CNN: Israeli troops landing near Syrian border in NE Lebanon

[Karmadillo]

Quoting Reuters. Landing helicopters near Baalbeck in the northeast.

[Dhalgren]

1. Is there a Hezbollah presence in the north of Lebanon?

I thought Hezbollah was primarily in the south. This is going to get out of hand on a much larger scale than it already is. This is fucking madness...

[Mandate My Ass]

3. Not that I know of and even if there was, they couldn't reach Israel

I'm guessing this was the real plan all along. x(

[Solo_in_MD]

9. There are...

Reports of longer range rockets and possbiley C-802 missiles that are kepot in Syria and moved to Lebanon for firing. Shoot and then scoot to an untouchable area. Not clear if those reports are credible and have been verified at this time.

That may or may not be why the IDF is there, outside of military sources there is not way to document if that is indeed happening.

[Igel]

27. Hezbollah is a largely Shi'ite phenomenon.

They're prominent in the south because they're the "glorious resistance defending the ummah", or some such twaddle.

But since NE Lebanon is also largely Shi'ite, with Sunnis mostly along the border, I'd assume (and do no more than assume) that they have a presence there. The Israelis have struck Baalbek a few times already in the last week or two.

I'm going off a 1983 map that shows the distribution of religious groups from 1982. Some things changed slightly during the occupation, and Hezbollah was really nasty to Christian groups (the typical communal violence; the Xian militia in the area supported Israel) when Israel pulled out.

Perhaps the speculation that the IDF soldiers are there is true. Perhaps they have word that Hezb's C&C set up base there. Perhaps there are significant stockpiles of munitions and ordnance. Speculation is fun, but irrelevant.

[Name removed]

37. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[funnymanpants]

39. straw man argument n/t

[funnymanpants]

38. called the illegal invasion

>>They're prominent in the south because they're the "glorious resistance defending the ummah", or some such twaddle.

Called the illegal invasion by Israel in 1982. Couldn't think of it, huh? The time when Israel said it was invading because some extremist in London killed a diplomat. The extremist in London were sworn enemies of the PLO in Lebanon. No matter. Israel wanted her war.

[uppityperson]

2. damn it all

[Monkeyman]

4. Reports are that more then 40 helicopters are now landing troops

[izzie]

24. American made?

This is all going to come back on us. I just can feel it.

[ThomCat]

5. But, but, but... Israel is only defending themselves.

:eyes:

It's hard to believe that people are still invested in the myth that Israel is innocent.

[uppityperson]

6. Reuters link/story

http://today.reuters.com/news/newsArticle.aspx?type=newsOne&storyID=2006-08-01T201942Z_01_L01895035_RTRUKOC_0_US-MIDEAST-BAALBEK.xml
CHTOURA, Lebanon (Reuters) - Helicopters landed Israeli soldiers on hills near the northeastern Lebanese town of Baalbek, a Hizbollah stronghold, on Tuesday, Lebanese security sources said.

The aim of the operation was not immediately clear, they said. An Israeli army spokesman declined to comment.

[Poll_Blind]

7. Map showing Baalbeck here...

Just to the right of center of map.

PB

[uppityperson]

12. thanks for the map

I copied it to GD topic too, thank you the map helps

[Scurrilous]

13. Baalbeck:

The six columns
of Baalbeck



Temple of Bacchus

http://www.middleeast.com/baalbeck.htm

[LSparkle]

15. Bekaa Valley ... they're after the opium crop!

[Poll_Blind]

18. (pulling on overalls) Not if I get there first! n/t

PB

[BrotherBuzz]

44. I may be mistaken, but I believe that region is ....

mostly known for producing hashish.

[laruemtt]

8. anybody care to watch

The Day After tonite..................

[Monkeyman]

10. Wait a min. is that not where Bush said Iraq moved their WMD's

[PCIntern]

11. Yeah, the Israelis are waiting to hear how to

run their operation from the folks at DU.

In 1967, I heard all the same stuff...that the U.A.R., Jordanian, Syrian, Saudi armies had not made a move into Israeli territory, and how dare the Israelis presume that these armies are going to invade.

MADNESS! Everyone cried in those days too.

Well, it would have been Palestine, and only Palestine, if they'd take the advice of thsoe who told them to fight a purely defensive war.

[Poll_Blind]

17. Keep putting DU down, I like watching you do it. Let it all hang out, man.

  You've pre-approved Israel's innocence in a possible coming shooting war with Syria AND marginalized DU in whatever possible way you could.

  Keep posting how you really feel- that's my advice.

PB

[Poll_Blind]

23. Don't go burning down the meeting-house for what's said inside.

Don't go burning down the meeting-house for what's said inside.

PB

[PCIntern]

43. I see, Mr. Freedom-of Speech...

As long as everyone agrees with YOU, then all's OK.

No one allowed an opposing viewpoint, eh?

any suggestions for what I should be thinking? I've been around this block before.

[Binka]

50. Yep Keep It Up PC n/t

[izzie]

26. But it is so much better than 1968 as we can see the war as it is

going on. Just think how far we have come.

[funnymanpants]

40. except it may be true that Irael started 67 war

Many historian think Israel did use the empty threats of other nations to start the `67 war.

"The former Commander of the Air Force, General Ezer Weitzman, regarded as a hawk, stated that there was 'no threat of destruction' but that the attack on Egypt, Jordan and Syria was nevertheless justified so that Israel could 'exist according the scale, spirit, and quality she now embodies.'...Menahem Begin had the following remarks to make: 'In June 1967, we again had a choice. The Egyptian Army concentrations in the Sinai approaches do not prove that Nasser was really about to attack us. We must be honest with ourselves. We decided to attack him.'

http://www.cactus48.com/1967war.html

And there are several more quotes on the link.

By the way, I don't know if Israel instigated the war or not. Certainly by these quotes you could say she did. On the other hand, one could point to the quotes of the Arabs to prove the opposite. Or one could quote Israeli historian Shlaim who believes niether side wanted the war.

[ChairmanAgnostic]

14. This is not good. not good at all.

By expanding their ground efforts, they mean to invade Syria, not just blow the living shit out of innocent civilians without rhyme or reason.

[_testify_]

16. Wait, so it was better BEFORE this?

I don't follow you.

[ChairmanAgnostic]

22. good point..

It was outrageous before (and it has gotten worse?)

I can't help but think that regional war is bad, but a growing, potentially global conflict is even worse.

[ConservativeDemocrat]

19. That may very well be where they suspect their soldiers are kept

...in fact, I wouldn't be at all surprised if they had intelligence to that effect.

All it would take is a single patriotic Lebanese person with inside info to unjam this. The thinking could easily be "let the Israelis get their kidnapped soldiers back, and much of their reason for continuing the attack goes away".

Of course this is all supposition at this point.

- C.D. Proud Member of the Reality Based Community

p.s. If you want to understand the real reasons for civilian casualties, check out these photos from an Australian newspaper.

[Journeyman]

20. Makes more sense than most. . .

It seems unlikely anyone would stage a cross-border invasion using a small number of troops who've been airlifted half-a-country away into a foreign land. A rescue operation, though, sounds reasonable.

[funnymanpants]

41. Highly doubtful

YOu are just speculating because you are an Israeli-no-matter-what apologist.

By the way, your link shows nothing, as other posters have pointed out. Did you see the thread on how Quana was the turning point in the war? It is the one with Levin in it. You should read it because Israel is now saying that there was no Hezbollah firing from the area.

Also, did you see the thread in which Israeli confidant (I've also heard justice minister) say that Israel could flatten Lebanon and kill civlillians because Israel had told them to leave?

[Zhade]

47. Right, because a Murdoch-owned rightwing paper would NEVER lie...

...about a photo that doesn't prove SHIT, especially when the alleged "damning photos" were supposedly "obtained exclusively".

Nice try to explain away Israel's war crimes, but thankfully the rest of the world isn't as stupid as you seem to think we are.

[David__77]

21. Syria has better not hesitate.

They should see this for what it is--an attack on Syria.

[BeHereNow]

25. And ultimately, Iran...

Which has been the neocon plan from the very start.
God help our troops in the region, and god help us all.
BHN

[Minstrel Boy]

29. But that's just what the war cabal wants

The US has been pressing Israel to attack Syria, according to IDF officials quoted in the Jerusalem Post. Israel is trying to goad Syria into taking the first shot.

[Posteritatis]

34. How is an attack within Lebanon an attack on Syria? (nt)

[uppityperson]

28. Msnbc link and story: paratroopers

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/14128276/

Israel drops troops near Syrian border
Soldiers parachute into Hezbollah stronghold of Baalbek

pdated: 10 minutes ago

BOURJ AL-MULOUK, Lebanon - Helicopters landed Israeli soldiers on hills near the northeastern Lebanese town of Baalbek, a Hezbollah stronghold, on late Tuesday, Lebanese security sources said.

Israeli warplanes also attacked at least five suspected Hezbollah positions near Baalbek in eastern Lebanon's Bekaa Valley, three hours before the official end of a two-day pause in the air war. The aim of the operation was not immediately clear, they said. An Israeli army spokesman declined to comment.

Also on Tuesday, Heavy ground fighting raged Tuesday near a border village and Israel resumed frequent airstrikes after it decided, in a major expansion of its offensive, to send thousands more troops deeper into Lebanon.

The soldiers will go as far as the Litani River, 18 miles from the Israeli border, to clear out Hezbollah fighters and hold the territory until a multinational force is deployed there, senior Israeli officials said Tuesday....

[leesa]

30. Poke, prod, jab...they will get Syria to respond yet

But, of course we all know Syria is NOT allowed to defend itself, even though Israel has been violating their borders with fly-overs and patrols for a long time now. And that little border incident the other day? Pffftt...Hezbollah was camping on the guardhouse at the checkpoint.

[outofbounds]

31. Who said Israel is going to attack Syria?

I haven't heard that anywhere. I would presume that Israel may have intelligence indicating that supplies are entering Lebanon at this point of the border. It would only make sense to to try to choke off supply lines and troop, excuse me, guerrilla reinforcements where ever they are crossing the border.

[countryjake]

32. New Reuters link to full story on attacks in Northeastern Lebanon...

http://today.reuters.com/news/newsArticle.aspx?type=TopNews&storyID=2006-08-01T204947Z_01_L30823603_RTRUKOC_0_US-MIDEAST.xml&WTmodLoc=Home-C1-TopStories-TopNews-2

[Megahurtz]

33. They're really going to bring some shit upon themselves. n/t

[uppityperson]

35. love the wording of article "expands war... ceasefire on horizon"

[Posteritatis]

36. Quickly googled map of the area

Baalbeck is just southeast of the final "n" in "Lebanon" on that map, at the edge of the watermark.

So far, the large majority of the ground fighting is south of the Litani river; it's not labelled on that map, but you can see it in the southwest of Lebanon, a little north of Tyre.

[High Plains]

48. Baalbek isn't anywhere near the Israeli border.

Man, their definition of "self-defense" is as totalitarian as is ours.

[allemand]

42. Al-Jazeera: IDF aimed to reach Hezbollah official in Baalbek hospital

01:49 Hezbollah denies reports that IDF snatched patients from Baalbek hospital (AP)

01:46 Al-Jazeera: IDF aimed to reach Hezbollah official in Baalbek hospital (Agencies)

01:45 Rice sees ceasefire in Lebanon in matter of `days, not weeks` (AP)

01:44 Shimon Peres: IDF operation in Lebanon could go on for `weeks, not months`

01:43 Hezbollah spokesman: IDF commandos trapped inside Baalbek hospital (AP)

01:34 Hezbollah`s chief spokesman: IDF troops battling guerrillas near Baalbek hospital (AP)

01:33 Witnesses: Hospital near Baalbek burning after hit in IAF strike (AP)

00:54 Al-Manar: Hezbollah fighting IDF troops on the ground west of Baalbek (AP)

00:30 Lebanese army official: Israeli air presence over Baalbek `unprecedented` (AP)

00:26 HELICOPTERS PUT DOWN IDF COMMANDOS NEAR BAALBEK (Haaretz)

http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/ShTickers.html

[Dover]

45. Lets see now....MORE troops in Iraq and MORE troops in Lebanon

I'm sure it's just a coincidence.

Syria is next. Iran to follow.

[countryjake]

46. Haaretz reports that hospital burning from Israeli airstrike...

Fierce fighting as IDF commandos launch raid deep in Lebanon
http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/745276.html

~snips~

Israel Defense Forces commandos landed by helicopter late Tuesday night near the Hezbollah stronghold of Baalbek in what Lebanese security sources described as a major operation against suspected Hezbollah positions.

Lebanese security sources said the troops landed as aircraft launched several strikes near Baalbek, which is located in eastern Lebanon's Bekaa Valley.

One Lebanese officer saying the Israel Air Force presence in the air above the ancient city was "unprecedented."

Witnesses in Baalbek said they saw dozens of IAF helicopters hovering over the city. They said the private hospital in Baalbek, filled with patients and wounded people, was bombed by IAF helicopters late Tuesday. Plumes of burning smoke billowed from the hospital after it was directly hit, they said.

[doc03]

49. Neocons have long claimed that Iraq moved the WMDs

to the Becca Valley. I wonder if we will have an "October Surprise" by Israel claiming to have found the missing WMDs. I think this is a real possibility.