the war-mongers pause. Nah - it's never their lives on the line.

[msmcghee]

28. The IDF gets US training?

Links or evidence please. I hadn't heard this. I suspect if anything the US could benefit from IDF training in this area.

[daleo]

33. Well, the Air Force is often involved in "top gun" training excercises

With the U.S., and often NATO (and they do pretty well). Perhaps joint excercises would be the precise term, although the point of excersises are training.

------------------------------------------
Here is a wiki link about the IDF that includes some information on U.S. cooperation:

"Expenditures and alliances
During 1950-66, Israel spent an average of 9% of its GDP on defense. Defense expenditures increased dramatically after both the 1967 and 1973 wars. In 1996, the military budget reached 10.6% of GDP and represented about 21.5% of the total 1996 budget.

In 1983, the United States and Israel established a Joint Political Military Group, which convenes twice a year. Both the U.S. and Israel participate in joint military planning and combined exercises, and have collaborated on military research and weapons development. Additionally the U.S. military maintains two classified, pre-positioned War Reserve Stocks in Israel valued at $493 million. <1> Israel has the official distinction of being an American Major non-NATO ally. As a result of this, America shares the vast majority of its security and military technology with Israel.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israel_Defense_Forces

-------------------------------------
Here's something where the training went the other way aroud (IDF trained U.S. forces for the Fallujah assault):

Lessons-Learned Fighting Terrorists
Fallujah Success Capitalized on IDF Know-How
Army and Marine Corps forces that battled terrorist insurgents in the Iraqi cities of Fallujah and Mosul employed urban warfare tactics gleaned from the combat experience of the Israel Defense Forces (IDF). In the last two years, hundreds of U.S. military personnel have trained in the Negev desert at Israel’s Adam counter insurgency urban warfare training facility. Meanwhile, the U.S. military has completed the construction of a number of simulated Arab villages at the U.S. Army’s Joint Readiness Training Center (JRTC) at Fort Polk, Louisiana.

http://www.jinsa.org/articles/articles.html/function/view/categoryid/1701/documentid/2774/history/3,2360,655,1701,2774

-------------------------------------
Here's a U.S. Engineer's facility in Israel:

Southern Infantry Training Base
The Southern Infantry Training Base (SITB) is a few kilometers north of Beersheba in the Negev desert region. Construction on this, the most remote of the three bases, began in mid-March 2001 and is now more than halfway to completion.

"This is in one of the isolated areas that's already used by the Israelis for training," said Sig Milerski, quality assurance engineer for Southern Infantry Training Base 81. "Now we're building a substantial training base with the whole range of support -- barracks, dining facility, synagogue, offices, gymnasium, and classrooms."

http://www.hq.usace.army.mil/cepa/pubs/oct02/story13.htm

[msmcghee]

35. Thanks for the answer.

As I suspected there are really no Israeli military personnel coming to the US to learn how to kill Arabs as many in this thread have proposed. And in fact it's the other way around.

Israel is our ally in the region. Israel established a homeland for the Jews there primarily as result of US and British efforts to convince the rest of the new UN organization in 1947 and 1948 that this was the best of all the alternatives.

Palestine was not a nation - it was a territory that had harbored many different ethnic groups over the ages. At the time there were many Jews living in the region. WWII killed millions of civilians and displace millions more. Although Palestine was not a state what political structure it had that represented the Arabs living there supported Germany in the war. After the UN declaration establishing israel as a state about 900,000 Jews relocated into Israel from neighboring Arab states where most lost all their property in that process and had to start over. But they were welcomed into Israel. Why were Palestinians who did not want to live in the new Israeli state not accepted as citizens into neighboring states? This crass political decision to place them in refugee camps instead is the primary reason why there is so much strife and hatred 60 years later, IMO.

My personal research on this makes me believe that it was a difficult decision for everyone - but of all the alternatives this was probably the best. Agree or not - but now we must make the best of it in a way that reduces the death and destruction. This current conflict was enabled by the Bush administration by stepping aside and ignoring their responsibility to be an honest broker for both sides - the responsibility that Clinton took on despite the political risks of failure.

If the US had worked with Lebanon we could possibly have prevented Hizbollah from setting up this deadly situation. Instead it festered and grew and now we see the tragic results. And we see Iranian led, virulently violent Shia taking over political power throughout the ME.

This is what we should be focused on - not the nature of Israel's defense from this furious Hizbollah attack. By condemning israel we let Bush off the hook and we make many Americans reluctantly realize that the left has no sense on these things - and no ability to defend America from our true enemies.

/rant

[daleo]

46. I think it is splitting hairs to say the IDF is not training with the U.S.

The "benefits" may be mutual, but the original point was that the IDF and U.S. are interlinked at least as much as Hezbollah and Iran or Syria.

Nonetheless, I agree that the key to settling the problem is to settle the issue of Palestine with:
- a viable two state solution (with fair and defensible declared borders)
- compensation for loss of homes of the refugees (return is not practical)
- international support for building up of state infrastructure.

I believe this was what Clinton was proposing, although many people would debate how fair the details of that deal were. But the broad goals were similar.

Bush, on the other hand, clearly has no interest in peace or justice in the region, and cares less about Palestinians or Lebanese than he does about poor Americans in New Orleans. Which is to say, less than zero.

[wellst0nev0ter]

47. Jews Were 35 % Of The Population And Owned Only 10% Of The Land

And yet were given 55 percent of the territories. But I guess that can all be excused because there was no "Palestine" but 2000 years ago there was an Israel (sarcasm implied)

[hoboken123]

57. ?

Who are you responding to?

Any time period on your 'stats'?

[The Stranger]

66. Israel invaded their country and, apparently, seeks to occupy it as well.

The "furious Hezbollah attack" is people defending their homeland against Israel. So get over it.

[Lurking Dem]

70. Uhhhhhhh

Wha? Hezbollah launched a crapload of missiles into northern Israel, crossed the border and kidnapped some soldiers.

On what planet is that not an act of war?

[IntiRaymi]

42. No link needed.

The US military is so well developed, as a professional organization, that there are innumerable collaborations with all militaries in the world.
There is absolutely nothing surprising, to me, about the US training the IDF. Or even vice versa.

[Lurking Dem]

71. Why have citations

when fervant belief will do?

[eleny]

21. How many killers have we trained at the School of the Americas?

People who live in glass houses....

Now known as “Western Hemisphere Institute for Security Cooperation”.

"Over its 59 years, the SOA has trained over 60,000 Latin American soldiers in counterinsurgency techniques, sniper training, commando and psychological warfare, military intelligence and interrogation tactics. These graduates have consistently used their skills to wage a war against their own people. Among those targeted by SOA graduates are educators, union organizers, religious workers, student leaders, and others who work for the rights of the poor. Hundreds of thousands of Latin Americans have been tortured, raped, assassinated, “disappeared,” massacred, and forced into refugee by those trained at the School of Assassins."

http://www.soaw.org/new/type.php?type=8

[ck4829]

22. Iran AND Syria implicated

Wow.

[breakaleg]

23. no doubt after they tortured him.... how can anyone believe

anything that comes out of torture by the Israeli's? And while we are at it, how is it that they can get away with this kind of thing? There should be more done in the international community to stop them.

[allemand]

24. Is there any explanation for this "confession" other than torture?

Regardless of whether or not the confession is true, what reason would an Hezbollah fighter have to make such a confession if he was not being tortured by his "interrogators"?

[godai]

38. Yes, another possibility...complete fabrication n/t

[frankieT]

25. Mahmoud Ali Suleiman is not a lebanese name

sounds more like palestinian or jordan. this stinks heavy propaganda !

[Marie26]

26. Palestinian

I wonder if this is the same person? A Palestinian man named Mahmoud Ali Suleiman graduated from the Beirut Arab University w/a degree in Geography in 1978.

http://www.bau.edu.lb/alumni/Art/Geography/geo78.html

[Marie26]

27. dupe nt

[allemand]

29. "light bruises or wounds on his cheeks and lips"

The tape shown on Israeli television appeared to be heavily edited, and some answers were cut off in mid-sentence. He appeared to have light bruises or wounds on his cheeks and lips.

Israel announced his capture Sunday, although it was not clear when he fell into Israeli hands. Separate television footage showed him in the custody of soldiers in the field with his arms bound and a large cloth covering his eyes.

http://www.contracostatimes.com/mld/cctimes/news/15219582.htm

It will be interesting to see if he already had those bruises in the first video.

[NorthernSun]

31. How high was the voltage?

Was it AC or DC? This story must be aimed at Likud's base. Nobody else is going to believe it.

[Anakin Skywalker]

32. When You Torture Someone

painfully enough, he will mostly likely say anything you want him to say. The Bushites and their cronies won't rest until they have made the case for YET another war in the Mid-East.

[everythingsxen]

34. Attention "Isn't this convenient" crowd:

Nowhere in that article does it say "Syria is implicated" nor is there an IDF person saying "Syria is implicated", the article in fact says that they drove to Syria and took a flight from there. From the airport.

Syria, if you are unaware, is next to Lebanon. Hezbollah operatives are, for the most part, not welcome in Lebanon. So they hopped the border and took a flight from Syria to Iran.

It is not all that sinister. It is in all likelihood true, and in all likelihood the man was ordered by his superiors to tell the truth, in an attempt to draw Israel into battle with Iran.

[ksilvas]

36. Israeli special forces trained in U.S., difference? non.

[Roland99]

39. How CONVENIENT this guy was supposedly part of the raid that started this.

[CatholicEdHead]

40. Is this a planted overseas propaganda piece?

It just sounds too good to be true.

[LeftHander]

41. US Propaganda!!....nt

[praeclarus]

43. sometimes you have to laugh a bit....

How bloody convenient that the fella fesses up to being trained in
Iran but not only that, by gawd, but I arrived via Syria. It wouldn't
have surprised me at all if he had added, I flew in from Syria with
a stopover in Iraq where I noticed a cache of WMDs in the corner and
Kim was there having a discussion with Fidel and Hugo about something.

[itzamirakul]

49. I guess if you are tortured enough, you will probably admit

to anything. I've read and heard that the Israeli intelligence officers have some methods of getting answers that go beyond the pale.

Also, this could just be some made up shyte, too. I definitely don't believe every word coming out of either our government, Israel's government or the Lebanese government. They all lie.

[HuffleClaw]

50. how conveeeeenient !

but essentially more bullshit propaganda. i'm waiting for the WMD stuff to appear next.

[xchrom]

52. shrug

how many countries around the world host and train in their armed services guests/fighters from other countries?

[leesa]

53. If they increased the wattage, he probably confessed to killing JFK.

[The Stranger]

54. How many DIFFERENT forms of torture did the Israelis use on him?

That is my question.

[saigon68]

60. This stuff works

[LivingInTheBubble]

61. And they had debriefings with Michael Moore....

...in UN vehicles marked as ambulances.

[Tight_rope]

63. BULLLSHIT!.....Torture anyone almost to death and they'll say anything!

This is just another "BULLSHIT" plot for Bushco to start a war with IRAN. Who knows the captured fighter probably didn't say anything about who or where he got his training. :shrug:

[fairplay]

64. Israeli interogators

I don't beleive my own government and I certainly don't beleive the Israeli government or their interogators. Today Lou Dobbs interviewed an American radical right wing Israeli government cheer leader who claimed that the Sunni Al Qaeda were in Southern Lebanon hanging with the Shite Hezzbolla! That lie was made to justify the killing of more civilians, most of whom are kids. Did you see the Israeli USA paid for death machines, lined up on highways for miles?

[ShortnFiery]

67. Welcome to DU fairplay

Yes, Welcome! Also, IMO, well written commentary above. :hi:

[saigon68]

79. Soon they will throw babies from incubators

LOL

[fairplay]

83. Is Karl Rove advising Israelis

Israeli propaganda so far: Suni Al Qaeda are in Southern Shiite Lebanon , captured Lebonese "confesses" he was trained in Iran, and today the Israelis "found" "dead" syrians amongst the dead Lebanese.

Who remembers the Palestinians, there is a black out on the ethnic cleansing going on in the Gaza and occupied West Bank. Heck, the Israeli don't need to use freight trains, slow starvation will do the job, after all the world can't get in there to see.

Rumor has it that Condi has come up against the End Times believers in the Bush WhiteHouse. The End Times believers have the last word, hoping to provoke Iran.

[Snivi Yllom]

68. of course Iran is knee deep in this

Ahmadinejad or his security goons likely gave the order to Hezbollah to start shit up with Israel.

[martymar64]

69. I smell psyops

It's being perpetrated to whip up war frenzy against Syria nad Iran. Don't fall for it.

[elvisbear]

76. He also confessed to being the 2nd shooter on the grassy knoll.

[EFerrari]

80. And the second tramp with the new shoes!

lol

[hollowdweller]

81. Totally skeptical anymore of any confession after all the torture stuff

Not saying it's not true, just that after everything that's gone down these last 3 years I don't count stuff like that the same.

[Thor_MN]

82. is "Suleiman" Arabic for "Curveball" by any chance?

just wondering ..:shrug: