WH Proposal Would Expand Authority of Military Courts (beyond terrorists)

[DeepModem Mom]

WP: White House Proposal Would Expand Authority of Military Courts
By R. Jeffrey Smith
Washington Post Staff Writer
Wednesday, August 2, 2006; Page A04

A draft Bush administration plan for special military courts seeks to expand the reach and authority of such "commissions" to include trials, for the first time, of people who are not members of al-Qaeda or the Taliban and are not directly involved in acts of international terrorism, according to officials familiar with the proposal.

The plan, which would replace a military trial system ruled illegal by the Supreme Court in June, would also allow the secretary of defense to add crimes at will to those under the military court's jurisdiction. The two provisions would be likely to put more individuals than previously expected before military juries, officials and independent experts said.

The draft proposed legislation, set to be discussed at two Senate hearings today, is controversial inside and outside the administration because defendants would be denied many protections guaranteed by the civilian and traditional military criminal justice systems.

Under the proposed procedures, defendants would lack rights to confront accusers, exclude hearsay accusations, or bar evidence obtained through rough or coercive interrogations. They would not be guaranteed a public or speedy trial and would lack the right to choose their military counsel, who in turn would not be guaranteed equal access to evidence held by prosecutors....

***

An early draft of the new measure prepared by civilian political appointees and leaked to the media last week has been modified in response to criticism from uniformed military lawyers. But the provisions allowing a future expansion of the courts to cover new crimes and more prisoners were retained, according to government officials familiar with the deliberations....

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/08/01/AR2006080101334.html?nav=most_emailed

[spindrifter]

1. This must be stopped.

[The Stranger]

18. Too late.

We haven't been able to stop anything they wanted to do.

1. Patriot Act was re-enacted
2. NSA wire-tapping has been virtually legalized
3. Rove skated
4. Telephone records have become fair game for the Pentagon
5. Now Guantanamo is being super-sized for regular U.S. Citizens

Need I go on?

It's over.

[libhill]

25. So now -

any one who disagrees with the rethugs goes to Gitmo - this country is fucked.

[Gully Foyle]

48. Except

"any one who disagrees with the rethugs goes to Gitmo - this country is fucked."
I doubt it will be limited to just Republican office holders. I don't see the Democrat rush to repeal heinous anti-civil liberty legislation, fact is Clinton used every single opportunity he could to remove civil liberties as well.
Power corrupts.

[regnaD kciN]

26. And...

6. Bush managed to stack the Supreme Court with two "unitary executive" advocates, to rubber-stamp all of the above.

:-(

[redqueen]

47. BULLSHIT!

NO DEFEATISM!

:mad:

[dave123williams]

2. Impeach NOW.

[ThomCat]

3. If this isn't unconstitutional then we no longer have a constitution.

:grr:

[Realityhack]

22. We had a constitution?

I thought it was just a peice of paper ;-)

Seriously though. I completely agree. This is totalitarian bullshit and must be stopped. Anyone who votes for it deserves not only the society they create but they deserve to be brought before one of these so called 'judicial' proceedings themselves.

[peacebird]

4. democracy was a nice experiment while it lasted.

[saigon68]

44. THE GHOST OF JOE STALIN HEADS US JUSTICE SYSTEM

Old Joe did a fantastic job.

Where wiill the Gulags be built?

KANSAS-- that's it Kansas. (The Home of Anal Senator Brown Stain)


http://brownback.senate.gov/pressapp/record.cfm?id=260811

Wednesday, August 2, 2006

WASHINGTON – U.S. Senator Sam Brownback today chaired a hearing of the Judiciary Subcommittee on the Constitution to discuss a bill that would prevent judicial activist groups from using a 1970s-era civil rights law to force taxpayers to pay their attorney’s fees in cases related to public displays of religious faith.

“Groups with a partisan political agenda should not have their legal costs reimbursed by state and local governments,” said Brownback. “If a group like the ACLU wants to sue a city for displaying a religious image, it should pay the bill itself, not take advantage of a provision that was designed to reimburse poor individuals pursuing civil rights cases.”

The Public Expressions of Religion Act, S.3696, would require parties to pay their own attorney’s fees when litigating cases regarding the First Amendment’s Establishment Clause, which prohibits the government from endorsing or promoting a particular religious view. This would remedy a nuance in the Civil Rights Attorney Fees Awards Act of 1976 which allows winning parties in Establishment Clause cases to recover attorney’s fees.

[Rex]

5. Washington Post dropping huge stories right now.

The power would give George Bush what he's always wanted, the divine right of kings.

[DeepModem Mom]

7. I missed this story earlier today in the WP, and just found it...

on their Most E-mailed List. Is this the first we've heard of this, or have I missed something else?

[Rex]

11. Story has been around for a week or so.

Seems like an attempt to get around the SCOTUS striking down Bush's tribunal hearings. Now the odd thing about this is that it would become LEGAL for the Exec to arrest everyone on the SCOTUS bench! Wouldn't happen, yet if anyone asked it would be legal to declare national security and end the conversation. No legal representation, EVER. That also means no contact with anyone. All legal. I see this having a broad impact on a lot of current laws on the book.

EDIT - I don't see Congress buying this...oh wait...not in session...77 days...oh boy...bad...

[DeepModem Mom]

17. This story must be post-new-draft of last week's leaked version. nt

[Rex]

19. It was a different paper.

Yeah this looks like more information.

Check this story out; http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=102&topic_id=2429785&mesg_id=2429785

Both of these news articles should scare the crap out of people, because unlike some vaporous enemy this is happening right in front of our noses. :(

Exec - worthless
Congress - worthless
SCOTUS - oh man
M$M - dam just dam.

[DeepModem Mom]

21. Indeed! nt

[Solly Mack]

6. and in 50 years, people will say "this is how it's always been"

unless it's stopped - and not just voted down either...but those behind such a law have to be exposed for the traitors they are and imprisoned.


This isn't a matter of an idea gone bad or bad legislation that just needs to be voted down ...this is a case of the Bush Regime circumventing the Constitution.

But who will hold Bush accountable?

[arcane1]

8. HOW can they do this with a straight face???

and HOW IN HELL can ANY republican supporter honestly support this?????

[Charlie Brown]

13. I don't see how any sane person can support this crap

"conservatives" have really lost their way if they want the state to wield this kind of power.

[Rose Siding]

Dick's decided on a trinity, pulling Don up on the dais, too

[bronxiteforever]

9. Unconstitutional and the founders would call it treason

[MrCoffee]

29. No, not treason...

Grounds for revolution. "He has refused his Assent to Laws, the most wholesome and necessary for the public good." "He has obstructed the Administration of Justice by refusing his Assent to Laws for establishing Judiciary Powers." "He has affected to render the Military independent of and superior to the Civil Power." "For depriving us in many cases, of the benefit of Trial by Jury." "For taking away our Charters, abolishing our most valuable Laws and altering fundamentally the Forms of our Governments."

When in the course of human events...

[w4rma]

10. I knew this day would come with these guys. This is the single scariest

law they have ever tried to ram through our government.

[I_Make_Mistakes]

14. If the Dems don't take back at least the House it's time to go,

before we don't have a choice. John Dean has exposed the road to facism in his new book, "Conservatives without a Conscience", this will be the precipice. The moderate Republicans think they can take back their party, I don't, and if the Dems don't make a big pick up in the Nov. elections, I am so out of here, because we already know the outcome of facist societies.

[w4rma]

16. There are no moderate Republicans in the Rethug Party anymore.

Everyone left is a radical right-winger who votes with Bush whenever he needs them to. That includes pretenders like Chafee and Specter.

[kurth]

31. A good Republican is a

[I_Make_Mistakes]

34. Honestly, that is not true. Specter did disappointment me and

in my younger years I might have even voted for that rat bastard. He was fairly calm till the fascists took over and I am pretty sure when Ricky gets sent back to Va., the PA voters will send Specter home the next time, I only hope they can attach a scathing epitaph to his removal.

If you are Christian, then the wolf in sheeps cloths will describe Arlen!

[libhill]

27. Some of us

can't afford to just uproot and move to Europe or Canada - I guess we're just screwed -

[I_Make_Mistakes]

32. I actually have been outside the country on several extended

trips and it is not so. It is far more expensive for luxury items outside the US, but it is a far less stressful life. I was in Bosnia (definitely 3rd world) and their quality of life was so much better! It is the THINGS that differentiate the US from other countries, not the quality of life.

We have been so propagandized that we don't even value the true value of quality of life.

I will provide 2 examples, (there are so many more, but today these are the most prominent).

I was 26, and making a good salary and living in apt, and had 2 Swedes as neighbors. They invited me into their apt., it was adequately, stereo, tv, sofa etc., furnished but nothing extra like Entertainment unit, love seat etc., and yet, they had only been here a few years and had seen the Grand Canyon, etc., more of America than I have. They had all the basics, (we have been socialized to want all these gadgets, that we really don't need), and we happier and had experienced more of the US than I will probably ever.

I went to Bosnia (Mary RC stuff) in 2000. It was at first so backward and poor, but I was there for 10 days and I started to see the value of family over things. The people there were wonderful, they worked hard, but took siesta type breaks, they didn't have all the niceties of life, and yet were so much happier than anyone in the US (even rich people). I remember a conversation I had with the owner of the hotel (guest house) I stayed at saying we are so busy trying to buy things and you are so busy trying to make memories with your family. I said, don't try to get things like America does because you will loose the good things that you have.

It is difficult for us to look at other societies and see their value, I assure you, you can be so much happier with so much less, you have to see it to actually believe it!

My old boss (yrs. ago originally from Ireland), came to the States because he had met a really wonderful woman from the Mainline (yes, it conjures images) in Phila.. He spent 5 years jumping through hoops to get his green card (I think $5.000.00 was his calculation, to be a legal US citizen. The co., I worked for asked me to approach him (I was a consultant to his co., which we owned but it was a weird situation) for a big time employment opportunity in Ireland (we were opening a branch there and I could've got him the top dog job). He turned the job down, (didn't want the stress and was gonna stay in the states, and a year later he married the mainline woman and moved back to Ireland and worked for the same company in a much lower position. He was happy.

I visited he and his wife (5yrs later) and 4 children later and understood that the things don't make happiness, but the living is sure more fun. They had less in things, but more in life!

I guess my point is if we limit our lives by the things we think we need, we will never know the things that we really need!

[libhill]

35. I understand your point, but

it's the initial getting there and getting established that would require $$$ that some of us don't have. But at this point, I really don't care. I want to get the hell out of here before these Fascist fucks steal any more power and authority than they already have. I never in my wildest dreams, ever thought I might have to leave my country to preserve my liberty. And all of their moves are aimed at totalitarian control. Terrorism has nothing to do with it. And any body who still buys into that bull shit is badly self deceived.

[I_Make_Mistakes]

37. I am so DU challenged. First I added you to my buddy list, then I

added you to my ignore all in an attempt to PM you which you don't wish to receive. Do you have any assets, house furniture etc.? I am in the process of liquidating what I have, don't need that much.

Also, you probably have skills that your not even aware of, like English. Look on escapeartist.com, they are good at relating the pros/cons and requirements of relocating to another country. I believe that US corporate fascists screwed the pooch when they devalued the knowledge and experience of the worker bees they crapped on getting to the top. I can't imagine the impact of the RW cry babies when they have unskilled and uneducated workers working for them! WAA WAA!

[libhill]

39. What's a PM?

I have no problem with being contacted, pro or con. I enjoy the feedback. Talk about D.U. challenged, that'd be moi ... ?

[I_Make_Mistakes]

50. PM is private message. Here goes I am not sure if you need to

donate to get a mailbox, because I have donated and have one. When I tried to send you a private message I got a message to the effect that you didn't want to receive one. You could also have put me on ignore (which I did to you inadvertently!).

I don't use those little cryptic items next to our user name too often and things happen when you click on them.

[Realityhack]

36. I think I missed your point somewhere in there...

You quote 5 years and $5,000 dolars to get into a country.

In response to a post saying that some people just don't have the cash to uproot overnight...

Were you agreeing? Cause it seems to me like $5,000 is more than I have and it would take a lot more to do the same thing overnight. And thats without me having a family.

[I_Make_Mistakes]

38. Sorry, my ex boss paid $5000.00 to get his US green card and

moved back to Ireland less than 2 years after obtaining his green card. I am sorry for the confusion, he paid $5000.00 to get a US green card and moved back with his wife and ain't coming back!

Anyone who is Irish can get a VISA overnight, they want the Irish to come home, I'm 2nd or 3rd generation not hard, but not easy.

[libhill]

40. I am too, but

considering my great grandfather and his brother came over here on a cattle boat from Ireland, (yeah, yeah, illegals I presume) it would almost seem like a betrayal to go back. Anyway, with all the religious strife in Ireland, the place has little more appeal to me than the Middle East. But there are other nations in Europe. Canada is too close, and could go either way.

[arcane1]

15. just don't read the Declaration of Independance out loud

they would likely lock people up for that now

[enough]

12. So predictable. So despicable.

snip>

John Yoo, a former Justice Department lawyer who helped draft the earlier plan, said Bush administration officials essentially "took DOD regulations" for the trials "and turned them into a statute for Congress to pass." He said the drafters were obviously "trying to return the law to where it was before Hamdan " by writing language into the draft that challenges key aspects of the court's decision.

"Basically, this is trying to overrule the Hamdan case," said Neal K. Katyal, a Georgetown University law professor who was Hamdan's lead attorney.

snip>

[I_Make_Mistakes]

33. Is Yoo the Berkely law Professor that helped draft the

torture memo? If not, please disregard. H

[Just Me]

20. So, are they basically giving SCOTUS the finger or WHAT?!?!

When is this abuse of power, criminal abuse of power going to be STOPPED by those in the position to stop it? This administration is totally spiralling out of control.

In my lifetime,...I am watching the intentional destruction of democracy in THIS country, in my lifetime. IT SUCKS!!!!

[MisterP]

23. Volksgerichtshof, Volksgerichtshof!

[Realityhack]

24. Yes Mien Furrer!!

I mean.. Mr. President.

- Dr. Strangelove

[SpiralHawk]

28. Freaking republicon fascists hate us for our freedoms

I gotta say it again: republicons hate us for our freedoms, and hate America.

[libhill]

41. Ah, now

they don't hate freedom, they just hate not being to sit on top of the world, in another Gilded Age, living high off the hog, while the rest of us go hungry or work for them for nothing or next to nothing. After all, where do we Great Unwashed get the audacity to think that we are entitled to a living wage, heath care, or even an education for our kids? That's who the Repukes are, that's what they're about, that's where they're coming from...

[K8-EEE]

30. Our Transformation Into A Banana Republic Almost Complete

Oh good, we're ALL subject to secret trinbunals and no due process?

Well let's see, we've already seen the rich get richer, poverty levels increase, stupid ass aggressive military actions, detentions of "dangerous" people without charges or any kind, dissent labeled "treason"....and we don't MAKE anything in this country anymore except weapons!

Wow they certainly are thorough!

[alfredo]

42. He wants dictatorial power before the fall elections. If the Dems try

to challenge him, Rumsfeld can make their actions criminal.

[alfredo]

43. Arrogant sons a bitches.

[drduffy]

45. The Line UP for the Camps starts here.....

f the US government and F the Pentagon.

there, that should do it......

[dusty64]

46. It finally made the corporate press...

:kick:

[indepat]

49. Heil, mein Fuehrer